Waterford GAA Discussion Thread 2013- Mod Warning Post #1

Black Suir

Sami Jenkis wrote: »

Last year the semi final draw was done as the players were leaving the field after the last quarter final was finished. I have heard from a club secretary that a proposal is going to be made at the next county board meeting, that the semi final draw take place before the quarter finals are played, which in my opinion is a better way to do it.
DLS/Ballygunner should be a cracker. Gunners seem to be coming good at the right time, and it will be tough to call. Can see Fourmile beating ballyduff, Mount Sion, although poor against Roanmore yesterday will fancy their chances against Tallow. The other game should be a tight affair, but can really see Abbeyside getting one over on Passage.

Does it really matter that the draw for the semi finals takes place before or after the quarter finals. You don't have the draw for the semi finals of the FA Cup performed before the quarter finals. Nobody can have any doubts that the draw is not fair in any way as it is done in public in front of anyone willing to wait three or four minutes after the full time whistle and on more than one occasion the pulling of teams was done by children and not by a board officer.

Black Suir

doz wrote: »

It was a brave move to take Pudge out from FF but I've always thought he operates better in that position where he is more involved in the play. That's where he played with county intermediates a couple of years back. Worked out well for them last night. Abbeyside v FMW will be a tough battle next day out!

AFAIK Kevin Daly isn't even 17 yet, I know for a fact he is underage for minor again next year as is Paddy Curran. Both great prospects and making great strides, though I felt Paddy was getting a bit of off the ball treatment last night that the ref did not pick up on.

Darragh Lyons is also minor next year and as far as I know will be old enough to play senior next year. The future is bright for the old boro.

Black Suir

hardybuck wrote: »

Well DLS v Ballygunner will take place in Walsh Park. FMW v Abbeyside will take place in Fraher Field, and probably Mount Sion v Tallow as well.

Either Passage or Ballyduff Upper will get stung with a long trip to either Walsh Park or Fraher Field. Even somewhere like Carriganore or Kilmac might be fairer to both.

It would be madness to bring Ballyduff to Walsh Park. The Passage lads would be up in Dungarvan quicker than some of the Ballyduff lads would get down to Dungarvan. Ballygunner and De La Salle has to go ahead in Walsh Park. Mount Sion and Tallow will be in Fraher Field. Abbeyside V Fourmilewater should go ahead in Fraher Field but could also move to Cappoquin. Two games in Fraher Field will form a double header with one of the other quarter finals possibly going ahead as a double header with the relegation play off. Its makes no real difference as to whether An Rinn goes to Walsh Park or Roanmore goes to Fraher Field.

Black Suir

shoddy14 wrote: »

You know for a fact hes underage for minor next year? Daly played in the county final last year V DLS, his 1st year being out of U16. This is his last year minor. No wonder there is so much bulls#!t written on this form.

Was thinking the same myself.

Black Suir

Anyone able to give a good report on the Camogie game over weekend. Tough on the team beaten two years in a row in the semi finals, and could end up playing Galway again next year as Limerick have a good team and you would fancy them to win this years final.

Sami Jenkis

Black Suir wrote: »

Does it really matter that the draw for the semi finals takes place before or after the quarter finals. You don't have the draw for the semi finals of the FA Cup performed before the quarter finals. Nobody can have any doubts that the draw is not fair in any way as it is done in public in front of anyone willing to wait three or four minutes after the full time whistle and on more than one occasion the pulling of teams was done by children and not by a board officer.

No Semi Finals of the FA Cup aren't, but the champions league is done that way. I'm not for one second implying with my earlier post, that the draws are not done fairly. I'm just giving an opinion as a player that I prefer knowing who our possible Semi finalists are going to be. Some might call it looking too far ahead, and take it a game at a time, but it's just my preference!

hardybuck

Black Suir wrote: »

It would be madness to bring Ballyduff to Walsh Park. The Passage lads would be up in Dungarvan quicker than some of the Ballyduff lads would get down to Dungarvan. Ballygunner and De La Salle has to go ahead in Walsh Park.

