Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - 2013/14 mod warning post#7259

bullvine

Can't believe the League Cup is been sh*tcanned!! It was winning that trophy in 2006 that started this current unbelievable period of dominance. Its a great trophy to win and especially beating Liverpool will make it even sweeter.

3rd place in the league, with a league cup win and a good run in the Champions League, would be an adequate first season for Moyes.

dfx-

adox wrote: »

Hes already won the community shield with Utd. How the team got there or who the opposition were is irrelevant.

It is if it's being considered as a serious bit of silverware. I'd agree that tomorrow night is a huge game for Moyes.

A home defeat to Liverpool after the big games so far wouldn't be acceptable surely.

Danye

adox wrote: »

It wasnt a smart reply. You seemed to be inferring from your Mourhino comments that Moyes should push in this competition to win his first piece of silverware.

Hes already won the community shield with Utd. How the team got there or who the opposition were is irrelevant.

There are a lot of doubts about whether he is capable of winning trophies as a manager. Winning what is effectively a friendly where the winner gets presented a trophy won't really satisfy those fans with the doubts.

If he was to win a trophy of worthwhile mention against some decent opposition, With his own team as soon as possible that would help ease some of the fans worries.

adox

Danye wrote: »

There are a lot of doubts about whether he is capable of winning trophies as a manager. Winning what is effectively a friendly where the winner gets presented a trophy won't really satisfy those fans with the doubts.

If he was to win a trophy of worthwhile mention against some decent opposition, With his own team as soon as possible that would help ease some of the fans worries.

Thats fair enough.:)

Danye

adox wrote: »

Thats fair enough.:)

I know

homerjay2005

Blatter wrote: »

So we have maybe 2-4 points less in the league than what we should have expected, won our opening CL game and the CS v Wigan. And you want to class that as an 'awful' start?

by and large, apart from some periods against Swansea and bayer, our football has been s*it, really s*it in fact.

the one point from those 3 big league games is bad enough, but the fact we were so poor in them deserves the word awful. maybe i have different expectations from the club than you do, you judge the club on points, i judge the club on its standard of football and right now, but are really disappointing.

we will improve, our fixtures are easier, but already the signs are not good. we cant keep dropping points in the big games and so far, Moyes is carrying on from his days at Everton in this respect.

adox

dfx- wrote: »

It is if it's being considered as a serious bit of silverware. I'd agree that tomorrow night is a huge game for Moyes.

A home defeat to Liverpool after the big games so far wouldn't be acceptable surely.

I never said it was a serious bit of silverware, just pointing out that technically Moyes has won silverware with Utd.

Community Shield is bottom of the pile for sure but the League Cup is only one step up.

Having said that I do realise that most arguing that tomorrow nights game is very important are not saying that because its the League Cup but more because of circumstances.

Blatter

homerjay2005 wrote: »

by and large, apart from some periods against Swansea and bayer, our football has been s*it, really s*it in fact.

the one point from those 3 big league games is bad enough, but the fact we were so poor in them deserves the word awful. maybe i have different expectations from the club than you do, you judge the club on points, i judge the club on its standard of football and right now, but are really disappointing.

we will improve, our fixtures are easier, but already the signs are not good. we cant keep dropping points in the big games and so far, Moyes is carrying on from his days at Everton in this respect.

No, I judge on both points and performances. Performance is obviously important. I just don't think the performances have been as bad as you do, I think they've been average. I'd expect to see Nani and Kagawa integrated more into the team in the coming weeks along with Fellaini settling in better and RvP & Rooney getting a string of games together, and hopefully that'll see the performance levels and results get better.

Martin Walker

Blatter wrote: »

No, I judge on both points and performances. Performance is obviously important. I just don't think the performances have been as bad as you do, I think they've been average. I'd expect to see Nani and Kagawa integrated more into the team in the coming weeks along with Fellaini settling in better and RvP & Rooney getting a string of games together, and hopefully that'll see the performance levels and results get better.

