Mobile Phone Credit - Extra Charge

foggy_lad

I never buy credit in any shop that charges extra because even in small villages there is an alternative shop that does not charge. I will always give them my business or wait and get credit when I am in a larger village or town where they do not rip off the customers with this extra fee.


Just to be 100% clear on this, Are ye saying that the networks are selling ye these credit amounts at more than the face value? disregarding all your own costs of doing business like phone line and esb etc etc are the networks charging more than €5 for a €5 top up?

Shelflife

foggy_lad wrote: »

I never buy credit in any shop that charges extra because even in small villages there is an alternative shop that does not charge. I will always give them my business or wait and get credit when I am in a larger village or town where they do not rip off the customers with this extra fee.


Just to be 100% clear on this, Are ye saying that the networks are selling ye these credit amounts at more than the face value? disregarding all your own costs of doing business like phone line and esb etc etc are the networks charging more than €5 for a €5 top up?

Yes vodafone charge us €5.14 for a €5 top up and €10.03 for a €10. The other networks are similar prices.

foggy_lad

Shelflife wrote: »

Yes vodafone charge us €5.14 for a €5 top up and €10.03 for a €10. The other networks are similar prices.

Are most small retailers not part of some organisation? could ye all not just stop selling these products in protest and tell your customers why, the networks will soon roll back as they get complaints from customers. Have ye complained to ComReg about this?

Shelflife

The organisations CSNA and RGDATA are not allowed to organise any boycott under as its illegal and would leave them open to being sued.

comreg and the consumer agencies wont intervene as they dont deal with businesses.

The mobile operators will openly and blatently lie to the customers when they ring up.

Access

brian_gall85 wrote: »

What if you have no credit or MBs left?

I would top up by text... And failing that, i would go to a shop that does not charge above the face value of the topup.

Please dont get me wrong here... I do see the problem that shopkeepers have with the charges on credit by the networks... But personally, I or anyone close to me simply would not buy a topup that costs above face value.

The shopkeepers need to look at it from the customers point on this one... Near me at home i have two convenience stores across the road from each other... One charges 2.20 for a two litre of milk and the other charges 1.89...(same milk) Guess which one i go to, to purchase my few items... And they gain more as i would buy the odd loaf of bread and do the lotto, buy treats for the kids etc. And thats only one example.

Im not knocking shopkeepers at all here... Just pointing out my point of view as a customer.

Edit: i know not everywhere would have two shops across from each other, nor two shops in the same village etc. But its just an example

Access

Shelflife wrote: »

Wasting your time trying to explain Brian, they have no concept of running a business and no concept of what other people may want or need.

Not everyone has another shop close by, not everyone has a bank account. not everyone has access to or the ability to use the internet. But that doesnt matter because these lads here have and thats all that matters, im all right [EMAIL="f*@k"]f*^k[/EMAIL] the rest of you.

Stop selling the €5 and €10 topups sure the pensioners and unemployed can afford the €20.


Theres actually more to a shopkeeper than making a profit, to the community esp in the smaller towns we provide services that the larger shops wouldnt even consider, free deliveries , credit to people in need a lift in and out to the shop, stocking items that are slow moving because customers have specific dietary needs, personal shoppers for those who cant carry baskets, opening up the shop to help out someone whos stuck to name a few.

But sure when we complain that multi national companies and banks are screwing us over we get the begrudgers telling us that if we cant manage our business to close up or delist everything because the can get it so screw everyone else. I want to use my card for every mickey mouse transaction and increase your costs and hold everyone up because IM ENTITLED TO !

You sound like lads who leave your water running all night became se its free and because you can.

Believe it or not there are more than you on the planet and just because you are sorted doesnt mean that everyone else is.Sure we have a bottom line to look after but theres alot more to running a business than making a profit.

But sure ye wouldnt need to worry about that , your all right jack !!

One of the most arrogant replys i have ever seen on boards.

Well done.

brian_gall85

NO SHOP WILL BE SELLING €5 OR €10 TOP UPS FOR FACE VALUE ANYMORE AS THEY NOW COST THE RETAILER MORE THAN THAT. SO THAT'S NOT AN OPTION ANYMORE - WE NEVER CHARGED UP UNTIL THIS MONDAY DESPITE MAKING LESS THAN 3% ON THEM.

Apologies for shouting but are we all now clear on the matter?

