Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - 2013/14 mod warning post#7259

Donnielighto

Homer needs to sit down and have a cuppa. I dont even like tea but I think it would suit him. Make my thread nice again homer.


Sorry lads, first time shroom

IvySlayer

Donnielighto wrote: »

Homer needs to sit down and have a cuppa. I dont even like tea but I think it would suit him. Make my thread nice again homer.


Sorry lads, first time shroom

:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:

*faints*

homerjay2005

Donnielighto wrote: »

Homer needs to sit down and have a cuppa. I dont even like tea but I think it would suit him. Make my thread nice again homer.


Sorry lads, first time shroom

?????? all i did was post something that was asked for, and then mentioned that people keep going on about Fergie 3 decades ago which is completely irrelevant now..

i want Moyes to succeed, i really do, but he needs to learn fast and get things back on track before things really start to go t*ts up - the players turning on him.

there is nothing to gain from Moyes not turning this around, nothing. he needs a bit of luck and a bit of support too, and hopefully he gets it, as certainly i nor any sane United fan wants whats happening right now to continue.

ill judge him properly in January but 3 months into that 6 month period for every positive in his reign, theres 4 or 5 negatives. he has got to do better.

SirDelboy18

There are plenty of valid reasons why Moyes should get time (if those are your beliefs). The fact that Ferguson got time, is not one of them.

Donnielighto

IvySlayer wrote: »

:eek::eek::eek::eek::eek:

*faints*

It's just not nice. Apart from tea at the mart, free refill an aul beef salad sandwich easy on the salad heavy on the beef and a slice of cake that amounted to a slice of a poor sponge with cream filling, maybe a bitta raspberry or even strawberry sauce if you were lucky. The sauce was always too sweet. Topped of with some crusty crunchy half coating half dusting of sugar, horrific.

Thats a beautiful cup of tea.

homerjay2005

SirDelboy18 wrote: »

There are plenty of valid reasons why Moyes should get time (if those are your beliefs).

apart from one poster here who i know personally, ive yet to see anybody whose opinion has weight behind it actually suggesting that Moyes doesnt deserve time. there seems to be a sense that if people are complaining about him, means they want him sacked tomorrow morning, which is not the case at all.

F.J.

There are several issues that are concerning me.The goals we are conceding,our attcking play and lack of midfield.

We have conceded 10 goals this season.Three from corners, two of which were given away needlessly(Liverpool,Leverkusen) and then defended poorly.We look very suspect at the back defending corners

Three goals have been conceded from counter attacks down our left(Leverkusen,City,WBA). These three goals have all happened in the space of the last four games.Surely in the analysis after the match this would be noted and corrective action taken.

The remaining four have come from a combination of individual errors and poor play.(Welbeck&ValenciavSwansea&City).Poor team defending against City and West Brom.

At least 50% of the goals we have conceded have been very soft ones to give away.We need to get back to defending well and cutting out these needless goals.

On the topic of defence everyone knows the issues with Ferdinand and Jones but Evans seemed to be lacking in confidence Saturday or was being restricted by the tactics.I am used to seeing him stride out of defence with the ball and start attacks but he did not do this Saturday especially when he had the chance to in the second half when we were losing. He just looked up and played it sideways to Ferdinand.

The substitutions and lack of them are hard to understand.Against City with Young playing like sh!te he leaves him on and then only makes one sub.Then at the weekend he whips Kagawa off at half time when he was doing alright to switch it up.Kagawa's confidence must be getting a hammering.Admittedly I was happy to see Januzaj come on but that was cause I thought Kagawa was injured.Fellaini sub was 15 minutes too late.

Thought Januzaj did well attacking wise when he came on but there were a couple of times he started tracking back and the minute he hit the half way line he stopped which I wasn't impressed with.

Our attacking play as we all know has been poor.We have not being able to involve our main strikers* van Persie/Hernandez at all and if this continues I can see a red card or two for van Persie.You could see how frustrated he was against Liverpool and he didn't get a sniff on Saturday when he came on.

