Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - 2013/14 mod warning post#7259

KH25

zerks wrote: »

At least Moyes found where Fergie left the hairdryer,seems like he read the players the riot act after yesterday's game.

Where are you seeing this? Completely deserved if true.

Mitch Connor

zerks wrote: »

At least Moyes found where Fergie left the hairdryer,seems like he read the players the riot act after yesterday's game.

Completely deserved, as long as Moyes is taking a look at his own obvious culpability in the manner of the defeat.

Selections and tactical plan was poor, and poorly executed.

Backstreet Moyes

zerks wrote: »

At least Moyes found where Fergie left the hairdryer,seems like he read the players the riot act after yesterday's game.

It's panning out as i expected. We will be more consistent and drop less points than the others in low key matches. But in the big games we will drop too many points.

bullvine

Just had at the fixture list, good run between now and Spurs on Dec 1st, Moyes is gonna need to win pretty much all of them especially Arsenal

Cantona's Collars

On a lighter note did anybody notice the tool behind the City goal in the 2nd half recording the game on an iPad? He had it held in front of his face at one point.
Your team are 4-0 up on their bitterest rivals and you spend the time looking at it on a screen while you're at the game,fuck sake.

KH25

zerks wrote: »

On a lighter note did anybody notice the tool behind the City goal in the 2nd half recording the game on an iPad? He had it held in front of his face at one point.
Your team are 4-0 up on their bitterest rivals and you spend the time looking at it on a screen while you're at the game,fuck sake.

I didn't notice that but sadly thats how people are these days. At live events like matches or concerts they pay to go and then watch the entire thing on a phone, Ipad or camera screen.

Nalz

KH25 wrote: »

Where are you seeing this? Completely deserved if true.

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Completely deserved, as long as Moyes is taking a look at his own obvious culpability in the manner of the defeat.

zerks wrote: »

At least Moyes found where Fergie left the hairdryer,seems like he read the players the riot act after yesterday's game.

Where did you see this???????????????

Mitch Connor

Trilla wrote: »

Where did you see this???????????????

In a number of the papers this morning, Mirror for one I think.

Julez

What team would people like to see on Wednesday?

For me...

---

DDG

---

----Fabio

---

Smalling

---

Vidic

---

Evra

---

---

Carrick

---

Felliani

---

---

Nani

---

Rooney

---

Kagawa

---

---

Chico

---

If Raf is back to fitness I'd like to see him in.

If Chico, Nani and Kagawa aren't getting time because they aren't match fit, then they need to get fit, and that will only happen if they play.

bryangiggsy

Mitch Connor wrote: »

In a number of the papers this morning, Mirror for one I think.

FFS the Mirror! Credible source that!:rolleyes:

Nalz

Mitch Connor wrote: »

In a number of the papers this morning, Mirror for one I think.

The mirror, ah f**k off.

Mitch Connor

Julez wrote: »

What team would people like to see on Wednesday?

For me...

---

DDG

---

----Fabio

---

Smalling

---

Vidic

---

Evra

---

---

Carrick

---

Felliani

---

---

Nani

---

Rooney

---

Kagawa

---

---

Chico

---

If Raf is back to fitness I'd like to see him in.

If Chico, Nani and Kagawa aren't getting time because they aren't match fit, then they need to get fit, and that will only happen if they play.

Really not sure.

Hernandez up top. Nani, Kagawa and Zaha off him. Fellaini can't play, so 2 from Anderson, Carrick and Cleverley. Jones, Evans and Raf probably need the game time. Evra probably needs to be rested - but that means Buttner....

Julez

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Really not sure.

Hernandez up top. Nani, Kagawa and Zaha off him. Fellaini can't play, so 2 from Anderson, Carrick and Cleverley. Jones, Evans and Raf probably need the game time. Evra probably needs to be rested - but that means Buttner....

Oh yeah, I forgot about Fell being cup tied, I would have had a weaker side out initially, but we can't afford to be beaten by Liverpool again! Thats why I left the likes of Rooney, Vidic, Evra, Carrick (not like we can afford to take him out of the side anyway) in.