You realise that Passage East is about an hour from Dungarvan right? Ballyduff would be 35-40 minutes to Dungarvan?

Mountainlad

hardybuck wrote: »

You realise that Passage East is about an hour from Dungarvan right? Ballyduff would be 35-40 minutes to Dungarvan?

True, but it's 20 mins from the City to Passage apparently, and over an hour from Ballyduff.

Kilmac seems like the ideal location in terms of distance between both but having been there I don't think it's a safe venue. Someone could hurt themslves by the wire fence as it is way to close to the sideline. Worse still are the stone pillars that hold it up, and found myself worried about the safety of the players at a football match I attended there as if a player's head collided with them he would quite likely die.

robopaddy

Mountainlad wrote: »

True, but it's 20 mins from the City to Passage apparently, and over an hour from Ballyduff.

Kilmac seems like the ideal location in terms of distance between both but having been there I don't think it's a safe venue. Someone could hurt themslves by the wire fence as it is way to close to the sideline. Worse still are the stone pillars that hold it up, and found myself worried about the safety of the players at a football match I attended there as if a player's head collided with them he would quite likely die.

:eek:

Mountainlad

robopaddy wrote: »

:eek:

I'm actually not certain what they're made of, but I do remember them being quite close to the sideline and thinking that. Picture here, but you can't really see the proximity to the sideline https://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=375115880668&set=a.375114750668.157832.276012245668&type=1&theater

Cathal McCallister will referee the all-ireland minor final, which means the opposite to the semi final there won't be that many frees.

PTH2009

whats the ticket situation like for the final. starting to resign to the fact i wont be there on the 8th sep. I knw id probly get them on the day but not in time for the minor final :(, ah well maybe they mite be an match day atmosphere in pubs in the city on the day

seananigans

are the Waterford hurling supporters-Dublin meeting somewhere to watch it ,would be good to see it with a crowd

Giveitfong

I’m surprised there has been no mention here (as far as I am aware) of Phil Fanning’s article on the Michael Ryan affair in the News & Star last week. According to Fanning, there is an agreement between the GAA and the GPA whereby County Boards are required to consult with players’ representatives regarding the appointment of county team managers. In line with this agreement, the Waterford County Board sounded out some senior players in the hurling panel who indicated that a change of manager would be desirable.


According to Fanning, this information was passed on to Michael Ryan who was skeptical about it and proceeded to contact a number of players directly. As Ryan stated on RTE last week, he contacted eight players, of whom only three said that they desired a change of manager. In my own personal opinion, Ryan should not have proceeded in this way, as it put players in a very difficult position to be asked by the person who could still have been manager next year whether they wanted him to stay on as manager.


There therefore appeared to be a conflict between what the County Board were told by the players they consulted and what Michael Ryan was told by the players consulted by him. According to Phil Fanning, “The County Board and Michael Ryan, wanted to know the exact position of the players so they were advised to call a meeting of players as a matter of urgency”. It is not clear from this who actually did the advising and who actually received this advice.


Fanning goes on to say that “The meeting was called for last Sunday morning” but doesn’t say who actually called the meeting and decided on the day, time and venue. The meeting was attended by “no more than eleven” players but that every other player on the panel whom it was possible to contact was asked to state their position on the reappointment of Michael Ryan and his management team. The result was “about two to one” in favour of change and this outcome was communicated to Ryan by Noel Connors.


According to Phil Fanning, Ryan immediately informed the County Secretary that he would not be seeking reappointment and the Secretary instructed the County PRO to release a statement to this effect immediately.


