Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - 2013/14 mod warning post#7259

Tom_Cruise

New Manager steps in to fill the boots of the greatest manager that has ever lived, who himself didn't have a great start to his career and people are already on about getting rid of him? Seems like madness.

Who is going to take over from him if he does get the chop?

He needs at least 1 if not 2 seasons before Utd sack him, unless he really messes up.

Lord TSC

Your Airbag wrote: »

Why should you trust him? Because he is still learning, still trying to find his best 11 and we have 30 matches left.

Thats not a reason to trust him. It's an attempt to give a reason to give him time. I want a reason to trust him.

If you are asking for a manger to be sacked after 8 games then you are spoilt and impatient. Chelsea and Man City would give a manager more time. Where does it stop if we sack him? what if the next manager doesn't turn it around we sack him too right? then we are a Chelsea and our ethos of stability is gone.

We keep looking until we find the right manager. We don't keep the wrong manager just because we're worried we might look bad. We don't keep the wrong manager because we fear we might be looked on badly. We look for the right manager because we are Man United.

You would have been calling for Fergies head back in his first years too, actually the words years is giving you too much credit, first few months we'll say. Look what happened when we stood by him. Look at Arsenal after sticking by Wenger after 8 years of no trophies.

I HATE this arguement.

Fergie did not have the team Moyes did. If Fergie had had this start with THIS team, then I'd imagine there'd have been calls for his head too. And Wenger has kept Arsenal in the top 4. If Moyes was doing that, there wouldn't be an issue...

Its cringe worthy to hear all these fickle impatient spoilt fans spout this crap after a header from a corner in the 89th minute cost us. Grow up. If we won there would have been none of this talk.

This "crap" isn't being spouted cause of one late goal. It's been building and building. It's frustration based on his entire tenure so far, not one game and one result.

And you know what. Yes, we are spoiled. We have a team who should be preforming way above the standards Moyes is setting. We have a team who should not have to worry about dropping the points we have been so far. United fans are spoiled because we have come to expect a certain standard. Moyes knew that starting out, and even being given some slack, he's still managing to underpreform in a big way.

So again I ask...WHY should we trust Moyes? Why should he get more time? Not even today or tomorrow but why should he be garrunteed a season or two no matter how bad he preforms? Thats a mentality that's had Valencia being useless; no matter how bad he preforms, there's no fear of being dropped.

Give me a reason why Moyes is right for the job right now? Give me a reason that relates to Moyes himself, not to the "ethos" of the club or a fear of being looked down on by other fans. Again I ask, why should I trust Moyes can turn around these negative tactics, poor sub decisions and horrible results?

Zico

With the best will in the world I can't hide the fact that I'm very disappointed with how Moyes has done.

Your Airbag

titan18 wrote: »

Last two leagues were won on 89 points, so we need 78 out of 90 left to match last season and the season before. The way we're going atm, I can't see us getting 78 and I'd be amazed if anyone can.

The league is throwing up a lot more upsets this season. If Man City win today they are 5 points ahead of us. We still have the gunners to play twice. Its not ideal but its not over, I can see a 8 point gap being closed. Arsenal and Chelsea have had much easier starts so I don't think it will be eight over the course of the season even if the Gunners beat us.

We will know where we stand in January.

Unearthly

Your Airbag wrote: »

Utd are in 8th. What are you actually on about?

Plus your missing the point and confirming mine. Hodgson took Liverpool from a side who didn't have a chance of winning an EPL title and turned them into a side didn't have a chance of winning an EPL title.

Its not the same thing as UTD just won the title and are still in the hunt for this one.

I was talking about Hodgson and Liverpool.

Hodgson took a team with top 4 ambition to hovering just above relegation zone, saying very small time things to the media, and a negative mindset in his tactics.

Moyes has so far taking united to mid table, saying small time things to the media, and has a negative mindset in his tactics.

Its also my opinion that neither Hodgson or Moyes had done enough in their career to justify getting either position.

