John Giles Dream Teams

Will I Amnt

Andersonisgod wrote: »

1 game, reason given was that Casillas had 15 days less pre season training than Lopez. I think we can all sleep safely in our beds knowing that if the Champions League final was on next Saturday, it'd be Casillas starting for Real Madrid.

I deleted that post. Not getting into this actually.
The Italian league supporter is harping on about Buffon. The Spanish league supporter about Casillas and the English league supporter about Schmeichel.
It's going nowhere.

bullvine

mitosis wrote: »

I thought you left a couple of times already?

I admire your worship for the great Schmeichel, it's admirable, but in the real world, outside of Man U, Buffon is rated as the best ever to play the game. And I don't mean just by Seaneh!!!

http://www.iffhs.de/?388d85ff8b00388f05f4cbc0385fdcdc3bfcdc0aec70aeedb88419

In fact, purely statistically, Schmeichel is only 4th

Dida at 14??

Seaneh

bullvine wrote: »

What utter rubbish, you have already proved you don't know what your talking about because you thought Michael Laudrup played in it. Schmeichel saved Van Basten's Peno in the Semi and was out of this world in the final against the then World Champions.

He also conceded 4 goals in 4 games, including 2 in the semi's.
It was Larsen's goals that got them to the Final and Ladrup was the best player at the tournament. I made one mistake in thinking Michael Laudrup played, which is an easy mistake seeing as he was their best player by a fecking country mile at the time.
Look, I've already said he was a great player, but he wasn't the best of all time, not even close to Buffon or Iker.

SweepTheLeg

Will I Amnt wrote: »

I deleted that post. Not getting into this actually.
The Italian league supporter is harping on about Buffon. The Spanish league supporter about Casillas and the Man Utd supporter about Schmeichel.
It's going nowhere.

Fixed.

Seaneh

bullvine wrote: »

Dida at 14??

2 champions league, few league titles, few fifpro awards, world cup... he had his moments.

I think he was ****e for his last few seasons and prone to turning his brain off, but on form, at the time, he was unplayable.

bullvine

Seaneh wrote: »

2 champions league, few league titles, few fifpro awards, world cup... he had his moments.

I think he was ****e for his last few seasons and prone to turning his brain off, but on form, at the time, he was unplayable.

When did he win the World Cup? cause I remember Marcos in 2002 in nets for the entire tournament

bucketybuck

SweepTheLeg wrote: »

Do you know anything about football? It was because he and Ramos fell out with Mourinho. Same reason Ramos was dropped for games.

I know for damn sure that Schmeichel at 32 ain't ever getting dropped for Diego Lopez, and certainly not by two different managers.

sReq | uTeK

Seaneh wrote: »

2 champions league, few league titles, few fifpro awards, world cup... he had his moments.

I think he was ****e for his last few seasons and prone to turning his brain off, but on form, at the time, he was unplayable.

Next it will be Bruce Grobbelaar

PhlegmyMoses

mitosis wrote: »

I thought you left a couple of times already?

I admire your worship for the great Schmeichel, it's admirable, but in the real world, outside of Man U, Buffon is rated as the best ever to play the game. And I don't mean just by Seaneh!!!

http://www.iffhs.de/?388d85ff8b00388f05f4cbc0385fdcdc3bfcdc0aec70aeedb88419

In fact, purely statistically, Schmeichel is only 4th

Er, what are these statistics? From what I can see, those numbers are points allocated from votes from people who picked subjectively. Unless I'm reading it wrong. A definitive statistic is always objective.

SweepTheLeg

bucketybuck wrote: »

I know for damn sure that Schmeichel at 32 ain't ever getting dropped for Diego Lopez, and certainly not by two different managers.

Mourinho dropped Casillas and Ramos because he fell out with them. Nothing to do with their ability. Also it doesn't matter who Anchelotti chooses because Casillas will always be picked first for Spain.

