Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - 2013/14 mod warning post#7259

Vic Vinegar

SherlockWatson wrote: »

Dicky Pryde wasn't Adolf Hipster!

Ah well, similar attributes. He's certainly a re-reg of someone, i'd bet.

SherlockWatson

Bombleswizzum wrote: »

Ah well, similar attributes. He's certainly a re-reg of someone, i'd bet.

Similar attributes? I'm quite offended!

Vic Vinegar

SherlockWatson wrote: »

Similar attributes? I'm quite offended!

Haha, that was you? i think i'm getting mixed up with another guy's username.

Apologies.

tallaghtmick

Cyas later lads poxy place turning to grammar nazi-ism(I know thats not how its spelt) to win arguements! Cant read anymore.

homerjay2005

worst start to the campaign since 1989, first time west brom have won at old trafford since 1978 and only the second time since 1974 have the defending champions lost 3 games this early.

im sorry lads, but that is pretty damning. im not calling for Moyes head just yet but id liken my support of him to a cat with 9 lives - he has lost five of them already for me after the shi* preseason, crap football, bad defeats, stupid transfer policy and stupid statements he has come out with. the very mimimum is that we are no more than 4/5 points off top and into the CL next round come the end of December and if we are worse than this, i think he is a dead man walking.

he has to turn this around or he will be out on his arse, its over to him now as this is not good enough and so far, those who said he shouldnt have got the job in the first place will just be reallly sickened right now.

i still cant see what he did to deserve the job, as alot of people said he did nor can i see anything in him that gives the impression he is good enough to manage this club. its not just about 6 games, there has been a very bad problem with the club since he took over, everything seems half assed amateurism and unfortunately this has now rubbed off on the player.

the sad thing is, alot of us seen this coming.

SherlockWatson

homerjay2005 wrote: »

worst start to the campaign since 1989, first time west brom have won at old trafford since 1978 and only the second time since 1974 have the defending champions lost 3 games this early.

im sorry lads, but that is pretty damning. im not calling for Moyes head just yet but id liken my support of him to a cat with 9 lives - he has lost five of them already for me after the shi* preseason, crap football, bad defeats, stupid transfer policy and stupid statements he has come out with. the very mimimum is that we are no more than 4/5 points off top and into the CL next round come the end of December and if we are worse than this, i think he is a dead man walking.

he has to turn this around or he will be out on his arse, its over to him now as this is not good enough and so far, those who said he shouldnt have got the job in the first place will just be reallly sickened right now.

i still cant see what he did to deserve the job, as alot of people said he did nor can i see anything in him that gives the impression he is good enough to manage this club. its not just about 6 games, there has been a very bad problem with the club since he took over, everything seems half assed amateurism and unfortunately this has now rubbed off on the player.

the sad thing is, alot of us seen this coming.

I can see where you are coming from, but I have to disagree with the 4/5 points off the top, and dead man walking part.

I'd be delighted if we were 4/5 points off the top at the end of the December considering this is a transition period and all the top teams have improved this year big time.

We've won the league with a bigger deficit than five points after December I think, 08-09 we were pretty far off at christmas IIRC.

Unearthly

SherlockWatson wrote: »

We've won the league with a bigger deficit than five points after December I think, 08-09 we were pretty far off at christmas IIRC.

Yes but Liverpool had played about 3 games more(also having their best ever season under Benitez), and Man Utd had played all of the top teams away from home first half of the season.

The real positives are that City look poor to, Chelsea stuttering, Arsenal are Arsenal and will implode eventually, Spurs are Spurs and will implode eventually.

Barring a continuation of this disastrous start, we shouldn't be too far off the top as the season progresses.

Devil08

How Phil Neville is coaching the team is beyond me. Taking over from Rene, one of the best coaches in the world. Shocking back room team.

Mitch Connor

Unearthly wrote: »

Barring a continuation of this disastrous start

Indeed.

The problem is if moyes can or can't turn this around.

I'm not seeing any positives or glimmers of hope so far. I don't see evidence that the team just needs to click.

Mitch Connor

Devil08 wrote: »

How Phil Neville is coaching the team is beyond me. Taking over from Rene, one of the best coaches in the world. Shocking back room team.

Bollox.

If Gary Neville had got the job we'd all be delighted. We don't have any reason to think Phil doesn't match up to Gary. Phil has been heavily involved with the U21 national side, he is highly rated.

He also didn't take over from rene. Or at least not individually. Round and lumsden likely replaced rene and phelan, with Phil and giggs taking more junior roles.

Lord TSC

Hey homejay, what happened to being 100% behind the manager come the start of the season?

