Irish teenager is 'being beaten to hell' in a Cairo prison

Joe10000

I think it is reasonable to expect that if you travel overseas and take part in a protest in a country in turmoil that it may not turn out ok.

bumper234

denhaagenite wrote: »

Even if I have not followed the whole thread, you didn't even follow my whole post which you have quoted from. This is the first line of my post, not just the part that you bolded!

But he is not protesting he is trolling BIG difference!

denhaagenite wrote: »

This is the type of poster that has earned ridicule and contempt. You might not like the answers that you have got but the questions have been answered multiple times. I'm not going to presume what you want him to say, but he has provided answers.

Apple monkey snotrag....That's what his "answers" equate to.

denhaagenite wrote: »

This is the type of poster that has earned ridicule and contempt. You might not like the answers that you have got but the questions have been answered multiple times. I'm not going to presume what you want him to say, but he has provided answers.

He was saying that in answer to this...not you

Cody Pomeray wrote: »

what's with the sudden emergence of a Dutch sub-community of posters on this topic?

Boombastic wrote: »

I'm eligible to vote in Ireland as I am a Citizen. I exercise* my right to vote.
I holiday in Holland every year. I don't interfere in Dutch Politics or attend protests there as I am not eligible to vote there. I don't holiday in countries with unstable governments on the verge of meltdown. I don't send my children on holidays in to near war zones. I would ask my relations from the unstable region to holiday in Ireland, as I would not want to see the shot and it's the year of the gathering and all



* I don't go down to the polling booth and start doing sit-ups and other exercises :pac:

bumper234 wrote: »

You holiday in Holland? Are you from there? Do you have family there?

Boombastic wrote: »

They obviously follow politics passionately enough to go protesting, just wondering if they felt so passionate about any issue in their country of citizenship to take to the streets.


Yes, and...?

denhaagenite

bumper234 wrote: »

He was saying that in answer to this...not you

Again, supposition.

The post was a page after Boom's post, the poster had posted numerous times since that and it was directly after my post. They haven't posted since. I don't know how someone making it clear that they holiday in NL and are not from there would equate to a "Dutch subculture".

To be honest, I'm pretty sure that the OP was basically in relation to the sensationalist headline. I don't want to get drawn into making inflammatory comments to shock people into siding with me.

My stance, again, is that this family were in fact holidaying with their extended family in Egypt, as they have been for years. However, they have also been protesting in favour of an undemocratic political group when on holiday in Egypt, for years. Yet they choose to reside in and enjoy the nationality of a democratic country??

The family that are in Ireland pleading for the help of the consulate have deliberately misled the media, consulate and DFA into assisting them, even though the truth would just as well have warranted the DFA to act- I believe that the role of the DFA is to assist anyone in distress in a foreign country, no matter what the case. I would like to know why their family are doing this, and why we should have any more sympathy for them than the girls in Peru, some young lad who tried to assasinate a president in Bolivia or a girl who is on trial for murdering a baby in Boston. In fact, their political leanings would threaten the democratic society that I enjoy and am proud to live in! That and they have willingly put a minor in mortal danger.

Leftist

denhaagenite wrote: »

. I would like to know why their family are doing this, and why we should have any more sympathy for them than the girls in Peru, some young lad who tried to assasinate a president in Bolivia or a girl who is on trial for murdering a baby in Boston. In fact, their political leanings would threaten the democratic society that I enjoy and am proud to live in! That and they have willingly put a minor in mortal danger.

muslims protesting is the same as killing babies? think your mask has slipped.

threaten democracy in ireland

denhaagenite

Leftist wrote: »

muslims protesting is the same as killing babies? think your mask has slipped.

It is an accusation, she has not been convicted- innocent until proven guilty. We haven't even got any solid proof that the Cairo 4 have been accused.

Means Of Escape

Joe10000 wrote: »

I think it is reasonable to expect that if you travel overseas and take part in a protest in a country in turmoil that it may not turn out ok.

Agreed
Would you walk with a banner in Zimbabwe calling for the removal of Mugabe and not expect a rifle butt in the jaw !?!?

bumper234

Boombastic wrote: »

I'm eligible to vote in Ireland as I am a Citizen. I exercise* my right to vote.
I holiday in Holland every year. I don't interfere in Dutch Politics or attend protests there as I am not eligible to vote there. I don't holiday in countries with unstable governments on the verge of meltdown. I don't send my children on holidays in to near war zones. I would ask my relations from the unstable region to holiday in Ireland, as I would not want to see the shot and it's the year of the gathering and all



* I don't go down to the polling booth and start doing sit-ups and other exercises :pac:

denhaagenite wrote: »

Again, supposition.

The post was a page after Boom's post, the poster had posted numerous times since that and it was directly after my post. They haven't posted since. I don't know how someone making it clear that they holiday in NL and are not from there would equate to a "Dutch subculture".