If this account is accurate, then it appears that the players’ meeting was convened at the behest of the County Board who simply wished to know the balance of opinion among the players regarding Ryan’s reappointment. The players did not meet of their own volition and simply conveyed the outcome of their meeting to Michael Ryan who in turn informed the County Secretary. The idea of the players issuing a public statement of their own did not arise. At no stage did the players indicate that they would not be prepared to play if Ryan were reappointed. It was the County Board which issued the press release when they did, and no fault regarding its timing falls on the players.


In his strongly worded article, Phil Fanning subjects members of the national press, posters on social media and, in particular, former County Chairman Paddy Joe Ryan to trenchant criticism for what Fanning regards as unfair, inaccurate and over-the-top criticism of the players for their role in this episode. It is worth reading but I don’t know if it is online – I haven’t been able to find a link myself.

Psychedelic

Black Suir wrote: »

Anyone able to give a good report on the Camogie game over weekend. Tough on the team beaten two years in a row in the semi finals, and could end up playing Galway again next year as Limerick have a good team and you would fancy them to win this years final.

http://hoganstand.com/Waterford/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=199478

Jarjohn

Giveitfong wrote: »

I’m surprised there has been no mention here (as far as I am aware) of Phil Fanning’s article on the Michael Ryan affair in the News & Star last week. According to Fanning, there is an agreement between the GAA and the GPA whereby County Boards are required to consult with players’ representatives regarding the appointment of county team managers. In line with this agreement, the Waterford County Board sounded out some senior players in the hurling panel who indicated that a change of manager would be desirable.


According to Fanning, this information was passed on to Michael Ryan who was skeptical about it and proceeded to contact a number of players directly. As Ryan stated on RTE last week, he contacted eight players, of whom only three said that they desired a change of manager. In my own personal opinion, Ryan should not have proceeded in this way, as it put players in a very difficult position to be asked by the person who could still have been manager next year whether they wanted him to stay on as manager.


There therefore appeared to be a conflict between what the County Board were told by the players they consulted and what Michael Ryan was told by the players consulted by him. According to Phil Fanning, “The County Board and Michael Ryan, wanted to know the exact position of the players so they were advised to call a meeting of players as a matter of urgency”. It is not clear from this who actually did the advising and who actually received this advice.


Fanning goes on to say that “The meeting was called for last Sunday morning” but doesn’t say who actually called the meeting and decided on the day, time and venue. The meeting was attended by “no more than eleven” players but that every other player on the panel whom it was possible to contact was asked to state their position on the reappointment of Michael Ryan and his management team. The result was “about two to one” in favour of change and this outcome was communicated to Ryan by Noel Connors.


According to Phil Fanning, Ryan immediately informed the County Secretary that he would not be seeking reappointment and the Secretary instructed the County PRO to release a statement to this effect immediately.


If this account is accurate, then it appears that the players’ meeting was convened at the behest of the County Board who simply wished to know the balance of opinion among the players regarding Ryan’s reappointment. The players did not meet of their own volition and simply conveyed the outcome of their meeting to Michael Ryan who in turn informed the County Secretary. The idea of the players issuing a public statement of their own did not arise. At no stage did the players indicate that they would not be prepared to play if Ryan were reappointed. It was the County Board which issued the press release when they did, and no fault regarding its timing falls on the players.


In his strongly worded article, Phil Fanning subjects members of the national press, posters on social media and, in particular, former County Chairman Paddy Joe Ryan to trenchant criticism for what Fanning regards as unfair, inaccurate and over-the-top criticism of the players for their role in this episode. It is worth reading but I don’t know if it is online – I haven’t been able to find a link myself.

Well this doesn't add up to our chairman's view on the matter a few weeks back http://examiner.ie/sport/cusack-in-running-for-deise-job-239669.html

robopaddy

Giveitfong wrote: »

I’m surprised there has been no mention here (as far as I am aware) of Phil Fanning’s article on the Michael Ryan affair in the News & Star last week. According to Fanning, there is an agreement between the GAA and the GPA whereby County Boards are required to consult with players’ representatives regarding the appointment of county team managers. In line with this agreement, the Waterford County Board sounded out some senior players in the hurling panel who indicated that a change of manager would be desirable.


