Rory McIlroy - 4 Time Major Winner

Jawgap

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

Sorry there is a lot of speculation in that - ok it is a golf forum so it is a speculation game. None of us know.

Phil Mickelson has a very high swing speed and when a little younger actually faster than Rory at times.

Fred Couples has had savage injury issues.

Yes has to be expected that the wear and tear on the modern pro is unreal.

No matter how you shine it up, protein drink it up or personal trainer it - much gym work is additional wear and tear.

But - I wouldn't accept that going to the gym is the route to swing speed.

I think people go a bit crazy when the idea of gym is questioned. We have seen Rory do some very heavy gym work. It is new - and I'd be a little weary of any certainties about it by anyone.

I'd keep an open mind both ways. Many golfers have swung the club hard and fast for long times without that type of work.

Rory is injured a lot for such a young person.

He won two majors as a chubby little kid. People applying certainty to his golf based on his current lifestyle , don't have the stats or facts to back that up (IMO).

Fair play to Rory - he want more to life than golf. Is the gym work about his golf at all - or something else. We don't know.

No, not really - if it was then the attrition rate in sports like rugby (and especially baseball) would be exponentially higher.

I'd say much of what Rory (and the other pros who make use of the gym) does is "pre-hab" type exercises - they strength workouts would be few and far enough between (just enough for the Nike ads ) - and there'd be serious focus on strengthening and stabilising the various muscle groups a golfer relies on and preserving his flexibility. Also, the gym work isn't intended to help out in the short term, it's to make sure he's still playing at the top, more often and for longer.

There's plenty of sports science studies that show how carefully crafted gym sessions, focusing on pre-hab type exercises can extended careers

If anything, the extended range sessions checking out new gear after the departure of Nike probably did the damage, and the recent bout is a recurrence of that - but what do I know, I haven't seen his MRIs and even if I did I wouldn't know what to look for

valoren

Appearances are not deceiving here in terms of physique.
If you're a golfer and you look like an NFL running back, then it could be due to your workouts being akin to that of an NFL running back than that of a golfer.

I think back to an interview with Monty earlier in the year. He talked about how while he himself is no physical specimen he and other pro's always felt that the foundation for a golfer is their legs, that they all focused on making their legs as strong as possible them being the source of power. They never worked on their upper bodies as this would inhibit turning. When Tiger came on the scene, Monty thought he had the ideal physique for golf. Lean, strong, like an elastic whip through the ball. That coupled with his mental strength and finesse made him unbeatable in the late 90's early 00's.

Then he got into fitness in a big way. Wanted to get better. Ate better, lifted. Compound movements. Because he was so dominant, and looking at what he was doing (rightly or wrongly), wanting to keep up, other's followed suit. We know the problems Wood's had since and the debilitating injuries he's had.

FixdePitchmark

Jawgap wrote: »

No, not really - if it was then the attrition rate in sports like rugby (and especially baseball) would be exponentially higher.

And this is where I get concerned - when stuff like Rugby and other high intensity physical sports are brought into it,

This is an interesting article.

http://www.the42.ie/hip-injuries-gaa-patrick-carton-3068419-Nov2016/

The reason I attach above is to show that a dramatic change in approach takes a while to find out impact.

The first golfer we seen bring the game to another level in physique was Tiger Woods - and that has ended with him retired at - nearly under 40.

By the way - I'm not sure how there could be good data on golf - because extreme gym work is a new aspect. Yes someone should do a paper on Tiger.

Golf up to now is a sport that you could be at the top level for 30 years.

Luke Donald was world number 1 fairly recently
Lee Westwood
Darren Clarke was best player in the world for a while.

I'm just making the case that golf is a precision sport - 70 % of the shots require little or no effort - just accuracy.

Now - I'm sure Rory knows what he is doing.

But If he is spending say 15 hours a week at the gym -

I'm open ears to someone saying - would he be better off practising his short game and putting for that time.

And, I'm not just winding people up there. I'm serious.

This talk of it worth 30 yards to him - I just don't accept.

Shane Lowry had an average drive last year of 298 yards , If I was to take a serious bet on who will be playing a good level of golf or golf at all at 45 - I'd bet Shane.

FixdePitchmark

valoren wrote: »

Appearances are not deceiving here in terms of physique.
If you're a golfer and you look like an NFL running back, then it could be due to your workouts being akin to that of an NFL running back than that of a golfer.

I think back to an interview with Monty earlier in the year. He talked about how while he himself is no physical specimen he and other pro's always felt that the foundation for a golfer is their legs, that they all focused on making their legs as strong as possible them being the source of power. They never worked on their upper bodies as this would inhibit turning. When Tiger came on the scene, Monty thought he had the ideal physique for golf. Lean, strong, like an elastic whip through the ball. That coupled with his mental strength and finesse made him unbeatable in the late 90's early 00's.