To be honest, I'm pretty sure that the OP was basically in relation to the sensationalist headline. I don't want to get drawn into making inflammatory comments to shock people into siding with me.

My stance, again, is that this family were in fact holidaying with their extended family in Egypt, as they have been for years. However, they have also been protesting in favour of an undemocratic political group when on holiday in Egypt, for years. Yet they choose to reside in and enjoy the nationality of a democratic country??

The family that are in Ireland pleading for the help of the consulate have deliberately misled the media, consulate and DFA into assisting them, even though the truth would just as well have warranted the DFA to act- I believe that the role of the DFA is to assist anyone in distress in a foreign country, no matter what the case. I would like to know why their family are doing this, and why we should have any more sympathy for them than the girls in Peru, some young lad who tried to assasinate a president in Bolivia or a girl who is on trial for murdering a baby in Boston. In fact, their political leanings would threaten the democratic society that I enjoy and am proud to live in! That and they have willingly put a minor in mortal danger.

Again thank you for clarifying that you don't read posts correctly. I will post this once more for you to see where you went wrong and then i will put you in the same contempt box as boom. Good luck screaming at the clouds you both seem to enjoy it.

bumper234 wrote: »

You holiday in Holland? Are you from there? Do you have family there?

Boombastic wrote: »

They obviously follow politics passionately enough to go protesting, just wondering if they felt so passionate about any issue in their country of citizenship to take to the streets.


Yes, and...?

ruthloss

I have heard their sister (who is safe here in Ireland) slating the Egyptian Army, the Egyptian Government and it's supporters., now if any of my family was being held in a foreign prison, I hope I would have the cop on not to piss off their captors.

denhaagenite

I hve agreed with you before that Boom's posts are sometimes ambiguous. He did clarify a good 40 minutes before Cody's heinous post that he is not Dutch, and that he only holidays there.

Boombastic's post clarified his nationality here in 440:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=86127356&postcount=440

and Cody's post was 465:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=86129622&postcount=465

But this is all completely off topic.

Means Of Escape

ruthloss wrote: »

I have heard their sister (who is safe here in Ireland) slating the Egyptian Army, the Egyptian Government and it's supporters., now if any of my family was being held in a foreign prison, I hope I would have the cop on not to piss off their captors.

Oh dear might be a lot of Nodins dragging themselves away ,heads bowed.
Time will tell.

bumper234

denhaagenite wrote: »

I hve agreed with you before that Boom's posts are sometimes ambiguous. He did clarify a good 40 minutes before Cody's heinous post that he is not Dutch, and that he only holidays there.

Boombastic's post clarified his nationality here in 440:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=86127356&postcount=440

and Cody's post was 465:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=86129622&postcount=465

But this is all completely off topic.

He clarified in this post when asked is he from Holland that he IS from Holland!

Boombastic wrote: »

They obviously follow politics passionately enough to go protesting, just wondering if they felt so passionate about any issue in their country of citizenship to take to the streets.


Yes, and...?

justanotherone

Some posters keep suggesting that the Malawa familiy were "only" "protesting" about "something they felt strongly about" as if "protesting" is some automatically innocent and noble and morally neutral activity.

It is all in the context.

If the Malawa family had gone to Northern Ireland, put on bowler hats, sashes, Glasgow rangers shirts, union flags and flutes, and gone to " protest " about something they " felt strongly about ", and subsequently found themselves banged up in a police cell, with a bandaged hand, would they be receiving sympathy because you see they were " simply protesting " about an issue close to their hearts and " simply taken refuge " in Drumcree churchyard because the protest had turned a bit violent ?

If the Malawa family had gone to the North Of England, put on Premiership football shirts and the Flag Of St George, to protest in support of the English Defence League, something they "felt strongly about" and subsequently found themselves banged up in a police cell, with a bandaged hand, would they be receiving sympathy because they were " simply protesting " and " taken refuge " in a city centre pub because the protest had turned a bit violent ?

What do the Malawa's " feel strongly about " ?

They appear to SUPPORT of the Muslim Brotherhood, who were attempting to FORCE Sharia Law on everybody, regardless of whether they wanted it or not. Not just Sharia Law, but lots of other nice things, like women having compulsory inpections of their genitals to prove they are virgins (and if not, what then ?)

From press reports it appears the Malawa mother also went to Egypt. Correct me if I am wrong, but it appears the press reports they may have a siblings who live in Egypt. Certainly they have cousins of the same age.