On the subject of Milk and bread we sell a 2 litre for €1.19 and sell it with a loaf of bread for €2.20.

JTMan

I assume you can still get €5 / €10 top ups online for face value and in phone stores for face value. This is just going to drive more top ups online.

brian_gall85

Which is exactly what the phone companies want to happen.

countrynosebag

The big companies (from whence the product originates) make almost solely profit on a thing the "sell" to a retailer to "sell" to us I believe.
The companies appear to pay little or no taxes and the end-of-the-line customer (that is us) are expected to pay all costs. We do not exist in the same cosy tax havens.
The retailers charge us as they have prohibitive costs of years only rents and huge public health and safety indemnity insurance etc. Varying levels of profit/greed exist too.
Now, have I got all this roughly right.
We also pay to get to the shop. Rural dwellers (me) have had buses stopped so much that our free bus pass goes unused and trying to get somewhere is an ever more desperate and expensive business. I cannot afford a taxi each way to the nearest villages (only two that sell this product) of about 12 miles each way.
We need to be able to order this via computer. Bear in mind to top up the money is a nightmare too. We also need to have some computer skills. I have tried and tried to avail of the advertised computer courses for older people, also advertised as short and tailored , we are simply able to learn what we need to get by. Bantry refuse outright. Skibbereen INSIST upon a course of a whole year with the exam - this is a qualification we do not want or need. It would be hard to keep attendance, health, transport costs, weather and so on. It would waste education that younger and unemployed need.o
All we would like is the comfort of a telephone, in case - some of us have no-one to ring but the Coalman or a shop to enquire about something as we cannot afford to go and have e no success. So, any suggestions. At present am still trying to get hold of the famous rural transport scheme. It would be the most wonderful thing to me and I would have someone to talk to occasionally. I would not get so frightened. I dread being found like that woman. No phone to ask for help here would be the end of some of us - LITERALLY. Perhaps it is the time to consider a new method altogether. We can do different things. It will.not kill us. Do not stop a monthly debut from bank a/c as my phone calls are about 5-10 euros here or there - perhaps 20 or 30 euros per year, and that is waiting time. It would be good to have it set up so that we could request and the erratic purchase could be debited. Flexibility is the key.
What amuses me, and things are bad for us, is that older people are accused of being set in their ways and I think you may be surprised to find that many have useful ideas to help themselves but only are able to if others YOUNGER, are flexible.

countrynosebag

Spelling and grammar errors are from this android as corrections (?) Seem to mess things around considerably. Trying to pull message up or down to alter is hard. I have tried to correct the above as much as possible. It has corrected already and a mess is made already. I have corrected twice and it seems yo 're-correct (?). Forum fir androids....... any suggestions welcome, well the constructive ones - need to make that one clear!

SimonLynch

Have all the phone companies done this? Paid the surcharge on a Meteor top-up today but haven't seen them mentioned.

brian_gall85

Yes everyone of them, the ironic think it's that Tesco, (a major competitor for a lot of retailers), are charging less than the rest for their top ups to retailers.

rex-x

brian_gall85 wrote: »

NO SHOP WILL BE SELLING €5 OR €10 TOP UPS FOR FACE VALUE ANYMORE AS THEY NOW COST THE RETAILER MORE THAN THAT. SO THAT'S NOT AN OPTION ANYMORE - WE NEVER CHARGED UP UNTIL THIS MONDAY DESPITE MAKING LESS THAN 3% ON THEM.

Apologies for shouting but are we all now clear on the matter?

On the subject of Milk and bread we sell a 2 litre for €1.19 and sell it with a loaf of bread for €2.20.

All my local shops still sell them at face value with no plans to add a surcharge, they are simply swallowing the cost because they know its the clever thing to do from a business standpoint, I would never pay above face value regardless of what it costs you, harsh but true

brian_gall85

They're part of a select few, I almost guarantee they won't sell at that price for long.

I bet their confectionary and soft drinks aren't being sold at anything like the rrp.

Paypoint have adjusted their cost to retailers so that they aren't selling them at a loss, but they have a small agent base.

rob316

I absolutely sympathize with the OP and other shop owners in that regard. No business can survive on those margins or lack of.