Then he got into fitness in a big way. Wanted to get better. Ate better, lifted. Compound movements. Because he was so dominant, and looking at what he was doing (rightly or wrongly), wanting to keep up, other's followed suit. We know the problems Wood's had since and the debilitating injuries he's had.

And this hits the nail on the head for me.

ligerdub

valoren wrote: »

Appearances are not deceiving here in terms of physique.
If you're a golfer and you look like an NFL running back, then it could be due to your workouts being akin to that of an NFL running back than that of a golfer.

I think back to an interview with Monty earlier in the year. He talked about how while he himself is no physical specimen he and other pro's always felt that the foundation for a golfer is their legs, that they all focused on making their legs as strong as possible them being the source of power. They never worked on their upper bodies as this would inhibit turning. When Tiger came on the scene, Monty thought he had the ideal physique for golf. Lean, strong, like an elastic whip through the ball. That coupled with his mental strength and finesse made him unbeatable in the late 90's early 00's.

Then he got into fitness in a big way. Wanted to get better. Ate better, lifted. Compound movements. Because he was so dominant, and looking at what he was doing (rightly or wrongly), wanting to keep up, other's followed suit. We know the problems Wood's had since and the debilitating injuries he's had.

Interesting points but I have to disagree.

It's a revisionist view to say that Woods suffered a shortened career due to his weights/strength regime. I recall back around the time he won the Masters in '97 (vividly) that Woods would be struggling to even walk by the time he's 40 given the pressure his swing was putting on his knees and other areas. This was before any of his fitness regimes were a part of his identity and approach, the comments were about his swing, full stop. This wasn't by anybody either, it was by high profile coaches.

Also, what is the explanation for the back injuries and the impact this has had on the careers of two former world number 1's, namely Fred Couples and Seve Ballesteros, neither renowned for being fitness freaks? Some golfers will get back injuries, it happens. You can't just pinpoint two cases and then try and link these to back a commonality, but ignoring all the other cases that don't suit this narrative.

http://ftw.usatoday.com/2016/04/golfers-keep-getting-injured-and-theyre-not-sure-what-to-do-about-it

Physical strength is the foundation to fitness, and more importantly, good posture. People just hate the idea of golfers being into strength and fitness. They associate it with body building and the likes, but the realities are far removed from this.

Jawgap

ligerdub wrote: »

Interesting points but I have to disagree.

It's a revisionist view to say that Woods suffered a shortened career due to his weights/strength regime. I recall back around the time he won the Masters in '97 (vividly) that Woods would be struggling to even walk by the time he's 40 given the pressure his swing was putting on his knees and other areas. This was before any of his fitness regimes were a part of his identity and approach, the comments were about his swing, full stop. This wasn't by anybody either, it was by high profile coaches.

Also, what is the explanation for the back injuries and the impact this has had on the careers of two former world number 1's, namely Fred Couples and Seve Ballesteros, neither renowned for being fitness freaks? Some golfers will get back injuries, it happens. You can't just pinpoint two cases and then try and link these to back a commonality, but ignoring all the other cases that don't suit this narrative.

http://ftw.usatoday.com/2016/04/golfers-keep-getting-injured-and-theyre-not-sure-what-to-do-about-it

Physical strength is the foundation to fitness, and more importantly, good posture. People just hate the idea of golfers being into strength and fitness. They associate it with body building and the likes, but the realities are far removed from this.

Yeah, if you look at Woods' issues, they began with his knees (bursitis and a busted ACL) - he also seems have had a succession of MCL issues. As someone who's struggled with knee issues following re-constructive surgery I know from endless physio sessions how you have to focus on not compensating for a lack of confidence in the knee joint or it leads to posture issues which leads to back issues particularly if you're compensating asymmetrically.

Jawgap

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

And this is where I get concerned - when stuff like Rugby and other high intensity physical sports are brought into it,

This is an interesting article.

http://www.the42.ie/hip-injuries-gaa-patrick-carton-3068419-Nov2016/

The reason I attach above is to show that a dramatic change in approach takes a while to find out impact.

The first golfer we seen bring the game to another level in physique was Tiger Woods - and that has ended with him retired at - nearly under 40.

By the way - I'm not sure how there could be good data on golf - because extreme gym work is a new aspect. Yes someone should do a paper on Tiger.

Golf up to now is a sport that you could be at the top level for 30 years.

Luke Donald was world number 1 fairly recently
Lee Westwood
Darren Clarke was best player in the world for a while.

I'm just making the case that golf is a precision sport - 70 % of the shots require little or no effort - just accuracy.

Now - I'm sure Rory knows what he is doing.

But If he is spending say 15 hours a week at the gym -

I'm open ears to someone saying - would he be better off practising his short game and putting for that time.

And, I'm not just winding people up there. I'm serious.

This talk of it worth 30 yards to him - I just don't accept.