Why is it that the Malawa's cousins in Egypt are not languishing in a cell. Why is the Malawa mother not in a cell. Egypt is a populous country. Not everybody is in a cell. What did, or did not, the Malawa cousins do that the Malawa siblings did to end up in detention ? How is it that the Malawa cousins, citizens of Egypt, managed to not end up in the same situation as their " Irish " cousins ?

wes

justanotherone wrote: »

Not just Sharia Law, but lots of other nice things, like women having compulsory inpections of their genitals to prove they are virgins (and if not, what then ?)

The military did that one:

Egypt: A year after ‘virginity tests’, women victims of army violence still seek justice


Not that we should let facts get in the way of things, or anything. Seems to me you are willing to invent any kind of fiction to smear this family. I really do wonder what your problem with them is exactly.

Also, Sharia law existed in the previous regime as well (run by a former military man Mubarak), the one the military Junta are bringing back, and there backed by Saudi Arabia, who [sarcasm] well known for there opposition to sharia law [/sarcasm].

justanotherone wrote: »

Why is it that the Malawa's cousins in Egypt are not languishing in a cell. Why is the Malawa mother not in a cell. Egypt is a populous country. Not everybody is in a cell. What did, or did not, the Malawa cousins do that the Malawa siblings did to end up in detention ? How is it that the Malawa cousins, citizens of Egypt, managed to not end up in the same situation as their " Irish " cousins ?

Why did the military junta decide to shoot protesters in the street? I think it can be very hard to contemplate, the actions of people who would shoot protesters in the street. Seems to me the Junta is looking for revenge.

You seem rather desperate to insinuate that they have done something, so are coming up with rather vague question to suggest they were up to something, ignoring the fact that the Junta doesn't really need any reason to kill or lock people up. They did it for year when they were in power under Mubarak, and they will have plenty more time to do so now.

Boombastic

Nodin wrote: »

And a big sneer.

It's been clear you've been implying its all to do with muslims since the OP. I've already shown this, and you're ignoring the answer.

Have you ever attended a bank bail out protest or a protest on an irish issue?

No, that is what you are implying. You equated radical element with Muslim and Islam and that is something you to examine about your self, because you are doing the Muslims community no favours with your remarks

bumper234 wrote: »

Again thank you for clarifying that you don't read posts correctly. I will post this once more for you to see where you went wrong and then i will put you in the same contempt box as boom. Good luck screaming at the clouds you both seem to enjoy it.

You seem fascinated by my 'ancestral home'. Can you declare yours, or are your just being a racist /xenophobe?

justanotherone

I am not suggesting they were " up to something ". I think it is fairly clear what they were up to; Spending the last few weeks getting themselves involved in protests in highly volatile, dangerous and unpredictable circumstances, not only against all the warnings issues by the DFA, but in direct contravention of the advice. Putting themselves in the way of live ammunition and death or severe injury. Nothing more and nothing less.

And as such, I don't see why, some 5 weeks later, the Irish taxpayer is supposed to have an outpouring of sympathy for them. They made their bed.

I am not buying this " only protesting ". As I said, it is the context. No sympathy is extended to people who are " only protesting " in support of violent unionism or the English Defence League, or the National Association of Man Boy Love. Simply protesting is not enough. They were putting themselves in harms way.

I think they were stupid and arrogant, and by the look of their facebook posts, drunk on finding the sort of frenzied Islamic activity (Day Of Rage) they could previously only watch from the Dublin sofas.

They were stupid, because their cousins in Egypt had more sense than to end up banged up in a cell.

And they were probably arrogant, because perhaps they considered that holding Irish passports they would have a get out of jail free card if things did go tits up.

I am not in favour of Sharia Law. I don't support the Muslim Brotherhood. I don't support what is currently happening in Egypt and I abhore the bloodshed and violence.

But some muslims in the Decadent West they despair of so much but continue to reside in, think it is fine to support intollerant Islamic dictatorships. Excecpt they don't have to live under such rules. But they are quite happy to impose it on others.

bumper234

Boombastic wrote: »

No, that is what you are implying. You equated radical element with Muslim and Islam and that is something you to examine about your self, because you are doing the Muslims community no favours with your remarks



You seem fascinated by my 'ancestral home'. Can you declare yours, or are your just being a racist /xenophobe?

Sure i am from England i was born there and moved to Ireland when i was 12. I hold a British passport and served in the British army from 1988-1993. happy now?:rolleyes:

Boombastic

bumper234 wrote: »

Sure i am from England i was born there and moved to Ireland when i was 12. I hold a British passport and served in the British army from 1988-1993. happy now?:rolleyes:

It doesn't make a difference to me one way or the other. I'm not a xenophobe or a racist. It seemed of great importance to you though, where my ancestral home is

Sunglasses Ron

bumper234 wrote: »

. I hold a British passport and served in the British army from 1988-1993.

