Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - 2013/14 mod warning post#7259

listermint

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

Klopp wouldn't have this negativity about the current Champions, he wouldn't let Southampton dominate us at home and let them highlight our naivety tactically. He definitely wouldn't have signed Fellaini.

He's the right man for the job IMO and it's in our favour because I doubt he'll be able to topple Bayern in the long run, and United could be the club for him to keep progressing.

Moyes was always a risk and so far it doesn't look like paying off, hopefully he can turn it around but we have to be realistic here.

Fair enough commentary buy you know as much as every other poster here that moyes was chosen and is chosen and is not going anywhere.

So how do you get on the path to recovery without fanciful management changes that aren't going to happen.

CSF

listermint wrote: »

United panel are mourning the loss of its only effective linchpin?

Don't disregard the negative effective mentality of change has on players. Also don't disregard the dire straights of how league contenders faired last season. It was a woeful season to be reasonably fair.

And don't take that as a slight which is a usual jump reaction.

There are managers out there who would have a similar effect though, that is the whole point really. People were being naive if they ever thought Moyes could, managers like Mourinho, Klopp, Simeone, Ancelotti, definitely.

Robson99

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

This team won the league by 10 points last year. The only huge personnel changes in the league have been in the management area. Neither chelsea or City have bought any new players that have lit the league up. Neither have United. What has changed?

We havent strengthened the first team enough for at least the last 3 years when we should have been. Chelsea and City have

irishfeen

Should we be expecting major changes/signings in January (players) if this current form continues?... if we are outside the top 4 (or well off top spot) come January you would imagine major transfer funds will be made available to ensure CL. Moyes will get IMO 3 years without question, with Ferguson and Charlton (especially) there to prevent knee-jerk reactions I cannot see Moyes being put out to dry in any situation.

PhlegmyMoses

listermint wrote: »

United panel are mourning the loss of its only effective linchpin?

Don't disregard the negative effective mentality of change has on players. Also don't disregard the dire straights of how league contenders faired last season. It was a woeful season to be reasonably fair.

And don't take that as a slight which is a usual jump reaction.

I absolutely agree that we should have added more in midfield. But that's it. There is no way that a team can go from winning the league by 10 points to struggling to beat mid-table teams over 8 games because of a lack of quality in the squad.

And this was my point all along. Let's say Ferguson was getting 100% out his players and it pushed us over the finish line last year and had us level the season before. This still doesn't mean that losing him would see us to degrade to this level. If 100% gets us first at a canter, 80% should still have us way closer to the top than we are now. Being honest, we're lucky to even be in the top half.

And if you want to downgrade last season to poor - I disagree but what can you do - what of the season before? Where we lost on goal difference. What has changed for all these other teams since last season that they have now? Why are City playing so well? Why is Silva suddenly on form again and Aguero and Toure? They haven't added many match winners to the team, a few decent squad players but their bench isn't much better than ours.

That's right, they got rid of a manager who wasn't doing well. And we got rid of a manager that was and replaced him with somebody that is really struggling to get to grips with the league.

You can keep beating the quality drum but the smart bet is on the fact that good players are underperforming and the manager is struggling at the moment. The quality thing is too simplistic and at odds with what I've seen of these players in the last 2 years.

Liam O

PropJoe10 wrote: »

United fans in "getting defensive about their squad" shocker. I would personally take Gary Cahill, Ivanovic or Terry over Ferdinand, Evans and Jones any day. Hernandez over Torres for sure, Dzeko over Hernandez as an overall player - probably. What are your views on the likes of Anderson and Cleverley? And with all due respect, Ryan Giggs should be nowhere near the United squad at this stage.

Have you seen Ivanovic play center back? Evans is probably on a par if not better than Cahill. Anderson and Cleverly are right now 3rd or 4th choice in a position that has been well publicised is the weakest in the team and will be a priority to change in January or Summer. Cleverly is a great player to have for his position in the squad. Won't complain about not playing much and can come in a do a job. Giggs has barely played.

Look Moyes is a bit of a deer in the headlights at the moment but I believe him when he says he has big plans for the team. He definitely needs to get a new mentality and approach to games. The players are there to play a far more polished version of his Everton system with possibly slightly worse full backs and he's yet to really employ it. A problem is that he never really found a striker who thrived in that system barring half a season of Jelavic so his handling of that position will have to improve.