I agree with this. We've played poor yes. We've lost yes. But losing to City and Liverpool isn't a crisis or disaster at all. City are a team full of top quality players in every position. Sometimes on there day these teams just polverise you. Liverpool, well, sometimes they beat us sometimes we beat them. Winning at Anfield is no easy task. I'm confident after the next 6 or 7 games we will lift plenty of points in the league, be in the next round of the league cup and be in a comfortable position in the champions league group.
If not and we lose a few games then I will start to worry.

bucketybuck

Blatter wrote: »

It hasn't been an 'awful' start to the season. It's been just below average tbh.

Blatter wrote: »

I just don't think the performances have been as bad as you do, I think they've been average.

Sorry, but this is just wrong. It has been an awful start, our performances to this point have been bloody cack. Even the game we won against Swansea was a dire performance that was marked by a burst of goals from nowhere.

The only game I enjoyed was the Bayer game, and even it was hardly high quality.

adox wrote: »

Hes already won the community shield with Utd. How the team got there or who the opposition were is irrelevant.

Whats utterly irrelevant is the community shield itself.

keane2097

I thought United were by far the better team against Chelsea, surprised that's being called a bad performance.

Lord TSC

keane2097 wrote: »

I thought United were by far the better team against Chelsea, surprised that's being called a bad performance.

Didn't get bonus points for being the better team on the night Personally felt we were better but that means nothing if we aren't actually winning games when we're the better team.

keane2097

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

Didn't get bonus points for being the better team on the night Personally felt we were better but that means nothing if we aren't actually winning games when we're the better team.

Yeah but in the context of the discussion re: points tallies and good/bad performances I would have thought that match would be in the good column.

Hulk Hands

At the end of the day, we are three points behind City and Chelsea despite a much harder start. I'd say we're about where we expected to be at this stage in our 3-way mini league for the title. Nobody else matters at this stage. The performance against City was terrible, but I believe we were much the better team against Chelsea. Liverpool...meh, I can't remember one good performance from us in recent memory at that shoddy little ground. Sometimes we get results there and sometimes we don't. The start hasn't been good, and perhaps that was to be expected. The brightside is that we should be over the difficult patch without losing any significant ground on our rivals

Rayne Wooney

How long has Rooney left on his contract?

It's really taking the mick if he gets more money

Nalz

v3ttel wrote: »

Nitpicking, no? Fairly obvious what he means.

Obvious what he means
Annoying for me how he consistently says hopefully, maybe etc

And yes it may be nitpicking!

Rayne Wooney

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

How long has Rooney left on his contract?

It's really taking the mick if he gets more money

2 years since the summer I think, so he'll have a year left come June.
Almost sure I heard that on the radio on Sunday

His wages are huge aren't they, maybe utd will just stick at current level.

Backstreet Moyes

Morrison with first goal again tonight. Has an impressive strike rate so far from cm.

Mitch Connor

Wish people would stop posting about pogba and Morrison. Fuking painful reading about them, should have been stars for us.

Please stop. Please.

dubmick

rarnes1 wrote: »

2 years since the summer I think, so he'll have a year left come June.
Almost sure I heard that on the radio on Sunday

His wages are huge aren't they, maybe utd will just stick at current level.

over 200k a week net

GSPfan

I can see why people care about Pogba, but Morrison. Nah.

MD1990

GSPfan wrote: »

I can see why people care about Pogba, but Morrison. Nah.

Cleverly is getting plenty of games & he is average

Irish94

In all seriousness, it is a joke that Hernandez is not getting more game time. He started nearly every big game three seasons ago, against Barcelona in the final etc.

One of my favourite players at the club, he is to good to be sitting on the bench every week.

Headshot

I do worry that him and Kag will be gone in the summer.

Irish94

Headshot wrote: »

I do worry that him and Kag will be gone in the summer.

I hope they do, if they do not get more games this season.