Simples!

titan18

Your Airbag wrote: »

The league is throwing up a lot more upsets this season. If Man City win today they are 5 points ahead of us. We still have the gunners to play twice. Its not ideal but its not over, I can see a 8 point gap being closed. Arsenal and Chelsea have had much easier starts so I don't think it will be eight over the course of the season even if the Gunners beat us.

We will know where we stand in January.

We're playing crap, he's making horrible decisions and tbh I'd see no reason why the likes of Kagawa and Hernandez would want to stay in January with him as manager.

Dicky Pride

Your Airbag wrote: »

Even more embarrassing. You wanted him gone before he even statred.

You're embarrassing yourself now. I didn't want him hired.

Headshot

Tom_Cruise wrote: »

New Manager steps in to fill the boots of the greatest manager that has ever lived, who himself didn't have a great start to his career and people are already on about getting rid of him? Seems like madness.

Who is going to take over from him if he does get the chop?

He needs at least 1 if not 2 seasons before Utd sack him, unless he really messes up.

But that difference is saf had a pedigree in Scotland, what pedigree has Moyes?

Has Moyes ever qualified for Europe? Has he won anything? Moyes has no experience at this level. Imagine if this was Klopp with this dreadful start, I would be the first in line to defend him because Klopp is an outstanding manager and knows how to win. I can trust a man that has done unreal stuff in Germany to get utd back to winning ways and help to transform how utd play. Moyes cant do this

IvySlayer

It's not being fickle.

Moyes has spent 28m, got rid of the backroom staff and brought in his own. Fair enough, but there's no identity to United. 442, tactics are shocking and depressing subs.

IvySlayer

Moyes:
"We had the opportunities to go 2-0 up. They had been knocking on the door but I thought we would see it out.

"But if you don't defend a corner well enough, there's always a chance they will score. We had a couple of good chances where we could have finished them off and if we had scored a second it would've put the game to bed, but 1-0 is always a dangerous scoreline."

See it out.........That's what wrong.

enviro

The fact of the matter is that Moyes will get more time to try and sort this mess out. Utd's board aren't going to replace him this soon, especially with Fergie still having an influence. Remember Fergie's parting words?

The situation Moyes finds himself in now is that we need to start picking up 3 points and fast, all because of the poor start to the season.

The continuation of the team's erratic form and failure of the tactics employed has lead to him resorting to negative tactics, as seen today by attempting to hang onto one nils in an effort to secure these much needed wins. Utd are on a slippery slope in this regard. Unfortunately the strategy backfired today. He is just going to have to take the responsibility for his failed decision.

Teams are no longer in fear of Utd imo, even in Old Trafford, that's clear to see in the way opposition teams are approaching the games. This can probably be attributed to Fergie's presence no longer being there on the side line/ dressing room. The influence the man had on everything Utd can't be underestimated. Utd's players are surely uncertain as change, big change; brings that and of course other teams see this weakness as well.

Moyes is employing a style this Utd team aren't use to playing, and never will be imo, we are not a negative team. Player changes or a tactical switch is required, with the latter being the obvious solution.

I fear for Champions League qualification and all the consequences this would bring for Utd. Moyes has a lot of work to do.

bucketybuck

Your Airbag wrote: »

We are not a Chelsea or Man City revolving door club and nor would I want us to be.

Its a nice sentiment and all, but should we really base major decisions on the noble goal of "not being like Chelsea"?

I'm not saying Moyes should be sacked, thats not my point here at all. But if the season continues to be as woeful as it has been so far, and if it comes to a point where the club has to seriously consider his position, then I hope the board will look at things rationally instead of considering noble but ultimately irrelevant ideals like "not being a revolving door club like Man City".

I haven't decided on Moyes yet, but I know this, the worst thing the club can do is stick with a poor manager simply because they stuck with Fergie all those years ago. Thats not good enough reason to stick with any manager.

wonderfullife

Tom_Cruise wrote: »

New Manager steps in to fill the boots of the greatest manager that has ever lived, who himself didn't have a great start to his career and people are already on about getting rid of him? Seems like madness.

