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Westworld (HBO/Sky Atlantic) [** Spoilers **]

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    #692
    GavRedKing
    Registered Users Posts: 53,262 ✭✭✭✭GavRedKing


    Its probably been said or picked up on already but that room where Bernard basically interviews Dolores from the past few episodes is the same room that the action went down in last night, I'm 100% sure it is anyway.


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    #693
    Effects
    Registered Users Posts: 9,760 ✭✭✭Effects


    I haven't looked back at the clothes he's wearing while interviewing Delores, but couldn't those interviews possibly be
    Arnold
    interviewing Delores, 35 years ago?


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    #694
    GavRedKing
    Registered Users Posts: 53,262 ✭✭✭✭GavRedKing


    Effects wrote: »
    I haven't looked back at the clothes he's wearing while interviewing Delores, but couldn't those interviews possibly be
    Arnold
    interviewing Delores, 35 years ago?

    Ya, actually thats more likely. Bernard did mention that the room was of an older generation to Theresa when they enter the installation saying it was an older service station, or some such.


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    #695
    white apples
    Registered Users Posts: 342 ✭✭white apples


    Elsie is credited with 9 series on IMDB, so seems like she'll be appearing again at some point.

    I think that board member might also be a host, and Ford programmed her to say those word to Theresa about the blood sacrifice.

    She (board member) is the one who fired Bernard. The other people in the room were Ford and Teresa. If Bernard remains and isn't fired they'll have to explain around this somehow, unless everyone in the room aside from Ford is either now dead, or a host? She's a loose end.

    He also seems confident when he says the board will do nothing. Who is the board - has he knocked off and cloned a bunch of them?

    Absolutely loved this episode, Hopkins is just magic to watch. Excited to see where this goes.


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    #696
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    Host v Guest violence was always possible. It's just that they aren't allowed to kill or fatally wound them.

    In one of the earlier episodes, Delores picks up a revolver that was buried, I think. I'm almost certain that this turns out to be a real gun and that she goes on to be the first host to kill a Guest in public. Not spoilering it, because it's just a total guess.


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    #697
    Effects
    Registered Users Posts: 9,760 ✭✭✭Effects


    white apples wrote: »
    Elsie is credited with 9 series on IMDB, so seems like she'll be appearing again at some point.

    She'll be back once Ford's slow host maker has finished creating her.


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    #698
    ahlookit
    Registered Users Posts: 1,710 ✭✭✭ahlookit


    Effects wrote: »
    She'll be back once Ford's slow host maker has finished creating her.

    Are you confusing Elsie with Teresa?

    Elsie is/was Bernard's programmer colleague who went MIA at the end of the previous episode.


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    #699
    Daroxtar
    Registered Users Posts: 4,333 ✭✭✭Daroxtar


    Wild speculative theory time- Ford is a host.
    He was created by Arnold and was the first one to become sentient and took over the park from within. Created his family to give himself a back story similar to the background he gave Bernard.
    His obsession with finding Arnold is because Arnold is the only one who knows the truth and could stop him. He's building the new narrative to protect himself..
    Evidence -
    Logan says they can't find a shred of information about him.
    Never changes his outfit.
    Asks Delores if she remembers the man he used to be, probably taken to mean he was a different type of person but maybe he was a man and is not now.
    Can control the hosts without issuing verbal commands.
    Hosts protect him automatically, like drones protecting the Queen Bee.

    Bernard isn't a clone Arnold, his robot father is the clone. The picture of ford and Arnold was a picture of him and his father, ie his creator. He made character adjustments to the clone because of his dislike of Arnold.


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    #700
    intheclouds
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,175 ✭✭✭intheclouds


    Perhaps Teresa will show up in Fords new narrative?


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    #701
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 0 ✭ [Deleted User]


    F**k you HBO, first "Hold the door", then "What door?" :(


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    #702
    Effects
    Registered Users Posts: 9,760 ✭✭✭Effects


    ahlookit wrote: »
    Are you confusing Elsie with Teresa?

    Elsie is/was Bernard's programmer colleague who went MIA at the end of the previous episode.