I would hate it if they did leave, but to see so much talent and potential rot on a bench makes me so frustrated and angry.

tallaghtmick

GSPfan wrote: »

I can see why people care about Pogba, but Morrison. Nah.

Sort his head and he will be unreal.

Vic Vinegar

Article from The Guardian, some quite negative comments from Moyes there.

David Moyes has admitted he might have to "take a few more blows" in his first season as Manchester United manager, warning there will be more difficult times to come as he tries to make the handover from Sir Alex Ferguson as seamless as possible.

Moyes, who missed out on several targets during the transfer window, said he was "shocked" by the 4-1 thrashing against Manchester City on Sunday, and indicated for the first time that the team he inherited from Ferguson had obvious deficiencies. The former Everton manager has previously talked about a side who are capable of winning the Premier League and Champions League, but now appears to have his own doubts about their quality. "I think a lot of people thought Manchester United [winning the title] last season, that it was probably the form of the other teams that was poor," he said.

Moyes had not initially planned to hold a press conference to preview Wednesday's Capital One Cup tie against Liverpool but changed his mind after the City defeat. "I think it's important that I took the punches," he explained. "I've taken the punches and I'm happy to do that. Not for a minute did I think this Manchester United job was going to be an easy job. There will be days like we had on Sunday and there might be more of them because we are in a period where there will be transition, there's a new manager for the players and, in turn, there will be new players.

"I don't think it's actually the squad, I think we've got numbers. I think maybe we've got work to do to bring in players not for the squad but to go right into the team. It's not necessarily the squad players we needed, we needed one or two who might have gone in [to the team]. That will happen. But going back to that transfer window, we always said it was going to be a tough one and it was going to take a little bit more time.

"It does mean I may have to take a few more blows, definitely. Maybe even more than that. Maybe all season I have to take a few blows but I knew this was going to be the case because I was taking over from a great manager and it was always going to take time for me to get my own ways and change things round a little bit."

Liverpool have already beaten United this season and Moyes, still missing the injured Robin van Persie, must decide whether to stick to the club's usual policy of using younger players in this competition or fielding a stronger side than he had originally planned to lessen the risk of a bad few days getting any worse.

"I think the team has played well [overall]. If you were being really fair you'd have to say that Manchester United have played well, but that [City] was a poor performance, really. We have not played badly except at Manchester City.

"We looked quite easy to play against, which is not the norm for Manchester United. I think the one thing here is that any team should always have a hard game against Manchester United. But I thought we were just too easy to play against. It was the basics. I hadn't seen that before. I also have to say I hadn't seen that level of performance from Manchester City either. But I hadn't seen that poor a performance from us, so there was quite a contrast."

City, by Moyes's own admission, might have made his first experience of the Manchester derby even more harrowing, the United manager accepting that Manuel Pellegrini's team had looked capable of scoring six or seven when they took a 4-0 lead early in the second half. "I'm not daft. I know we were in real danger at that moment. I took a little bit [of encouragement] that we tried to make sure nothing went any further because at that time it could have. But, by that time, Manchester City knew they didn't have to do any more, so I'm also aware of that."

Van Persie is still troubled by a groin injury, with Moyes rating him as having only an "outside chance" for Saturday's game at home to West Bromwich Albion.

"You just hope there will be a reaction and I'm sure there will be," United's manager continued. "When you've got the players we have, I can see it written all over their faces how they feel.

"It doesn't really matter whether I have seen a reaction [in training]. The reaction has to be seen when you people [media and public] can see it. I'm still getting to know all the players here. I'll get a chance to know more of them this week, and hopefully they will show what they can do."

Rayne Wooney

I wonder if Moyes will play a youngish side tomorrow with the league game at the weekend.

Hopefully we see a front four of

Zaha Kagawa Nani
Hernandez

Your Airbag

Bombleswizzum wrote: »

Article from The Guardian, some quite negative comments from Moyes there.

