Westworld (HBO/Sky Atlantic) [** Spoilers **]

Cantona's Collars

Sad Professor wrote: »

Sylvester removed the explosive.

I was thinking that but couldn't quite remember.

alchemist33

....... wrote: »

The handshake scene with Ford and Bernard and the clean back of the head shot Dolores killed him with have me thinking along the same lines.

What was so unusual about the handshake?

SoftMicro

alchemist33 wrote: »

What was so unusual about the handshake?

Paraphrasing here but something along the lines of Ford mentioning in a previous episode that the earlier hosts handshakes would give them away as being robots.

Sam Kade

Are people still watching this? I gave up after 3 episodes.

Potential Underachiever

Sam Kade wrote: »

Are people still watching this? I gave up after 3 episodes.

Nope, the season is over!

I kind of thought that Delores didn't have a choice but to kill Ford. Felt that there was actually a cue with the music to activate it. Arnold played music when Delores killed him and Ford played music as well.

Drumpot

Train Dragon wrote: »

I watch most of my TV in bed, half knackered, so this sounds like it'll need a lot more attention

Binge watch over Christmas..

But like somebody said, don't waste your time if you aren't going to pay attention . I watch casualty with the wife when I am tired and lack concentration at tv time. But watched Westworld when I was more alert... I still missed a lot of things and found myself lost but I don't get annoyed if I am enjoying something.

I think some people need to chill out and take their time with this. If it's not for them then they should just stop watching. You know with Nolan you are gonna get some mind f**k stuff that's hard to follow with things that may not make complete sense. Get comfortable with suspension of reality and just take it that most of the things that annoy people are either not important to the story or have been left purposely open/ambiguous. They may or may not be explained later ....

Immerse yourself in the landscape, the culture, the music. Appreciate the awesome cast, each getting some dynamite lines and some killer scenes. Critical analysis of television is overrated. I think many people miss good stuff by spending too much time comparing things or just focusing mostly on subjective flaws.

This show is not perfect for everybody but it's perfect for me...

marco_polo

Turtwig wrote: »

In an earlier episode Dolores reveals that by accessing different narratives or stories she was able to give herself certain abilities. It seems likely she recalled the "wyatt" narrative to give herself the ability to be shoot and kill with a good deal of accuracy. I don't think any of the shots they showed her take at the board members missed their marks.

The whole Dolores speaking to Dolores certainly implies that she gained true sentience.

I just watching back again and any Dolores sentience doubt are blown away for me. Near the beginning of e10 in a conversation with Delores and Arnold concerning the maze he specifically says "do you now Delores what the center represents?, who's voice I've been wanting you to hear?" Tying that back to the final few minutes leaves little room for any other interpretation IMO.

Thelomen Toblackai

Finally caught up on this and finished it last night. Really impressed with the last couple episodes and how they tied everything back together with some genuinely surprising twists.

Absolutely brilliant series.

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mloc123

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I kinda took the handshake to be Ford handing over to Bernard...

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alchemist33

I did remember the comment about the handshake, and Ford's handshake SEEMED significant, but given how many people mentioned it I thought there might have been something more tangible about the handshake for us to notice. It looked like a pretty normal handshake to me.

FAILSAFE 00

alchemist33 wrote: »

I did remember the comment about the handshake, and Ford's handshake SEEMED significant, but given how many people mentioned it I thought there might have been something more tangible about the handshake for us to notice. It looked like a pretty normal handshake to me.

It looked very odd to me. I must watch it again.

cumulonimbus

alchemist33 wrote: »

I did remember the comment about the handshake, and Ford's handshake SEEMED significant, but given how many people mentioned it I thought there might have been something more tangible about the handshake for us to notice. It looked like a pretty normal handshake to me.

It doesn't look like anything to me!

MisterAnarchy

It seems neither Anthony Hopkins or Jeffrey Wright have been nominated for Golden Globes.
Its absolutely disgraceful that Hopkins was overlooked ,his acting was superb ,almost mesmerising.

Turtwig

Correct me if I'm wrong but wouldn't the golden globe for shows that started after September be next year?

Edit: nevermind, both wood and Newton were nominated. As was the show in some general categories.

Cina

MisterAnarchy wrote: »

It seems neither Anthony Hopkins or Jeffrey Wright have been nominated for Golden Globes.
Its absolutely disgraceful that Hopkins was overlooked ,his acting was superb ,almost mesmerising.

