Dog life in Germany

FoxyVixen

Just thought I'd start a thread relating to my experiences on holidays which were really nothing but positive. Thought it would start a good discussion, mods can remove if they feel it's nothing but me rambling about my time away

This year me and the OH went to Munich for 5 days followed by 5 days in Prague. I was already aware that Germany has a more relaxed view on dogs - or strict depending on how you look at it.

Arriving in the Haptbahnof, I was surprised at the number of dogs I witnessed - on lead and fully under control - walking about their business and catching a train to their destination. With the amount I saw in the morings, I believe most dogs were going to work with their owners - a variety of breeds, shapes and sizes.

What amazed me more, is that there wasn't the slightest whiff of excrement or urine to be noted on the ground, every dog walked on through the crowds quite happily, and whilst their may have been the odd bark, most walked past each other with nothing but a glance - no pulling to get at the other dog.

Walking through the city itself, not one stray did I see, not one dog aggravated another, not one owner had to shout to get their dogs attention. We were going through the English Gardens when I noticed a HUGE St. Bernard - not the typical characteristic coat, more beige than the brown tan colour. This animal was beautiful to see, not a hair out of place - but no lead on it and from what I could see no-one around it appeared to own it!! I watched as it itself seemed interested in a small dog that had entered the park from the other side and thought, "Here we go!".

Well, it turned out its owner happened to be the gardener who simply said one word at a normal tone and the big lump sat right back down. I thought it incredible that there was this huge animal brought to work in the gardens by the owner. You wouldn't see that here.

Furthermore, should you want to take the kids to the zoo in either city/country, no problem, for a small fee Rover can join you too!!

The more I witnessed with dogs in these two places, the more frustrated/sad/bitter I became that our own country is so god damned backwards, that few dog warden/animal inspectors are qualified in their fields or even capable of enforcing very minor laws such as wandering dogs/adequate ownership.

Is it really that hard to enforce, or is our government really that lazy to be bothered with it? Will we ever get to a stage that we could possibly have our dogs on the trains with us?

muddypaws

Great that you had such positive experiences.

As with everywhere though, you do get the irresponsible and the annoying. My brother and his family lived in Germany and had a Rottweiler, they were there when the laws were changed due to an incident with a staffie and a drug dealer, and their dog had to be muzzled. However, once the dog passed a test, he could walk freely unmuzzled, so the onus was on the owner to be responsible, so while they do have BSL, it is dependent on which part of Germany you are in, and if owners can show they are responsible, then the dog will be treated like any other. My sis-in-law did have a few runs in with Germans who were scared of the dog, shouting at her in the street or park, they were usually other dog owners, Max the rottie was always on lead, but just being a big dog I guess, some people freak out. Ironic though, when you think its a rottweiler in Germany.

It would be lovely if we could have more freedom for our dogs, but I think its probably more about how we differ as a society, and our lack of social responsibility perhaps? Not just with dogs, but life in general.

FoxyVixen

Ah I remember you mentioning that story before somewhere on here alright with the Rottie .

It's funny that you mentioned their reaction, just remembered seeing a Sibe walking down Prague. Lovely animal, though I thought it quite tall for a Sibe. Anywho, as it went down the street happily on lead with its owner, there was not one person who didn't turn to gawp at the dog. Clearly a rare breed to be seen in Prague and I had to smile to myself at the comparison to here where there is one on every corner :rolleyes:.

I wonder did the people think it was a wolf walking through the city :pac:

kylith

When I was in Paris dogs were even allowed in cafes. Ireland is so backward with regard to dogs; even trying to get one on public transport is a nightmare.

FoxyVixen

I witnessed that in Paris too, though in comparison to the Germans (and a certain extent to the Czechs) the French didn't seem to care if their dog did something it shouldn't. For example barking its head off at the table or snapping at someone walking past.

So far as I see, the Germans have it bang on regarding dog ownership. I wonder does it have anything to do with the Schutzhund training there. Perhaps they have a better understanding of canine behaviour than your average person who might impulse buy a pup here!

OldNotWIse

Ireland can be a truly terrible place for dogs. Very little responsibility for microchipping, neutering as well as breeding that is not regulated - leading to puppy farms etc. Low interest in or perhaps ignorance about rescuing - feeding into the puppy breeding supply and demand chain...thousands of healthy dogs dying every month.

Socially, dogs cannot really go anywhere. I've seen shopping centres in Paris, Brazil etc where dogs are allowed - never saw any problem with it. Here, you might get your small dog on a bus if you get the right driver on a good day. Very few off-lead parks for them. Veterinary care very expensive. Appauling almost "vigilante" attitude towards dog-owners, with people reporting everything from dirty looks to verbal abuse for perceived wrongdoings, equally balanced out with actual wrongdoings by some owners, including not cleaning up after their dog, not socialising him/her - leading to behavioural problems. The restricted breed list is ill thought out. Laws re licensing are not implemented, and the microchipping law will likely be the same.

Dont even get me started on the greyhounds that are raced and then discarded.

Very low convcition rate for animal cruelty and neglect.