After the initial disappointment of the recent bad results kicks in I'm left thinking that I'm not going to overreact and am mainly calm. I have pulled out my hair in recent seasons at Fergie's lack of progression in a tactical sense and this could just be the culmination of that. If I had no faith change was coming I'd be more annoyed and not playing one of my favourite players isn't helping but I have faith in his work of keeping Rooney and Nani that he has his own ideas and that change is coming next season. This season could be tough but the players will pick it up and it's not totally too late to talk about a title challenge. Though I hope Arsenal do it if United aren't good enough. There's a winning run in this team. The difference between this point last season and now is that RVP isn't bailing the team out. That's pretty much it imo because the start of last season was very shakey.

PhlegmyMoses

Robson99 wrote: »

We havent strengthened the first team enough for at least the last 3 years when we should have been. Chelsea and City have

I actually agree. I just don't agree that the difference is as big as many are making out. I'll come back to my main point. United have been so bad this year that the quality argument is just muddying the water. We are better than we are playing now. Miles better. This argument may be valid if at the end of the season we were blown out of the water by the likes of City and Chelsea in key matches and we ended up coming third. We're not even likely to see that situation right now if our current form continues.

homerjay2005

stankratz wrote: »

8th position after 8 games in the post-Ferguson era after a dismal summer, not ideal but not time for the nuclear launch just yet, not for me.

considering you were one of the vocals who slammed those who had "meltdowns" all summer about the tranfser window, its certainly surprising to see you change your view now and call it dismal!

why the change of mind?

bucketybuck

I see a number of people have mentioned the January transfer window, that we need to see what happens there.

I am curious, considering our pathetic showing in the summer transfer window why exactly are people confident about the January one?

Rayne Wooney

bucketybuck wrote: »

I see a number of people have mentioned the January transfer window, that we need to see what happens there.

I am curious, considering our pathetic showing in the summer transfer window why exactly are people confident about the January one?

Because if the January transfer window is pathetic we're f*cked, simple as. You have to hope the club will do what's needed.

We need 2 world class players at the bare miniumum, Baines and Ander just won't do

Robson99

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

I actually agree. I just don't agree that the difference is as big as many are making out. I'll come back to my main point. United have been so bad this year that the quality argument is just muddying the water. We are better than we are playing now. Miles better. This argument may be valid if at the end of the season we were blown out of the water by the likes of City and Chelsea in key matches and we ended up coming third. We're not even likely to see that situation right now if our current form continues.

I agree we are capable of playing much better. But Moyes has been left a squad that possibly only Fergie could get to win a league. As I said previously he is doing himself no favours with his selections or substitutions. Giving giggs playing time in ahead of some of the younger players and not giving Kawaga a chance is just a continutation of Fergies managment. He needs to make his own calls. But some people are blaming Moyes totally for the way we are at the moment and I think this is wrong. Remember we didnt even commence his employment with us until July 1st. This was madness. He should have commenced the day after his final game with Everton. The transfer window was a shambles. Looking for players for half nothing. If we wanted the likes of Fabergas we should have just put 50m on the table and give them something to think about. I dont blame Moyes fully for the transfer shambles. I think the board has a lot to answer for too

Red Crow

What's worrying is Moyes has shown nothing to suggest that he has the pedigree of a top manager. Introducing Januzaj has been his best call but he sets us up poorly and has shown that he can't change a game with his substitutions.

You have to question why did we go for a manager who is clearly learning on the job and is a huge work in progress as opposed to someone who was already a winner. I'm not calling for him to be sacked but he isn't doing much right at the minute and the results aren't good enough.

It's hard to get behind someone when there is so much going wrong at the minute and the performances are sh1te.

Lord TSC

bucketybuck wrote: »

I am curious, considering our pathetic showing in the summer transfer window why exactly are people confident about the January one?

I tried to be positive about the summer window, but I'm terrified of the mid-season window now.

My fear is not only will we not bring in anyone of note (maybe one or two squad players at best), but we could lose, at minimum, Kagawa and Hernandez....

PhlegmyMoses

I don't think that we'll do all that much in January. If Moyes is confident that his job will be there next season unless we really make a balls of it and the board is happy to back him, I can't see us going in with a blank chequebook, which is what we need to do business in January.