Who is going to take over from him if he does get the chop?

He needs at least 1 if not 2 seasons before Utd sack him, unless he really messes up.

For the love of God give that sh1te a rest about Fergusons start at Utd.

Fergie took over with Utd in 21st place in the league!! 21st! Took over with some talented players fond of the booze and in a shocking state fitness wise.

Moyes took over the champions of England.

bucketybuck

Moyes wrote: »

but 1-0 is always a dangerous scoreline.

Then go out and make it 2-0 you scared prick. :mad:

Your Airbag

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

Thats not a reason to trust him. It's an attempt to give a reason to give him time. 1. I want a reason to trust him.



2. We keep looking until we find the right manager. We don't keep the wrong manager just because we're worried we might look bad. We don't keep the wrong manager because we fear we might be looked on badly. We look for the right manager because we are Man United.



I HATE this arguement.

Fergie did not have the team Moyes did. If Fergie had had this start with THIS team, then I'd imagine there'd have been calls for his head too. And 3. Wenger has kept Arsenal in the top 4. If Moyes was doing that, there wouldn't be an issue...



This "crap" isn't being spouted cause of one late goal. It's been building and building. It's frustration based on his entire tenure so far, not one game and one result.

And you know what. Yes, we are spoiled. We have a team who should be preforming way above the standards Moyes is setting. We have a team who should not have to worry about dropping the points we have been so far. United fans are spoiled because we have come to expect a certain standard. Moyes knew that starting out, and even being given some slack, he's still managing to underpreform in a big way.

4. So again I ask...WHY should we trust Moyes? Why should he get more time? Not even today or tomorrow but why should he be garrunteed a season or two no matter how bad he preforms? Thats a mentality that's had Valencia being useless; no matter how bad he preforms, there's no fear of being dropped.

Give me a reason why Moyes is right for the job right now? Give me a reason that relates to Moyes himself, not to the "ethos" of the club or a fear of being looked down on by other fans. Again I ask, why should I trust Moyes can turn around these negative tactics, poor sub decisions and horrible results?

1. If you have no faith he is a good manager and can handle the UTD job nothing I can say will change your mind no matter how good my point would be. This doesn't mean your right and is a loaded question to provoke this argument. I'm not taking the bait.

2. We keep looking until? How long do you give each manager then? Less than 8 games as you said you didn't want Moyes before today. So you give somebody the sack after 8 games if things are not going well. Thank god the powers at UTD don't have this kind of thought logic because it would damage the club and shift the blame from the players and give them more power and turn us into a circus like Chelsea.

3. We are four points from 4th. Are you actually reading this stuff before you post it? Jose and Pellegrini will be out of the top four after nine games if they lose their next matches, with your logic they should join Moyes down the job centre.

4. He should get more time because he could still win 4 trophies this season. We are still in for four. We are not out of anything. We are not a Chelsea or City.

So your happy to finish fourth and keep Moyes on as you said Wenger kept Arsenal in the top four? but we are four points off fourth and you want Moyes gone in October? Actually why did I respond to this illogical nonsense.

Quandary

I want to see Moyes given a fair chance but, if at the end of th season Utd are outside the top 4 then I think that's just not good enough and he should be sacked.

There has to be a minimum level of achievement for him. No one I can see is expecting him to win the league in his first season but slipping outside the top 4 is simply not good enough.

There is so much pressure on him now and he really isn't helping himself. Massive improvement needed between now and Xmas to steady the ship.

The_Kew_Tour

I wonder how many people were saying our squad was fine for past few years and right now want Moyes out.

Disappointed wit today no question. Some of things being said about Moyes is OTT though.

Your Airbag

Dicky Pride wrote: »

You're embarrassing yourself now. I didn't want him hired.

The point I was making. You didn't want a good manager who worked wonders in his last job given even a chance. Who knows yet what he could achieve.

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

I wonder how many people were saying our squad was fine for past few years and right now want Moyes out.

Disappointed wit today no question. Some of things being said about Moyes is OTT though.