One positive I have noticed lately is that more and more pubs in city centre are allowing dogs into the beer garden now when its not busy, our local even brings out a plastic bowl of water for ours , saying, "Is it the usual for her?" lol

Like all things, there's good and bad, some very worthwhile charities, it's been my experience that the private ones that get little or no state fundung tend to be the best, and of course individuals who make the world a better place for dogs every day but if I were to come back as a dog, I dont think it would be to Ireland...statistically it would be an unsafe bet!

kylith

FoxyVixen wrote: »

I witnessed that in Paris too, though in comparison to the Germans (and a certain extent to the Czechs) the French didn't seem to care if their dog did something it shouldn't. For example barking its head off at the table or snapping at someone walking past.

Any I saw were very well behaved, but I could imagine the French would be a bit more laissez faire than the Germans.

the_syco

OldNotWIse wrote: »

One positive I have noticed lately is that more and more pubs in city centre are allowing dogs into the beer garden now when its not busy, our local even brings out a plastic bowl of water for ours , saying, "Is it the usual for her?" lol

Something from the country, probably; you're more likely to stay longer if your dog is content to stay there.

A thread with a list of dog friendly pubs may be an idea?

One of my mates would sometimes pop into a particular coffee cafe type place in Dublin city centre that allowed dogs to sit with them outside in the porch area, and there'd usually be one or two dog owners there.

Tranceypoo

I'm from London originally and we were always able to bring our dog(s) on the buses, the tube, no problem, nothing out of the ordinary, I remember being shocked here a few years ago when myself and the husband asked in a local pub if we could bring our dog into the beer garden and they said no, also at Coole Park in Co Galway, you can't bring your dogs into the outside area of the large café because you have to walk through the café, instead they have a 'dog park' in the huge courtyard outside which is literally a place to 'park' your dog, as if it were a car, thought that was horrible.

We were in Venice once and dogs were in the cafes and everywhere, in fact we were in one coffee shop that was really crowded, not a seat to be had and a couple were sat at one of the tables with the KCC sat up on a chair at the table, no one batted an eyelid! Also in Vienna I was walking round Mango (ladies clothes shop) and a lady had her huge hairy dog (a mutt I think) wandering round with her, again no one passed any notice.

I am truly fed up with attitudes to animals here.

Just to add, I've been to the South of France a good few times and always see teeny tiny dogs with their owners just doing a dump in the street, along the Croisette, outside the posh hotels, everywhere and I've never once seen an owner pick it up!!

keaves

Myself and the other half went to Berlin this year and couldnt get over how well behaved all the dogs where and how accepting the germans where of them!
Like you foxy we saw them sitting calmly on trains with owners,older dogs in dog trailers attached to the back of bikes while others trotted beside them , water bowls left out for them in shops or cafes,saw dogs with their owners shopping in h&m.
They where everywhere! I was told by
a guide you get an allowance for
owning a dog; like child benefit i guess
For feeding and caring for your dog.

sorry im typing this on my pgone which has a smashed screen making it horrible to spell check or paragraph: the moral of the story is the other half wants to ship us and the dogs to Germany for a better dog intergrated life!

Kattra

Being from Germany myself i can assure you: we also have our fair share of irresponsible dogowners. In fact the legislation concerning the restricted breeds was a knee-jerk reaction after a child was killed by two dogs used for dogfighting. The owner had a criminal record and one of the dogs already had been involved in several attacks to other dogs (and their owners). The result were several restrictions for certain breeds. What breeds and what kind of restrictions still differs from state to state.

It all comes down to the owner: a bad owner in Germany will cause the same trouble as a bad owner in Ireland.

But indeed: generally I have to say the dog ownership in Germany is better. Dogs are usually kept in the house, keeping them in a kennel or in the backyard has become extremely uncommon (and frowned upon by the neighbours ^^). To let the dog out on its own to have a stroll is unheard of. We can`t always take them with us to work, but this option is getting more common every year. If we are offered the opportunity it is expected the dog behaves properly.

A big difference is the ability to have a dog with us in trains or on the bus. This is quite normal and most dogs are getting used to it early on. Dogs are a vital and normal part of every day live, even for people who don`t own one themself.

Backyard breeding is very uncommon, the myth of the bitch or dog who "has to have a litter at least once in live" is almost gone. In fact while there are of course some litters by accident the german rescues don`t have to cope with the amount their irish counterparts have to deal with. It is rather uncommon to find a purebreed dog in rescue. Oh...and all german rescues (Tierheim) have a no-kill policy and are partly funded by the county.

This comes with a price: our dog license is much more expensive. For my small hometown it ranges from 42 Euro (first dog) till whooping 600 Euro (restricted breed without the behaviourtest) per year.
Also you have to pay fines if you don`t pick up after your dog, do not have a dog license or let your dog of leash in the city. And yes: this is reinforced by the police.

Doing Schutzhund-Training is not sooooo common as you might think. There a very few owners who are involved in this, obedience or agility are the most used organized training classes.

Sadly there is no allowance for owning a dog. For people who loose their job and have to live on the dole there is an option to get a little bit extra. But this is extremely rare and is only for dogs already in the familiy.