We won't be getting bargains and our policy of slow burning transfer deals during the summer should temper anybody's hopes that we'll be splashing out in January.

Being honest, I'd nearly rather that Moyes started to get more out of what he has right now, than blazing money in a panic in January. Our next signings need to be for the first XI and will cost us money. They need to be right.

SirDelboy18

Rooney playing as the "no.10" is hurting us so much. He has gotten far too much praise for running around a lot and scoring some frees.

If we had Kagawa in there our fortunes would improve dramatically.

bucketybuck

SirDelboy18 wrote: »

Rooney playing as the "no.10" is hurting us so much. He has gotten far too much praise for running around a lot and scoring some frees.

You won't get much agreement for that, but I think its the truth. Rooney brings a lot to the table, but he isn't actually the type of creative force that we need in that position.

Robson99

SirDelboy18 wrote: »

Rooney playing as the "no.10" is hurting us so much. He has gotten far too much praise for running around a lot and scoring some frees.

Spot on SirDelBoy

J. Marston

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

Because if the January transfer window is pathetic we're f*cked, simple as. You have to hope the club will do what's needed.

We need 2 world class players at the bare miniumum, Baines and Ander just won't do

I spent all summer saying we didn't need him since Evra played well last season.

Couldn't have been more wrong. Evra was an absolute shambles yesterday. Honestly, some of his defending reminds me of something you'd see a park kickabout.

Mitch Connor

Rooney isn't playing as a number 10, thats part of our problems. He is playing as a striker alongside RVP - meaning noone is linking our midfield and attack properly.

Rayne Wooney

Rooney shouldn't play the next game based on his performance yesterday, but as usual he'll get what he wants or hand in a transfer request.

We apparently turned down Ozil I'm guessing because he would have to play where Rooney does, compare what Ozil has done for Arsenal this season and Rooney for us.

Robson99

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Rooney isn't playing as a number 10, thats part of our problems. He is playing as a striker alongside RVP - meaning noone is linking our midfield and attack properly.

He is playing between Rvp and our midfield. Call it the No 10, in the hole or what ever people like but he is supposed to be the link. And he has been piss poor at it

cson

Bit surprised at the Rooney hate in here; I think he's been one of your better players this season. Also, what's going on with Kagawa is an absolute travesty.

Rayne Wooney

Rooney is definitely playing deeper than RVP

homerjay2005

bucketybuck wrote: »

I see a number of people have mentioned the January transfer window, that we need to see what happens there.

I am curious, considering our pathetic showing in the summer transfer window why exactly are people confident about the January one?

January could be an even bigger let down, available players just are not there. we found it hard enough to sign players in the summer, as Champions. cant imagine too many world class players queueing up to sign for us at the way things are going, despite what the head in the sand brigade like to think.

we may get Baines and/or Herrara, but cant see them solving our problems and they are not the world class players we need. id only be happy to see them come in, if the likes of Valencia, Young, Welbeck, Jones and co were shifted off, but thats not going to happen as they wont get anywhere near the money we paid for them.

eagle eye

cson wrote: »

Bit surprised at the Rooney hate in here; I think he's been one of your better players your best player this season. Also, what's going on with Kagawa is an absolute travesty.

FYP.

Mitch Connor

yesterdays game.

Two issues immediately noticable.

Rooney and RVP pretty much alongside each other, so link between attack and defence tougher.

More of an issue - Fellaini and Carrick basically standing on each other for the game. Despite the criticism, I don't think Fellaini is as bad a player as we have seen so far - I think he simply isn't playing well. Doesn't seem to either have a role, or understand the role, and hasn't developed a partnership with Carrick.

Robson99

Mitch Connor wrote: »

yesterdays game.

More of an issue - Fellaini and Carrick basically standing on each other for the game. Despite the criticism, I don't think Fellaini is as bad a player as we have seen so far - I think he simply isn't playing well. Doesn't seem to either have a role, or understand the role, and hasn't developed a partnership with Carrick.

