For people who leave their dogs outside at night...

borderlinemeath

I keep my dogs in at night. I usually keep them in during the day if I'm off out for a while as well. Any visitors staying in the house or the kennels are also locked in securely. My worst nightmare would be that somebody would steal them/get into the garden and injure them etc.

Well that's exactly what happened a couple of weeks to somebody in my local town. An intruder went into their garden at 12.30am and killed one of their dogs outright and so badly injured the other that he had to be PTS. When I read the local paper I was sick to my stomach. It doesn't say whether it was a burglary gone wrong or whether there was other factors at play but the pets paid with their lives. Sick.

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thegreatiam

didnt read the link but this sort of thing happens all the time in other countries. burglars will throw poison meat over the fences to kill security dogs so they can rob the house.

Saw it all the time in south africa, they tried it on dogs at the house I was staying. Frustrating thing was that our dogs weren't guard dogs but family pets (JRT cross and a spaniel) and were so docile they would probably sit and watch as people made off with the tv.

Luckily they didn't eat much of the meat and were only sick for a day or so. But having seen it I would say that the family would've gladly given all the valuables to have the dogs remain unharmed.

It takes a sick coward to do this kind of thing.

I had friends there who had bigger dogs as pets/protectors and lost them because of some sicko trying to steal some small valuables. Not even anything of real worth, old mobile phone and costume jewelry. Its a horrible, horrible thing to hear about.

Our dogs, (the spaniel and the JRT) remained unharmed living to the ripe old age of 17 and 20!

borderlinemeath

thegreatiam wrote: »

didnt read the link but this sort of thing happens all the time in other countries. burglars will throw poison meat over the fences to kill security dogs so they can rob the house.

Saw it all the time in south africa, they tried it on dogs at the house I was staying. Frustrating thing was that our dogs weren't guard dogs but family pets (JRT cross and a spaniel) and were so docile they would probably sit and watch as people made off with the tv.

Luckily they didn't eat much of the meat and were only sick for a day or so. But having seen it I would say that the family would've gladly given all the valuables to have the dogs remain unharmed.

It takes a sick coward to do this kind of thing.

I had friends there who had bigger dogs as pets/protectors and lost them because of some sicko trying to steal some small valuables. Not even anything of real worth, old mobile phone and costume jewelry. Its a horrible, horrible thing to hear about.

Our dogs, (the spaniel and the JRT) remained unharmed living to the ripe old age of 17 and 20!

The dogs that died look to me like jrt crosses, loud perhaps but certainly not guard dogs.

I think the problem in this country is that people think dogs are for 'outside'. Even dogs that are considered family pets are sometimes never allowed in the house. The mentality is that because it's an animal it should stay outside and it'll be fine. If these dogs were inside the house at the time of the burglary and if the house was occupied then the outcome may well have been different.

kylith

In fairness if they were indoors at the time of the robbery they'd probably still be dead. People who would kill dogs to rob a house won't not do it just because the dog is in the living room rather than the garden. The only difference is that the dog may have lived long enough to raise the alarm, which could well have put the human occupants in danger.

meoklmrk91

I prefer to keep my dog inside at night, he has never spent a night outside for as long as he has been with me. I think they get a much better nights sleep, plus I don't understand people who think its better to leave the dog outside to guard the house, I will hear my dog barking when he is in the house, this is invaluable to me as I am heavy sleeper, I can act by trying to scare them off or call the gardai as opposed to something happening my dog, either being hurt or killed.

borderlinemeath

kylith wrote: »

In fairness if they were indoors at the time of the robbery they'd probably still be dead. People who would kill dogs to rob a house won't not do it just because the dog is in the living room rather than the garden. The only difference is that the dog may have lived long enough to raise the alarm, which could well have put the human occupants in danger.

It's a different proposition breaking into a house with barking dogs inside. The intruders killed the dogs outside, effectively disabling the 'alarm'. I'd much rather take my chances at fending off burglars from inside with barking dogs than have them killed outside and then come in for the occupants anyway. It gives you that much more time to ring the gardai, find something to defend yourself with (golf club or whatever) and even lights coming on inside a house would scare off a burglar unless they were determined to get something that you had in your possession.

kylith

borderlinemeath wrote: »

It's a different proposition breaking into a house with barking dogs inside. The intruders killed the dogs outside, effectively disabling the 'alarm'. I'd much rather take my chances at fending off burglars from inside with barking dogs than have them killed outside and then come in for the occupants anyway. It gives you that much more time to ring the gardai, find something to defend yourself with (golf club or whatever) and even lights coming on inside a house would scare off a burglar unless they were determined to get something that you had in your possession.