A lot of our issues relate back to our lack of midfield which have been discussed ad nauseum so I won't add further too it at this late hour.

*Rooney is second striker not main.

Your Airbag

Moyes will get one year and would take one hell of a bad year for him to get sacked at the end of it.

There is more than his reputation at stake. Fergie brought him in and asked for us to stand by him so he will not want to lose face either.

What I want to see more of from Moyes is anger and less stress. On the Everton bench he would often look like he could strangle players. He may not be confident enough to do this with the UTD stars yet but it needs to happen.

Donnielighto

homerjay2005 wrote: »

?????? all i did was post something that was asked for, and then mentioned that people keep going on about Fergie 3 decades ago which is completely irrelevant now..

i want Moyes to succeed, i really do, but he needs to learn fast and get things back on track before things really start to go t*ts up - the players turning on him.

there is nothing to gain from Moyes not turning this around, nothing. he needs a bit of luck and a bit of support too, and hopefully he gets it, as certainly i nor any sane United fan wants whats happening right now to continue.

ill judge him properly in January but 3 months into that 6 month period for every positive in his reign, theres 4 or 5 negatives. he has got to do better.

Ah I get ya but you come across so harsh at times it's like you're willing him to fail. The killer is though that you're clearly a genuine fan going to matches and helping people with tickets, first hand advice and but it's killer seeing that in this thread. I get where youre coming from but your view just seems so coloured now that nothing other than pure success will suffice. Give him a few months a few seasons of simmering and bubbling. The club is healthy and the external threats just dont feel like the machines they were.

Edi. Happy to see that you'll revisit it again.

Ed The Equalizer

There's no comparison between Fergie pre-Utd and Moyes pre-Utd... here's Fergie's bio at Aberdeen - it's as good if not better than what he did at United:

Not many would have predicted the sucess that was to be acheived under new boss Alex Ferguson when he took over in 1978. By his own Admission Fergie may not have given his post his full attention in his first season. The industrial tribunal and the ilness of his father had contrived to pre occupy the new boss. It was a learning curve for both Fergie and his players. What was perhaps the most significant was that the nucleus of a grat Aberdeen side was at his disposal. Following a first season that promised much but delivered little, doubts remained. Those concerns heightened when the Dons git-wrapped the League Cup to Dundee Utd in December 1979.It was perhaps the lowest period under Alex Ferguson.In May 1980 the Dons had clawed back a Celtic lead in the title race to take the championship in dramatic fashion. A 5-0 defeat of Hibernian at Easter Road on the last day of the season gave Aberdeen the title for only the second time in their history. Ferguson had brought in Mark McGhee and with the emergence of the likes of Alex McLeish and Jim Leighton there was much to look forward to. Fergies' great strength was to instil a beleif in his players that they could be a match for anyone. That beleif was to Augur well as this Aberdeen was gradually brushing both halves of the Old Firm aside. Ferguson also plundered his old team St Mirren on occasion and in all he brought Peter Weir, Billy Stark, Doug Bell and Frank McDougall, all of whom made a telling contribution at Pittodrie. In 1982 Aberdeen went close to the title again but it was in the Cup Final that they came of age. They went into the game against Rangers as overwhelming favourites, such as the progress made, and they did not dissapoint as the Dons won 4-1 in impressive style. That Cup success opened the door to Europe and it was in that arena that Aberdeen were to be judged. In season 1982/83 under Alex Ferguson the Dons went on to win both the ECWC and the Scottish Cups, a marvellous achievement for a provincial club. The fact that Aberdeen had beaten Bayern Munich and then their ultimate scal of Real Madrid in the Gothenburg Final served notice that these Dons were not for messing. Their European success was acheived by a side that were all modest buys and home grown talent, all from Scotland. Never since has any team managed such a feat. Domestically it was on the battlefields of Ibrox and Parkhead that Aberdeen had to make their mark. They did that with no little style. Ferguson was a master of the mind games, building his players up before such games and it is to his credit that the players beleived in themselves; that they could go anywhere and not lose.
Of course it was inevitable that Alex Ferguson would attract the attentions of other clubs during his spell at Pittodrie. His stature had grown by the year and there was no let up by the Dons who had now become without doubt, the No 1 team in Scotland. Following on from their European nSuper cup success in 1983, Ferguson demanded his side reclaim the league title. His players duly obliged with record points hauls in 1984 and 1985 as Aberdeen retained the Championship for the first time.