Posted something similar earlier Mitch. The two of the are basically standing in a line beside one another. One needs to be getting forward to help out. It was very obvious to see on one particular attack in the second half when nani had the ball outside the edge of the box. There was no urgency from Fellani to get forward into the space and when he did get there the opening was closed down. He needs to be better than that irrespective of what instructions he is given going onto the pitch

Red Crow

cson wrote: »

Bit surprised at the Rooney hate in here; I think he's been one of your better players this season. Also, what's going on with Kagawa is an absolute travesty.

Rooney has been decent while everyone around him has been poor. I think Kagawa should be playing all right.

PhlegmyMoses

Does anybody think that our fullbacks both averaging positions as far forward as our wingers is part of the problem? Nobody on the flanks is really averaging a threatening position in either a goalscoring sense or a crossing sense. I noticed it yesterday with Januzaj who seemed to be constantly covering for Evra. Our fullbacks don't offer enough end product to justify averaging that kind of position relative to our wingers.

Robson99

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

Does anybody think that our fullbacks both averaging positions as far forward as our wingers is part of the problem? Nobody on the flanks is really averaging a threatening position in either a goalscoring sense or a crossing sense. I noticed it yesterday with Januzaj who seemed to be constantly covering for Evra. Our fullbacks don't offer enough end product to justify averaging that kind of position relative to our wingers.

That is a problem alright and was very evident again Sunderland. Weer not getting to the byline near enough to get in quality crosses.
However I think Moyes is getting caught up between wanting to play 442, 4231, 433 etc There is so much chopping & changing of formations etc that even the players look confused.

Discodog

My concern is that I don't think Moyes expected such a poor start. It must be putting huge pressure on him. He must be beginning to have doubts.

I also doubt that the Club & Board expected it. Moyes was SAF appointment. I would be amazed if SAF isn't going to get involved in mentoring Moyes.

Will Rooney want to stay if we don't get, at least, into the top four?

VW 1

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

Does anybody think that our fullbacks both averaging positions as far forward as our wingers is part of the problem? Nobody on the flanks is really averaging a threatening position in either a goalscoring sense or a crossing sense. I noticed it yesterday with Januzaj who seemed to be constantly covering for Evra. Our fullbacks don't offer enough end product to justify averaging that kind of position relative to our wingers.

The way they are playing now it is a problem because in Moyes' system it seems as if they are still acting as traditional wingers in some ways and there is a confusion, they are wide and the fullbacks overlap, there is nowhere to go but down the outside and fire a cross in which clearly hasn't been working.

If we are insisting on pushing on with two upfront it looks like we will need to change from the current formation to do so, RVP and Rooney are too starved of any kind of quality possession to do enough to affect games.

I would like to see the midfield diamond revisited now that we have Fellaini, we are better equipped personnel-wise for the system to work.

Carrick at its base as the deep lying DM using his positional sense to cover in frot of the CBs and his passing range to be the rhythm setter. Fellaini and Cleverley in there to do the grunt work and Kagawa to have his free role behind the strikers to link play and get into the box.

Evra and Raf easily have enough in them to provide width and the defensive burden I feel would be naturally eased with us having more possession and being able to impress a passing game higher up the pitch.

ankles

Key changes are not just Moyes for Ferguson but also the loss of the entire, highly successful, coaching set-up, replaced by, in effect, Everton's coaches. This really disappointed me. For all the talk about Moyes's lack of CL experience, I would have been happy if he had worked with the coaching team, but losing the entire CL coaching experience was a huge call (and wrong in my mind). It also massively increased the sense of upheaval. Neither, obviously, did he want to follow through on the previously identified transfers, apart from the failed marquee signings (I mean Garay etc. even Moyes couldn't turn down Fabregas and THiago). It smacks of an insecure man trying to put down a marker, despite the damage he causes to club continuity.

Added to this are the ultra-defensive mindset in team set-up, the muddled thinking (two holding midfielders and two forwards, bizarre substitutions, "bombing fullbacks" like it's 1999, panic subs when things on the pitch get hairy etc.), and it adds up to where we are now with last year's title winning team. Look who are top of the league, Liverpool and Arsenal, as well as mis-firing City and Chelsea. We should be strolling the league this year, instead we are lucky that no one is firing as they should.