There are a lot of captain hindsights in here today forgetting that Moyes took over this squad that had no CM additions or older players replaced. Yes he should have done better in the window but he was weeks in the job and had a pre season tour to settle.

It amazes me that people actually expect there to be no side effects of manger of 25 yrs who was considered the greatest ever handing over the reigns to a new manager who is managing a top club for the first time ever (kinda like how Fergie was when he got the job).

Moyes will get a season no doubt and I'm happy to see that. I would rather see some of the dead wieght and older players gone before Moyes.

Lord TSC

Your Airbag wrote: »

1. If you have no faith he is a good manager and can handle the UTD job nothing I can say will change your mind no matter how good my point would be. This doesn't mean your right and is a loaded question to provoke this argument. I'm not taking the bait.

Nice cop out.

This is a big problem. I ask people why I should have faith in Moyes specifically, what makes HIM the right man for the job, and the answers are hard to come by.

I'm not provoking anything or trying to bait you. I want a genuine answer as to why I should trust HIM>

2. We keep looking until? How long do you give each manager then? Less than 8 games as you said you didn't want Moyes before today. So you give somebody the sack after 8 games if things are not going well. Thank god the powers at UTD don't have this kind of thought logic because it would damage the club and shift the blame from the players and give them more power and turn us into a circus like Chelsea.

You seem obsessed with Chelsea and looking like them. I don't care about Chelsea, I don't care about what other fans think. I want to find the right man for the job. And with Moyes right now, it's not a case of players out of form or things just not going our way; it's the poor tactics, the baffling subs, bad handling of PR, a bad transfer window....it's a lot of little things adding up, not just on the field but off it too.

3. We are four points from 4th. Are you actually reading this stuff before you post it? Jose and Pellegrini will be out of the top four after nine games if they lose their next matches, with your logic they should join Moyes down the job centre.

We're lucky Chelsea and City have been poor as well this season, and if United weren't doing worse, I think the media would have latched onto them right now with a "Who'll go first" story. But "But X and Y are doing bad too" isn't an arguement to defend Moyes, and once again, you are talking about other teams and how they relate to United. And even then, at least Jose is more proven than Moyes. People will rightly have faith he can turn things round cause he's had so much success over the years. There are reasons to trust Jose is up to the job.

How City and Chelsea are doing though, and how many managers they've gone through, should have no impact on the weighing up of Moyes and his suitability to be United manager.

4. He should get more time because he could still win 4 trophies this season. We are still in for four. We are not out of anything. We are not a Chelsea or City.

I'm not arguing we aren't still in it. I'm saying I believe that time will only continue to make the problems Moyes is showing worse, not better. And as such, I ask again, why should I trust Moyes can turn things around?

So your happy to finish fourth and keep Moyes on as you said Wenger kept Arsenal in the top four? but we are four points off fourth and you want Moyes gone in October? Actually why did I respond to this illogical nonsense.

I'm quite happy to keep Moyes if he can even look like we're in a fight for the top 4. Problem is nothing I'm seeing right now suggests he can keep that fight going long term. What gives you trust and faith in him that he can up things when we're 3 games into a "Must win 5 games" and we've only got 4 points? You give out that I am showing no faith in him but you get annoyed when I ask why you have such utter faith in him.

Lennonist

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

Fergie did not have the team Moyes did. If Fergie had had this start with THIS team, then I'd imagine there'd have been calls for his head too. And Wenger has kept Arsenal in the top 4. If Moyes was doing that, there wouldn't be an issue...

There was calls for Ferguson's head at the time particularly in Autumn '89 after he had been there a few season and spent a fair bit of money. There were names bandied about in the media to take over from him, I remember Steve Coppell was regarded as a shoe in to be next Man U boss when Ferguson was to be sacked. Ferguson would've been sacked these days, and he would not have had the career he had at Man U, because he would've been sacked before he got to grips with the job.

Ferguson has left Moyes with an average enough side not capable of competing for the title, and then they didn't sign anyone other than Fellaini in the summer. Poison chalice if there ever was one.