Nah, I kid. Your last post is exactly in line with my thoughts right now...

Devil08

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Bollox.

If Gary Neville had got the job we'd all be delighted. We don't have any reason to think Phil doesn't match up to Gary. Phil has been heavily involved with the U21 national side, he is highly rated.

He also didn't take over from rene. Or at least not individually. Round and lumsden likely replaced rene and phelan, with Phil and giggs taking more junior roles.

Round and Lumsden - two lads who should be coaching at Stoke. I wouldnt take either Neville coaching at the club, certainly not the first team. Look at the coaches who have been working with the youths and reserves for years, they are much better than Neville at getting the best out of players. Brian McClair, Paul McGuinness are 2 I would have promoted to first team. Can you really see RVP taking advice from Phil Neville and thinking he can learn from him? Its laughable.

Mitch Connor

Devil08 wrote: »

Round and Lumsden - two lads who should be coaching at Stoke. I wouldnt take either Neville coaching at the club, certainly not the first team. Look at the coaches who have been working with the youths and reserves for years, they are much better than Neville at getting the best out of players. Brian McClair, Paul McGuinness are 2 I would have promoted to first team. Can you really see RVP taking advice from Phil Neville and thinking he can learn from him? Its laughable.

I agree in general terms. I wish we could have kept Rene, but Phil did not take over for him. Rene is the loss, a big loss.

bucketybuck

Mitch Connor wrote: »

If Gary Neville had got the job we'd all be delighted.

What? I certainly wouldn't.

Mitch Connor

bucketybuck wrote: »

What? I certainly wouldn't.

Really? If it was Gary in the junior coaching role instead of Phil you wouldn't be happy!

Fair enough. I though all united fans would have loved Gary being part of the coaching team.

BloodBath

The real positives are that City look poor to, Chelsea stuttering, Arsenal are Arsenal and will implode eventually, Spurs are Spurs and will implode eventually.

City don't look poor. They were very unlucky to not win yesterday. They have looked dominant in most games. We have looked poor in nearly all.

Chelsea still look reasonably solid. Just lacking goals which will come once Jose gets Torres and Eto firing on all cylinders.

Arsenal have a great first team but not a great bench in certain areas. Injuries to key players could cost them but with the way they are playing at the moment god help us in November when we meet them.

Spurs aren't Spurs. AVP has built an entirely new squad with strength and depth. They, like Chelsea, are solid defensively but lacking in goals but a 1-0 win is as good as a 3-2 win.

On a more positive note does anyone else think Torres favourite Street fighter Character was his fellow Spaniard Vega? He might be taking it a bit too far though.

SherlockWatson

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Really? If it was Gary in the junior coaching role instead of Phil you wouldn't be happy!

Fair enough. I though all united fans would have loved Gary being part of the coaching team.

Same, anyone who has seen him on Sky can tell he really knows his shít.
Is he still involved with the England National Team?

Mitch Connor

SherlockWatson wrote: »

Same, anyone who has seen him on Sky can tell he really knows his shít.
Is he still involved with the England National Team?

Yep, contracted through to the World Cup.

bucketybuck

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Really? If it was Gary in the junior coaching role instead of Phil you wouldn't be happy!

Fair enough. I though all united fans would have loved Gary being part of the coaching team.

Really. I like watching him on Sky Sports, but he has done exactly nothing as a coach.

The likes of McClaren and Quieroz had earned their reputations as coaches long before they came to United, and they got those jobs based on their achievements as coaches. Remember when Fergie used to go out actually scouting for the best coaches/assistant managers in the game, like when Brian Kidd left?

Neither Phil nor Gary Neville have any track record in coaching, and the only reason Phil Neville is now a coach at Manchester United is because he played for Moyes and used to play for United. And those are terrible reasons for picking a good coach.

homerjay2005

Teamshadowclan wrote: »

Hey homejay, what happened to being 100% behind the manager come the start of the season?

i gave him a chance after the shambles that was the transfer window, but now once things have settled down and games are being played, he is starting to lose my support. he can turn it around though, the players are there and fixtures are not too bad either, to get us to January. Once we get there, i hope we sign 2 top class players which gives us a chance, but its a bit sad and pathetic that its come to this, Woodward already should be getting his p45 as he has not done his job.

this "we are not chelsea" argument is really bugging me though, if Moyes turns out to not be good enough, the club should hold their hands up and say they got it wrong. we cant keep somebody in the job who is not good enough and keep him there for the sake of it.

over to Moyes now to sort this, he needs to learn fast and turn this around. so far, he has had a nightmare start and all things considered, it couldnt have gone any worse.