I understand what you're saying. But when you hear your dogs bark in the night do you automatically call the police or do you go down to see what they're barking at? Going downstairs makes you vulnerable, but calling the police every time your dog barks during the night would be paranoia. And if your dogs were to start barking, then stop would you assume there was a burglar who'd silenced them or be thankful that they were quiet so they wouldn't wake the neighbours?

I agree that a barking dog is a fantastic deterrent, but if a thief is determined to get into your house then the fact that there's a dog in there is more of an inconvenience than anything else, unless it's a big enough dog that they'd have concerns about taking it down.

borderlinemeath

kylith wrote: »

I understand what you're saying. But when you hear your dogs bark in the night do you automatically call the police or do you go down to see what they're barking at? Going downstairs makes you vulnerable, but calling the police every time your dog barks during the night would be paranoia. And if your dogs were to start barking, then stop would you assume there was a burglar who'd silenced them or be thankful that they were quiet so they wouldn't wake the neighbours?

I agree that a barking dog is a fantastic deterrent, but if a thief is determined to get into your house then the fact that there's a dog in there is more of an inconvenience than anything else, unless it's a big enough dog that they'd have concerns about taking it down.

First thing I always, always do when the dogs bark in the night is look out the window and check the gates or to see if the security lights have come on. We have gravel surrounding 3 sides of our house so it's not easy to approach from the front without setting off lights and crunching gravel and approaching from the back sets off more lights and leaves an intruder with no form of transport nearby as we're rural (ish)

kylith

borderlinemeath wrote: »

First thing I always, always do when the dogs bark in the night is look out the window and check the gates or to see if the security lights have come on. We have gravel surrounding 3 sides of our house so it's not easy to approach from the front without setting off lights and crunching gravel and approaching from the back sets off more lights and leaves an intruder with no form of transport nearby as we're rural (ish)

That's good. I live in a terraced house, my garden wall is only a couple of meters from the back of my house (more than close enough for someone to scale it, put a hammer through the back door and get themselves inside within a very short space of time), I'm urban so there are lots of places to leave the get away car, and if my neighbour's son comes home late at night it sets my dogs (who sleep inside) to barking.

I agree that keeping dogs in at night is better; it's likely to be a bit safer, they're less likely to annoy people by barking at cats, and it's certainly better with our changeable weather. I just couldn't say 'if you keep your dogs in they will be safe' because if the thieves want something badly enough they'll come and take it, and if they have to kill your dogs to do it they will, whether they're in the garden, the living room, or at the end of your bed.

teggers5

Absolutely sicking! My heart goes out to the poor family involved.
May the scum responsible rot in hell!

twinklediamond

borderlinemeath wrote: »

The dogs that died look to me like jrt crosses, loud perhaps but certainly not guard dogs.

I think the problem in this country is that people think dogs are for 'outside'. Even dogs that are considered family pets are sometimes never allowed in the house. The mentality is that because it's an animal it should stay outside and it'll be fine. If these dogs were inside the house at the time of the burglary and if the house was occupied then the outcome may well have been different.

To be honest you seem to be suggesting that the solution here is that either the owner is permanently at home or the dog is permanently inside.

It is cruel to keep a dog indoor all the time. Most dogs prefer to be outside, especially this time of year.

westies4ever

twinklediamond wrote: »

It is cruel to keep a dog indoor all the time. Most dogs prefer to be outside, especially this time of year.

utter tosh. dogs are quite happy to live indoors providing they get out regularly for exercise etc.

i have a dog flap so they can choose to be indoors or out. they choose to be inside 95% of the time whatever the weather. how do you know what they prefer if they dont have a choice.

borderlinemeath

twinklediamond wrote: »

To be honest you seem to be suggesting that the solution here is that either the owner is permanently at home or the dog is permanently inside.

It is cruel to keep a dog indoor all the time. Most dogs prefer to be outside, especially this time of year.

Not at all. Most dogs want to be with their human companions, be that inside or outside. When they're alone it doesn't matter where they are, they're still alone and usually asleep.

fatmammycat

twinklediamond wrote: »

To be honest you seem to be suggesting that the solution here is that either the owner is permanently at home or the dog is permanently inside.

It is cruel to keep a dog indoor all the time. Most dogs prefer to be outside, especially this time of year.