Seaneh

bullvine wrote: »

When did he win the World Cup? cause I remember Marcos in 2002 in nets for the entire tournament

He has a medal, didn't play though.

bullvine

Seaneh wrote: »

He has a medal, didn't play though.

Your clutching now really, he made no contribution to a world cup win unlike Iker or Buffon.

Rushden

I must be the only one that thinks Casillas is extremely overrated

bucketybuck

SweepTheLeg wrote: »

Mourinho dropped Casillas and Ramos because he fell out with them. Nothing to do with their ability. Also it doesn't matter who Anchelotti chooses because Casillas will always be picked first for Spain.

Ha. He got dropped twice supposedly in his prime and apparently it just doesn't matter. Thats rational.

I'd say Schmeichel at 32 could have kicked Mourinho in the balls and he still wouldn't have been dropped.

Giggsy11

Seaneh wrote: »

He has a medal, didn't play though.

Lol, Gibson and Obertan (if he got one) deserves their PL medal 100 times more than Dida's world cup medal.

Not a single min on the pitch and you are using that World cup medal as a stat.

Dcully

Id probably make room for Pavel Nedved, what a player!

SweepTheLeg

Rushden wrote: »

I must be the only one that thinks Casillas is extremely overrated

He's earned his place as the top goalkeeper. Re watch some Euro/WC matches of him.

bucketybuck wrote: »

I'd say Schmeichel at 32 could have kicked Mourinho in the balls and he still wouldn't have been dropped.

Are you 12?

rob316

Where's Gareth Bale???

Will I Amnt

Seaneh wrote: »

He has a medal, didn't play though.

Wonder if that guy that got Mourinho's medal he threw into the crowd after winning the league is in the Premier League winning managers records.

SweepTheLeg

Dcully wrote: »

Id probably make room for Pavel Nedved, what a player!

That Juve team with Nedved/Davids/Del Piero/Trezeguet/Camoranesi was unreal.

Dcully

Another one to add Hristo Stoichkov crazy but brilliant.

Seaneh

bullvine wrote: »

Your clutching now really, he made no contribution to a world cup win unlike Iker or Buffon.

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Lol, Gibson and Obertan (if he got one) deserves their PL medal 100 times more than Dida's world cup medal.

Not a single min on the pitch and you are using that World cup medal as a stat.

Will I Amnt wrote: »

Wonder if that guy that got Mourinho's medal he threw into the crowd after winning the league is in the Premier League winning managers records.

Bit farcical to compare those situations with a player with 91 caps for Brazil, won 2 champions leagues, the first goal keeper ever to play 200 Serie A games for Milan, he first ever Brazilian 'Keeper to be nominated for the Ballon D'or, played in the 2006 WC Finals, only condeeding 2 goals in 6 games, first ever winner of the FIFpro Goalkeeper of the year award, and on and on and on.

I don't think he's anywhere near the best ever, or even of his generation, but for a few years he was one of the best in the world and people, especially people who have watched him about 5 times in their entire lives, completely write him off, which is ****ing retarded.

bullvine

Dcully wrote: »

Another one to add Hristo Stoichkov crazy but brilliant.

Great player but not ahead of the likes of Van Basten, Romario, Muller I would think

Giggsy11

Seaneh wrote: »

Bit farcical to compare those situations with a player with 91 caps for Brazil, won 2 champions leagues, the first goal keeper ever to play 200 Serie A games for Milan, he first ever Brazilian 'Keeper to be nominated for the Ballon D'or, played in the 2006 WC Finals, only condeeding 2 goals in 6 games, first ever winner of the FIFpro Goalkeeper of the year award, and on and on and on.

I don't think he's anywhere near the best ever, or even of his generation, but for a few years he was one of the best in the world and people, especially people who have watched him about 5 times in their entire lives, completely write him off, which is ****ing retarded.

:eek:

Who has written him off? For a record all the posts were about his world cup medal and nothing more. Like you said it's a ****ing retarded post.

Seaneh

Giggsy11 wrote: »

:eek:

Who has written him off? For a record all the posts were about his world cup medal and nothing more. Like you said it's a ****ing retarded post.