Hampden also became a second home for the Dons as they again created club history by winning the Scottish Cup three times in succession in 1982, 1983 and 1984. These were heady days and Alex Ferguson could do little wrong. Ferguson also endeared himself to the Aberdeen support when he not only knocked back Tottenham and Wolves but Rangers attempts to make him and his captain Willie Miller to Abrox were doomed to fail. For once in recent Scottish football history the buying power of the Old Firm counted for little. Ferguson had a job to finish and Rangers would not stand in his way.Perhaps it was his treatment at Ibrox as a player that had some bearing, but it was good news all round for Aberdeen who continued to dominate their Glasgow rivals. In1985 the Dons clinched the Premier League title in front of their own fans for the first time. Willie Miller led the way with the goal that gave the Dons a 1-1 draw against Celtic and the Party began. Some months later they won the only trophy that had eluded Ferguson during his seven years at pittodrie, the League Cup. The Dons boss had never been an admirer of the competition but had stated that he wanted to win it that year to complete his set of successes. That may have sounded arrogant outwith the confines of Pittodrie but he had just cause for such optimism as the dons at that time were virtually unbeatable. For the record Aberdeen won the League Cup to satisfy their manager and did without conceding a single goal in any of their ties.

A year later it was all to come to an end. Events at Old Trafford had meant that Manchester Utd had dispensed with Ron Atkinson. Ferguson was top of the Old Trafford shopping list. Privately he had stated that he would only ever leave the Dons for perhaps three clubs in the worl, unfortunately Manchester Utf was right up there.

On reflection it was a golden era under Ferguson and those days will never be repeated such as the unique circumstances that prevailed.

Despite a traumatic early spell at Manchester Utd, Ferguson has gone on to become the most sucessful manager ever in British football, culminating with his club's European Champions Cup success over Bayern Munich in 1999. Defeating the German champions was nothing new to Fergie; Aberdeen supporters had seen it all before.

Source: http://www.afcheritage.org/Team/Manager/index.cfm?manager_id=11

Vic Vinegar

Poor article that, it's riddled with spelling errors and it's arranged awfully.

Ed The Equalizer

Bombleswizzum wrote: »

Poor article that, it's riddled with spelling errors and it's arranged awfully.

Whatever, it more than suffices to make the point that Fergie had an incredible record when he took over. Moyes has an ok record but as we know has never won anything.

Just reading that Fergie advised him to keep the backroom but he went with his own staff... doesn't fill me with confidence and so far his decision making seems pretty suspect.

Supraman

Any truth in the rumors of zaha and moyes daughter ?

Donnielighto

Supraman wrote: »

Any truth in the rumors of zaha and moyes daughter ?

Shes nice. Funny about moyes loafing suarez. If zaha is treading her and moyes is unhappy I could see him doin zaha at trainin.

DARK-KNIGHT

Anyone feel
Deadwood like anderson, Valencia, young and couple others need to be sold or moved on? IMO they are muck at the moment it doesn't justify paying a wage to any of them they are not good enough for our club

Really disappointed after west brom game...

The_Kew_Tour

we have had dead wood at the club for few years.

gosplan

Taok wrote: »

Just reading that Fergie advised him to keep the backroom but he went with his own staff... doesn't fill me with confidence and so far his decision making seems pretty suspect.

It's only cause things aren't going his way though.

What I mean is we've no idea what the impact of Moyes working with a totally new coaching team would have had or conversely how the coaching team would have fared under a new manager and new system.