Unearthly

Lennonist wrote: »

Ferguson has left Moyes with an average enough side not capable of competing for the title

Yes he left them the champions who can't compete for the title.

F*cking hell

The_Kew_Tour

Your Airbag wrote: »

There are a lot of captain hindsights in here today forgetting that Moyes took over this squad that had no CM additions or older players replaced. Yes he should have done better in the window but he was weeks in the job and had a pre season tour to settle.

It amazes me that people actually expect there to be no side effects of manger of 25 yrs who was considered the greatest ever handing over the reigns to a new manager who is managing a top club for the first time ever (kinda like how Fergie was when he got the job).

Moyes will get a season no doubt and I'm happy to see that. I would rather see some of the dead wieght and older players gone before Moyes.

You're spot on.

Our biggest downfall was not signing players this summer or the summer last year, but in Summer of 2011.

When we got stuffed by Barca that should have been the wake up call we needed. We lost CL final in 2011 and we stand still. Bayern lose CL final in 2012 and by buying quality they win the thing next year.

Sadly now Moyes is picking up pieces from cracks that have been at the club for past 2-3 years.

Lennonist

Unearthly wrote: »

Yes he left them the champions who can't compete for the title.

F*cking hell

Oh dear, deary, deary me.

wonderfullife

Lennonist wrote: »

There was calls for Ferguson's head at the time particularly in Autumn '89 after he had been there a few season and spent a fair bit of money. There were names bandied about in the media to take over from him, I remember Steve Coppell was regarded as a shoe in to be next Man U boss when Ferguson was to be sacked. Ferguson would've been sacked these days, and he would not have had the career he had at Man U, because he would've been sacked before he got to grips with the job.

1. Ferguson has left Moyes with an average enough side not capable of competing for the title, and 2. then they didn't sign anyone other than Fellaini in the summer. Poison chalice if there ever was one.

1. that average enough side pissed the league last season.

2. Whatever peoples opinions on Woodward, Moyes had the whole summer to sign whoever he wanted. The buck stops with the manager on nearly all issues club-related.

Poison chalice?! lol. Golden Goose more like. A slick, well-run, organised operation which should be yielding any manager worth his salt trophies galore over the next 5 years. Sure, you cant guarantee winning the league every season but right now they don't look capable of winning an egg and spoon race on Sports Day.

allthedoyles

Its not just the loss of Ferguson , but the whole entourage .

Everyone is expecting history to repeat itself , saying that SAF was on the verge of been sacked in '89 , and so on .

Hopefully history will repeat itself , but probably not for many years to come .

So expect a big lull .

Unearthly

Lennonist wrote: »

Oh dear, deary, deary me.

Unless I misinterpreted you, explain to me how a squad that won the league so comfortably last season is not capable of even challenging for the title this season?

homerjay2005

disappointing performance, disappointing result and ive all but given up on us winning the title this season now as i cant see Moyes turning this around at the way he is going. our players just look clueless and this is the real worry.

im not going to call for him to be sacked like others are, im going to wait until December to fully assess him, but today he shown once again, that he is out of his depth. we've turned into Everton, 13 points dropped from 8 games, is just astounding.

Your Airbag wrote: »

Are you actually reading this stuff before you post it? Jose and Pellegrini will be out of the top four after nine games if they lose their next matches, with your logic they should join Moyes down the job centre.

why do you keep comparing our club to others? i dont give a f8ck how they are doing and i only care about ourselves and right now, we are doing absolutely s*it.

you keep mentioning about not wanting to be like clubs who sack managers - if Moyes was doing his job and up to the job, we wouldnt be having this discussion. so far, he has been woeful. if he doesnt improve quickly, he wont deserve to be manager of us. we cant just keep somebody in the job, who isnt good enough just for the sake of it or just for sentiment.

im not sure why you keep defending him.

the more and more this goes on, the crazier the decision to give him the job gets.

Moyes made some baffling substitutions today, really bizarre. You can't blame the players when he makes so many weird negative changes. Very disappointed to see that sort of mentality being displayed so obviously.