Ordinary man

I'd rather they got knocked out playing the likes of kagawa, januzaj, zaha and hernandez than scraping a win with young,valencia,welbeck and giggs. I want to see moyes set up a team for the opposition to worry about rather than a team trying to nullify the opposition.

tallaghtmick

Hey at least the loanee's played well Moyes out :pac:

TheDoc

bryangiggsy wrote: »

FFS the Mirror! Credible source that!:rolleyes:

Henry Winter was mentioning last night how Moyes doesn't need a hairdryer, or lessons from SAF on how to rollick players.

He would have lashed his Everton squad out of it for a performance like that. Mentioned that the United players are about to get their first taste of his nasty streak.

Seemingly he can peal wallpaper of walls with his screaming.

And well deserved. He's being all nicey pie just in the door, given people some space as he settles and they get used to him. Big changes so lets play calm.

I'd say behind closes doors he went ballistic.

Julez

Ordinary man wrote: »

scraping a win with young,valencia,welbeck and giggs.

We'd probably lose again TBF.

jonnyfingers

Disappointed with the performance yesterday. We just seemed so slow to everything. The goals were nearly all down to lazy defending, not sure how much Moyes can take the blame for that.

However persisting with Young, Valencia and Wellbeck when the likes of Nani, Kagawa and Hernandez were on the bench is something I can't understand. I'll give Moyes the benefit of the doubt as the two early second half goals really killed the game and no substitutions he made were really going to salvage a win or a draw. So maybe he rested them in anticipation of the next game, or in the face of a lost cause he wanted to tinker with the tactics with the current line up to try and get them to play better. And we did play well enough for the last half hour but by then City had eased off and we were still very wasteful going forward.

I always knew it would take time for the team to get used to the new manager and possibly a new style, so I have to give Moyes time. It's a shame we've had some tough fixtures early on, but all we can do is focus on the next game. Hopefully he can pull things together pretty quickly.

Lovely Bloke

Moyes needs the league cup.

matthew2008

'your job now is to stand by our new manager' - SAF...... yes it was a horrible performance, yes theirs certain players in the team who simply arnt up to performing at this level, but lets not turn our club into a Chelsea type pantomime, lets actually give moyes a chance instead of starting every sentence with 'im happy to give moyes a chance, BUT......'
things where never guna be smooth sailing when he retired, I thought most people woulda guessed that.
also young has to go, I don't care to where he should be sold to anyone willing to bid

v3ttel

---

DDG

---

Fabio, Smalling, Evans, Evra

---

Carrick-- Fellaini

---

Nani

---

Kag

---

Jan

---

Chico

---

For Wednesday, I hope. Evans, Nani, Kag, Januzaj & Chico all need game time. Carrick & Fellaini need time to form a partnership.

By the way, was there a game yesterday?

5starpool

v3ttel wrote: »

---

DDG

---

Fabio, Smalling, Evans, Evra

---

Carrick-- Fellaini

---

Nani

---

Kag

---

Jan

---

Chico

---

For Wednesday, I hope. Evans, Nani, Kag, Januzaj & Chico all need game time. Carrick & Fellaini need time to form a partnership.

By the way, was there a game yesterday?

Already been mentioned several times, but Fellaini is cup tied in the league cup.

Giggsy11

v3ttel wrote: »

---

DDG

---

Fabio, Smalling, Evans, Evra

---

Carrick-- Fellaini

---

Nani

---

Kag

---

Jan

---

Chico

---

For Wednesday, I hope. Evans, Nani, Kag, Januzaj & Chico all need game time. Carrick & Fellaini need time to form a partnership.

By the way, was there a game yesterday?

Fellaini is cup tied.

There is no excuse for not playing Kagawa and Nani in the league cup and also Evans. If they are not fit, this is the game to get their match fitness.

Would love to see Rooney playing but also would love to see Nani, Kagawa, Januzaj playing behind Hernandez.

aperture_nuig

I can only imagine the state of this thread on wednesday night if Liverpool win.