Doesn't matter though, it's being painted as a Moyes mistake.

But Christ, look at Ancelotti. Possibly the best squad on the planet but going through an obvious transitional phase. Anyone think he's out of his depth or question his decision making?

Lord TSC

Poor Moyes. Criticized for not preforming a clear out of the team, but also criticized for preforming a clear out of the backroom staff:P

IvySlayer

Ole is 5/1 to be next Fulham manager, but Poyet is the favourite, hope Ole manages in the premiership sometime

The_Kew_Tour

I do feel sorry for Moyes.

I think he deserves a chance.

Some of the things said about him are OTT.

Dont get me wrong things have been far from perfect, but think some fans are way OTT in their reaction to start so far.

Alpha Dog 1

DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »

Anyone feel
Deadwood like anderson, Valencia, young and couple others need to be sold or moved on? IMO they are muck at the moment it doesn't justify paying a wage to any of them they are not good enough for our club

Really disappointed after west brom game...

I wouldn't say valencia is deadwood, he's started the season pretty well and was missed last weekend.

bucketybuck

Alpha Dog 1 wrote: »

I wouldn't say valencia is deadwood, he's started the season pretty well and was missed last weekend.

This must be a wind up.

The_Kew_Tour

Tomorrow night is a tricky tie for us. Hopefully 3 points. I think we will see a reaction tomorrow night. Maybe im too optimistic or stupid. Not sure which.;)

Cantona's Collars

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Tomorrow night is a tricky tie for us. Hopefully 3 points. I think we will see a reaction tomorrow night. Maybe im too optimistic or stupid. Not sure which.;)

We said that last week.:o

Nalz

DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »

Anyone feel
Deadwood like anderson, Valencia, young and couple others need to be sold or moved on? IMO they are muck at the moment it doesn't justify paying a wage to any of them they are not good enough for our club.

I wouldnt class Valencia as deadwood, definitely more useful to the squad than Anderson and Young imo

DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »

Really disappointed after west brom game...

As you should be, it's a defeat against a poor side. Time to move on to Shak D

Lord TSC

I don't think the likes of Val, Young, Anderson or Clev should be sold, unless there's a great offer coming in for them.

We need a full squad. They shouldn't be near the first team right now, but they are grand benchwarmers/cup fodder.

Your Airbag

Almost exactly what I said about Moyes last night, he needs to be more like his Everton self. I think he is overwhelmed at the moment.


http://www.telegraph.co.uk/sport/football/teams/manchester-united/10345724/Manchester-United-manager-David-Moyes-must-get-back-to-being-the-fearsome-leader-he-was-at-Everton.html

Shinji says he needs to improve or he won't survive at UTD

http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11667/8950832/shinki-kagawa-admits-he-needs-to-improve

DARK-KNIGHT

Alpha Dog 1 wrote: »

I wouldn't say valencia is deadwood, he's started the season pretty well and was missed last weekend.

Ok how do you rate Valencia?? He isn't good enough simple

Cantona's Collars

Hard for Shinji to improve when he's not getting game time.Even if he'd only one leg he'd have been better than Young.

DARK-KNIGHT

One rival set of fans in that thread open currently are pissing me off just trying to bite tongue now it's not worth a ban to react

Backstreet Moyes

DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »

Anyone feel
Deadwood like anderson, Valencia, young and couple others need to be sold or moved on? IMO they are muck at the moment it doesn't justify paying a wage to any of them they are not good enough for our club

Really disappointed after west brom game...

Young and Valencia are totally out of form but we can't afford to lose wingers unless they are replaced. I have no problem with them staying around once they are back up behind Nani, Kagawa and Janjuaz and are not starting.

Cantona's Collars

DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »

One rival set of fans in that thread open currently are pissing me off just trying to bite tongue now it's not worth a ban to react

Many are too young to even remember the last time their team won the league.

Giggsy11

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

I do feel sorry for Moyes.

I think he deserves a chance.

Some of the things said about him are OTT.