Pj!

All the negativity forced me back to this exact time last season. Back to the good times with the mighty Sir Alex, back to escape all the gloom...

Ferguson has got it wrong. Completely wrong.

If Ferguson wins league or CL it will be or greatest success ever. Even over the treble.

he is fùcking up the team

I'm sure I'll be knocked for this, but as a Utd fan for thirty years, I wish to God that Ferguson would go.

Oh.

GSPfan

Moyes reckons we need 5 or 6 world class players to win the European Cup.

Lets see then .......

De Gea
Vidic
Ferdinand
Evra
Rooney
Van Persie

Surely its not world class players in goal defense or attack but world class midfielders?

Nalz

GSPfan wrote: »

Moyes reckons we need 5 or 6 world class players to win the European Cup.

Lets see then .......

De Gea
Vidic
Ferdinand
Evra
Rooney
Van Persie

Surely its not world class players in goal defense or attack but world class midfielders?

Rio Ferdinand is far from world class now
But your point still stands :-)

I think Raf now is more important than Rio now

homerjay2005

Pj! wrote: »

All the negativity forced me back to this exact time last season. Back to the good times with the mighty Sir Alex, back to escape all the gloom...
Oh.

what exactly are you trying to say? Any criticism of Moyes right now is justified, how do you expect people to react?

if you are happy that the club is playing **** football and our manager is starting to look like a laughing stock who is out of his depth, then good for you.

i and 1000's of others are not and we are perfectly entitled to be "negative" as you call it. others would call it being f*cking realistic.

Nalz

Pj! wrote: »

All the negativity forced me back to this exact time last season. Back to the good times with the mighty Sir Alex, back to escape all the gloom...












Oh.

Lol

Remember the 5-0 Newcastle 6-3 Southampton week. All the boys and girls were squeeling then, won't stop them now!

We're in trouble, mistakes were made but time is needed to fix it.

Rayne Wooney

GSPfan wrote: »

Moyes reckons we need 5 or 6 world class players to win the European Cup.

Lets see then .......

De Gea
Vidic
Ferdinand
Evra
Rooney
Van Persie

Surely its not world class players in goal defense or attack but world class midfielders?

De Gea
Rafael
Vidic
Evra
Nani
Kagawa
Rooney
Van Persie

All 8 of those are capable of being world class in the right system, but we need to buy a world class CM, there's no going around it. Too much dallying around has been done, Manchester United need a world class starting 11, fúck the "one of the best squads in the world" excuse. The club needs to wake up.

I know we give City and Chelsea grief for spending the money they do, but would any United supporter have objections if the club spent 100 million on Fabregas and Modric*. The answer is no. Those two would be the answer to the problem we have.

*I know it's unrealistic, before someone points it out

Mikeyt086

GSPfan wrote: »

Moyes reckons we need 5 or 6 world class players to win the European Cup.

Lets see then .......

De Gea
Vidic
Ferdinand
Evra
Rooney
Van Persie

Surely its not world class players in goal defense or attack but world class midfielders?

GSPfan

Trilla wrote: »

Rio Ferdinand is far from world class now
But your point still stands :-)

I think Raf now is more important than Rio now

Yeah I wouldn't swap Rafael for any other RB so in my eyes I'd have him in there and maybe Rio and Evra would be doubts but yeah I'm not sure what Moyes is getting at.
Bit of an odd comment. I like that he thinks we should have better players but downgrading the whole team when its only midfield in which we lack any world class players is a bit annoying.

For this arguement lets use the words Worlds Class to mean that they would be in contention for a place in any team in the world. Definitely DeGea, Vidic, Van Persie, Rooney. Thats 4. Rafael will definitely be there as he matures.

homerjay2005

not a good sign that we spent £27million on a player and not many think he is world class.

GSPfan

Mikeyt086 wrote: »

Yeah not anymore but on his day he can be immense. He has been world class in the not so distant past.

Rayne Wooney

homerjay2005 wrote: »

not a good sign that we spent £27million on a player and not many think he is world class.

I never believed he was and he's done little to convince me since he's joined, top 10 in the league yes. Would any other "elite" club have him near their starting 11? No.

homerjay2005

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

I never believed he was and he's done little to convince me since he's joined, top 10 in the league yes. Would any other "elite" club have him near their starting 11? No.

thats the thing, alot of our players who not get game time for any other top class team. this isnt all Moyes fault though, Ferguson has alot to answer for. we all went ballistic in 2011 when people said we were one of the worst teams ever to win a league.

we called though people bitter and what not, but looks like they were right. this team has been over achieving for years and now that the stability is gone, they are not responding.