My dog likes to spend his time at home sprawled on the lawn where he can see me working in my office- door open, but he sleeps inside at night and when I go anywhere, he remains inside- usually dozing on the landing where he can keep an eye/ear on the front door. Despite his love of the lawn, he has no interest at all for being outside if I am in any other room than the office, which opens out onto the garden. I won't generalise for what 'most' dogs prefer, but in my experience dogs, being highly social creatures, like to be with their family and there is nothing cruel about that.

fatmammycat

borderlinemeath wrote: »

Not at all. Most dogs want to be with their human companions, be that inside or outside. When they're alone it doesn't matter where they are, they're still alone and usually asleep.

Gah, what you said, but in a more succinct fashion.

OldNotWIse

I'd kill anyone who did this to my dog. I worry about people poisoning ours as we live ground floor and have a little balcony which she sometimes sleeps on during the day if its sunny. She'd never be shut out there though, and at night she's in our bed!

ShaShaBear

We recently moved, and are living in a quietish estate. Shadow does bark the odd time during the night still, as he isn't used to the noises of the town and doesn't realise that not all cars pulling up outside mean a visitor. However, we did have some young ones try to get around the side of the house last night - not sure why. But Shadow didn't bark, he growled. Every hackle he had went right up and he snarled and growled at the window. We knew by the sound of it that something was wrong and as soon as we turned on the bedroom light they ran.

A loud and ferocious-sounding dog inside a home that has already been alerted to your presence is an excellent deterrent. A burglar would have to figure out how to get into the house, wonder if the dog will be ready for him, if there are other dogs in the house that he cannot see, and if people in the house already know they are there. That's too much of a risk to take, and I can wake up happy that the burglar decided against robbing me, and not waking up to find someone taking my stuff, going downstairs to get attacked and possibly killed, and then realising my poor dog is in a heap outside, stone cold dead, trying to save my life. Nuh-uh. Nope.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. The most valuable thing in this house IS my dog.

Tranceypoo

ShaShaBear wrote: »

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. The most valuable thing in this house IS my dog.

I feel exactly the same, well put!

mosi

kylith wrote: »

I just couldn't say 'if you keep your dogs in they will be safe' because if the thieves want something badly enough they'll come and take it, and if they have to kill your dogs to do it they will, whether they're in the garden, the living room, or at the end of your bed.

A few houses on my street have either been broken into or have had attempted break ins in the past few months. So far we have been lucky, probably because it's easier to try and rob a place that doesn't have a pack of dogs inside. Mine all live inside, and sleep in the bedroom at night. They are generally quite good about noises outside. The little ones can bark if they hear a cat outside, but the big boy generally doesn't bark in the house without reason. They sleep in the bedroom at night, so they are as safe as I am. I have no doubt that they are safer inside than out.

twinklediamond wrote: »

It is cruel to keep a dog indoor all the time. Most dogs prefer to be outside, especially this time of year.

That is complete and utter rubbish. When my lot are let out in the garden for the toilet, it is not long before I have three sad faces looking in at me. My parents' greyhound does not like to be outside at all. Even when they sit out in the garden, he prefers to slink back inside to his sofa. When he is let out for the toilet, he paws on the back door to be let back in when he is done.

leanonme

mosi wrote: »

A few houses on my street have either been broken into or have had attempted break ins in the past few months. So far we have been lucky, probably because it's easier to try and rob a place that doesn't have a pack of dogs inside. Mine all live inside, and sleep in the bedroom at night. They are generally quite good about noises outside. The little ones can bark if they hear a cat outside, but the big boy generally doesn't bark in the house without reason. They sleep in the bedroom at night, so they are as safe as I am. I have no doubt that they are safer inside than out.



That is complete and utter rubbish. When my lot are let out in the garden for the toilet, it is not long before I have three sad faces looking in at me. My parents' greyhound does not like to be outside at all. Even when they sit out in the garden, he prefers to slink back inside to his sofa. When he is let out for the toilet, he paws on the back door to be let back in when he is done.

I think all dogs are happier with what they are use to. If you have a dog that is use to being inside then he won't be as happy out side and cause versa. My dogs are not use to being in side as there is five of them all large dogs who love the out doors. We have one who likes to come in but after about 20 minuites she wants to be back out side again. The others might come in for 5 or 10 minuites and then leave again. I don't have a dog flap but would leave the door open. Three o the five dogs are locked up during the night in a run as they are hunting dogs and we would be worried they would disappear of, but the other two are free to roam around the farm yard and we like it that way. Because one of them is a cattle dog he is good at alerting us if any of the animals are out.

borderlinemeath

leanonme wrote: »

I think all dogs are happier with what they are use to. If you have a dog that is use to being inside then he won't be as happy out side and cause versa. My dogs are not use to being in side as

Most dogs are happier with human companionship, again it doesn't matter whether that's inside or outside. Thousands of years of domestication by humans have geared them to be dependent on humans for food, companionship and exercise/stimulation.