According to Fanning, this information was passed on to Michael Ryan who was skeptical about it and proceeded to contact a number of players directly. As Ryan stated on RTE last week, he contacted eight players, of whom only three said that they desired a change of manager. In my own personal opinion, Ryan should not have proceeded in this way, as it put players in a very difficult position to be asked by the person who could still have been manager next year whether they wanted him to stay on as manager.


There therefore appeared to be a conflict between what the County Board were told by the players they consulted and what Michael Ryan was told by the players consulted by him. According to Phil Fanning, “The County Board and Michael Ryan, wanted to know the exact position of the players so they were advised to call a meeting of players as a matter of urgency”. It is not clear from this who actually did the advising and who actually received this advice.


Fanning goes on to say that “The meeting was called for last Sunday morning” but doesn’t say who actually called the meeting and decided on the day, time and venue. The meeting was attended by “no more than eleven” players but that every other player on the panel whom it was possible to contact was asked to state their position on the reappointment of Michael Ryan and his management team. The result was “about two to one” in favour of change and this outcome was communicated to Ryan by Noel Connors.


According to Phil Fanning, Ryan immediately informed the County Secretary that he would not be seeking reappointment and the Secretary instructed the County PRO to release a statement to this effect immediately.


If this account is accurate, then it appears that the players’ meeting was convened at the behest of the County Board who simply wished to know the balance of opinion among the players regarding Ryan’s reappointment. The players did not meet of their own volition and simply conveyed the outcome of their meeting to Michael Ryan who in turn informed the County Secretary. The idea of the players issuing a public statement of their own did not arise. At no stage did the players indicate that they would not be prepared to play if Ryan were reappointed. It was the County Board which issued the press release when they did, and no fault regarding its timing falls on the players.


In his strongly worded article, Phil Fanning subjects members of the national press, posters on social media and, in particular, former County Chairman Paddy Joe Ryan to trenchant criticism for what Fanning regards as unfair, inaccurate and over-the-top criticism of the players for their role in this episode. It is worth reading but I don’t know if it is online – I haven’t been able to find a link myself.

yea i had heard something similar. Basically the players were quite shocked that ml. ryan handed in is resignation straight away in the matter that he did. Many of them didnt actually think that he would and were expecting at best a shake up of the management team. But no one actually said they would refuse play under him.

Whatever the truths about it, I do think ryan did over-react by resigning when he did. I think he let his anger and emotions get the better and it was almost a 'this is what ye want so' type of knee-jerk reaction. If he had sat on it for a few days maybe things could have been different. Unfortunately for him I dont think theres any going back now

suitcasepink

Jarjohn wrote: »

Well this doesn't add up to our chairman's view on the matter a few weeks back http://examiner.ie/sport/cusack-in-running-for-deise-job-239669.html

Just my own opinion but I wouldnt take every word our chairman says too literally tbh.
Choosing to believe Fanning(to an extent anyway) on this one.

WumBuster

robopaddy wrote: »

yea i had heard something similar. Basically the players were quite shocked that ml. ryan handed in is resignation straight away in the matter that he did. Many of them didnt actually think that he would and were expecting at best a shake up of the management team. But no one actually said they would refuse play under him.

Whatever the truths about it, I do think ryan did over-react by resigning when he did. I think he let his anger and emotions get the better and it was almost a 'this is what ye want so' type of knee-jerk reaction. If he had sat on it for a few days maybe things could have been different. Unfortunately for him I dont think theres any going back now

I dunno really, he didnt murder anyone. If he puts his name forward again i think theres a good chance he'll be reappointed.

Mountainlad

deise_girl wrote: »

Just my own opinion but I wouldnt take every word our chairman says too literally tbh.
Choosing to believe Fanning(to an extent anyway) on this one.