Pretty correct and sensible comments from Moyes. He is erring on the side of caution. Of course we will take more blows, we have many tough games left.

He also mentions how we are fine for squad players and need more signings to go into the first team.

I think maybe we've got work to do to bring in players not for the squad but to go right into the team. It's not necessarily the squad players we needed, we needed one or two who might have gone in [to the team]. That will happen. But going back to that transfer window, we always said it was going to be a tough one and it was going to take a little bit more time.

"It does mean I may have to take a few more blows

Transfer window failings aside its encouraging that he still wants to add players to the first 11 and because. We will be active again in January and hopefully we will act more accordingly in the transfer window.

Backstreet Moyes

GSPfan wrote: »

I can see why people care about Pogba, but Morrison. Nah.

If Morrison puts his head down and concentrates on his football he will be the better player. Has the potential to be world class. Hope someday he comes back.

I know it's annoying. But to think if things went differently we could have Morisson, Pogba, Janjuaz and Zaha in the squad.

Giggsy11

dubmick wrote: »

over 200k a week net

So when he signed a contract in 2010, it was 180K, then few days later papers starting to report it was 250K (including image rights and later that part was left off) and now this summer people started saying it was 300K and now you are saying it is 400K.

It must be some amazing contract that it increases every 6 months.

Giggsy11

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Wish people would stop posting about pogba and Morrison. Fuking painful reading about them, should have been stars for us.

Please stop. Please.

I hate reading about Pogba and people going in circles about why he left and all that BS again and again but at the same time I love reading about Morrison doing well. It was clear that he left because of attitude issues and he is a very big ManUtd fan.

If he becomes the player we all he can then I'm sure we will try to sign him and he will sign without a doubt.

This is what he said after he left (I think)

RavelMorrison49 Ravel Ryan Morrison

Quote:
I have never 1s turned down a contract off manchester united

GSPfan wrote: »

I can see why people care about Pogba, but Morrison. Nah.

Morrison is a fantastic talent, he is played deeper which is good for his career as he will improve his overall game but he is a fantastic prospect as a advanced midfielder.

homerjay2005

so its taking Moyes 3 months to see what we all knew, 3 months ago. brilliant.

hopefully it means we will go all out in January to sign the players that could have been signed during the summer, but im not sure if that is a good thing as do people trust him and Woodward to get these deals done?

its very telling and worrying that after 7 games, he is saying there are defencies in the first team though. if supporters are able to see it, why cant the man who is with them day in day out, see it quicker?

Lovely Bloke

He said it himself during the summer, so stop acting like it's some big revelation he's made will you. It's just not true, and you are being totally disingenuous.

He said he was targetting central midfielders, creative ones, in the summer. When he arrived he said it was a targetted area for improvement.

Now, for whatever reasons the only arrival was Fellaini, and he's had an indifferent to poor start, but he's played in only, what, three games - way too early to judge.

Way too early to judge Fellaini, Moyes.

It's not totally Moyes + Woodward's fault, Fergie + Gill ignored the midfield for nigh on a decade.

I kind of agree that players like Kagawa, Chico and Nani should be getting game time, but again, it's fairly harsh to be judging the players who ARE playing on six or seven games.

homerjay2005

Baldy Conscience wrote: »

He said he was targetting central midfielders, creative one

And tell me who did he sign? not one creative player, not one.

he also said he was happy with his business, now he appears to be changing his mind to cover his ass and set a lower expectation.

he also said that he would be happy to carry on (without getting new players in) as the team was a title winning team, now he has changing that and hints that they only won it, cos the other teams were poor.

i do agree with you however about Fergie and Gill being as much at fault, some of Fergies recent signings have been baffling, i think we are all aware of the problems in the first team before Moyes took over. the thing is - he had plenty of time to act on it, but went half assed about it.

all in all, the last 3 months have been an absolute mess, i dont think anybody can deny that now.

MagicMarker

Moyes can't afford to play a younger side tonight. Adnan might start, but I doubt it.