Dont get me wrong things have been far from perfect, but think some fans are way OTT in their reaction to start so far.

Also if our ex staff keeps their gob shut, it will help a lot. All this talk about how one coach improved Ronaldo and how one coach says what Fergie said to Moyes. They should just shut the **** up and let Moyes do his job.

magnumbud

zerks wrote: »

We said that last week.:o

and got the reaction against the pool :-P

Cantona's Collars

magnumbud wrote: »

and got the reaction against the pool :-P

The WBA game sucked away any feelgood factor we had from that.Even against Liverpool we were no great shakes.

master-t

zerks wrote: »

Hard for Shinji to improve when he's not getting game time.Even if he'd only one leg he'd have been better than Young.

But he is being given chances and he's not performing well in fairness. I know he got hooked at HT the weekend, but up to that point - do you think he has been good when he has played? I don't. I know he has it in his locker, but he would need to start showing it.


He has class, but what he did at Dortmund and a spurt last season can't justify a starting spot. No pre season taken into consideration, let's see Shinji start playing to his level. That's two managers are seeing issues playing him. He just doesn't seem suited to the left, but Rooney is undroppable in the No.10 - so Shinji has to adjust if he wants to play.

kryogen

Are people blind to Janjuaz failings as player (right now?)

Calls for him to be starting are a bit much tbh, he is a good prospect, has some definite class, it does show through, but he is not disciplined enough to be starting games right now, someone threw up pics not too long ago to bash Carrick, all I could do was laugh because it was Jans not having a clue how to defend that was more at fault for the goal!

People brush over a lot of faults when a new talent comes along, some of it is understandable I guess, particularly when the player is young, and has come through the academy. He is getting game time, that I am happy about, he is not good enough to start yet though, not in any meaningful game anyway.

We already have a player, who has shown his class and quality and deserves in the next few weeks, to be given an uninterrupted run in the team to see if he can nail down a spot. Adnan should be below him in the pecking order, alongside Zaha.

Rooney and Kagawa need to spend more time on the field together consistently to figure out how to play together better, they both take up a lot of the same positions and movements etc at the moment, understanding each other and complimenting each others game will take time to happen.

It is criminal to me that a player who is so good at unlocking tight defences is going to be wasted when creativity is something we are crying out for.

Over the course of the next few weeks I would love to see, barring injury of course a front four of RVP, Rooney, Kag and Nani. Give them time to gel, see what happens, if this truly is a transitional period for the team let their be some actual transition! All we are seeing out there is more of the same, with poorer results.

Also, give Rio a break for God sake, the last time he played so many games in a row was 7 years ago, when he was 28! He can be a huge asset this season, as he was last season, if managed correctly. He will break down if not imo.

Young is a grand squad player, overpaid for him, but hardly Moyes fault. Valencia is the same, he hasn't been "figured out" as some would tell you, he was in the league a while before he even joined United so I would think teams knew all about him before the last couple of years, its like he has the ips basically. He will do fine as a squad player though.

kryogen

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Also if our ex staff keeps their gob shut, it will help a lot. All this talk about how one coach imporved Ronaldo and how one coach says what Fergie said to Moyes. They should just shut the **** up and let Moyes do his job.

Since Moyes didn't value their opinion enough to keep them round, I doubt it affects him what gets said in the media.

Tbh, if what gets said in the media does hamper him in some way from doing his job, he isn't the man for the job anyway. Its Man United, prime time news. Have you noticed the distinct lack of Townsend being vilified and pointed at all week as whats wrong with football?

You have to have a thick skin to manage, or play at the top.

I am certain Moyes has a very thick skin

Giggsy11

kryogen wrote: »

Since Moyes didn't value their opinion enough to keep them round, I doubt it affects him what gets said in the media.

Tbh, if what gets said in the media does hamper him in some way from doing his job, he isn't the man for the job anyway. Its Man United, prime time news. Have you noticed the distinct lack of Townsend being vilified and pointed at all week as whats wrong with football?

You have to have a thick skin to manage, or play at the top.

