Drugs talk

P. Breathnach

koth wrote: »

.... I can't think of many topics that are "adult themes/topics" that wouldn't also be relevant to teens.

What about the enjoyment of using illegal substances? Y'know, the subject-matter of this thread.

Insect Overlord

As if any teenager is going to read a post on the Internet and suddenly realise "Wow, this is why people take drugs! Because they enjoy them! It all makes sense to me now!"

P. Breathnach

P. Breathnach wrote: »

What about the enjoyment of using illegal substances? Y'know, the subject-matter of this thread.

I think the point koth is making, is that one subject should not mean the privatisation of one of the busiest forums on boards.

Delirium

P. Breathnach wrote: »

What about the enjoyment of using illegal substances? Y'know, the subject-matter of this thread.

That would be included also. I would think it a good thing for them to read an adult discussion on the topic.

EDIT: whoops has clarified what my post was attempting to convey.

MadsL

Insect Overlord wrote: »

It could do with some more new blood now, once you keep it appropriate.

The spelling!!!

The goggles do nothing!

Czarcasm

MadsL wrote: »

Well, if the issue here is "won't someone think of the children" why don't we think of the children and make AH over 18, that way we don't have to hold back on adult themes or topics.

Perhaps a sub forum could be AH Jr?

No need to police it, just a very clear warning that AH is 18 rated. A ban for anyone who is discovered as underage? Since most posters sign up with their actual age that is a matter of record...a hamster script could remove access without too much difficulty I would have thought...

All fairness Mads Boards is already "thinking of the children" as you put it by designating Boards a PG-13 site. There's really only so much responsibility Boards has towards it's users and those who have chosen to not implement some form of web filtering protocol on their internet connected devices. Dev and Dav can hardly go handholding and schooling parents on how to parent their children (There's an idea I'd pay for the SSF, facetime with Dev and Dav ).

Having said all that, I really don't thing age restrictions are the issue here, I think anyone claiming that thread is informative about drugs, well, stop that! AH is full of comedy gold already, but trying to pass that thread off as informative or educational about drug use or misuse is just... well, I'll have some of whatever they're having!

In the end the responsibility for what anyone under the age of 13 reads on Boards is the responsibility of their parent or guardian. Anyone over the age of 13 that reads that thread would be expected to use their judgement to determine the value of the thread to them.


As an aside, but somewhat related-

In the Netherlands, it is actually illegal for a person under the age of 16 to sign up to a social networking site; there's no such restriction in Ireland.

MadsL

koth wrote: »

That would be included also. I would think it a good thing for them to read an adult discussion on the topic.

Wait. Are we still discussing AH? :pac:

Dades

P. Breathnach wrote: »

What about the enjoyment of using illegal substances? Y'know, the subject-matter of this thread.

10 print "Hello!"
20 goto 10

dr.bollocko

If somebody was to say "Try E once and you will die" should that be censored too?

Do we want to insulate the world from the possibility that taking illegal narcotics might be a positive experience for some people? Would that not stunt the discussion or narrow their world view to remove some level of indication of a positive experience?

kneemos

dr.bollocko wrote: »

If somebody was to say "Try E once and you will die" should that be censored too?

Do we want to insulate the world from the possibility that taking illegal narcotics might be a positive experience for some people? Would that not stunt the discussion or narrow their world view to remove some level of indication of a positive experience?

You don't want to portray drugs as a positive experience to children surly.

MadsL

kneemos wrote: »

You don't want to portray drugs as a positive experience to children surly.

Errr....

Which drugs are we talking about?

danniemcq

It doesn't say how to take them,
It doesn't say where to get them,
It doesn't say how to make them,

I can't see an issue with it personally. I can't see a 13 year old reading the post and making their mind up there and then that this is what they plan to do that night. As mentioned before saying you had a great night after getting hammered isn't gonna make a 13 year old go drinking.

I hope that most 13 year olds don't do everything they are recommended online, otherwise an awful lot of computers would have system32 deleted

NegativeCreep

kneemos wrote: »

You don't want to portray drugs as a positive experience to children surly.

So it's better to fill their heads with horror stories and lies about how awful they are all the time?

Yeah 'cause that seems to be working...

kneemos

NegativeCreep wrote: »

So it's better to fill their heads with horror stories and lies about how awful they are all the time?

Yeah 'cause that seems to be working...

Wouldn't go saying they're great.

NegativeCreep

kneemos wrote: »

Wouldn't go saying they're great.

No one said they're great. They can be though, a lot of the time. Lying to kids about drugs doesn't keep them away from them. Most of the time they can see through the lies anyway and that makes them want to try it for themselves. It's best to provide information on being safe when if they do decide to take them. That's why censorship of such information on the internet is a bad idea. Look at Erowid for an example. I'd say that site has saved many a life in its time.

MadsL

kneemos wrote: »

Wouldn't go saying they're great.

Caffeine is fantastic not great!

Again which ones are we talking about.

kneemos

MadsL wrote: »

Caffeine is fantastic not great!

Again which ones are we talking about.

The illegal ones.Don't start that shoite about alcohol and tobacco.

Esel

kneemos wrote: »

Don't start that shoite about alcohol and tobacco.

The buzz from the carbon monoxide hit from the first cig of the day is great! Do it, kids - you know you want to.