No, someone questioned him being in a top 100 list, I posted his achievements, he has a world cup medal, he was part of the brazil team for over a decade. He wasn't amazing but he was very, very good.

Nalz

Seaneh wrote: »

was cringe worthy stuff.

Nowhere near as cringy as you using the "premiership was cack" line reagrding Peter Schmeichel...

Not to mention praising a player for his contribution to winning a major tournament that he never played in.

Backstreet Moyes

Seaneh wrote: »

Bit farcical to compare those situations with a player with 91 caps for Brazil, won 2 champions leagues, the first goal keeper ever to play 200 Serie A games for Milan, he first ever Brazilian 'Keeper to be nominated for the Ballon D'or, played in the 2006 WC Finals, only condeeding 2 goals in 6 games, first ever winner of the FIFpro Goalkeeper of the year award, and on and on and on.

I don't think he's anywhere near the best ever, or even of his generation, but for a few years he was one of the best in the world and people, especially people who have watched him about 5 times in their entire lives, completely write him off, which is ****ing retarded.

That has absolutely nothing to do with the points they were making as you know. You never seen the World Cup like you never seen Denamrk in 92 which is obvious. Your using Google and assumptions to try back up your points and have been caught red handed twice.

SweepTheLeg

A lot of people flaring up over this Dida situation.

Seaneh

Trilla wrote: »

Nowhere near as cringy as you using the "premiership was cack" line reagrding Peter Schmeichel.

The premiership WAS cack until the late 90's, it took a long time for English clubs to catch up after the ban was lifted. The standard of players in the premiership now is streets ahead of the premiership from 1991-1998.

You just have to look at United's record in the early-mid 90's in Europe as proof of that, despite dominating the English game they couldn't make inroads in Europe.
The premier league, until the late 90's, was nothing compared to Germany, Italy, Spain and was even lagging behind France.

GavRedKing

Nuts102 wrote: »

That has absolutely nothing to do with the points they were making as you know. You never seen the World Cup like you never seen Denamrk in 92 which is obvious. Your using Google and assumptions to try back up your points and have been caught red handed twice.

Brazil didnt win the WC in 06, Seaneh said his medal comes from not playing in 02 which is correct.

sReq | uTeK

Nuts102 wrote: »

That has absolutely nothing to do with the points they were making as you know. You never seen the World Cup like you never seen Denamrk in 92 which is obvious. Your using Google and assumptions to try back up your points and have been caught red handed twice.

Seat please

Backstreet Moyes

GavRedKing wrote: »

Brazil didnt win the WC in 06, Seaneh said his medal comes from not playing in 02 which is correct.

He listed his medal as an achievement for winning the world cup in which he played 0 minutes. Which makes it obvious he thought he was playing in the World Cup.

bucketybuck

Seaneh wrote: »

No, someone questioned him being in a top 100 list

Who did that?

Backstreet Moyes

I have no problem with people having opinions on who are the best keepers of all time. For me Buffon, Casillas, Schemeichel are the three best of all time and Khan not far behind.

Everybody has their opinions and i don't think people can call other people wrong. The three of them were fantastic and a case can be made for all of them. For me Schmeichel is the best i have seen but their is not much in it. My problem is how people can say one of them is way better than the others.

Seaneh

Nuts102 wrote: »

That has absolutely nothing to do with the points they were making as you know. You never seen the World Cup like you never seen Denamrk in 92 which is obvious. Your using Google and assumptions to try back up your points and have been caught red handed twice.

I didn't watch the 2002 world cup?

I didn't see Ronaldo's stupid haircut or Keane's last minute goal against the Germans or Heirro trying to undress Nail Quinn in the penalty box or Ian Harte missing the penalty? I didn't remember Roy throwing his toys out of the pram in Saipan? I didn't see Ronaldo scoring 8 goals in 7 games? Or His preformance in the final against germany?