He already won the academy award for this character, I don't think he'll mind

ManOfMystery

MisterAnarchy wrote: »

It seems neither Anthony Hopkins or Jeffrey Wright have been nominated for Golden Globes.
Its absolutely disgraceful that Hopkins was overlooked ,his acting was superb ,almost mesmerising.

Totally agree. The entire cast was great in this and Wood/Newton/Wright were superb, but Hopkins was something else entirely.

Brendan Filone

Had to pause at this part in finale so I could laugh:



I can't believe how genuinely happy he is that the hosts can actually harm him now!

MOH

Brendan Filone wrote: »

Had to pause at this part in finale so I could laugh:



I can't believe how genuinely happy he is that the hosts can actually harm him now!

There's a few places that made me laugh. The two gunslingers reactions to how powerful the security guns were, and Felix when he realised Bernard is a host and starts looking at his own hands.

RDM_83 again

Spoilers ahead obviously

Overall very good but does anybody else think that for some reason the quality seemed to slip for the last two or three episodes? I'd give it 9/10 for the first 6 or 7 but only 6/10 for the last ones, I'm not really sure why but things seem to go a bit off.

The board member lady, the young black woman stood out for a number of reasons, she is far too young for the role particularly since she is meant to be familiar with Ford, also she can't act, every scene has her with that weird smirk/half smile, I'd guess the actress is at most 30 so it just rings hollow.

Thandie Newtons storyline seems to get too easy, jesus the Hosts get killed all the time by guests, why would security hesitate so much over killing them, also considering the control room can lock itself down completely shouldnt the rest of the place be a bit better designed in terms of dangerous hosts. She walks to the train station and its like nothing is happening yet a floor below maybe 20 people have just been killed.

The field techs motivations make no sense, the white dude has his throat cut by her yet the next episode he still re-assembles her without the explosives in her spine, the asian guy keeps helping them even when the Hosts have shown themselves to be dangerous murders.

Additionally something that has been bugging me is this? Does Thandie Newtons and the field techs storyline matter at all? like they are keeping it all clandestine yet somehow she ends up reprogrammed to break out. Presuming its Ford doing this, how are we meant to believe he knew the field techs would react this way?

I did love a lot of the show but as I said something went very off the last 3 episodes, it makes me worried about the calibre of next season.

edit: another thing with the lab techs (felix and dude), they seem to have complete access to the stuff that really difficult for the actual owners of the company to get at?these lowest of the low level guys have root access with no security around to stuff the board can't get at?????

Drumpot

RDM_83 again wrote: »

Spoilers ahead obviously

Overall very good but does anybody else think that for some reason the quality seemed to slip for the last two or three episodes? I'd give it 9/10 for the first 6 or 7 but only 6/10 for the last ones, I'm not really sure why but things seem to go a bit off.

The board member lady, the young black woman stood out for a number of reasons, she is far too young for the role particularly since she is meant to be familiar with Ford, also she can't act, every scene has her with that weird smirk/half smile, I'd guess the actress is at most 30 so it just rings hollow.

Thandie Newtons storyline seems to get too easy, jesus the Hosts get killed all the time by guests, why would security hesitate so much over killing them, also considering the control room can lock itself down completely shouldnt the rest of the place be a bit better designed in terms of dangerous hosts. She walks to the train station and its like nothing is happening yet a floor below maybe 20 people have just been killed.

The field techs motivations make no sense, the white dude has his throat cut by her yet the next episode he still re-assembles her without the explosives in her spine, the asian guy keeps helping them even when the Hosts have shown themselves to be dangerous murders.

Additionally something that has been bugging me is this? Does Thandie Newtons and the field techs storyline matter at all? like they are keeping it all clandestine yet somehow she ends up reprogrammed to break out. Presuming its Ford doing this, how are we meant to believe he knew the field techs would react this way?

I did love a lot of the show but as I said something went very off the last 3 episodes, it makes me worried about the calibre of next season.

edit: another thing with the lab techs (felix and dude), they seem to have complete access to the stuff that really difficult for the actual owners of the company to get at?these lowest of the low level guys have root access with no security around to stuff the board can't get at?????

I took it that Ford was facilitating Maeve most if not all the way. He wrote her initial story to get to the real world so it would make sense that he used his "backdoor" privelages that would help her have an easier getaway.

He could of even made sure that these two lab guys were the ones who persistently fixed her up. I believe ford is a genius and great reader of human behaviour, just like his inventions that were programmed to manipulate and entertain.