Lovely Bloke

Can't wait to see Fellaini against Liverpool on Wednesday, hopefully he can put yesterday's performance behind him

tallaghtmick

Baldy Conscience wrote: »

Can't wait to see Fellaini against Liverpool on Wednesday, hopefully he can put yesterday's performance behind him

He's cup tied.

Lovely Bloke

tallaghtmick wrote: »

He's cup tied.

mcbain.jpg

Julez

Baldy Conscience wrote: »

Can't wait to see Fellaini against Liverpool on Wednesday, hopefully he can put yesterday's performance behind him

Backstreet Moyes

Only positive i can take is after a much tougher start we are only 3 points behind Chelsea and City. Obviously the defeats have not been good but if i was offered 3 points behind them after 5 games i would have took it.

Hopefully yesterday opened Moyes eyes that some of the players are just not up to it. With an easy run of fixtures hopefully we can see Moyes give Zaha, Janjuaz, Nani and Kagawa a chance to claim a starting spot.

On Valencia yesterday i usually give him a break from his limited attacking ability because he defends well but i don't know what he was at yesterday. Twice he didn't track back costing a goal each time. Hopefully Moyes punishes him and he spends sometime on the bench where he deserves to be on current form.

Your Airbag

Looking back on yesterday and the way both teams set up they were actually similar, two strikers and two wingers, but what City had been instructed to do tactically was the difference. Nasri was key, he was out wide but kept cutting inside, dragging Smalling with him which in turn allowed Kolarov to get forward to get off a cross, Valencia never picked him up so Vidic or Rio would go across to block him leaving us very open.

Valencia who is usually defensively sound had a poor game in this area yesterday. Its unlike him not to track and pressure a defender. This and Nasris positioning led to the gaps in our backline and Citys goal haul.

We could have used Kagawa the same way, he is made to cut inside. Although Evra got forward a lot more than young, it didn't have the same effect as Young only recieved the ball wide and stayed there so Zabaleta was not dragged away from his back four too much, allowing him and Navas who stayed wide all day to work together against Evra and Young. This pressure meant Young gave the ball away a lot.

Kompany was sticking to Rooney like glue, a risky tactic, so if Kagawa was cutting inside left and dragging Zabeleta with him this would have left big gaps for Evra or runners from midfeild to exploit in the City backline. Fellaini seems to be set up to sit very deep at UTD, bar the 2nd half when he was at the front of a midfeild three. If Kompany was sticking to Rooney and Kagawa was keeping Zabeleta occupied then it was perfect for Eva and Fellaini to push through the exposed areas. There were gaps anyway but UTD didn't go after them, I think Moyes negativity as a manager is getting highlighted in these big games. He seems to want to contain teams, this is probaly a mindset from his Everton years and at times when our midfeild is outplayed it invites teams onto us instead of getting them on the backfoot.

Chico yesterday would have been better then Welbeck at keeping Citys back line occupied. They were pushing high to keep close to Kompmany who was shadowing Rooney. Chico would have dragged them back towards goal with those runs of his, further disrupting their setup.

By the time Clev cam on it was damage limitation. Young was off, Welbeck went wide left and Rooney was up front with Fellaini for support. City now were further back and not pressing us as high up allowing us to see a bit more of the ball.

I think Moyes tactical inability was shown up yesterday and he didn't anticipate City's tactics when making his team selection and had no contingency plan. When the game kicked off he either didn't see what was happening or didn't want to admit his mistakes by making an early sub. Hopefully he will learn his own failings as well as lambasting the likes of Val and Young for their slackness and Rio and Fellaini for that matter.

Moyes seems to go after the smaller sides but is very cautious against the big sides, I fear we could see this throughout the season.

Backstreet Moyes

I am not sure if Jones or Evans are back and i think i read somewhere Fellaini might be cup tied. I would like the below team played but i am sure Giggs, Young and Valencia will find a way in.

DDG

Fabio Jones Smalling Evra

Carrick Anderson

Zaha Kagawa Janjuaz

Hernandez

Giggsy11

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I do understand some people saying Kagawa playing from the left might not work - but we now surely KNOW Young and Valencia wide in, basically, a 442 doesn't work. Would prefer we failed trying to give something new a go rather than failing doing the same thing week in week out.