I must be dreaming it so, bit odd that a 17 year old football fan on summer holidays from secondary school wouldn't watch the world cup, especially since between RTE, BBC and ITV pretty much every game of the tournament was screen on Irish television.

GavRedKing

Nuts102 wrote: »

He listed his medal as an achievement for winning the world cup in which he played 0 minutes. Which makes it obvious he thought he was playing in the World Cup.

He replied to someone who said he thought Marcos was number .

Seaneh wrote: »

He has a medal, didn't play though.

Just because you dont play doesnt mean you're not deserving of your medal TBH, to be considered one of the best 23 in your country and to win a WC with said country is a great achievement regardless of how much or how little ya played.

Its being pedantic anyway Dida wouldnt get in the top 10 of all time IMO let alone be considered for either team or their bench.

Seaneh

GavRedKing wrote: »

Its being pedantic anyway Dida wouldnt get in the top 10 of all time IMO let alone be considered for either team or their bench.

Exactly, and I wouldn't argue his inclusion, ever, I could list 10 goal keepers in the last 20 years I'd have ahead of him off the top of my head, easily.
Milan have never had a history of great goal keepers (Seb Rossi and Christian Abbiati being prime examples of Milan's habit of sticking with "decent" rather than great keepers) , but people, especially on here, seem to think he was some useless liability when in reality he was a very good goal keeper. His peers acknowledged it, his trophy cabinet proves it and his record for Milan and Brazil speaks for itself.

bucketybuck

Seaneh wrote: »

I didn't watch the 2002 world cup?

I didn't see Ronaldo's stupid haircut or Keane's last minute goal against the Germans or Heirro trying to undress Nail Quinn in the penalty box or Ian Harte missing the penalty? I didn't remember Roy throwing his toys out of the pram in Saipan? I didn't see Ronaldo scoring 8 goals in 7 games? Or His preformance in the final against germany?

I must be dreaming it so, bit odd that a 17 year old football fan on summer holidays from secondary school wouldn't watch the world cup, especially since between RTE, BBC and ITV pretty much every game of the tournament was screen on Irish television.

You certainly didn't see Dida on the field.

Seaneh

Oh and Ask Victor Valdes or Pep Renia or Angelo Peruzzi or Marco Amelia or anyone else who went to a world cup but didn't play and ask them "are you a world cup winner" and I bet you, 0 out of 10 of them will say yes.

Seaneh

bucketybuck wrote: »

You certainly didn't see Dida on the field.

When did I claim I did?

I didn't see Henry Shefflin on the field either.

But I never claimed I did so why is it relevant?

Prufrock

This is not what I had in mind when I started this thread...Dida?

The players Giles picked are not the 22 greatest players of all time. Its a match he would like to see. Also some players seem to be excluded to make sure the teams are even. There are no players born in the uk or ireland included in either team. Giles has a different dream team matchup for uk/irish players.

Maby I should have posted that at the start...

GavRedKing

So ya, Casillas greatest ever goalkeeper? I think so and considering he has a few years on Buffon by the time he retires, if hes not now he certainly will be, he'll have added to his already out of this world record at both club and international level IMO.

Nalz

Seaneh wrote: »

The premiership WAS cack until the late 90's, it took a long time for English clubs to catch up after the ban was lifted. The standard of players in the premiership now is streets ahead of the premiership from 1991-1998.

You just have to look at United's record in the early-mid 90's in Europe as proof of that, despite dominating the English game they couldn't make inroads in Europe.
The premier league, until the late 90's, was nothing compared to Germany, Italy, Spain and was even lagging behind France.

And this is a true measurement on how good\bad Schmeichel was?

Ok, you do know Manchester United reached the semi finals of the Champions league 96/97, beaten by the champions Dortmund? They even won the 1991 Cup Winners cup beating Barca, Koeman and co in the final without the great Dane.

In 1994 the 3 foreign rule existed. United drew 2-2 with Barca. Schmeichel didn't play in the 4-0 group game in the Nou camp. United were very unlucky not to reach the quarters that year. Even the eventual champions Ajax couldn't beat Salzburg home and away that year. Then again thats irrelevant...such is Uniteds European record when assessing Peters class.