Are you outside with your dog most of the time?
Ah, I get it, so there's plenty of stimulation and action outside in the farmyard.

leanonme

borderlinemeath wrote: »

Most dogs are happier with human companionship, again it doesn't matter whether that's inside or outside. Thousands of years of domestication by humans have geared them to be dependent on humans for food, companionship and exercise/stimulation.

Are you outside with your dog most of the time?
Ah, I get it, so there's plenty of stimulation and action outside in the farmyard.

Yea the dogs are out side 95percent of the time. And when ever I am home I have the door open so they can come in if they like, but they prefer the yard. My dad would be around the yard most of the day esp during winter and the dogs love him and love to be around him. The dog that stays out around the yard at night spends most of the day siting beside dad or walking round with him an he never comes into the house and never looks to come in either. We have a busy yard with people coming and going, people checking sheds regularly, and during winter sheds would be checked during the night so the dogs see people all the time.

That's why I would go on the line that dogs are happiest with what then know. Recently one of the dogs got injured and required stitches, so I kept her in most of the time and she was so unhappy untill she was able to be out playing with her friends.

borderlinemeath

leanonme wrote: »

Yea the dogs are out side 95percent of the time. And when ever I am home I have the door open so they can come in if they like, but they prefer the yard. My dad would be around the yard most of the day esp during winter and the dogs love him and love to be around him. The dog that stays out around the yard at night spends most of the day siting beside dad or walking round with him an he never comes into the house and never looks to come in either. We have a busy yard with people coming and going, people checking sheds regularly, and during winter sheds would be checked during the night so the dogs see people all the time.

That's why I would go on the line that dogs are happiest with what then know. Recently one of the dogs got injured and required stitches, so I kept her in most of the time and she was so unhappy untill she was able to be out playing with her friends.

And I'll still maintain that it's the human companionship that they enjoy rather than being outside. Your dogs know that outside is a hive of activity and company, it's mental stimulation for them. A dog that is kept alone in a yard all day without human interaction and it's all he knows - would you consider him to be happy and well stimulated?

JustAThought

I live in a terrace -the gardens back onto each other & there are no side entrances.

When I saw a burglar in broad daylight on the roof of my shed from my spot dozing under a tree in the sun I ran shouting inside to get my phone . The local gaurds REFUSED to send a car. rEFUSED. They said they were " busy". I rang directory inquiries the other local station & asked them to send a car. They were shocked & said they had to relay the message to " my" station & couldn't believe the local gaurds acted that way in all of this my dog who with me was now " locked" with me inside the kitchen in the back of the house going BERZERK.

The gaurds NEVER came.

The only reason the burgalar crawled back off up the fence the way he came was because of the dog.

Burgalars don't heed alarms or " gaurds". They don't give a sh1t. But they believe a dogs intentions when they hear their snarling & see their teeth. No health & safety or " entitlements" there.

Horrified at the original post . Couldn't face reading the link. There is evil amongst us. You cannot imagine what is happening inside their deformed heads.

Beyond sickening.

Gumbi

You'd be surprised what a big GSD or Rottweiler can do to scare off a burglar.

This intruder was sleeping under a tree in your garden? That sounds pretty weird to me...

wexie

kylith wrote: »

I understand what you're saying. But when you hear your dogs bark in the night do you automatically call the police or do you go down to see what they're barking at?

I'm pretty sure I'd be able to tell the difference between my lads barking at a cat or fox messing around with the bins and someone trying to get into the house (or one of the cars for that matter). Having said that, you're probably right insofar that I likely would still go down to have a look.

kylith wrote: »

unless it's a big enough dog that they'd have concerns about taking it down.

I'd imagine not many burglars would be happy to take their chances here, just from the sounds alone. Unless of course it's just the Shihtzuh barking and my big fella stays quiet (he does that sometimes when he's trying to figure out what's going on). In that case the burglar would be in for a very rude surprise

I've actually been wondering about this recently (lots of breakins here at the moment) my dogs normally sleep in the kitchen and the utility which means they've no access to the rest of the house. If someone came in the front door I'd have to get passed them to let the dogs out of the kitchen so I've been wondering should I let the dogs have the run of the house at night.

Which means they'd be much more useful in the event of a breakin, unfortunately also means we'd probably have to get a bigger bed

RubyGirl

Gumbi wrote: »

You'd be surprised what a big GSD or Rottweiler can do to scare off a burglar.

This intruder was sleeping under a tree in your garden? That sounds pretty weird to me...