Also starting on wide doesn't even mean kagawa will be playing as LW. Few years back Giggs used to start as LW but drift centrally all the time and play as our playmaker. Kagawa can surely play that role.

If Nani starts they can interchange position all game or even combine well from the same side. I remember Kagawa and Nani linking up so well in the very few mins they played. It was like only they 2 had any idea on how to play one touch pass and move.

Lord TSC

I've had bad internet all weekend so thankfully had time to calm down after the match. Cause yesterday evening, I was that apocalyptic, I'd likely have gotten a ban by complaining. :P

I cannot understand why we only used one sub for the game. I know at 4-0 or 4-1, the game is over, but to not even use it as a chance to let Nani, Kags or Hernandez to get some game time for fitness or experience or team intergration baffles me. Really felt like after Cleverly came on, Moyes may as well have gone home cause we still didn't look like doing anything.

It's positive to say we're only 3 behind Chelsea and City, but that's ignoring how bad their start has been as well. I stand by what I said in the build up to the game; I wasn't scared of City and think we should have put up a good challenge to them at least, if not gone for a win. Instead, we looked powerless against them, and my worry now is it gives City some momentum going forward that they didn't have before and shouldn't have now.

I do wonder what Val has to do to get dropped. His pairing with Smalling yesterday was woeful. Likewise, Evra and Young didn't seem to connect at all (I think for one of the goals, it was Fellaini having to try and cover left back for some reason). I don't think they should be sold. We need squad players, and Young and Val could be good ones. But we need changes to the first team right now. Even if it's just giving Nani and Kagawa a chance, or moving Welbeck out to the wing again and playing Hernandez. Or even Januzaj. Anyone other than Young and Val. ANYONE.

In fairness, I've not seen anyone calling for Moyes had and rightly so, but it won't be long till the media vultures start circling and questioning if he's out of his depth, and yesterday will only fuel that fire annoyingly. At least we've got our hardest games (theoretically) out of the way.

Backstreet Moyes

On a side note these past few games have reminded me how good Rafael is. We have been toothless all season down the right in his absence. The only game we looked good down the right was when Fabio played.

Also on Evra yesterday i have never seen him so quiet going forward. As YourAirbag said Kagawa yesterday would have made us better going forward. Him cutting inside would have offered Evra plenty of space going forward.

I really think Moyes went their yesterday hoping not to lose and his team selection showed that. His record against City was brilliant with Everton he took them on and got in their face. Instead yesterday he looked scared about losing and his team selection showed this. He has to take a good bit of the blame but the players have to take a good chunk of the blame also. I loved Fergie but Moyes seems to be following on Fergie's style against big teams and being very negative and picking solid players like Wellbeck and Valencia. It hasn't worked in recent years and i hope Moyes changes this.

RGDATA!

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

In fairness, I've not seen anyone calling for Moyes had and rightly so, but it won't be long till the media vultures start circling and questioning if he's out of his depth, and yesterday will only fuel that fire annoyingly. At least we've got our hardest games (theoretically) out of the way.

media vultures? have a read back of the last few pages.

Giggsy11

Nuts102 wrote: »

On a side note these past few games have reminded me how good Rafael is. We have been toothless all season down the right in his absence. The only game we looked good down the right was when Fabio played.

Also on Evra yesterday i have never seen him so quiet going forward. As YourAirbag said Kagawa yesterday would have made us better going forward. Him cutting inside would have offered Evra plenty of space going forward.

I really think Moyes went their yesterday hoping not to lose and his team selection showed that. His record against City was brilliant with Everton he took them on and got in their face. Instead yesterday he looked scared about losing and his team selection showed this. He has to take a good bit of the blame but the players have to take a good chunk of the blame also. I loved Fergie but Moyes seems to be following on Fergie's style against big teams and being very negative and picking solid players like Wellbeck and Valencia. It hasn't worked in recent years and i hope Moyes changes this.