For posters who say just absorb the costs how can you? That cost needs to go into something wether its a dairy milk or 500ml bottle of coke. But you cant put that up either as evidenced by the threads on here.
.
The bigger retailers can absorb the costs but the corner shop just simply can not. Does anyone have any idea of the cost of rent, rates, wages, and all other overheads? I'd imagine very little actually do.

Everyone's anger should be with the phone companies not the shop owners who are only trying to get by.

I know some shops absolutely take the piss with pricing and put it down to convenience but a surcharge I think is a perfectly reasonable thing to do.

Out of interest OP what % of your turnover would be represented by phone credit?

brian_gall85

Can't give you an annual figure off the top of my head, but I know that the day the surcharge started (on €5 and €10 with us I might add), that the total sales for postpoint was over 25% when lotto products were excluded from the turnover figure - and that was a Monday.

As you say the bigger companies can absorb the costs, but we simply cannot sell them at a loss. I'd guarantee that phone credit doesn't even make up 2.5% of Tesco and Dunnes turnover.

rob316

brian_gall85 wrote: »

Can't give you an annual figure off the top of my head, but I know that the day the surcharge started (on €5 and €10 with us I might add), that the total sales for postpoint was over 25% when lotto products were excluded from the turnover figure - and that was a Monday.

As you say the bigger companies can absorb the costs, but we simply cannot sell them at a loss. I'd guarantee that phone credit doesn't even make up 2.5% of Tesco and Dunnes turnover.

25% before Lotto thats hefty. I challenge anyone to run a business where 25% of turnover is run at a loss, its simply unsustainable. Then add in more poor margin products like cigarettes and fuel if you sell fuel.

I used to be involved in the day to day of a very busy service station. If a customer bought say fuel, credit and cigarettes on plastic there was simply nothing left margin wise.
Then when some prick would do a drive off he would be driving away with your daily some twice daily profit on fuel. We kept cigarettes in a locked safe as if you lost any the cost is hugely damaging.
You cant pay the wages and overheads on the "profit" from these products.

What the phone companies are doing is criminal, absolute no need for it.

Hanlor

There is an alternative where you don't have to pay these extra charges. If you have a debit or credit card, you can do it on line or by dialling any of these (depending on your network). €10 Top up costs €10

1740 Meteor
1747 Vodafone
1749 O2

brian_gall85

Which is exactly what the networks and the banks want you to do.

Hanlor

Brian, that may well be the case but if it saves money adding credit, isn't it the most logical thing to do?

brian_gall85

Logical, yes, but that isn't what I started this thread for. I simply wanted to point out that the phone companies are now charging retailer more for credit (for the retailer to sell to the end user) than they are charging customers who top up online our using your method. Hence screwing the little guy at the pursuit of even greater profits.

Boscod

Hi,
Purchased a €10 VOD top up today using AIB Internet banking, however only €9 was credited to my balance. So question is, who has taken the €1 ....AIB or VOD?

brian_gall85

Certainly wasn't a shop as they would have only charged you around 50c extra

jacob2

i buy my credit in tescos no 50 cent charge i was in west dublin last week bought credit in a shop and they charged me 1 euro on ten euro credit add all them euros up in a day

brian_gall85

Guess how much €10 credit costs me (and the shop in question) to buy Jacob, I'll give you a clue it isn't less than €10...on top of that you have to factor in the running cost of the machine, i.e. staff, electric, broadband....

Nah, the €1s are all pure profit...

ejabrod

Boscod wrote: »

Hi,
Purchased a €10 VOD top up today using AIB Internet banking, however only €9 was credited to my balance. So question is, who has taken the €1 ....AIB or VOD?

The same happened to me this morning.

Topped up by €5 but credit was €4.01???? WFT? (Meteor)

foggy_lad

ejabrod wrote: »

The same happened to me this morning.

Topped up by €5 but credit was €4.01???? WFT? (Meteor)

that looks like a charge by the bank

ejabrod

foggy_lad wrote: »

that looks like a charge by the bank

The top up was done online. The bank don't have the ability to reduce the amount of available credit after a top-up.

If it was a bank charge I would expect it to show up on my statement, not the affect the credit value

foggy_lad

ejabrod wrote: »

The top up was done online. The bank don't have the ability to reduce the amount of available credit after a top-up.

If it was a bank charge I would expect it to show up on my statement, not the affect the credit value

agree, the bank would have a seperate charge at the end of the Quarter with all your other banking fees and charges, must be a new charge by the networks or the particular company that does the online top-ups.