Czarcasm

kneemos wrote: »

You don't want to portray drugs as a positive experience to children surly.

kneemos I don't think you're giving children enough credit tbh. There's far worse they could be reading than Boards about drug use. Individuals posting about their own experiences of drugs, whether they've been positive or negative, the general tone of the thread is not one advocating the use of drugs or recommending that children get familiar with their local unregulated illegal drug distributor.

Amirani

kneemos wrote: »

The illegal ones.Don't start that shoite about alcohol and tobacco.

What ****e? Alcohol and tobacco usage is illegal for under 18s. If you're taking the "protect the kids" approach, surely discussion of these drugs is just as deserving of a ban?

kneemos

Czarcasm wrote: »

kneemos I don't think you're giving children enough credit tbh. There's far worse they could be reading than Boards about drug use. Individuals posting about their own experiences of drugs, whether they've been positive or negative, the general tone of the thread is not one advocating the use of drugs or recommending that children get familiar with their local unregulated illegal drug distributor.

I think you're giving them too much credit.When did kids get reasonable and use good judgement?
The very essence of being a kid means they need to be told what to do and what not to do.Giving a kid information and telling to make up their own mind is barmy and frankly negligent.

MadsL

kneemos wrote: »

The illegal ones.Don't start that shoite about alcohol and tobacco.

My point as is so transparent, is that the legality of a drug is in no way linked to the level of harm inflicted on the user.

If we take legality as an indicator of harm and try to use that as a basis for educating children, that's a really messed up thought process. Hey kids illegal drugs are bad, OK. Legal ones are alright though.

MadsL

kneemos wrote: »

I think you're giving them too much credit.When did kids get reasonable and use good judgement?
The very essence of being a kid means they need to be told what to do and what not to do.Giving a kid information and telling to make up their own mind is barmy and frankly negligent.

So I should still be telling my 16 year what to eat?

Tell me, and I usually hate this question, so forgive me, are you a parent?

The essence of parenting is giving your children information so they can use that to make (hopefully) good choices. And being supportive, but firmly pointing out where they when wrong, when they make bad ones.

I trust my 16 year old to make good choices now, otherwise why would I even let her out of the house?

hullaballoo

kneemos wrote: »

I think you're giving them too much credit.When did kids get reasonable and use good judgement?
The very essence of being a kid means they need to be told what to do and what not to do.Giving a kid information and telling to make up their own mind is barmy and frankly negligent.

It's up to their parents to tell them what to do, not the Internet.

Czarcasm's alluded to the point, but the reality is that reading boards.ie is one of the least harmful things a child can do with access to the Internet. I'd bet that most of the teenagers here are here because they have enough sense not to get caught up in the more dangerous sites.

Czarcasm

kneemos wrote: »

I think you're giving them too much credit.When did kids get reasonable and use good judgement?
The very essence of being a kid means they need to be told what to do and what not to do. Giving a kid information and telling to make up their own mind is barmy and frankly negligent.

I agree with you that children need to be guided, but I wouldn't consider anything I read in that thread information. It's opinion. There's a woeful difference.

When you were a child and you watched tv and the presenter said "Don't try this at home kids!", what's the first thought that entered your head? If you take the mystery out of something, it takes all the curiosity out of it too.

There's an awful lot of media scaremongering about "the internet" and children at the moment, so much so that in the UK they're forcing ISP's to set web filtering software in place, that an adult will have to call their ISP to have the filter removed on their account. This kind of dependency on automatic censorship is the worst kind of irresponsibility. It'll mean people will assume their children are now safe online and they'll take their eye off the ball. Children are becoming incredibly technically resourceful, and if they themselves don't know how to set up VPN, TOR, etc, guaranteed they know someone who does!

I understand where your concerns are coming from- should Boards be accommodating discussions about drugs and other illegal activity? Put it this way-

I often don't agree with a lot of what's said on Boards, but stifling discussion around social issues means that you'll also stifle those who would like to see the facts represented in a discussion. What do you think children are going to want to do then, Being naturally curious about the world around them as they are and all?

I would consider most reading on Boards as opinion rather than fact, and the important thing is to teach your child the difference, teach them to think for themselves and analyse opinion, don't just listen to the first thing they hear or the first thing they see (admittedly that's come back to bite me in the ass more times with my own child, but I'd rather he knows he can disagree with me and discuss issues than be holed up in his bedroom looking up answers on the internet on his own!).

My name is URL

Is it still against the rules to talk about trepanation? :pac:

Esel

My name is URL wrote: »

Is it still against the rules to talk about trepanation? :pac:

We need that like a hole in the head, tbh.

minidazzler

dr.bollocko wrote: »

If somebody was to say "Try E once and you will die" should that be censored too?

Funny, that's exactly what the Garda said when he called to our school in 6th class

Nodin

MadsL wrote: »

My point as is so transparent, is that the legality of a drug is in no way linked to the level of harm inflicted on the user.

If we take legality as an indicator of harm and try to use that as a basis for educating children, that's a really messed up thought process. Hey kids illegal drugs are bad, OK. Legal ones are alright though.

Indeed. The "official" stance on drugs is essentially untrue, and gives various substances classifications on other criteria than harm caused, possibility of addiction etc. Teenagers see this for themselves, thus undermining any information that comes from 'official' sources.