Shane Lowry had an average drive last year of 298 yards , If I was to take a serious bet on who will be playing a good level of golf or golf at all at 45 - I'd bet Shane.

Actually, the hip, knee and ankle injury "epidemic" in GAA was predicted over a decade ago, based on a similar trend that evolved in rugby during the transition to professionalism. GAA teams starting following similar training regimens......leading to over-development of upper bodies relative to lower bodies, and Newton guaranteed injuries once players started twisting, turning, stopping and starting, and momentum led to joint over-stress. As in rugby the problem was corrected through controlled athletic development, and pre-habbing.

Also, you don't need empirical data on golf to advise a golfer. The science of sports mechanics is well understood, a good sports scientist with a good strength and conditioning coach could quickly develop a decent training programme, and I'd say the top pros have access to those resources, if they want them

.....and yeah, I'll defo take the bet that Lowry will still be playing at a decent level at 45........because Robbie Cannon is his strength and conditioning coach, and a member at our place

EDIT: Robbie's take on Rory's strength training "How strength training has helped Rory McIlroy"

ForeRight

Dustin Johnson does the exact same type of training as Rory. Functional movements and compound movements.
With professional personal trainers who are experts no less! I'm sure they no better than anyone on here what they should and shouldn't be doing.

DJ is lifting collosal weight compared to Rory yet I never hear anyone giving out about him?

luvthegame

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

Rory is injured a lot for such a young person.

Outside of the three self inflicted injuries [rib twice and ankle in 2015] I dont really recall any other ones? I think the rib is clearly a response to club testing. It makes sense and its what he has put out there.

ligerdub

luvthegame wrote: »

Outside of the three self inflicted injuries [rib twice and ankle in 2015] I dont really recall any other ones? I think the rib is clearly a response to club testing. It makes sense and its what he has put out there.

Yes, he has been unlucky in that regard, not much he could have done about those.

HighLine

Rory out of the Memorial now too? Season not looking good for him.

https://www.irishgolfdesk.com/news-files/2017/5/27/mcilroy-out-of-memorial-focussing-on-getting-back-to-full-health-for-us-open

red ears

HighLine wrote: »

Rory out of the Memorial now too? Season not looking good for him.

https://www.irishgolfdesk.com/news-files/2017/5/27/mcilroy-out-of-memorial-focussing-on-getting-back-to-full-health-for-us-open

He is playing so little golf I don't know how he thinks that will help him win the US open.

rooney30

Previous quote "Darren Clarke was the best player in the world for a while"

Still chuckling to myself at this

CMOTDibbler

Rory has confirmed that he'll be back for the US Open. Apparently been working on his game at Quinta do Lago. Iirc, he did the same when he was coming back from his ankle injury.

ForeRight

Matsuyama playing the irish open now too.

Well done Rory

valoren

ForeRight wrote: »

Matsuyama playing the irish open now too.

Well done Rory

That's....*long pause*....great.
:pac:

FixdePitchmark

ForeRight wrote: »

Matsuyama playing the irish open now too.

Well done Rory

Fair play Rory

Wouldn't be the same if you didn't have a Japanese lad with a caddy holding up everyone on a top links, mid summer.

Armchair Andy

FixdePitchmark wrote:

mid summer.

They're in for some land when they're in the full wets and the scorecard in tatters in the arse pocket.

Make the cut? **** this get netjets.

FixdePitchmark

Armchair Andy wrote: »

They're in for some land when they're in the full wets and the scorecard in tatters in the arse pocket.

Make the cut? **** this get netjets.

In fairness - they are due a good week of weather - law of averages and all that.

PokeHerKing

FixdePitchmark wrote:

In fairness - they are due a good week of weather - law of averages and all that.

We're in for a good summer this year.

FixdePitchmark

PokeHerKing wrote: »

We're in for a good summer this year.

Someone said that to me last week. Genuinely has been terrible since.

PokeHerKing

FixdePitchmark wrote:

Someone said that to me last week. Genuinely has been terrible since.

Starts this Wednesday.

Maybe..

FixdePitchmark

Where would we be without Rory . Giving out about Shane not in gym and clinging onto paddy .

benny79

FixdePitchmark wrote: »

Where would we be without Rory . Giving out about Shane not in gym and clinging onto paddy .

Yeah you cant beat a bit of Irish begrudgery! What Rory has done for the Irish Open is outstanding IMO.. and to all the Irish lads in fairness obviously mainly him..

Keano

Rory will be using the Talyormade Spider at the US Open

HighLine

Keano wrote: »

Rory will be using the Talyormade Spider at the US Open

Big change... hope it goes well!

Seve OB

Hitting it well apparently and seems to like the course

benny79

I think he hasn't played enough to be in the mix! but you never know..

Henry Ford III

Seve OB wrote:

Hitting it well apparently and seems to like the course

Shot 78.

Rikand

He's just not *Match fit*