Chagan

Your Airbag wrote: »

Moyes will get a season no doubt and I'm happy to see that. I would rather see some of the dead wieght and older players gone before Moyes.

This depends on what Moyes considers "dead weight" though.



I don't think he should have to worry about getting sacked yet but he definitely needs to pull his finger out realise where he is. Sitting back to hang onto a 1-0 victory against, regardless of their recent form, what is essentially a mid table team just isn't good enough.

Even if we had held on, with the league as competitive as it is this year goal difference could be crucial in deciding the top 3 etc. We should piling on pressure, not inviting it on us.

Hank Scorpio

Unearthly wrote: »

Unless I misinterpreted you, explain to me how a squad that won the league so comfortably last season is not capable of even challenging for the title this season?

I agree with you but the influence of Ferguson shouldn't be underestimated

Lennonist

Unearthly wrote: »

Unless I misinterpreted you, explain to me how a squad that won the league so comfortably last season is not capable of even challenging for the title this season?

They're not genuine title contenders this season is what I mean, they needed a few more signings in order to do so. They would do really well to get a top 4 spot and I'm sure they'll take that at this juncture. Moyes is in danger of being the first scapegoat of the transition from Ferguson's departure at Man U.

Rayne Wooney

He looked tactically inept, Pochettino showed him up really.

Still no point calling for his head now, we don't want to be like Chelsea with a manager revolving door, that's what'll happen if they get rid of him now. Give it until the end of the season and if we're outside the top 4, beg Klopp to save us.

Your Airbag

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

I want a genuine answer as to why I should trust HIM>



You give out that I am showing no faith in him but you get annoyed when I ask why you have such utter faith in him.

I gave you reasons in point four.

Who said I have utter faith in him? I am willing to give him time, big difference. He has a squad to improve with some older and average player still in it. The we were champions last season argument (not one your making) is invalid. Its a new season and we are facing teams with new squads, City and Spurs spent 80m+, Arsenal have improved and a lot of their younger players have improved. All of those latter points are out of Moyes control.

We have 30 EPL games left. A UCL campaign, the FA cup and league cup still to compete for.

I am more interesteed to see how Moyes improves the squad and shapes it how he wants it to be over a season or two because right now he is managing a side that has been playing a certain style for a long time. The signings and players made for that squad were brought in to match the previous managers style of play.

To expect this all those other teams spending and the changes that we need to have no effect on us eight games in after after such a long period of our ex manager having the players train and play his way is unrealisitc.

I will give Moyes one season minimum, I would like him to have two and expect him to buy in players that will allow him to put his stamp on the team.

homerjay2005

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

He looked tactically inept, Pochettino showed him up really.

Still no point calling for his head now, we don't want to be like Chelsea with a manager revolving door, that's what'll happen if they get rid of him now. Give it until the end of the season and if we're outside the top 4, beg Klopp to save us.

the problem is, the longer this goes on, the less and less top world class managers and players will want to join us. We are all pinning out hopes on January transfer window, but that could turn out to be even worse than the summer.

some people talked about Fergie being back by January (cant remember who they were) and about getting good odds on it.....i dont think it will happen as the club will be too stubborn to admit they f8cked up (if things dont turn around) but it could well happen - there simply is nobody else left to replace Moyes at the moment and thats not going to change.

Unearthly

Lennonist wrote: »

They're not genuine title contenders this season is what I mean, they needed a few more signings in order to do so. They would do really well to get a top 4 spot and I'm sure they'll take that at this juncture. Moyes is in danger of being the first scapegoat of the transition from Ferguson's departure at Man U.

Fair enough. I think its more the managers fault than the squad although I agree new signings were needed.

