The iPhone 5s and 5c

Xavi6

sarkozy wrote: »

There's still 4's going around.

Open to correction but I think it's only an 8gig 4S being kept on.

You could grab a second hand 5 though of course from someone upgrading.

quad_red

An interesting take from Engadget;

In my estimation, this is Apple's attempt to make the iPhone lively again. After six years, a certain amount of fatigue has set in. The "throw colors at it" approach has worked beautifully for Apple in the past. The company's sauced up a variety of previous iPod products with new hues, and remember: this is the company that once offered socks in a variety of colors. The iPhone 5c isn't for feature phone users in emerging markets. It's also not for the spec hounds who will be buying an iPhone 5s regardless. By and large, it's a marketing tool to get the masses to pay attention to the iPhone name. Mark my words -- the first prime-time iPhone ads you'll see following today's event will not highlight the iPhone 5s; Apple's already planning to sell one of those to almost every iPhone 5 owner. What you'll see instead are buckets of paint, upbeat music and a revitalized theme surrounding the word iPhone.

http://www.engadget.com/2013/09/10/apples-iphone-5c-isnt-low-cost/

And wired:

Though the faster, sleeker, more powerful phone is unarguably cool, the steps forward are still incremental. And incremental isn’t what the world expects from Apple. Steve Jobs’ death wasn’t an event of worldwide significance because he could craft better spec sheets. Apple’s brand is synonymous with vision, a corporate identity that was once its greatest asset. Now that asset has become a liability.

http://www.wired.com/business/2013/09/apple-annoucements/

seamus

andrewdeerpark wrote: »

A truly cheap iPhone, for say €250 euro simfree.

Yep. When I saw the $99 contract price for the 5C, I honestly thought we were looking at the release of a €200/€250 phone. Looks like it's just bluster, it's a painted iPhone 5, so the product lineup remains effectively unchanged from previous releases.

At the higher end; NFC, wireless charging

Apple still aren't betting on the NFC, and it's easy to see why, since NFC is in general still a niche and unknown technology.
Apple make devices for the general population, not for tech geeks.

There's also the argument that Apple don't do new technologies well. They succeed when they implement proven and well known technologies. When they introduce technology that's not established or well known, they don't tend to do quite so well. Siri is the most recent example of this.

NFC implementation isn't yet in the place when the end-user can just turn it on and it works, like WiFi. It's not mature enough for that, yet. Hence why Apple don't implement.

The same is probably true of wireless charging, though I don't know if wireless charging is being hyped more than it needs to. Is it really that much easier? In addition, the main draw of wireless charging is standards. If everyone builds to the same standard then you can have wireless charging all over the place. Apple don't do industry standards unless they don't have a choice. The Qi standard is still new enough that Apple don't have to adopt it by default, but then it's just Apple out on their own with their own wireless charging standard.

It'll come along eventually, but again it's not seen as something established enough to warrant inclusion. Lots of devices now claim to support wireless charging, but they all still come with a USB cable in the box, not a charging mat.

Frank Lee Midere

andrewdeerpark wrote: »

I never believe that story, that is classic Apple creating a surge with pent up demand and generating queues of people and media interest. Every phone shop I was in the last month was stocked to the hilt with the iPhone 5.

Apple doesn't do that. They get a much greater stock increase by selling more stuff. Nor are they selling more iPhones then they can build. That's not true. It's only true on releases. And I don't see the 5S as having any issues on supply because it doesn't bring much to the table. That biometric scanner might have been great if it did more than scan.

As an iOS fan I don't get why apple fans don't want cheaper devices. Apple seem to forget they are in a platform war. Android has 80% loyalty - less than the iPhone but high. New customers who move to android will mostly stay there.

And why have a new range of phones of you are just replicating the tired old strategy of this years model, last years model and the year before's model. Except last years model now has nasty plastic.