    Nope. Speculating that Elsie was killed by Ford and he's replacing her. Possibly hadn't planned on it so taking a little longer to replace her with a host.


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    #703
    Effects
    Registered Users Posts: 9,760 ✭✭✭Effects


    Daroxtar wrote: »
    Drones protecting the Queen Bee.
    Off topic but drones don't protect the queen bee. They don't really care about the queen at all. Their function is to reproduce and they can't even sting.


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    #704
    Effects
    Registered Users Posts: 9,760 ✭✭✭Effects


    Daroxtar wrote: »
    The picture of ford and Arnold was a picture of him and his father, ie his creator.

    I'm a bit confused by your post. The picture is of Ford and his father, and possibly Arnold on the right, who Bernard can't see.

    As for Ford obsessed with finding Arnold, is he? Did I miss that?


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    #705
    Cina
    Registered Users Posts: 2,387 ✭✭✭Cina


    Effects wrote: »
    I'm a bit confused by your post. The picture is of Ford and his father, and possibly Arnold on the right, who Bernard can't see.

    As for Ford obsessed with finding Arnold, is he? Did I miss that?

    Bernard has to be modeled on Arnold, right? The fact that he can't see 'that which could hurt him' (or whatever Ford said along those lines) can only make sense if the person in the picture is him.


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    #706
    Effects
    Registered Users Posts: 9,760 ✭✭✭Effects


    Cina wrote: »
    Bernard has to be modeled on Arnold, right? The fact that he can't see 'that which could hurt him' (or whatever Ford said along those lines) can only make sense if the person in the picture is him.

    Yeah, that was my point.


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    #707
    Daroxtar
    Registered Users Posts: 4,333 ✭✭✭Daroxtar


    Effects wrote: »
    I'm a bit confused by your post. The picture is of Ford and his father, and possibly Arnold on the right, who Bernard can't see.

    As for Ford obsessed with finding Arnold, is he? Did I miss that?

    When he's asking Delores when was the last time she spoke to Arnold and he's hurting her arm. Seemed fairly keen on tracking him down imo
    I'm taking the picture at face value, we saw what we saw, him and Arnold.


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    #708
    Effects
    Registered Users Posts: 9,760 ✭✭✭Effects


    Daroxtar wrote: »
    I'm taking the picture at face value, we saw what we saw, him and Arnold.

    The guy in the picture is the same guy in the Cabin that Arnold created as a gift for Ford. Ford explained that the host was a recreation of his father. He even adjusted his personality to be more like his father, an alco.

    So unless Ford is lying about who the host in the cabin is then the other man we see in the picture is Ford's father, not Arnold.

    You can't take the picture at face value, you have to read into it.

    We've also seen Arnold's hands, and they are not the hands of a caucasian. They have a darker skin tone, like Bernard's.


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    #709
    intheclouds
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,175 ✭✭✭intheclouds


    Effects wrote: »
    The guy in the picture is the same guy in the Cabin that Arnold created as a gift for Ford. Ford explained that the host was a recreation of his father. He even adjusted his personality to be more like his father, an alco.

    So unless Ford is lying about who the host in the cabin is then the other man we see in the picture is Ford's father, not Arnold.

    You can't take the picture at face value, you have to read into it.

    We've also seen Arnold's hands, and they are not the hands of a caucasian. They have a darker skin tone, like Bernard's.

    I don't think the guy in the pic is the guy in the cabin.

    When did we see Arnold's hands?


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    #710
    jcsoulinger
    Registered Users Posts: 1,785 ✭✭✭jcsoulinger


    Why are people so sure Ford was involved with Elsie's disappearance?, I reckon there's more chance of management being behind it.


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    #711
    Foxtrol
    Registered Users Posts: 11,137 ✭✭✭✭Foxtrol


    The whole call between Bernard and his wife is confusing me a bit now. I’ll need to go back and rewatch but it seems like a lot of extra effort to go to for Ford to get a person or host to record a fake call for him with a fake wife (though it could be some sort of dream/implanted memory). I think it would be much simpler to set him up to be estranged from a wife altogether, as it’s clear that other hosts will follow much more wild storylines. I get the potential links with him and Arnold but I wouldn’t totally write off that there was a real Bernard at one point and that he could be a replacement host that reaches out every now and again to people in the real world so not to raise any questions.