Not playing Nani and playing Young is absolutely mental. At least he can have the case for Valencia as he did well against Leverkusen, but Young? **** me when we could have played Welbeck there and Hernandez along with Rooney who at least would have stretched defense.

First 5 fixtures were hard so playing with same team is sort of understandable, but if he keeps Hernandez on the bench forever I don't think he will be with ManUtd next season. Nani signed new contract but didn't start a single game. He was not match fit was the reason and if he is never player he will never be match fit, same like Kagawa.

First few months Moyes was poor, hopefully he starts using the full squad and not just players like Valencia and Young all the time.

Your Airbag

Oliver Kay ‏@OliverKayTimes

Rooney will "without doubt" be offered a new contract at #mufc if he keeps up his good form, says director (ex-CEO) David Gill on @bbc5live

https://twitter.com/oliverkaytimes/status/381706269532225536


Hopefully he will sign it.

MisterAnarchy

fish fingers wrote: »

Jesus just keep Young away, please. Beyond useless.

I bet Martin O'Neill feels foolish now after saying a few years ago that Ashley Young was on a par with Lionel Messi

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/aston-villa/3740559/Ashley-Young-is-on-a-par-with-Lionel-Messi.html

BloodBath

My thoughts on yesterdays abysmal game. City looked and played like Champions. Definitely the team to beat based on that performance. We were poor in a lot of areas and Moyes hopefully learns some valuable lessons from this game.

What he should have learned;

Rio is past it. I said it last week and we seen further evidence of it yesterday. He is not the commanding physical presence he was in CB a few years ago. He looks timid and afraid to commit to anything. His marking and ability to see threats seems to have diminished as well and he rarely even tries to challenge for aerial balls. Evans, Jones and Smalling need to be brought in with Evans being the top candidate with the most experience and a solid performance alongside Vidic last season.

Smalling, as good as his performance was in Europe, is not a right back. Rafael needs to be brought back into the team to give a better attacking threat down the right and the speed to get back. We could do with buying another proper right back so we don't have to constantly play somebody out of position in this role whenever Rafael is out. Either that or relegate Valencia to right back.

We were outclassed in midfield yet again. The test of Carrick and Fellini's impact on central midfield has failed. They were both completely static for most of the game. Not closing down city and not moving for each other anywhere near enough. Fellaini looked slow and clumsy. We are lacking somebody who moves around a lot looking for every ball, finding passes to the strikers and wingers and dictating play like Scholes did. Rooney often had to come back deep to try and do this but when your passing options are Young, Valencia and Welbeck then nothing is going to come of it.

Young and Valencia are simply not good enough against the big teams. They should be second choice wingers brought on for easier games. Nani and Kagawa really need to shine this year and they are both good enough to do that. Moyes just needs to play them and get the most out of them while giving new prospects Zaha and Januzaj runs against easier teams.

We really missed Van Persie yesterday. Rooney was the only scoring threat and was marked brilliantly by Kompany for the whole game much like van Persie was marked out of the game by Liverpool. It takes excellent service or a goal scoring threat by the midfield or wingers to overcome that. Sadly we have little goal scoring threat from the midfield or wingers and their delivery to the strikers is just awful. Welbeck had another terrible performance. I forgot he was on the pitch at one stage. He had 0 impact on the game and squandered a great early chance that I'm sure Van Persie would have controlled and buried. Hernandez should be 3rd choice striker ahead of Welbeck.

Moyes isn't totally to blame. Fergie is the one who let our midfield deteriorate for a number of years. We lost Ronaldo, Scholes, Fletcher, Giggs (Not good enough for the big games anymore) and Pogba with Anderson never proving himself to be good enough and 0 players outside of Valencia and Zaha brought in.

Every summer for the last 3 seasons I've been thinking "time to sort the midfield out" but it's never happened. The attitude was well we won the league so it's clearly good enough. Moyes did have the opportunity to improve it this year and he did try to bring quality in but we didn't get the players we needed yet again. Fellaini I always thought was not what we needed. He's too much like Carrick but his passing and movement is not as good, not that Carricks is great. While he is a good addition to the team he should not be playing alongside Carrick and we definitely overspent on him. We need not 1 but 2 playmaking midfielders now. Cleverly could possibly be one of them if he develops more. He looked good when he was brought on. He's a lot more dynamic than Carrick or Fellaini.

dfx-

Your Airbag wrote: »

https://twitter.com/oliverkaytimes/status/381706269532225536


Hopefully he will sign it.