Backstreet Moyes

Seaneh wrote: »

The premiership WAS cack until the late 90's, it took a long time for English clubs to catch up after the ban was lifted. The standard of players in the premiership now is streets ahead of the premiership from 1991-1998.

You just have to look at United's record in the early-mid 90's in Europe as proof of that, despite dominating the English game they couldn't make inroads in Europe.
The premier league, until the late 90's, was nothing compared to Germany, Italy, Spain and was even lagging behind France.

I will admit i am probably wrong i won't make statements like your Laudrap statement because i am only going from something i thought i heard and didn't know anything about football back then.

But didn't English clubs suffer big in the 90's from the rule saying only 3 foreign players were allowed. Where Irish, Welsh and Scottish players were classed as foreign. I thought this put English clubs at a big disadvantage in Europe and is why they struggled.

bullvine

Seaneh wrote: »

When did I claim I did?

I didn't see Henry Shefflin on the field either.

But I never claimed I did so why is it relevant?

Ahh come on you presumed he was the keeper in 2002 like you presumed Laudrup was in the Denmark team in 1992. If you had watched the 2002 WC as much as you think you had you would have known that Marcos was the keeper. The interest in that Brazil team was massive because of the 3R's at the time and also the fact of a quarter final against England.

GavRedKing

Prufrock wrote: »

This is not what I had in mind when I started this thread...Dida?

The players Giles picked are not the 22 greatest players of all time. Its a match he would like to see. Also some players seem to be excluded to make sure the teams are even. There are no players born in the uk or ireland included in either team. Giles has a different dream team matchup for uk/irish players.

Maby I should have posted that at the start...

Post the Irish/UK team then you'll see fireworks :pac:

Seaneh

Nuts102 wrote: »

I will admit i am probably wrong i won't make statements like your Laudrap statement because i am only going from something i thought i heard and didn't know anything about football back then.

But didn't English clubs suffer big in the 90's from the rule saying only 3 foreign players were allowed. Where Irish, Welsh and Scottish players were classed as foreign. I thought this put English clubs at a big disadvantage in Europe and is why they struggled.

That and it just took English clubs a long time to compete again after the ban because the league wasn't regarded as important by foreign players which meant it was hard to attract the better players to the league. That started changing towards the end of the decade and the league exploded in terms of quality from about 97 onwards, I think Wenger had a lot to do with that.

bullvine

Nuts102 wrote: »

I will admit i am probably wrong i won't make statements like your Laudrap statement because i am only going from something i thought i heard and didn't know anything about football back then.

But didn't English clubs suffer big in the 90's from the rule saying only 3 foreign players were allowed. Where Irish, Welsh and Scottish players were classed as foreign. I thought this put English clubs at a big disadvantage in Europe and is why they struggled.

You are not wrong. It took the English teams some time to adapt. The Ban on teams didnt help, coupled with the 3 foreign player rule. The turning point was in 96-97 when United got to the semis and were unlucky to be beaten, from then on, there was a big improvement for English sides in Europe.

bullvine

Seaneh wrote: »

That and it just took English clubs a long time to compete again after the ban because the league wasn't regarded as important by foreign players which meant it was hard to attract the better players to the league. That started changing towards the end of the decade and the league exploded in terms of quality from about 97 onwards, I think Wenger had a lot to do with that.

Yeah Wenger buying Bergkamp made a massive difference......... and was a start of an influx of top foreign players....:D

Backstreet Moyes

Seaneh wrote: »

When did I claim I did?

I didn't see Henry Shefflin on the field either.

But I never claimed I did so why is it relevant?

You used the fact the Laudrap brothers were more influential in 92 to knock back Schemeichels medal. Which was proved to be rubbish as you were caught out.

Then you used Dida winning a medal where he played 0 minutes as a point to prove how good he was.

That makes a good bit of sense alright.