GSPfan

Fellaini is very good but we are under no illusion that he is not world class. I'm glad we have him but defo not good enough to feature for any team in the world.

At this stage I'm hoping for a big clear out next summer or even January. I could say goodbye to Anderson, Kagawa, Cleverley, Giggs, Young, Valencia and not really care too much. Obviously not all in one go but if any of them left I would not be too bothered as for individual reasons I dont see them offering much.

Kagawa is great but it seems like he is this generations Veron. We may never see the best of him. Rather not ruin 4 years of trying to wedge him in somewhere.

Pj!

homerjay2005 wrote: »

what exactly are you trying to say? Any criticism of Moyes right now is justified, how do you expect people to react?

if you are happy that the club is playing **** football and our manager is starting to look like a laughing stock who is out of his depth, then good for you.

i and 1000's of others are not and we are perfectly entitled to be "negative" as you call it. others would call it being f*cking realistic.

Chill the beans there homer jay.

Just an amusing observation in what is no doubt a period of gloom, despair, grief and sorrow.

Nalz

Lads, we can all be mega pessimistic (and in turn bite at everyone who is) and flood this thread with essays regurgitating all that's gone wrong, adding on the latest mishap every time...

but the truth is we're in a bit of trouble, transfer window was a bit of a farce, he's not going to be sacked anytime soon and some players are out of form.

On the other hand there is plenty of time to turn this around, its early in the season, Rooney is flying and staying, RVP to come back, these mistakes on the pitch can be and surely will be rectified (he cannot but play his strongest team for the next few fixtures now) and hopefully we'll push up the table and do well in the league cup and CL.

homerjay2005 wrote: »

not a good sign that we spent £27million on a player and not many think he is world class.

True... He's worth imo £18-£20m and wouldnt call him world class or what we really required.

Then again look what we spent on Anderson (apparently)

PhlegmyMoses

homerjay2005 wrote: »

thats the thing, alot of our players who not get game time for any other top class team. this isnt all Moyes fault though, Ferguson has alot to answer for. we all went ballistic in 2011 when people said we were one of the worst teams ever to win a league.

we called though people bitter and what not, but looks like they were right. this team has been over achieving for years and now that the stability is gone, they are not responding.

Yep, you should definitely change your fundamental belief and position in an argument about the quality in our squad on the basis of a handful of games under a new manager. I think there'll be some red faces at the end of the season of this thread gets resurrected. Knees jerking everywhere.

Rayne Wooney

homerjay2005 wrote: »

thats the thing, alot of our players who not get game time for any other top class team. this isnt all Moyes fault though, Ferguson has alot to answer for. we all went ballistic in 2011 when people said we were one of the worst teams ever to win a league.

we called though people bitter and what not, but looks like they were right. this team has been over achieving for years and now that the stability is gone, they are not responding.

Spot on here.

We're on the road to becoming Arsenal, who are now only getting back in the mix because they started putting money into the team.

The club seem to be afraid to be put in the same group as City and Chelsea, but surely they can see the difference between paying 40 million on some wannabe and giving him crazy wages to buying world class talents who will actually help United compete in Europe and the league.

We can spend money smartly, the "United way" isn't really relevant anymore in this day and age.

Bannerman7

Moyes............To win the Champions League, you need five or six world-class players. That's the level you have to be at to win it. We've not got that yet but what we have got is experience.

We David ? You mean to say you have experience:rolleyes:

Thanks for that David, that will certainly inspire confidence :eek:

homerjay2005

Pj! wrote: »

Chill the beans there homer jay.

Just an amusing observation in what is no doubt a period of gloom, despair, grief and sorrow.

there is nothing amusing about it, at all. Fergie was not and should not be immuned from criticism, over the last 5 years he made alot of questionable decisions and while the clown who called for him to go was way OTT, thats one person out of 50,000 posts on this forum over the past 12 months.

Ferguson did oversee a very alarming drop in football quality and fooled us all into thinking the team was much better than it is - the brilliance of RVP and Rooney, together with one of the best center back pairings in the history of the game made us hard to beat and we won 2 leagues out of it. now that that CB pairing has cracks in it, RVP carrying a knock and a few players off form, suddenly we look painfully inept.

considering this place has a history of fake accounts, trolling etc etc, id take the thoughts of certain posters with a pinch of salt. by the way, why didnt you post who actually said these comments or did you do this just to make your point more relevant than it actually is?

lets not forget also, its not only fergie thats gone and its not only on the pitch that we have problems. Gill, Rene and the other lads that left (except Phelan ) are all badly missed.