If they had got rid of the 4S and priced the lower end iPhone 5C at 399 ( still more expensive than the lumina) it would sell like gangbusters. To produce a teenage friendly phone with entry level prices of 550 is madness.

efb

I think the high price is to maintain the marque it has established for itself. People pay for the brand and don't like seeing it devalued.

miralize

Anyone want to venture a guess as to when the phones are coming to Ireland? Before December 2013 is a bit too vague for my liking

Gumbo

efb wrote: »

I think the high price is to maintain the marque it has established for itself. People pay for the brand and don't like seeing it devalued.

In fairness, i dont see Samsung dropping the price of the S5 when its released.

whiterebel

murpho999 wrote: »

Why are people so convinced that the Lumia is the big threat.

They have not done well at all.

People go on here as if iPhone has been a disaster for last few years and ignore that it sells in huge numbers.

Also, stock price reaction today is no indication of how successful a product will be.

There are some names that you only ever see here trolling after Apple events.

miralize

I laughed

IRLConor

efb wrote: »

I think the high price is to maintain the marque it has established for itself. People pay for the brand and don't like seeing it devalued.

It's more likely at a high price to maintain the per-device profit margins that Apple usually enjoys.

I don't know of any product that Apple has ever sold at a reduced profit margin in order to gain market share. There was a great analysis done years ago about the laptop market (I can't find a link right now). Apple at the time had a tiny fraction of unit sales but made more profit than all the other sellers combined.

In the smartphone world they're a bit more nuanced in their approach since they know that market share translates into better long term App Store and iTunes revenue but unless I'm very much mistaken they're still keen on making a profit per device before the app purchases start rolling in.

That's why I think the iPhone 5C is not as cheap as people were hoping. I think people were thinking "make cheap iPhone, capture more market" but Apple were thinking "reduce manufacturing cost, make more money".

ION08

I read various articles that say the iPhone 5C's rear lights up?

Are there any pics of this? Is it the logo that lights up or the whole cover or what?

For such a fairly significant aesthetic feature, they haven't given it a lot of focus or explained it very well

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/tech/hardware/Apple-replaces-iPhone-5-with-iPhone-5S-and-iPhone-5C/articleshow/22481218.cms

new_maniac

IRLConor wrote: »

It's more likely at a high price to maintain the per-device profit margins that Apple usually enjoys.

I don't know of any product that Apple has ever sold at a reduced profit margin in order to gain market share. There was a great analysis done years ago about the laptop market (I can't find a link right now). Apple at the time had a tiny fraction of unit sales but made more profit than all the other sellers combined.

In the smartphone world they're a bit more nuanced in their approach since they know that market share translates into better long term App Store and iTunes revenue but unless I'm very much mistaken they're still keen on making a profit per device before the app purchases start rolling in.

That's why I think the iPhone 5C is not as cheap as people were hoping. I think people were thinking "make cheap iPhone, capture more market" but Apple were thinking "reduce manufacturing cost, make more money".

100% agree with this, at the start when I first heard the news of a new iPhone and a supposed cheap iPhone, I was thinking "make cheap iPhone, capture more market", but someone pointed out yesterday afternoon that Apple never said they were releasing a budget phone, It was then that I got thinking....are they just selling a colorful variant of the new iPhone? What they have actually done is repackage the iPhone 5 and sell it like its a brand new phone.

SpaceTime

I've been using both Android and iOS for some time and I like both.

Android's definitely a lot more cutting edge about adding geeky features but what I like about iOS is the appliance-like simplicity of it and Apple's support for software updates.

I have been shafted by both Samsung and HTC where updates arrived ridiculously late because of carrier-specific software that just never seemed to arrive in anything remotely like a timely manner where as Apple cuts the carrier out of the loop and you get an iOS update when it comes out regardless of which carrier you're on.

The other issue I have with Android is that it allows apps to have ridiculous privileges to access data and phone functions by default. You install something totally innocuous like a bus timetable or something and discover it's looking for privileges to access your text messages and phone calls or address book etc.

I know Google's fixing this in the next version of Android, but it's still only going to be people who've bought a new android phone in a few months time that will be able to control that and you can be sure that a lot of people will still be on Android 4.1 and 4.2 for quite a long time to come.