Your Airbag

homerjay2005 wrote: »

why do you keep comparing our club to others? i dont give a f8ck how they are doing and i only care about ourselves and right now, we are doing absolutely s*it.

you keep mentioning about not wanting to be like clubs who sack managers - if Moyes was doing his job and up to the job, we wouldnt be having this discussion. so far, he has been woeful. if he doesnt improve quickly, he wont deserve to be manager of us. we cant just keep somebody in the job, who isnt good enough just for the sake of it or just for sentiment.

im not sure why you keep defending him.

the more and more this goes on, the crazier the decision to give him the job gets.

Why do I keep comparing to the other clubs in our league who are above us which is what you and others are worried about, clubs that have a history of rotating managers and haven't had the long period of success we have had? Its pretty obvious why and a natural comparison to make. I' not going to compare us to Roma or Celtic.

I keep defending him because we have a long way to go and we could yet have a good season and any Manager would need time to stamp his influence on this sqaud that is 90% still Fergies.

Cantona's Collars

46% Possession at home to Southampton.Rigid system with no room for a playmaker who's so highly rated by his previous club they tried to re-sign him.
Moyes looks to be pandering to Rooney by playing him even if he's not on top form (something that can be levelled at other players).Baffling subs,ignoring an up & coming talent and playing a 40 year old out of position.
Just another Saturday in the life of MUFC these days.
One crumb of comfort is that no other team is setting the pace in the league,thank fuck Chelsea or City haven't gone on a winning streak.To think we were laughing at Arsenal in the Summer.They bought a playmaker & are actually playing him as one,we play ours as a winger when he does get a few minutes on the pitch and depend on Carrick & Fellaini to pull the strings in midfield.

Our play has been slow & ponderous for nigh on a season & a half now,yet it shows no sign of improvement.It's a damning indictment when two of the top strikers in the league go so long without scoring from play.The style seems to be Carrick-Fellaini-Carrick-Winger-cross,cleared.Rinse & repeat.Even today Carrick was forcing things trying to create something and as a result some of his passes were like shots at times & the receiving player was at his best to control the ball let alone do anything with it.Just shows how frustrating things were for him when he ends up doing things like that.

bucketybuck

Heres the thing. Everybody rightly points out that neither Chelsea nor City have had good starts to the season either, and they haven't. But both those sides can point to some really good performances this season. Both those sides have at some point clicked and showed the potential of the top quality players they have, and their fans can point to those performances and say "We have been poor at times, but look what we can do when it works".

At not one single point this season has United looked anything but lethargic and very, very poor. Even games like Swansea where we won, the performances of the players and manager were not very good at all and we were quite lucky to get the three points. This is what people mean when they say "Show me a reason to trust Moyes", there has not been one performance we can cling to and say "Look at this, this worked and it can be like this again". Not one.

Rayne Wooney

homerjay2005 wrote: »

the problem is, the longer this goes on, the less and less top world class managers and players will want to join us. We are all pinning out hopes on January transfer window, but that could turn out to be even worse than the summer.

some people talked about Fergie being back by January (cant remember who they were) and about getting good odds on it.....i dont think it will happen as the club will be too stubborn to admit they f8cked up (if things dont turn around) but it could well happen - there simply is nobody else left to replace Moyes at the moment and thats not going to change.

Realistically we'll get Ander and Baines, the tactics will remain the same, which is the problem. Think about it if we had Ander today he wouldn't have played with Carrick and Fellaini there, Baines would have improved our crosses but Nani and Jan were doing a decent job of that already.

I suggested that Fergie could be back after Christmas depending where we are in the league, I think it would give the players a boost and salvage some kind dignity for the club if we're still the way we are now, then Klopp could be brought in in the Summer.

Your Airbag

homerjay2005 wrote: »

the problem is, the longer this goes on, the less and less top world class managers and players will want to join us. We are all pinning out hopes on January transfer window, but that could turn out to be even worse than the summer.

some people talked about Fergie being back by January (cant remember who they were) and about getting good odds on it.....i dont think it will happen as the club will be too stubborn to admit they f8cked up (if things dont turn around) but it could well happen - there simply is nobody else left to replace Moyes at the moment and thats not going to change.

Ffs some of this stuff is hard to listen too. Acutally read that back to yourself. Its complete rubbish. Are you genuinely serious?