I'm thinking along the lines of...

De Gea
Fabio Smalling Evans Evra
Carrick Cleverley
Nani Kagawa Giggs
Rooney

Although wouldn't be surprised to see Chico instead of Kagawa.

If Rio starts again... well that would really show how little trust Moyes has in Smalling or Evans.

Soups123

I think Moyes knows he needs a result tonight, had you of won the weekend I think he'd have gone close to second string but can't take the risk now.

I fancy united to win this won well 3-1

Lovely Bloke

homerjay2005 wrote: »

And tell me who did he sign? not one creative player, not one. .

So you are putting the blame for this squarely at the feet of Moyes? And he's the one YOU are accusing of changing his tune? Were you not blaming EW earlier this month?

homerjay2005 wrote: »

he also said he was happy with his business.

Of course he has to say those things publically - what should he do now? Come out and say, "well the players here aren't really good enough" - if he did that he'd be rightly castigated, probably by you.

Wait...

homerjay2005 wrote: »

now he appears to be changing his mind to cover his ass and set a lower expectation..

...it's already started.

One way or the other, he can't win with you.

homerjay2005 wrote: »

he also said that he would be happy to carry on (without getting new players in) as the team was a title winning team, now he has changing that and hints that they only won it, cos the other teams were poor...

Is he wrong? I don't think so, I think there was a certain amount of Chelsea and City capitulating last season, now United took advantage of that as they should and took the title. It IS a title winning squad - a stick which will be used to beat Moyes with, already has been "it's a title winning squad, he can't fail!" - which is it?

homerjay2005 wrote: »

i do agree with you however about Fergie and Gill being as much at fault, some of Fergies recent signings have been baffling, i think we are all aware of the problems in the first team before Moyes took over. the thing is - he had plenty of time to act on it, but went half assed about it.

All the fault of Moyes, yes? He identified the targets, Woodward flew home from Australia and signed sponsors.

Cantona's Collars

One player we won't be signing is Lewandowski,he's confirmed that he'll sign an agreement with Bayern in January before moving on a free next summer.

IamtheWalrus

There does seems to be a change of tune from Moyes. Maybe he was towing the party line previously and since the start of the season hasn't been great, he's being more honest. I'd be more alarmed if he was saying everything is rosey.

Since Moyes is pretty much playing with a team he didn't assemble, I think I'm willing to accept a potential trophy-less season. Let Moyes bring his own players in and find his feet. There are few if any managers who could seamlessly take over from SAF.

Mitch Connor

I'd be less annoyed with Moyes comments now if he/United hadn't dithered so much in the summer and screwed up bringing in the quality of player Moyes feels was required.

The fact we only seemed to start making bids for players not from Barcelona or Everton in the last week of the window must be partly his fault, as much as I have blamed Woodward. Moyes should have been demanding action on several fronts.

FutureGuy

7 points from 15 and three of our toughest matches out of the way. I'm as annoyed as anyone about the goings on recently but we now have a run of games where we can get 15 points from 5 games WBA (H), Sunderland (A), Southampton (H), Stoke (H), Fulham (A).

If we can come out of that with 5 wins hand have the winger situation settled, then we can be alot more optimistic about things. Nani needs and Kagawa need to be given the opportunity to start consitently, with Januzaj and Zaha being given some bit of time on the pitch. Young not being given a minute would please me immensely.

Would love to just fast forward to November.

IamtheWalrus

homerjay2005 wrote: »

hopefully it means we will go all out in January to sign the players that could have been signed during the summer

Most good players aren't available in January. Next Summer should be the target.

Mitch Connor

IamtheWalrus wrote: »

Most good players aren't available in January. Next Summer should be the target.

This is my fear.

In January it will be 'hard' to buy players because it is the January window and many players won't want to move with just 6 months before the World Cup.

Then in the summer we will hear it is hard to sign players cause they are at the World Cup, or on holidays after it, and we will get into August in the exact same situation we are in now.