Was there ever doubts that he would be offered another one? I thought it's all about whether he signs it

tallaghtmick

Baldy Conscience wrote: »

mcbain.jpg

Awful get off the stage!!!! :pac:

Danye

Pro. F wrote: »

No I am obviously not agreeing with you. Your idea that United were using some special type of formation and tactics that should be called "traditional" and that City were something different is completely wrong. The difference was the quality of the players in midfield, not the tactics. It's got nothing to do with Moyes having stone age tactics or anything like that.

Where have I said United were using a special formation?

Moyes is insisting on playing the same formation with the same average players despite it clearly not working. He's not playing a formation that maximises the players he has at his disposal. By insisting on playing the same poor players in the same rigid formation and not have the willingness to change and adapt is strong age.

Pro. F wrote: »

If you want to criticise Moyes for selecting poor players or for not making the right moves in the transfer market then go ahead, I could agree with a lot of that. But saying that his tactics and/or formation are out dated, or even significantly different from City's, is completely wrong.

You seem to think that player selection and tactics are separate. The players you play dictate your tactics!! Player selection and tactics are interlinked. By playing poor players who haven't performed and who are also limited shows that they're outdated.

Pro. F wrote: »

What did he do to counter the fact that Toure is a big player for City? Oh I don't know, maybe worked endlessly on team shape and defensive organisation

Oh that worked out well didnt it then!??

Pro. F wrote: »

maybe he worked on passing combinations to get the team in possession in good areas of the field and so tire Toure out defending.

We played with 2 siting midfielder who where too far away from our front 2 and two average wingers. How did he think we would even get into good positions on the pitch the way we where set up.

Pro. F wrote: »

Why did he pick two average players to play out wide? That I do not know, and I have given him plenty of criticism for it. But that is not a sign of old fashioned tactics. It's just poor player selection.

Again you seem to think team selection has no effect on or tactics. Playing limited players who are playing poorly is a poor tactical decision and the fact he had be unwilling to change his players and in turn the formation despite in not working does indeed make it Stone Age.

Pro. F wrote: »

You seem to think that modern tactics are picking the players that are good

Emm, yeah. I guess that would be a good place to start.

Pro. F wrote: »

and out dated tactics are picking the players that aren't good.

Yep. That's spot on. Hopefully when you te read that the penny might start to drop for you.

Pro. F wrote: »

No matter how old fashioned you want your tactics to be, Val and Young are still going to be shíte.

Ok, now take in to account that I'm after explaining to you you how your team selection has an effect on your tactics, answer me this... Why has Moyes insisted on playing Valencia and Young despite you saying their crap. Why is he playing them?

Pro. F wrote: »

How you can say that after the way Cleverley played today is just ridiculous.

What did Cleverly do today? Passing the ball sidewards and backwards in a game that was over doesn't count by the way.

homerjay2005

matthew2008 wrote: »

'your job now is to stand by our new manager' - SAF

ah come off it, Ferguson would have been critisised also for yesterday and the other poor performances this season, Moyes should be treated no differently.

the club has high standards however and so far Moyes , has not shown he can reach that. its early days yet, but so far its not good. people have rightly questioned if he is the right man for the job. a very poor summer along with 3 or 4 poor performances so far, has only deepened that fear.
we need to go on a run of games now and start closing the gap at the top or pressure will mount even more. Moyes could have saved alot of this with a proper transfer window, which allowed players time to bed in and actually buying the right players would have helped also.

one genuine question here, if a situation arises where we finished 5th this season, would people think Moyes deserved another season?