I say this as someone who supported Moyes's appointment, but he is just driving me crazy. And yes, I do remember Fergie's first few years etc. and he had a much bigger job to do than take over a title winning team

homerjay2005

ankles wrote: »

I say this as someone who supported Moyes's appointment, but he is just driving me crazy.

genuine question here, why did you support the appointment as opposed to a proven, world class manager?

and what were your expectations for the season when he took over in july? it was very noticeable here that peoples expectations dropped from "we will win the league" to " we will qualify for CL". now its dropped even further to "hopefully we will finish in top 4, but i am worried we wont".

i still think we will finish top 4, but i think that is my heart thinking more than my head and its more in hope, than expectation.

the problem is, had we put in a proper, world class manager, the whole ethos and atmosphere around the club would be so much better now and i am sure of that.

the word transition shouldnt be needed at a club like United. Bayern, Juve, PSG, barca, Real and all the other top clubs, wouldnt have hired Moyes, and Chelsea, City, Arsenal, Spurs wouldnt either - they had oppurtunities over the past 3 years (except Arsenal) to change their manager and Moyes was never close to landing any of those jobs, i dont see what he did to deserve the United one. cappointing a manager who has never achieved anything, to take over from one of the most successful managers ever, was certainly a baffling decision.

PhlegmyMoses

homerjay2005 wrote: »

the word transition shouldnt be needed at a club like United. Bayern, Juve, PSG, barca, Real and all the other top clubs, wouldnt have hired Moyes, and Chelsea, City, Arsenal, Spurs wouldnt either - they had oppurtunities over the past 3 years (except Arsenal) to change their manager and Moyes was never close to landing any of those jobs, i dont see what he did to deserve the United one. cappointing a manager who has never achieved anything, to take over from one of the most successful managers ever, was certainly a baffling decision.

I agree with some of your post but this bit is bollocks.

Loads of those clubs have signed managers that weren't big names or mightily experienced. In recent years off the top of my head, Bayern hired Klinnsman, who was a disaster, Juve had Delneri and Ferrara (be like us employing Roy Keane), Barcelona promoted a man with no experience when Pep left and just hired a man with little European pedigree, Real hired Queiroz and Ramos and a raft of others like them,.

Chelsea hired Di Matteo and a load of other failures and got rid of Villas Boas too quickly and Spurs were a joke for managers until they got Villas Boas. It's too simplistic an argument.

tallaghtmick

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

I agree with some of your post but this bit is bollocks.

Loads of those clubs have signed managers that weren't big names or mightily experienced. In recent years off the top of my head, Bayern hired Klinnsman, who was a disaster, Juve had Delneri and Ferrara (be like us employing Roy Keane), Barcelona promoted a man with no experience when Pep left and just hired a man with little European pedigree, Real hired Queiroz and Ramos and a raft of others like them,.

Chelsea hired Di Matteo and a load of other failures and got rid of Villas Boas too quickly and Spurs were a joke for managers until they got Villas Boas. It's too simplistic an argument.

Yet we didnt learn from it.

homerjay2005

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

Chelsea hired Di Matteo and a load of other failures and got rid of Villas Boas too quickly and Spurs were a joke for managers until they got Villas Boas. It's too simplistic an argument.

and yet, despite all these appointments you mentioned, Moyes was not once in contention for any of these jobs. all of these clubs have new managers except one and all of them got proven, top class managers - we didnt.

Lord TSC

Discodog wrote: »

Will Rooney want to stay if we don't get, at least, into the top four?

I worry that as well as losing Hernandez and Kagawa, we could suffer other losses like him too. I expect Barca and Real to be sniffing round De Gea soon too, and it'll be harder to keep him if we're struggling for 4th.

PhlegmyMoses

homerjay2005 wrote: »

and yet, despite all these appointments you mentioned, Moyes was not once in contention for any of these jobs.

This doesn't mean that he shouldn't have been. I'd absolutely have had Moyes over loads of those people. It's not some mental appointment without any logic behind it. Anyway, this is old ground at this point and it's too early for the "I told you sos" to be out in full force.