Having socially ran into a few ex BA service members in my time I can say that the term "British military intelligence" has been seriously oxymoronical (a new word. Yeahhhh)

bumper234

Sunglasses Ron wrote: »

Having socially ran into a few ex BA service members in my time I can say that the term "military intelligence" has been seriously oxymoronical (a new word. Yeahhhh)

As opposed to the Irish army right? Shout Bang Bang lads we can't afford the bullets:rolleyes:

bumper234

Boombastic wrote: »

It doesn't make a difference to me one way or the other. I'm not a xenophobe or a racist. It seemed of great importance to you though, where my ancestral home is

Yet you asked me and others SO many times

Boombastic

bumper234 wrote: »

As opposed to the Irish army right? Shout Bang Bang lads we can't afford the bullets:rolleyes:

So you support as much killing as possible?


What has this got to do with this thread? (Apart from you supporting violence) The Irish Army are not war mongers....

Boombastic

bumper234 wrote: »

Yet you asked me and others SO many times

Ah bumper, if you look back, you asked me, I answered, you went ranting about it again?? but lets not get in to quotes posts of old again


Most intelligent people reading the thread can see for themselves

bumper234

Boombastic wrote: »

So you support as much killing as possible?

In the theater of war? Of course i do.

Boombastic wrote: »

What has this got to do with this thread? (Apart from you supporting violence) The Irish Army are not war mongers....

Nothing to do with this thread myself and the other poster were comparing knowledge of different armies, Do you feel you should jump on everyone's post?

Sunglasses Ron

bumper234 wrote: »

As opposed to the Irish army right? Shout Bang Bang lads we can't afford the bullets:rolleyes:

I know the odd gob****e who joined the Irish army.

And the FCA, good god.

Still, the BA vets were generally semi literate cavemen.

Just my opinion of course.....

bumper234

Sunglasses Ron wrote: »

I know the odd gob****e who joined the Irish army.

And the FCA, good god.

Still, the BA vets were generally semi literate cavemen.

Just my opinion of course.....

Good job i wasn't a squaddie then i guess:)

Boombastic

Sunglasses Ron wrote: »

I know the odd gob****e who joined the Irish army.

And the FCA, good god.

Still, the BA vets were generally semi literate cavemen.

Just my opinion of course.....

Do the come crying for the Irish Embassy to save them when they get hurt?

wes

justanotherone wrote: »

I am not suggesting they were " up to something ".

Those question you were asking, would suggest otherwise. Not to mention this statement:

justanotherone wrote: »

I am not buying this " only protesting ".

So you are contradicting yourself, or are just going out of your way to be as confusing as possible.

justanotherone wrote: »

As I said, it is the context. No sympathy is extended to people who are " only protesting " in support of violent unionism or the English Defence League, or the National Association of Man Boy Love. Simply protesting is not enough. They were putting themselves in harms way.

EDL protests tend to be violent, and they weren't btw protesting in support of any kind of violence, and lastly comparing them to NAMBLA, is just another example of your own personal smear campaign against them, as evidenced when you made up the false claim in regards to the Muslim Brotherhood engaging in virginity tests, when it was actually the military they were protesting against, who do those tests.

As for putting themselves in harms way, they couldn't have possibly have know the military would go on a shooting spree of protesters.

justanotherone wrote: »

I think they were stupid and arrogant, and by the look of their facebook posts, drunk on finding the sort of frenzied Islamic activity (Day Of Rage) they could previously only watch from the Dublin sofas.

So what if they were. They still have the right to peaceful protest. Again, you seem to have some rather personal issues with these people for some reason.

justanotherone wrote: »

They were stupid, because their cousins in Egypt had more sense than to end up banged up in a cell.

So there stupid now? Seems to me there were more the victims of plain bad luck.

justanotherone wrote: »

And they were probably arrogant, because perhaps they considered that holding Irish passports they would have a get out of jail free card if things did go tits up.

So there arrogant and stupid, and any other name you can come with it. You really seem to hate this family for some reason.

justanotherone wrote: »

But some muslims in the Decadent West they despair of so much but continue to reside in, think it is fine to support intollerant Islamic dictatorships.

So they were supporting a Islamic dictatorship now? The Muslim Brotherhood, while authoritarian, was not a dictatorship.

justanotherone wrote: »

Excecpt they don't have to live under such rules. But they are quite happy to impose it on others.

How exactly is protesting on the streets imposing anything on anyone exactly? You seem to be happy to hurl out hyperbole, and any kind of fiction to smear these protesters.

Boombastic

wes wrote: »

....................
As for putting themselves in harms way, they couldn't have possibly have know the military would go on a shooting spree of protesters.
.................
.

Of course they knew there was the possibility..this wasn't the first incident of violence in Cario in recent weeks and they still choose to bring their teenage brother along for the lol's

danniemcq

mod note:

A new thread has been created here. Please read the OP before posting. Thanks