To be honest, I really think United should be looking at getting deals done, or in place with both club and player, NOW. Maybe we don't sign them til the summer, but get the deals agreed - similar to Zaha deal last January.

Lovely Bloke

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Moyes should have been demanding action on several fronts.

Maybe he was, Mitch I know and believe you have contacts with stronger, more reliable info than most of us in here have access too, but surely not everything that goes on within the club is available to you.

Would you be happier if Moyes went in making demands, not get what he wants then storms out of his job? Is that what you want?

Do you want him to come out and start criticising his new employers less than six months into his new job, yes? He would risk sacking, would you be happy if that happened?

It's fúcking stupid stuff from you and people like you

homerjay2005

the transfer window is closed 4 weeks and our manger and fans are talking about needing new players.

i rest my case. im heading to manchester now and going on the lash for the day, enjoy the game.

Mitch Connor

Baldy Conscience wrote: »

Maybe he was, Mitch I know and believe you have contacts with stronger, more reliable info than most of us in here have access too, but surely not everything that goes on within the club is available to you.

Would you be happier if Moyes went in making demands, not get what he wants then storms out of his job? Is that what you want?

Do you want him to come out and start criticising his new employers less than six months into his new job, yes? He would risk sacking, would you be happy if that happened?

It's fúcking stupid stuff from you and people like you

What is he doing now then? He is openly saying the United first team isn't good enough and that it was down to the poor form of other teams that we won the league. How is that not firing an open shot at Woodward and Co for not bringing in players?

He towed the party line all summer, then after 6 games changes his tune COMPLETELY. If he is comfortable in this stance now, why so fuking coy in the summer, when something could actually be done about it?

We spent all summer pissing about with stupid bids for Fellaini, Baines (who we bid 12million for TWICE), Fabregas (who we never bid market value for), Ronaldo (who we never bid for) and Bale (who we were never going to get).

Then in the last week of the window we tried to sign any fooking player Madrid had and failed on all fronts there. Along with a weird bid for Di Rossi and Herrera.

The entire transfer approach in the summer was a shambles and Moyes, as manager, has to take some responsibility for allowing it to drag as much as it did.

I also think the 'new manager' excuse is absolutely weak. He scouted us in order to play us - so new our strengths and weaknesses as much as anyone. He knew where we were weak, he knew what the players were or were not capable of. He had from early May through to September 2nd to get what he wanted done and all he could manage to get done was Fellaini. He then blabs on about having only started July 1st and moans about the fixture list. Weak management. I couldn't give a crap if his contract only started July 1st - not getting to work as soon as the Everton season finished is unacceptable imo, and I don't believe that is how it happened.

Yes, Woodward screwed up bids and his approach to transfers was abysmal imo, but it can't be all his fault. Moyes shouldn't have allowed bids to drag on as they did. No need to wait 2 weeks between bids for Fellaini or Fabregas (or longer).

If Moyes considers the United team not good enough (and I agree) then he has to take the blame for that as much as anyone. As manager he is responsible.

Lovely Bloke

Yeah, you're right Mitch, Moyes should definitely have been in the papers and all over SSN all summer saying the squad is piss poor and needs signings, that wouldn't have opened the club up to being absolutely buggered in the transfer market at all.

Mitch Connor

Baldy Conscience wrote: »

Yeah, you're right Mitch, Moyes should definitely have been in the papers and all over SSN all summer saying the squad is piss poor and needs signings, that wouldn't have opened the club up to being absolutely buggered in the transfer market at all.

Where as what happened was what?

We paid 4million more than required for Fellaini and signed no one else. Thats a much better outcome.

Yeah, so much better to have the money in the bank then pay an extra few million and possibly get a player like Fabregas.

So Moyes is now complaining about the team - so we are going to get rodgered in the January or Summer windows, by your reckoning, so Moyes is a moron now, by your reckoning?

Crann na Beatha

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