ITU & Ironman

bryangiggsy

Are the pro ITU guys a standard above the pro Ironmen. First IM70.3 and G Noble throws down a 3.50. I know it was not a strong field but that translates into an 8-8.10 full Ironman time if he went the distance. Macca regularly states if Gomez ever moves up to IM distance he will blow the field away. Is Ironman for pro retirement from ITU?

MrCreosote

Yes is the simple answer.

For better or worse, once ITU got triathlon into the Olympics this was an inevitability. These days the money, kudos and government funding is all into the ITU run events and athletes.

tunney

bryangiggsy wrote: »

Are the pro ITU guys a standard above the pro Ironmen. First IM70.3 and G Noble throws down a 3.50. I know it was not a strong field but that translates into an 8-8.10 full Ironman time if he went the distance. Macca regularly states if Gomez ever moves up to IM distance he will blow the field away. Is Ironman for pro retirement from ITU?

Alot of ifs and buts there.

peter kern

yes and no

Certainly its tougher to make it to the olympics as a pro than to hawaii as a pro.
Why iam not aware of any olympian at the london games not being full time. I am aware off 5 athelte to working ( some full time some part time) and qualified for hawaii.

Bottom line is Itu guys are funded, Ironmans are not which means more athletes can survive if they are not top notch but since going to the olympics is very important for federation to get funding they have to give atheltes the support even if they have no chance to make the top 10.

Thats one side of the coin the other is of course their is only 8 top tier olympic races ( world series races) thats where most atheltes go for . so the best race each other more frequent.
Ironman challenge rev3 by now has some 80 races each year so of course the filed spreads out and
Long course atheltes cant race as often as the oly guys ....
only at Melbourn abu dahbi frankfurt roth and of course hawaii and vegas do you actually have a real field thats top notch most Ironman races and etc struggle those days to have an Itu european cup level.
SO atheltes are further spread out than ITU (Most of the top draft legal races in the Usa have no stronger field than Ironman.

TO look at the funding one would say that the gender difference for an half Is about 24 min ( lets not argue about every second )
so you see last weekend you can say both winner in austria had a similar performance. the difference is one does get no funding ( very few countries do fund their long distance guys before you say typical irish)
so its harder for the long course guy to make a living.
Gavin is doing fantastic and Ireland can be extremly proud to have him at the same time if he was an long distance atheltes with no funding chances are good he would never have made is ( he is v stubborn so he prob would have but it would have been more difficult )

For every Itu athlete that makes it long there is 1 that doesnt make it and macca and leanda cave and mark allan are the only once to have an World champ title over the oly distance and hawaii title on their CV (Iam sure i forgot 1 but they are rare )
SO its defo not easy to win hawaii , abu dhabi ,franfurt melboure.
Lessing spencer smith robbo have never really made on the ironman level and won accumulated 10 world champ titles.

ALso I would always put my money on an Oly guy over an Ironman guy over an 70.3
its closer to oly than ironman.

its certainly much easier to win an 70.3 race for the reasons above but to win hawaii or an world champ oly title are as difficult ( though I have no doubt that 5 of the last olympic tri games medal winners would be with a very hig chance to win hawaii 1 year )
bit like in running most top 10 k runner make top marathon runner. ( but also many dont make it )

ps spencer smith lessing peter proberts have 10 oly world titeles and i think won 2 Ironmans and 0 top three at hawaii ( i think a 4th is the best they go in hawaai spencer smith )

MrCreosote

You don't have to look any further than Macca's olympic qualifying attempt to see the gulf in standards really. The reigning Kona champ was finishing way down the field in the WTS and world cup events.

Ironman has some amazing athletes, don't get me wrong, but the depth isn't there. And it'll get more noticeable as time goes on because all the youth development is into short course racing.

I don't buy this "endurance athletes improve as they age" either. This was always said about the marathon, but once the prize money available improved for the big city marathons, suddenly all the young guns switched from the track and started dominating them.

peter kern

to this point one could say he has also not gotten any results since he is being back at long course ....
Its certainly hard for an ironman to move down again ( an ironman with an ITu backgorund swims about 8-15 k a week ... most Itu guys swim aobove 25 k a week . SO Mc cormack has let his swim dropp to much ( he did not make the first swim pack in hawaii in his last hawaii apperance ) and at his age it is hard to get the speed in swim back. ( some would say he wasnt hungry enough anymore as he was a good swimmer back in his day)
his run was actually not bad after 6 month of training of oly distance.
also dont forget he is the best guy at marketing triathlon has ever seen .......

MrCreosote wrote: »

You don't have to look any further than Macca's olympic qualifying attempt to see the gulf in standards really. The reigning Kona champ was finishing way down the field in the WTS and world cup events.

Ironman has some amazing athletes, don't get me wrong, but the depth isn't there. And it'll get more noticeable as time goes on because all the youth development is into short course racing.

I don't buy this "endurance athletes improve as they age" either. This was always said about the marathon, but once the prize money available improved for the big city marathons, suddenly all the young guns switched from the track and started dominating them.

peter kern

http://www.ironman.com/triathlon/coverage/athlete-tracker.aspx?race=worldchampionship70.3&y=2013#axzz2eCYvgIil

On a tough bike course given the fact there was some of last years top 15 Itu guys racing ( i think dom and clark where 11th and 1oth in the points ranking before london ) it would appear that some Itu guys that say ironman is easy might need to reconsider. BUt to be fair vegas is a strenght course not a speed course.