I feel a lot more secure on iOS than on Android for that reason.

The other thing I've found is that Apple's iPhone cameras actually take on average very good pictures.
My HTC One takes absolutely awful photographs almost all the time. I'm extremely disappointed with it compared to an iPhone 4S which it replaced.

I just think if you buy an iPhone you get something pretty rock solid, reliable and well put together with good software available where as if you buy an Android it can be somewhat pot luck depending on which manufacturer you go with and which network you're on.

The other thing is that I just don't really trust Google anymore. I'm finding things are being asked for by default far too much. Like for example, I was absolutely horrified to find all my HTC One's camera photos uploaded to Google+ without my explicit permission.

OK, they weren't published but I had no intention of uploading them to a server and I did not opt into that service, at least not deliberately and I am a pretty IT-savvy person.

That kind of thing is driving me off the Android platform entirely.

Apple makes money out of the hardware and the App Store purchases. Google's not really making very much money out of hardware at all and its business model is advertising. So, I'm pretty certain I can trust Apple more than I can trust Google as they've less incentive to use my data.

new_maniac

SpaceTime wrote: »

I've been using both Android and iOS for some time and I like both.

Android's definitely a lot more cutting edge about adding geeky features but what I like about iOS is the appliance-like simplicity of it and Apple's support for software updates.

I have been shafted by both Samsung and HTC where updates arrived ridiculously late because of carrier-specific software that just never seemed to arrive in anything remotely like a timely manner where as Apple cuts the carrier out of the loop and you get an iOS update when it comes out regardless of which carrier you're on.

The other issue I have with Android is that it allows apps to have ridiculous privileges to access data and phone functions by default. You install something totally innocuous like a bus timetable or something and discover it's looking for privileges to access your text messages and phone calls or address book etc.

I know Google's fixing this in the next version of Android, but it's still only going to be people who've bought a new android phone in a few months time that will be able to control that and you can be sure that a lot of people will still be on Android 4.1 and 4.2 for quite a long time to come.

I feel a lot more secure on iOS than on Android for that reason.

The other thing I've found is that Apple's iPhone cameras actually take on average very good pictures.
My HTC One takes absolutely awful photographs almost all the time. I'm extremely disappointed with it compared to an iPhone 4S which it replaced.

I just think if you buy an iPhone you get something pretty rock solid, reliable and well put together with good software available where as if you buy an Android it can be somewhat pot luck depending on which manufacturer you go with and which network you're on.

The other thing is that I just don't really trust Google anymore. I'm finding things are being asked for by default far too much. Like for example, I was absolutely horrified to find all my HTC One's camera photos uploaded to Google+ without my explicit permission.

OK, they weren't published but I had no intention of uploading them to a server and I did not opt into that service, at least not deliberately and I am a pretty IT-savvy person.

That kind of thing is driving me off the Android platform entirely.

Apple makes money out of the hardware and the App Store purchases. Google's not really making very much money out of hardware at all and its business model is advertising. So, I'm pretty certain I can trust Apple more than I can trust Google as they've less incentive to use my data.

I definitely see your point here. Though I am an android user and I can't see myself going to an iPhone, this thing about privacy crops up in my mind on a regular basis. To be honest I don't download a lot of apps because I don't really need much more than the default functionality of the device (the odd game or my banking app are the height of my app downloads), but It does concern me that apps want access to my location and things like that. The other thing I don't like on the Play Store is that even though I have the content maturity set to the cleanest level, it still insists on giving me indecent junk on the first page of the store (I know it's further down the page and out of sight, but still, if you ask for clean you should get it, I'm sure iPhone's don't have this problem)

whiterebel

SpaceTime wrote: »

The other issue I have with Android is that it allows apps to have ridiculous privileges to access data and phone functions by default. You install something totally innocuous like a bus timetable or something and discover it's looking for privileges to access your text messages and phone calls or address book etc.