No I think it was her who was under the tree. My guy's are inside dog's and would alert me to any intruders. I have 4 and out of that 2 of them would go mental if anyone came in without permission. ON the dog's prefer outside to inside debate, mine are def inside dogs and during the summer when the door is left open all are inside. It's cooler for them aswell with the weather so hot.

dodderangler

Gumbi wrote: »

You'd be surprised what a big GSD or Rottweiler can do to scare off a burglar.

This intruder was sleeping under a tree in your garden? That sounds pretty weird to me...

I've often wondered what my Akita in my mams house would do if someone was to break in. He knows a stranger and let's them know he's not comfortable with them near him. Usually drunk people or people that talk in a loud voice. But when es out the back garden and hears someone in the back lane he barks like crazy and doesn't stop until they are gone. Pretty loud bark aswell that would definatly deter someone.
My pointer cross is the same when people are in the back lane. She barks and doesn't stop till they are gone. But she'd probably just lick them to death but she will let myself and neighbours know that something isn't right.

DBB

borderlinemeath wrote: »

And I'll still maintain that it's the human companionship that they enjoy rather than being outside. Your dogs know that outside is a hive of activity and company, it's mental stimulation for them. A dog that is kept alone in a yard all day without human interaction and it's all he knows - would you consider him to be happy and well stimulated?

If we're going to use individual examples of dogs living indoors vs outdoors, and preferring what they're used to, then I'll do the same!
When I got my GSD, she was 9 months old, and had never lived in a house before. She was exclusively outdoors with their other GSDs, in a reasonably busy stable yard, and was much more dog-orientated than human-focused.
From the very minute I got her home, she utterly relished living inside.. like a duck to water, it would have been difficult to tell that she had never been inside before... she had one toilet accident (100% human error), and I had to accompany her outside so that she knew she wasn't going to be left out there.
For the record, I owned her aunt before her. She had lived outside exclusively for 7 years before I got her. And she ADORED living inside too.
So, it depends on the dog: just because they're used to it, doesn't necessarily mean they prefer it!

RoverZT

twinklediamond wrote: »

It is cruel to keep a dog indoor all the time. Most dogs prefer to be outside, especially this time of year.

Have to agree.

I am always trying to get my Malamute in at night, he will come in for an hour or two and then he is crying to go outside again, running upstairs and crying next to my bedroom door to leave him outside.

It get's very annoying, especially when I have to get up early for work and even more annoying that he will only go into his dog house when it's torrential rain.

If it's raining heavy enough he will just curl up in the garden, with his tail covering his face and will sleep through the rain, doesn't bother him at all.

I then have to run around the garden at 4am in the rain trying to get him into the house, he thinks it's a game and keeps running away.

We had a german shepherd when I was a child who was the same, he hated being inside at night, though he was very smart and used his dog house.

Are all Malamute's like that?

borderlinemeath

RoverZT wrote: »

Have to agree.

I am always trying to get my Malamute in at night, he will come in for an hour or two and then he is crying to go outside again, running upstairs and crying next to my bedroom door to leave him outside.

It get's very annoying, especially when I have to get up early for work and even more annoying that he will only go into his dog house when it's torrential rain.

If it's raining heavy enough he will just curl up in the garden, with his tail covering his face and will sleep through the rain, doesn't bother him at all.

I then have to run around the garden at 4am in the rain trying to get him into the house, he thinks it's a game and keeps running away.

We had a german shepherd when I was a child who was the same, he hated being inside at night, though he was very smart and used his dog house.

Are all Malamute's like that?

As DBB pointed out above, you can't generalise and say all dogs prefer outside or inside, and as you can testify, weather is not a factor! It's just not that simple.

I mind dogs. I can recall 2/3 dogs that prefer to be inside exclusively all the time, barely going out to toilet. Bearing in mind that my large, adventure playground of a garden was probably nothing like what they were used to at home. Without these exceptions, all dogs loved going out exploring and playing for a time, but mainly if I was out there or my OH was working outside. If I returned in to the house they would slink back in one by one, or sit outside where they could see me. Or for those dogs that came from exclusively male homes or who were particularly attached to the man of the house - these dogs seem to prefer sitting on the floor in my OHs garage while he worked.

I haven't encountered one dog that preferred to stay out all the time. Not one. That includes collies and labs that have been exclusively outdoors, slept outdoors and would probably not know what the inside of their home house was like. Where they want to be is where the activity is, usually with the humans and if that isn't available, then with the dogs.

In relation to your Mal, I've met a few and I find them to be very 'distant' if you know what I mean. Very independent in themselves and have less of a need for human companionship than many other breeds. I suppose it's partly due to the nature of the working breed. Muddypaws will be able to tell you far more about them than me!