It's true he's been contradicted by Michael Ryan already on that matter, him saying the County board told him the players were meeting.

Would remain skeptical about anything written in a paper at the same time though.

Ballyvoile Boy

Giveitfong wrote: »

I’m surprised there has been no mention here (as far as I am aware) of Phil Fanning’s article on the Michael Ryan affair in the News & Star last week. According to Fanning, there is an agreement between the GAA and the GPA whereby County Boards are required to consult with players’ representatives regarding the appointment of county team managers. In line with this agreement, the Waterford County Board sounded out some senior players in the hurling panel who indicated that a change of manager would be desirable.


According to Fanning, this information was passed on to Michael Ryan who was skeptical about it and proceeded to contact a number of players directly. As Ryan stated on RTE last week, he contacted eight players, of whom only three said that they desired a change of manager. In my own personal opinion, Ryan should not have proceeded in this way, as it put players in a very difficult position to be asked by the person who could still have been manager next year whether they wanted him to stay on as manager.


There therefore appeared to be a conflict between what the County Board were told by the players they consulted and what Michael Ryan was told by the players consulted by him. According to Phil Fanning, “The County Board and Michael Ryan, wanted to know the exact position of the players so they were advised to call a meeting of players as a matter of urgency”. It is not clear from this who actually did the advising and who actually received this advice.


Fanning goes on to say that “The meeting was called for last Sunday morning” but doesn’t say who actually called the meeting and decided on the day, time and venue. The meeting was attended by “no more than eleven” players but that every other player on the panel whom it was possible to contact was asked to state their position on the reappointment of Michael Ryan and his management team. The result was “about two to one” in favour of change and this outcome was communicated to Ryan by Noel Connors.


According to Phil Fanning, Ryan immediately informed the County Secretary that he would not be seeking reappointment and the Secretary instructed the County PRO to release a statement to this effect immediately.


If this account is accurate, then it appears that the players’ meeting was convened at the behest of the County Board who simply wished to know the balance of opinion among the players regarding Ryan’s reappointment. The players did not meet of their own volition and simply conveyed the outcome of their meeting to Michael Ryan who in turn informed the County Secretary. The idea of the players issuing a public statement of their own did not arise. At no stage did the players indicate that they would not be prepared to play if Ryan were reappointed. It was the County Board which issued the press release when they did, and no fault regarding its timing falls on the players.


In his strongly worded article, Phil Fanning subjects members of the national press, posters on social media and, in particular, former County Chairman Paddy Joe Ryan to trenchant criticism for what Fanning regards as unfair, inaccurate and over-the-top criticism of the players for their role in this episode. It is worth reading but I don’t know if it is online – I haven’t been able to find a link myself.

As I've said in the previous thread prior to this article being published, a number of people (most are not from Co. Waterford) have been capitalising on this story for their own benefit since the day of the announcement. Some even took to bragging about the media coverage they were getting. If all of this is true as written above, then a few people in the media should be eating humble pie (which of course they won't, they'll just tweet/write/be interviewed about something else and conveniently ignore what they've already said).

Michael Ryan has done nothing wrong in my book, but neither have the players and they took a lot of harsh criticism in recent weeks and remained dignified and silent about it. The county board may have more than a few questions to answer, but they will go unanswered also. I would doubt if he will go forward for the job again, but he should be asking questions primarily of the county board officials about the sequence of events, if he feels hard done by.

The clubs ultimately do bear responsibility in all of this - they send delegates to the co. board to represent them and vote in the elected officers. No good a member of any club whinging about what goes on in the co. board, unless you know who your club delegate is and have made your feelings known.

In my experience, delegates will vote for the people they think can look after them for a favour - get a player off a suspension at a vital time etc. Just the same as politics in Ireland really. It's no accident that many high up in Waterford GAA are current/former politicans. You need to know how to get votes if you want to be in charge. There's nothing wrong with politicians being in charge by the way and they are still all volunteers giving their time, but it's worth pointing out how things work.