Backstreet Moyes

Not going to quote the big long post above but the Ferdinand part is crap. It's some myth he is past it. He has had a poor start to the season but was in the team of the year last season after playing very well. We have far more problems than Ferdinand.

kryogen

homerjay2005 wrote: »

ah come off it, Ferguson would have been critisised also for yesterday and the other poor performances this season, Moyes should be treated no differently.

the club has high standards however and so far Moyes , has not shown he can reach that. its early days yet, but so far its not good. people have rightly questioned if he is the right man for the job. a very poor summer along with 3 or 4 poor performances so far, has only deepened that fear.
we need to go on a run of games now and start closing the gap at the top or pressure.

one genuine question here, if a situation arises where we finished 5th this season, would people think Moyes deserved another season?

Id like to think I would, it would depend on how we finished the season and how the style of play was etc

I would like to see him get 2-3 seasons minimum, barring a disaster. Failing to get top 4 would of course be a disaster, but if that happened this season, I could forgive it.

Headshot

If he fell out of the top 4 this season he has to go, no top manager could ever fall out of the top 4 with the current PL champions

Danye

The fact that as fans of the current champions were asking the question what if we don't get top 4 what happens then speaks volumes.

This is Man United were talking about. Winning the league or at the very very minimum challenging for it is what we should be doing.

kryogen

Headshot wrote: »

If he fell out of the top 4 this season he has to go, no top manager could ever fall out of the top 4 with the current PL champions

I find it hard to argue with you tbh, despite that I would still want to give him the second season if it looked like things were on the up. Chopping and changing looking for instant success hasn't worked well for many teams and he needs time to make the job his, it may get darker before the dawn but if it seems like dawn is approaching I would want him to continue.

The early signs are not good, but only a fool would make a judgement right now, nobody would question whether Mourinho is up for the task of managing a top club for example despite the relatively poor start they have had

Lord TSC

It would be one thing to regress down to second or third, given City and Chelsea are sniffing round us all the time, but the idea we'd drop past Arsenal and Spurs as well makes my skin crawl tbh.

BloodBath

Also, I'd seriously question peoples knowledge of football, going by the cries for Kagawa yesterday. Are you ****ing retarded? It was clear we were going to line up with Valencia right and Wellbeck left at the start, with RVP and Rooney up top. The injury to RVP ment we needed to shift. Swopping RVP for Chico would leave no striker on the bench, so naturally Young was trusted on the left and then Wellbeck moved up front.

Our left flank was shockingly exposed yesterday throughout, that would have been ten times worse with Kagawa playing in from there. Kagawa cant play in a 2 man midfield, and he wouldn't replace Rooney who is in good form. People need to take a breathe, and keep their rubbish viewpoints on football to themselves. All it's doing is creating hysteria. The team we had out yesterday should have been MORE then capable of getting a result. The players have made Moyes look the fool through a lack of performance but more hurtful a lack of desire.

Kagawa could have and should have started in his best role playing behind Rooney with Nani or Welbeck on the left wing. Even Cleverly looks like he would have been a far better choice than Young there. Kagawa is being kept out of the team by Rooney when RVP is playing. He should be given the role if RVP is out with Rooney up front. Valencia and Young have shown nothing positive in over a year to be first choice.

Fergie would never play so rigidly with a team. Moyes has done very little rotation so far. I can understand he is under pressure and may not want to risk some other players. Not when you're trying to maximise points from a tough set of opening fixtures but playing Rio in 6 games in a row is not a wise move. Why hasn't Nani, Hernandez and Kagawa got more game time? I don't buy all these fitness and illness excuses. It's still early days though and hopefully Nani and Kagwa start getting more game but there are underlying problems with that midfield as it is.


I think I'd like to see something like this. Call it a 4-5-1 formation. We get swamped in midfield by a lot of top teams. We need more speed, movement and skillful interplay there. 2 defensive options like a Carrick/Fellaini combo do not give us that. Consider Cleverly a more holding left that lets Evra overlap and will help Carrick or Fellaini out when needed

---

DDG

---

---

---

Evans---Vidic

---

Rafael

---

Evra

---

Carrick

---

Nani

---

Fellaini

---

Cleverly

---

Rooney----Kagawa

---

---

---

RVP

---