How Soon Is Now

homerjay2005 wrote: »

genuine question here, why did you support the appointment as opposed to a proven, world class manager?

and what were your expectations for the season when he took over in july? it was very noticeable here that peoples expectations dropped from "we will win the league" to " we will qualify for CL". now its dropped even further to "hopefully we will finish in top 4, but i am worried we wont".

i still think we will finish top 4, but i think that is my heart thinking more than my head and its more in hope, than expectation.

the problem is, had we put in a proper, world class manager, the whole ethos and atmosphere around the club would be so much better now and i am sure of that.

the word transition shouldnt be needed at a club like United. Bayern, Juve, PSG, barca, Real and all the other top clubs, wouldnt have hired Moyes, and Chelsea, City, Arsenal, Spurs wouldnt either - they had oppurtunities over the past 3 years (except Arsenal) to change their manager and Moyes was never close to landing any of those jobs, i dont see what he did to deserve the United one. cappointing a manager who has never achieved anything, to take over from one of the most successful managers ever, was certainly a baffling decision.

See your gonna get so many people question this and come out with the likes of ''Well he needs time'' ''Look at Fergie when he started out and where he finished'' ''We need to stand by him bla bla bla''

The fact is nothing he has done since the proper season started brings any sort of confidence in his ability or the teams.

Its even more annoying when everytime we have failed this season you have players coming out in media saying we must stand up and take the blame !

Its Moyes who should be taking responsibly for this its his decisions and his team selections and the **** up in the transfer window that has us in this position for the most.

At the end of the day when he was named as manager i wished him the best and hoped and believed he can make it. The more i see of him and how hes went about this job in every way i really dont think he should be at this level hes drowning at this stage ffs.

The problem with replacing a manager like Alex Ferguson is your losing from day one theres always gonna be a slight down period while you sort out your team and get used to how a club like Manchester United is run. BUT i am nearly sure a proven top level manager would not of went about things the way Moyes has on and off the pitch. You can clearly see he is in over his head at the club so far and players are taking the **** for it now. That includes the ones hes leaving on the bench and holding back there careers.

Its not good enough no matter how much time we give him if his attitude stays like this were getting no where and i can see the longer this going on we will start to lose players also.

Manchester United players are not used to being at this level and they wont want to be either.

If the board brought in Moyes as a cheap alternate to a proven world class manager then there gonna really lose out in the long run. We all are.

Being level on points at this stage of the season with Hull is a disgrace to the football club and its fans. Eight points off the top..... Crazy stuff.

We won the ****ing league handy last year its not like he took over a mid table team ffs.

Mr.Prodston

homerjay2005 wrote: »

genuine question here, why did you support the appointment as opposed to a proven, world class manager?

and what were your expectations for the season when he took over in july? it was very noticeable here that peoples expectations dropped from "we will win the league" to " we will qualify for CL". now its dropped even further to "hopefully we will finish in top 4, but i am worried we wont".

i still think we will finish top 4, but i think that is my heart thinking more than my head and its more in hope, than expectation.

the problem is, had we put in a proper, world class manager, the whole ethos and atmosphere around the club would be so much better now and i am sure of that.

the word transition shouldnt be needed at a club like United. Bayern, Juve, PSG, barca, Real and all the other top clubs, wouldnt have hired Moyes, and Chelsea, City, Arsenal, Spurs wouldnt either - they had oppurtunities over the past 3 years (except Arsenal) to change their manager and Moyes was never close to landing any of those jobs, i dont see what he did to deserve the United one. cappointing a manager who has never achieved anything, to take over from one of the most successful managers ever, was certainly a baffling decision.

I'm not jumping on you here. I've just hopped online and scanned the thread and yours was the last post and is an ideal launchpad for the question I wanted to ask.

If not Moyes what world class manager should we have appointed? Mourinho went to Chelsea, Pep went to Bayern and Carlo to Madrid. Under the assumption that these aren't viable options who would be a better appointment?

Sir Alex Ferguson has been in charge for 26 years, that's a very long time in a "unique" job. By Unique I mean that nobody else has been in charge of a club of such a high profile for so long. Nobody has the perfect credentials to replicate that until they can prove otherwise.

I think everything here has been presented pretty reasonably.

homerjay2005

Mr.Prodston wrote: »

If not Moyes what world class manager should we have appointed? Mourinho went to Chelsea, Pep went to Bayern and Carlo to Madrid. Under the assumption that these aren't viable options who would be a better appointment?

Jose would be our manager now, if we offered him the job. his appointment at Chelsea came weeks after we got Moyes and same goes for Carlo.

and Fergie knew for months he was retiring - Pep probably would not have signed for us regardless, but maybe just maybe had fergie done the dog work with him, we could have got him.

eitherway, its all irrelevent now, they decided Moyes would take up, probably 1 or 2 years ago and thats that, we wasted the chance to move on and progress.