Meanwhile, while all this is going on, there's not a minor hurling league table to be had anywhere on the co. website. If it wasn't for Thomas Keane on Twitter, none of the clubs would know where they stand in the minor competitions. This is happening in a county which will be contesting the All-Ireland minor final in less than 2 weeks!!

Mountainlad

Ballyvoile Boy wrote: »

Meanwhile, while all this is going on, there's not a minor hurling league table to be had anywhere on the co. website. If it wasn't for Thomas Keane on Twitter, none of the clubs would know where they stand in the minor competitions. This is happening in a county which will be contesting the All-Ireland minor final in less than 2 weeks!!

Didn't know this, but I noticed he made a slight error with regard to the Division 3 table. Fourmile and Ardmore was down as a draw when Fourmile won the game by three points.

I think The Observer must be getting their tables off him too as they had the same mistake. Fairplay to him though, he does an awful lot for promoting Waterford GAA on his twitter and blog through reports and updates of goings on around the County. Thanks Tom

alllcounty

Mountainlad wrote: »

Didn't know this, but I noticed he made a slight error with regard to the Division 3 table. Fourmile and Ardmore was down as a draw when Fourmile won the game by three points.

I think The Observer must be getting their tables off him too as they had the same mistake. Fairplay to him though, he does an awful lot for promoting Waterford GAA on his twitter and blog through reports and updates of goings on around the County. Thanks Tom

How come Deise Tom doesn't post on here anymore???

robopaddy

WumBuster wrote: »

I dunno really, he didnt murder anyone. If he puts his name forward again i think theres a good chance he'll be reappointed.

I dont know... I mean if he did where does that leave us then after what has gone on? Water under the bridge? Not likely

UCANCHOOSE

Is there any names being mentioned around about the new manager?

WumBuster

robopaddy wrote: »

I dont know... I mean if he did where does that leave us then after what has gone on? Water under the bridge? Not likely

Water under the bridge for who, him or the players? After whats gone on? i didnt hear any reports of a row or falling out between any of the players and Ryan.

Mountainlad

UCANCHOOSE wrote: »

Is there any names being mentioned around about the new manager?

You can get odds of Colm Parkinson with Diarmuid Lyng at 250/1 on Paddy Power. That's value...

Jarjohn

Congrats to John, Mossie and Jim on their selection and should get a great reception on AI day http://www.hoganstand.com/Hurling/ArticleForm.aspx?ID=199615

seananigans

http://breakingnews.ie/sport/gaa/cinemas-to-screen-hurling-final-for-free-604830.html

Minor game doesnt look to be covered :-( ,but tickets are free and done in the cinema in town ,tickets can be orderd here


http://tickets.ie/event.aspx/gaa-odeon-cinemas-live-screening-all-ireland-hurling-final-odeon-cinemas-08-September-2013/RNM54

thweres tickets in Dublin (Blanch and coolock) for those of us who are exiles, but it means making a speedy zip to the cinema after the minor game is over

robopaddy

WumBuster wrote: »

Water under the bridge for who, him or the players? After whats gone on? i didnt hear any reports of a row or falling out between any of the players and Ryan.

I dont know whether ur trying to be smart or just burying ur head in the sand with regard to the whole thing but to say theres no evidence of a rift between management and players and that ryan can realistically come back and simply take over from where he left off u are deluded.

Black Suir

Sami Jenkis wrote: »

No Semi Finals of the FA Cup aren't, but the champions league is done that way. I'm not for one second implying with my earlier post, that the draws are not done fairly. I'm just giving an opinion as a player that I prefer knowing who our possible Semi finalists are going to be. Some might call it looking too far ahead, and take it a game at a time, but it's just my preference!

If I was a player I would prefer to get over my quarter final clash and then worry who you are playing in the semi finals. Take one game at a time and only think about the next once you are at that stage of the championship.