I am certain Moyes has a very thick skin

I never said it is stopping Moyes doing his job, just that it is irritating that every other week one of the ex coach is spouting bs when in the last few years that was not the case.

Edit: Rene left not because he was not valued or anything close to that, he didn't want the role where he was not in charge of training sessions but Moyes is young enough manager to conduct the training session so he left. Nothing to do with not valuing him or his opinion.

homerjay2005

kryogen wrote: »

Are people blind to Janjuaz failings as player (right now?)
.

the problem is, no matter how many failings he has, he still has more life and drive about him over Young, Welbeck and Valencia.

given how poor those 3 are, Zaha deserves a shot also.

tallaghtmick

DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »

One rival set of fans in that thread open currently are pissing me off just trying to bite tongue now it's not worth a ban to react

Even worse on Facebook especially one guy who seems to just post Liverpools fans stuff on my page all the time, when as usual I destroy his awful pool fan logic it reverts to and I quote "at least we dont buy refs with little brown bags" at this point I told him enough is enough and to **** off to Anfield with that Paranoia.

Lucas Hood

Any followers of the Ukrainian League here ? How have Shaktar coped with the loss of Mkhitaryan , Fernandinho & Willian (Left in Jan 2013 but still a big loss) ?

magnumbud

zerks wrote: »

The WBA game sucked away any feelgood factor we had from that.Even against Liverpool we were no great shakes.

i was saying we reacted against pool. i was making a joke.

lordgoat

homerjay2005 wrote: »

the problem is, no matter how many failings he has, he still has more life and drive about him over Young, Welbeck and Valencia.

given how poor those 3 are, Zaha deserves a shot also.

He doesn't defend homer. He's a luxury at the moment. I assumed kags was injured when he was coming on. He IMO was the main cause of the goal. And he have up a chance with his first touch in the game. He's a great attacker but he's nowhere near ready defensively.

The team played worse at the start if the second half when Nani had to switch.

Also he should have taken the WBA player down and taken his yellow card for their goal.

kryogen

homerjay2005 wrote: »

the problem is, no matter how many failings he has, he still has more life and drive about him over Young, Welbeck and Valencia.

given how poor those 3 are, Zaha deserves a shot also.

Zaha is raw, so is Jan, the only person on the bench I want to see starting consistently right now is Kagawa and then Welbeck, Danny has been playing well imo, he will never be our number 1 or anything, but he links play very well and is far more adept tactically that Adnan has shown so far.

More training with the first team and sub appearances will bring him along well I feel.

Alpha Dog 1

DARK-KNIGHT wrote: »

Ok how do you rate Valencia?? He isn't good enough simple

Do you think kagawa is better than valencia on the wing?

GSPfan

lordgoat wrote: »

He doesn't defend homer. He's a luxury at the moment. I assumed kags was injured when he was coming on. He IMO was the main cause of the goal. And he have up a chance with his first touch in the game. He's a great attacker but he's nowhere near ready defensively.

The team played worse at the start if the second half when Nani had to switch.

Also he should have taken the WBA player down and taken his yellow card for their goal.

Whats going on with your spelling Lordgoat? Ha. Are you typing while driving?

kryogen

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Edit: Rene left not because he was not valued or anything close to that, he didn't want the role where he was not in charge of training sessions but Moyes is young enough manager to conduct the training session so he left. Nothing to do with not valuing him or his opinion.

This, is all speculative because one side has said something, and the other has said something else. It really depends on who you believe I guess. Its not something I can discuss with any confidence though. For what its worth, I would lean toward Rene of course.

For me, more evidence is there to support what he has said on the matter but like I said, is all speculative.

master-t

I just think given the form of our wide players - Nani, Valencia, Young, Welbeck - someone like Zaha should be given a chance. He was one of our best players pre season and I think he could offer us something different. He is Raw, no doubt about it, but is direct and attacking.

chainsawman

I cant wait in May for all the doubters and ABU to eat their words. Moyes will come up trumps.