If somebody slits your throat you might not feel so brave as to stand up to them, even if their lives are in your hand. People online seem to presume that most people would react bravely and rationally when their lives are challenged.

These guys would probably lose their jobs if they tampered with Maeve and are fairly low down the pecking order. They possibly hoped she would be just decommissioned if she went off the story while active in the park. I think Felix was sympathetic to the hosts and Maeve even points out that he's "not a good human".. slot of the techies seem to be very odd , riding and whacking off on sleeping hosts. They would be used to killings and ratings, I would imagine that might desensitise them in some way.

I could be totally wrong but I feel the things that you are getting upset about are plausibly explainable. People do not always react in an obvious linear fashion. Ford was manipulating most of the things we watched (certainly in the now timeline) and as somebody with a "backdoor" skeleton key to the entire park is it really that difficult to imagine he "made it easy" for Maeve ? That he helped create the situation whereby the lab guys felt compelled to help her?

There are questions about how ford knew external parties (like MIB in Dolores story before beach with teddy) would help move things along. But I think that the same result/conclusion could of happened with or without the human assistance. Ford covered up deaths already so if the humans (MIB and techies) weren't assisting his "story" for Dolores and Maeve to end up wheee they did, he could of just made them disappear like Elsie or Stubbs. MIB repeated his infatuation with Dolores many times so I think based on past behaviour Ford was confident that he would search out and attack Dolores as he had so many times before.

Turtwig

RDM_83 again wrote: »

Spoilers ahead obviously

...

Board member is very possibly William's daughter imo.(He referred to her on a first name basis too didn't he.)

Security wanted to contain the rebellious hosts. They'd only let the guests know about it as a last resort. Maeve planned her escape to let her override a section of the lockdown. She also had the two gunslinger hosts provide distraction while she "escaped".

Although her narrative was seemingly to escape it looks like her emotional bond to her child made her override that narrative and possibly suggests she is also stepping towards sentience.

Felix, Asian guy, has realised the hosts may be sentient so he's conflicted and has already clearly shown he's was at odds with his employers.

Slyvester, throat slit, is genuinely scared for his own bacon now. (There may also be an element of him realising the hosts aren't the mere bits of plastic he thought they were.)

Whoever "wrote" Maeve's narrative knew the security protocols inside out. Hence why Maeve and co were able to circumvent them.

Effects

Turtwig wrote: »

Board member is very possibly William's daughter imo.(He referred to her on a first name basis too didn't he.)

She doesn't look likely to be Logan's niece to be honest. There's nothing unusual about using first names.

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tommy2bad

RDM_83 again wrote: »

Additionally something that has been bugging me is this? Does Thandie Newtons and the field techs storyline matter at all? like they are keeping it all clandestine yet somehow she ends up reprogrammed to break out. Presuming its Ford doing this, how are we meant to believe he knew the field techs would react this way?

I don't think Ford is actually controlling the situation. It's more he's facilitating it happening. I got the impression he has realised Arnolds idea that sentience is inevitable in the hosts given a certain set of circumstances is true and he also realises that quite a lot of this is due to how Arnold programmed them. Having previously disbelieved this and thought the signs of sentience were only glitches and illusions.
We don't see Ford plan the end point but we do see him projecting it and then setting the stage, though some have read this as Ford controlling everything.
All along Ford has been protecting the hosts more than driving them. The opposite of William/MiB who has been trying to force a change.
The Tecs are interesting, one enamoured of the possibility that the hosts could reach self-awareness, the other uncaring and dismissive of the idea. Similar to how Ford and the Delos board see the hosts.
The MiB is also fascinating, he wants the hosts to be able to hurt the guests, a better game we presume but as we learn that MiB is William, you have to wonder if it's more that the guests can't return love in any genuine way unless they have the capacity to hurt. It fits with what we know of his relationships in the outside world and how he was hurt by his wife before embarking on this trail of destruction in the park.

tonc76

Turtwig wrote: »

Board member is very possibly William's daughter imo.(He referred to her on a first name basis too didn't he.)

Didn't MIB say that his daughter had shunned him since his wife's suicide?

tonc76

tonc76 wrote: »

Didn't MIB say that his daughter had shunned him since his wife's suicide?

I think his daughter then went on to kill herself too?

Optimus Prime

Is it possible that thandie newtons character is in a third timeline separate from the young William , Ed Harris ones?

I'm trying to remember if there is any significant cross overs between her story and the others that would make that not work (I've only watched the series once )