Even if UTD finished outside the top four this season we are still the most supported club in the world, with a great modern history of domestic and european success and recognised as one of the best and most prestigious clubs in the world.

The top managers would be f'ing climbing over each other to manage us.

A bad start and some people lose touch with reality.

Moyes out, he is driving us over a cliff, Busby must be spinning in his grave, no top manager will want to manage us soon.

Its cringe worthy stuff and embarrassing to see how fans react.

Mr.Nice Guy

Moyes ain't going anywhere and a lot of the points that have been lost this season have been due to individual mistakes, i.e. Ferdinand a few weeks back.

Fergie last season asked for fans to be patient and give Moyes time. I'm pretty sure he meant more than 8 league games into the season.

I had hoped, considering Fergie's start at United, that fans of this club would be a bit more level-headed, but I guess in this cut-throat culture of football that this was too much to expect.

Thankfully there are sensible football people within United like Fergie and Charlton who realise football isn't like playing Football Manager and Moyes will be given plenty of backing.

It's a transitional period. Deal with it.

bucketybuck

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

I suggested that Fergie could be back after Christmas depending where we are in the league, I think it would give the players a boost and salvage some kind dignity for the club if we're still the way we are now, then Klopp could be brought in in the Summer.

Fergie coming back would destroy any dignity we have left.

He is gone, and with all due respect he should stay gone, its just pushing the problem down the road otherwise.

Chagan

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

I suggested that Fergie could be back after Christmas depending where we are in the league, I think it would give the players a boost and salvage some kind dignity for the club if we're still the way we are now, then Klopp could be brought in in the Summer.

Who says Klopp would be interested if he felt that he'd be usurped as soon as things went badly.

ician

Moyes will be given 2 seasons at least I feel

Rayne Wooney

zerks wrote: »

To think we were laughing at Arsenal in the Summer.They bought a playmaker & are actually playing him as one,we play ours as a winger

On this Ozil has actually been playing from the right a lot, but the difference is Wenger has adapted his tactics to suit Ozil playing through the middle from the right. As a result they are tearing teams apart through the middle and only go out wide as a last resort really.

United could easily do this, but don't.


I think it's time for Moyes to start taking risks, he's been playing safe so far and his job could well be on the line anyway, he has nothing to lose, if it doesn't change he's gone either way. So I'd like him to show some steel and go out for the win in the next game few games, draws just aren't an option now let alone losing.

Cantona's Collars

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

It's a transitional period. Deal with it.

It's not as if we started this season with a brand new team,we aren't Sunderland.This is the same team that won the league last season yet we seem incapable of scoring more than a single goal or holding onto a lead.
Sad to say that a team who were used to getting nothing from their visits to OT came here today and played with no fear,West Brom did the same a few weeks ago.

No disrespect but these teams are hardly Barca or Bayern.

We had a tough start but 4 points from 3 'winnable' games is shocking form.I won't join the "Moyes out" rabble but something has to happen and soon or we'll find ourselves in a hole that will be too deep to crawl out of.

Hank Scorpio

bucketybuck wrote: »

At not one single point this season has United looked anything but lethargic and very, very poor. Even games like Swansea where we won, the performances of the players and manager were not very good at all and we were quite lucky to get the three points. This is what people mean when they say "Show me a reason to trust Moyes", there has not been one performance we can cling to and say "Look at this, this worked and it can be like this again". Not one.

Leverkusen at home was a good performance, struggling to think of others

Rayne Wooney

nuxxx wrote: »

Leverkusen at home was a good performance, struggling to think of others

Play Kagawa = good performance

Is it a coincidink?

titan18

Moyes at most gets one season on current form. When we fail to qualify for the CL, the Glazers will tell him to fcuk off

Agueroooo

titan18 wrote: »

Moyes at most gets one season on current form. When we fail to qualify for the CL, the Glazers will tell him to fcuk off

This^^

The fella will be steam rolled if CL is missed out on.

CL money is at the nucleus of the Glazer master plan.