I was shocked when I was trying to fix something on my son's Android phone when I saw the privileges most, if not all, apps were demanding.

GorillaRising

What kind of apps are these? I've never had an issue with permissions. I'd be fairly stringent anyway though.

Alpha Dog 1

whiterebel wrote: »

I was shocked when I was trying to fix something on my son's Android phone when I saw the privileges most, if not all, apps were demanding.

These are all on the iPhone as well it's just that they are listed on Android phones.

whiterebel

Alpha Dog 1 wrote: »

These are all on the iPhone as well it's just that they are listed on Android phones.

You are asked whether you wish to share the information with the developer or Apple, and you can opt out. I don't recall this being asked on the android devices.

wayne040576

whiterebel wrote: »

You are asked whether you wish to share the information with the developer or Apple, and you can opt out. I don't recall this being asked on the android devices.

It asks you when you are installing the app.

ION08

ION08 wrote: »

I read various articles that say the iPhone 5C's rear lights up?

Are there any pics of this? Is it the logo that lights up or the whole cover or what?

For such a fairly significant aesthetic feature, they haven't given it a lot of focus or explained it very well

http://economictimes.indiatimes.com/tech/hardware/Apple-replaces-iPhone-5-with-iPhone-5S-and-iPhone-5C/articleshow/22481218.cms

"... It also has an 8 megapixel camera, live photo filters and a rear cover that lights up."

Nobody else intrigued by this no ??

new_maniac

ION08 wrote: »

"... It also has an 8 megapixel camera, live photo filters and a rear cover that lights up."

Nobody else intrigued by this no ??

I did try to find out but I don't see anything; I don't even think they show it off in the promo video on their website

ION08

new_maniac wrote: »

I did try to find out but I don't see anything; I don't even think they show it off in the promo video on their website

Yeah exactly, which seems very strange to me.

Yet if you google that phrase its in pretty much every article about the 5C

new_maniac

ION08 wrote: »

Yeah exactly, which seems very strange to me.

Yet if you google that phrase its in pretty much every article about the 5C

Possibly, every news website in the world has got this one liner from the same place and it was misinterpreted from the beginning...it does have a flash on the back, but i would say that's it....a light up back is nothing more than a battery wasting atheistic (as cool as it sounds, don't get me wrong) and smartphones only tend to have fancy stuff on them for a good reason (like the touch ID on the 5S).

ION08

new_maniac wrote: »

Possibly, every news website in the world has got this one liner from the same place and it was misinterpreted from the beginning...it does have a flash on the back, but i would say that's it....a light up back is nothing more than a battery wasting atheistic (as cool as it sounds, don't get me wrong) and smartphones only tend to have fancy stuff on them for a good reason (like the touch ID on the 5S).

Quite possibly the case..

I was listening to the radio on the way home from work yesterday around 7pm and they were giving an overview of the 5S and they mentioned it had an "illuminated ring around the home button" :rolleyes:

new_maniac

ION08 wrote: »

Quite possibly the case..

I was listening to the radio on the way home from work yesterday around 7pm and they were giving an overview of the 5S and they mentioned it had an "illuminated ring around the home button" :rolleyes:

Yes, that had been floating around, but it too was all speculation on the technology websites, turns out its a stainless steel activator

PrettyBoy

Was planning on upgrading my 4S but none of the new features impress me tbh, Apple are getting less innovative every year.

new_maniac

PrettyBoy wrote: »

Was planning on upgrading my 4S but none of the new features impress me tbh, Apple are getting less innovative every year.

I've sort of found this with most smartphones though, they've got a little..well...boring

.ak

I thought the 5C was going to be released to rival Samsung's midrange phones. It's just another expensive phone. Think they're missing a trick by not releasing a 'Nano' style phone tbh.

yer man!

dubmick wrote: »

599 / 699 for the 5C. Low cost my arse. Apple talking the p*ss.

414 Euro in the states

PrettyBoy

Just heard on the radio that the 5S is "expected to cost €800 out of contract"? Will there be a 16GB 5S?