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    #712
    Hazys
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,510 ✭✭✭Hazys


    Theresa comes back as a host so Ford now has a mole who will be able to relay information back to him on what the Board's plan is.

    Maybe Bernard was a real person before and crossed Ford, so Ford killed him and replaced him with host Bernard, hence why he has such a convincing back story and that nobody in the company was suspicious of him. Also that might be his real wife (ex?) that we saw he video conferences with before.

    Also first scene of the episode was very telling in hindsight with Bernard having a memory/nightmare of his son. So Bernard is a host with the ability to remember and because of that, hes passes off as human showing that hosts that can remember are almost identical to humans.


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    #713
    intheclouds
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,175 ✭✭✭intheclouds


    If they live in a world where any disease can be cured then how did Bernard's son die in hospital?

    Even if it was just an implanted memory, is it not improbable? And if Bernard talked about it to people would that not make them suspicious?


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    #714
    Effects
    Registered Users Posts: 9,760 ✭✭✭Effects


    intheclouds wrote: »
    I don't think the guy in the pic is the guy in the cabin.

    It's clearly the same guy in the cabin and the photo. They even have the same clothes on.
    arnold-and-fords-father-in-westworld-comparison.jpg
    When did we see Arnold's hands?

    We see Arnold building Dolores in a flashback, it shows his hands working on her.


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    #715
    Hazys
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,510 ✭✭✭Hazys


    Another interesting Q is if Bernard was a host all along...how long has he been working in the company? Because he has to age. Did Ford only replace the real Bernard with Host Bernard in the last couple of years or does he update Ford to age?

    This is all presuming that hosts don't have aging capabilities.


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    #716
    Hazys
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,510 ✭✭✭Hazys


    intheclouds wrote: »
    If they live in a world where any disease can be cured then how did Bernard's son die in hospital?

    Even if it was just an implanted memory, is it not improbable? And if Bernard talked about it to people would that not make them suspicious?

    I presumed curing disease isn't the same as curing injury or death.

    If Bernard can stab Thersea to death that means humans in their time can die prematurely. It looked like Barnard's son, had a massive injury to his head.


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    #717
    intheclouds
    Closed Accounts Posts: 3,175 ✭✭✭intheclouds


    Effects wrote: »
    It's clearly the same guy in the cabin and the photo. They even have the same clothes on.

    We see Arnold building Dolores in a flashback, it shows his hands working on her.

    That doesn't look like the same guy to me although the clothes are similar. The cabin guy has much heavier features.


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    #718
    Effects
    Registered Users Posts: 9,760 ✭✭✭Effects


    Here's Arnold building Dolores:
    westworld.png

    Everything points to Bernard being a copy of Arnold.


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    #719
    Hazys
    Closed Accounts Posts: 7,510 ✭✭✭Hazys


    They can't be complete replicas. Surely people would get suspicious if Bernard looked identical to the founder Arnold 30 years later.


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    #720
    Effects
    Registered Users Posts: 9,760 ✭✭✭Effects


    intheclouds wrote: »
    That doesn't look like the same guy to me although the clothes are similar. The cabin guy has much heavier features.

    Really? It doesn't get that much more obvious to be honest.

    Do you think production just got lazy and are reusing the same wardrobe? Perhaps it's just coincidence that they are wearing the same outfit?
    Or perhaps they thought there was good reason to hire two hugely similar actors to play two different characters.


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    #721
    jcsoulinger
    Registered Users Posts: 1,785 ✭✭✭jcsoulinger


    intheclouds wrote: »
    If they live in a world where any disease can be cured then how did Bernard's son die in hospital?

    Even if it was just an implanted memory, is it not improbable? And if Bernard talked about it to people would that not make them suspicious?

    It's possible that the son died just before disease was eradicated.


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