ComputerKing

I don't think Ireland is backword in regards to dogs. I think that it's the dog owners that are backword. And I certainly agree that dogs shouldn't be allowed on public transport or in cafes or anything considering dog owners can't keep the under control and let them sh1t all over the place and bark at people. Dog owners need to take responsibility for their dogs first.

borderlinemeath

ComputerKing wrote: »

I don't think Ireland is back word in regards to dogs. I think that it's the dog owners that are back word. And I certainly agree that dogs shouldn't be allowed on public transport or in cafes or anything considering dog owners can't keep the under control and let them sh1t all over the place and bark at people. Dog owners need to take responsibility for their dogs first.

Talk about making sweeping generalisations about all dog owners:rolleyes:

anniehoo

borderlinemeath wrote: »

Talk about making sweeping generalisations about all dog owners

Debate your point Borderline, don't "nit pick" on spelling

Kattra

ComputerKing wrote: »

And I certainly agree that dogs shouldn't be allowed on public transport or in cafes or anything considering dog owners can't keep the under control and let them sh1t all over the place and bark at people.

I can assure you: neither in France, Sweden or Germany have I ever seen a dog poop or pee in a train or a bus. Even barking is very rare and mostly dealt with very quickly by the owner.
But i indeed have seen various drunks making a mess there. :rolleyes:

ComputerKing

Kattra wrote: »

I can assure you: neither in France, Sweden or Germany have I ever seen a dog poop or pee in a train or a bus. Even barking is very rare and mostly dealt with very quickly by the owner.
But i indeed have seen various drunks making a mess there. :rolleyes:

I agree been to France and Sweden too and never seen either as well but in Ireland it seems you can't walk anywhere without have to go out of your way to stop your self from stepping in it.

LittleMissDiva

I'm from Germany too. In Germany most of the dogs are familiy and not only a pet for me thats the big difference to Ireland,

boomerang

Kattra wrote: »

This comes with a price: our dog license is much more expensive. For my small hometown it ranges from 42 Euro (first dog) till whooping 600 Euro (restricted breed without the behaviourtest) per year.
Also you have to pay fines if you don't pick up after your dog, do not have a dog license or let your dog of leash in the city. And yes: this is reinforced by the police.

A price I would very happily pay!

I hope the laws aren't so restrictive though that there is nowhere you can leave you dog off the lead. I totally understand the need to keep dogs on lead in built-up areas, but would love to think German dogs can enjoy a romp in a field or on a beach, too.

Kattra

The on-the-leash rule is just for built up areas. In the bigger citys like Hamburg, Berlin or München there are specially assigned off leash areas. In smaller citys you just go to some empty field or the woods and let them off there. Farmers and Hunters are normally ok with that as long as you don`t try to enter fields with livestock or let your dog chase anything.
Exception from the rule is the time from April till July, there you have to keep dogs on leash to protect the young wildlife.

Some beaches in tourist resorts are blocked for dogs. But then there are always special "dogbeaches" in the same area where they can run free.

Concerning the dog poop on the streets: we have far more bins in our parks and streets in Germany then here in Ireland. This helps to encourage people to pick up after their dog...a lot! These here a especially handy: http://www.dogstation.de/

Chun Li

I brought my dog with me to Germany for 2 years. Almost daily, other dog owners would stop to talk 'dog' which I found really nice. Tail docked dogs would not be a common sight.

Positives:
-Brand new apartment and it was no problem to have a dog (you do need extra insurance though).
-She frequently traveled on the tram with me.
-All cafes in the park have dog bowls.
-Dog stations scattered around with doggy bags.
-Vet fees are relatively inexpensive.

Negatives:
-During the snowy weather, it is much more common not to clean up after your dog. Guess what, snow melts!
-More expensive dog licence, which is a tag on the dogs collar.

I do love when I've been in Germany, to see the doggies everywhere and involved in everything

Tranceypoo

#startslearninggerman#

Cedrus

ComputerKing wrote: »

I don't think Ireland is backword in regards to dogs. I think that it's the dog owners that are backword. And I certainly agree that dogs shouldn't be allowed on public transport or in cafes or anything considering dog owners can't keep the under control and let them sh1t all over the place and bark at people. Dog owners need to take responsibility for their dogs first.

TBH this post is evidence that Ireland is backwards regarding dogs. It's true that there are many bad dog owners here (=backwards) but there are many good owners as well and good dogs who are perfectly capable of behaving properly in a beer garden or train but are not allowed to by silly rules. I've seen paralitically drunk parents in pubs with their out of control children but been refused permission to bring my puppies into the beer garden of the same pub.

Tranceypoo

Cedrus wrote: »

TBH this post is evidence that Ireland is backwards regarding dogs. It's true that there are many bad dog owners here (=backwards) but there are many good owners as well and good dogs who are perfectly capable of behaving properly in a beer garden or train but are not allowed to by silly rules. I've seen paralitically drunk parents in pubs with their out of control children but been refused permission to bring my puppies into the beer garden of the same pub.

YES!!