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

Anyway, this is old ground at this point and it's too early for the "I told you sos" to be out in full force.

there is no pleasure in "i told you sos" what so ever and i dont see anybody doing it. we all hope Moyes comes good and the club wins the league this year. however, for that to happen now, we need a minor miracle - theres too many teams above us playing well and people seem to fail to realise that as of this time next week, 1/4 of the season will be over already.

CSF

Mr.Prodston wrote: »

I'm not jumping on you here. I've just hopped online and scanned the thread and yours was the last post and is an ideal launchpad for the question I wanted to ask.

If not Moyes what world class manager should we have appointed? Mourinho went to Chelsea, Pep went to Bayern and Carlo to Madrid. Under the assumption that these aren't viable options who would be a better appointment?

Sir Alex Ferguson has been in charge for 26 years, that's a very long time in a "unique" job. By Unique I mean that nobody else has been in charge of a club of such a high profile for so long. Nobody has the perfect credentials to replicate that until they can prove otherwise.

I think everything here has been presented pretty reasonably.

Mourinho was heartbroken over being overlooked for the United job, Simeone, Klopp, Hiddink, Laudrup, Pellegrini, Villas Boas, Rodgers, Conte, Heynckes, Benitez, Mazzarri, Capello. All better managers and no doubt there is more because Moyes is incredibly average.

Sure you could nitpick at my post and single out the one that you personally think is crap, and yes no doubt a number of them may have been unviable. But the point is that with that many better managers than Moyes it is crazy that he ended up getting one of the top 5 jobs in football.

ericzeking

Jayzus that was tough going catching up on the thread, about 15 pages. In short I agree with the sentiment that Rooney playing as a striker and not as the creative no.10 midfield type player we crave is a major problem with our play. I'd like Kagawa or Januzaj given a shot in that position and wouldn't be averse to playing Rooney up top and giving rvp a break. Chicharito should get more minutes too, we need his enthusiasm. Actually yesterday would have been a perfect game for him with that high line Southampton were defending.

Chazz Michael Michaels

Moyes is performing to his level, lads. What do you expect?

Robson99

CSF wrote: »

Mourinho was heartbroken over being overlooked for the United job, Simeone, Klopp, Hiddink, Laudrup, Pellegrini, Villas Boas, Rodgers, Conte, Heynckes, Benitez, Mazzarri, Capello. All better managers and no doubt there is more because Moyes is incredibly average.

Sure you could nitpick at my post and single out the one that you personally think is crap, and yes no doubt a number of them may have been unviable. But the point is that with that many better managers than Moyes it is crazy that he ended up getting one of the top 5 jobs in football.

Im not going to nitpick CSF but I would only have taken Klopp or Laudrup from that list.

Chazz Michael Michaels

Robson99 wrote: »

Im not going to nitpick CSF but I would only have taken Klopp or Laudrup from that list.

Moyes > Capello?

LOL

homerjay2005

Robson99 wrote: »

Im not going to nitpick CSF but I would only have taken Klopp or Laudrup from that list.

Jose and Carlo are as proven as they come...you honestly wouldnt have wanted them or chosen Moyes before them?

Mitch Connor

Mr.Prodston wrote: »

I'm not jumping on you here. I've just hopped online and scanned the thread and yours was the last post and is an ideal launchpad for the question I wanted to ask.

If not Moyes what world class manager should we have appointed? Mourinho went to Chelsea, Pep went to Bayern and Carlo to Madrid. Under the assumption that these aren't viable options who would be a better appointment?

Sir Alex Ferguson has been in charge for 26 years, that's a very long time in a "unique" job. By Unique I mean that nobody else has been in charge of a club of such a high profile for so long. Nobody has the perfect credentials to replicate that until they can prove otherwise.

I think everything here has been presented pretty reasonably.

We'd have got Mourinho if we had offered him the job, regardless of what has been said since. Jose thought it was his.

CSF

Robson99 wrote: »

Im not going to nitpick CSF but I would only have taken Klopp or Laudrup from that list.

There are some other names there who I don't see how you could possibly have rejected. The likes of Conte, Simeone and Heynckes in particular.