Danye

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

I think there'll be some red faces at the end of the season of this thread gets resurrected. Knees jerking everywhere.

I wouldn't say so. One thing we can all agree on is that we want what's best for the club and want it to be successful. It's just that we have all different opinions on how the club should go about it.

I wasn't a fan of Moyes getting the job and I haven't been a fan of what I've seen but that's not to say come May I want us sitting in 6th place just so I can post "I told you so" and feel as if I've been proved right.

Anybody hoping for that isn't a fan in my opinion. I hope DM proves me wrong.

homerjay2005

PhlegmyMoses wrote: »

Yep, you should definitely change your fundamental belief and position in an argument about the quality in our squad on the basis of a handful of games under a new manager. I think there'll be some red faces at the end of the season of this thread gets resurrected. Knees jerking everywhere.

what knee jerking? ive been saying for years that our football is poor and alot of our players are over rated, so please tell me where i am knee jerking? i also made it clear several times that i was not sure Moyes was the right replacement and that he didnt do anything to deserve this job. if fans are not happy with the way things are going, they are fully entitled to have this option.

and to be honest, the problems we have are not just results, the performances have been as bad as ive seen for years - this is all carrying on from what happened during the summer and preseason,but alot of ye on here had yere heads in the sand saying it would all be ok, we are champions etc and completely ignored all the very obvious warning signs that they club was heading in a very bad direction.

there will be no red faces either, Moyes HAS to turn this around as right now, how he has acted since July is not befitting of a manager of the greatest club in the world. we all laughed at Liverpool and how they treated Hodgson. i can see now where they were coming from and if Moyes doesnt get his acct together, we will head that way.

Pj!

homerjay2005 wrote: »

by the way, why didnt you post who actually said these comments or did you do this just to make your point more relevant than it actually is?

I didn't post the names because many still post heavily here and I didn't want anybody to think I was picking on them.

Rayne Wooney

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

We're on the road to becoming Arsenal, who are now only getting back in the mix because they started putting money into the team.

When?

Panthro

From an outsider point of view, it's sickening to think that come May when United are there or there abouts in one of the top league positions, this whole "mini meltdown" (it's September lads FFS!) will be a distant memory.
But sure, better off saying nothing.

DM_7

Losing to Everton and Tottenham upset people before end of September last season as well so the annoyed reactions are something I am used to seeing.

No doubt United have a lot of improving to do, but I would only be worried if I thought the required improvement out of the players (and management) wasn't possible.

Rayne Wooney

[Deleted User] wrote: »

When?

2nd September 2013, approx 10pm


It's not a huge step but it is a step in the right direction for Arsenal, if you want to win you need to either produce or buy world class players, there's no other way if you want to win premier leagues or champions leagues. Arsenal did and are a hell of a lot stronger now even though it was one player.

GSPfan

Yeah Arsenal spending 40million on 1 player is not a great example to use. We have to wait till at least January to see if Arsenal are any better off than usual.

Its gonna be a mad year.

homerjay2005

discussion similar to what we are having here, is on 5live now.

the consensus seems to be that people believe that the poor standard of our first 11 is being shown up now, that the organisational and motivational powers of Ferguson are gone.

there is a bit of blame on him for setting Moyes up for a fall, its obvious that this discussion they had about the squad has set him up incorrectly.

one thing that is now a huge worry is the fact that Moyes if publically questioning the ability of the players twice this week and i cant image them being too happy about it - this could have major repercussions for him.

2 months ago he was happy with the squad and said he would be happy to go through the window and buy nobody. all of a sudden we need loads of investment and he is saying our players are not that good after all.

thats suicide IMO.

GSPfan

Panthro wrote: »

From an outsider point of view, it's sickening to think that come May when United are there or there abouts in one of the top league positions, this whole "mini meltdown" (it's September lads FFS!) will be a distant memory.
But sure, better off saying nothing.

Better off but you did anyway.

Nalz

homerjay2005 wrote: »

one thing that is now a huge worry is the fact that Moyes if publically questioning the ability of the players twice this week and i cant image them being too happy about it - this could have major repercussions for him.

2 months ago he was happy with the squad and said he would be happy to go through the window and buy nobody. all of a sudden we need loads of investment and he is saying our players are not that good after all.

thats suicide IMO.

True

I know we've lost 3 league games and look a shadow of what we were (at that we got away with murder now and again) but this grinds my gears.

How someone hasn't pulled him up on this negativity in the press (be it true or not) is beyond me....especially after the transfer window we had.