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Dun Laoghaire Traffic & Commuting Chat

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    #1682
    JayRoc
    Registered Users Posts: 1,612 ✭✭✭JayRoc


    Cyrus wrote: »
    Look on MyHome and pick out the 1m mansions in south county Dublin

    Either they don’t exist or our definition of mansion doesn’t correlate .

    It's worth 1million= it's a mansion.


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    #1683
    Springy Turf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 173 ✭✭Springy Turf


    JayRoc wrote: »
    It's worth 1million= it's a mansion.

    Nope. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mansion


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    #1684
    Cyrus
    Registered Users Posts: 20,059 ✭✭✭✭Cyrus


    JayRoc wrote: »
    It's worth 1million= it's a mansion.

    Well that’s just silly


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    #1685
    Living Off The Splash
    Registered Users Posts: 2,123 ✭✭✭Living Off The Splash


    JayRoc wrote: »
    TL/DR: Fella lives in a 1million Euro gaff wants us to feel sorry he has to dip into the "savings" to pay his 2-grand property tax ��

    I purchased my house in the early 1990's. It was not worth anywhere near a million then.

    I am not asking anyone to feel sorry for me.


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    #1686
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,995 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Living Off The Splash wrote: »
    If it was based on the 2013 value then my tax demand would not have changed. As I have received a new increased tax demand this week it would appear that they are taking the 2020 value of my house to assess my tax. Or maybe they are not, but just returning to the greasy till, in the middle of a pandemic to increase their coffers.
    The increase (which is actually a reduction of a previous decrease) is precisely nothing to do with cycle lanes. You're barking up the wrong tree.
    Cyrus wrote: »
    Women are scared , great to have strong men like you to show them how, it’s like the 1950s in here !
    You brought up the gender issue yourself, not me.
    https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/health-family/fitness/why-are-so-few-teenage-girls-cycling-to-school-1.4043983
    Cyrus wrote: »
    There are plenty of small 1m properties around , of course it depends on what your definition of large and small is but suggesting someone gets a lodger without understanding who is in the house and how big it is just silly .

    I can only imagine how hard it must be to find a little bit of space in these (checks notes) 'small' €1m properties in the DLR area.

    https://www.myhome.ie/residential/dublin/property-for-sale-in-dublin-south-county?minprice=1000000
    Cyrus wrote: »
    And the roads are bad, I was only dalkey avenue and Killiney hill road today both littered with pot holes, given the value of the houses along those roads and the property and income and every other kind of tax they pay those roads should be better.
    Gotta love the level of entitlement shown here, that the roads in the 'nice areas' should get the best maintenance, not the roads that actually need it most.


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    #1687
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,995 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Living Off The Splash wrote: »
    No. As a motorist of 50 years I have paid lots of taxes associated with motoring.

    As a cyclist I think that you should start contributing as well.

    Watch the whinging when that happens.

    You've paid nothing near the true cost of motoring, which is largely paid by society as a whole, including those who don't drive.

    https://www.forbes.com/sites/carltonreid/2019/01/24/motorists-should-pay-full-costs-of-road-pollution-deaths-and-damage-says-eu-transport-commissioner/?sh=4318376c2c0b

    Take a quick look at what's happening in smarter countries, where cyclists are being incentivised, subsidised and in some cases, actually being paid to cycle, given the substantial benefits that arise for society as a whole - environmental benefits, traffic reduction benefits, public health benefits.

    As another poster advised you, read the room.


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    #1688
    ted1
    Registered Users Posts: 23,524 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    Living Off The Splash wrote: »
    If it was based on the 2013 value then my tax demand would not have changed. As I have received a new increased tax demand this week it would appear that they are taking the 2020 value of my house to assess my tax. Or maybe they are not, but just returning to the greasy till, in the middle of a pandemic to increase their coffers.

    Your tax demand changed as they removed the 15% discount they were offering for the past few years. You should check to ensure it’s off the 2013 value.


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    #1689
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,995 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Awaaf wrote: »
    A property tax should be there to raise revenue but also to encourage sensible and efficient use of valuable housing assets. In raising revenue it has a lot of advantages as a tax as it hits those who own a lot of property who may be able to avoid other taxes. As regards efficient use of property it discourages sitting on property and encourages those who struggle to pay to downsize and let families occupy larger houses.

    The problem in my view is that this is a stick only approach and many of these people are elderly and struggle to respond effectively to this measure. I feel what is needed is an agency which is focused on aiding elderly people who are asset rich and cash poor to downsize i.e. managing the whole process of offering them viable alternatives until they are happy to sign up and move on.

    In fact this agencies remit could be expanded to encourage whole streets with development potential for large scale housing schemes near public transport to be freed up through generous incentives.

    These people generally got enough incentives. The State subsidised property ownership for years, through mortgage interest tax relief, again at the expense of society at large.

    Do we really have to 'incentivise' the people with the best balance sheets again?


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    #1690
    Cyrus
    Registered Users Posts: 20,059 ✭✭✭✭Cyrus


    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    The increase (which is actually a reduction of a previous decrease) is precisely nothing to do with cycle lanes. You're barking up the wrong tree.


    You brought up the gender issue yourself, not me.
    https://www.irishtimes.com/life-and-style/health-family/fitness/why-are-so-few-teenage-girls-cycling-to-school-1.4043983



    I can only imagine how hard it must be to find a little bit of space in these (checks notes) 'small' €1m properties in the DLR area.

    https://www.myhome.ie/residential/dublin/property-for-sale-in-dublin-south-county?minprice=1000000


    Gotta love the level of entitlement shown here, that the roads in the 'nice areas' should get the best maintenance, not the roads that actually need it most.

    Ah you missed my little joke the cycling bros are you and ted like the super Mario bros only pedal powered , not the collective of middle aged men in Lycra who need a reason to avoid their family on a Sunday. And you have mentioned about women being scared to cycle before so its not the first time.

    The first house that shows in your search is a mighty 122 sq/m , great let’s run a B and B from it .

    And sense of entitlement? Maybe but is it too much to ask that the people who pay the highest property taxes and most likely the most in other taxes as well have a road that isn’t littered with pot holes ? It would also be safer for our blessed cyclists too and given the speed they travel down dalkey avenue that can only be a good thing right ?


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    #1691
    Springy Turf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 173 ✭✭Springy Turf


    Living Off The Splash wrote: »
    No. As a motorist of 50 years I have paid lots of taxes associated with motoring.

    As a cyclist I think that you should start contributing as well.

    Watch the whinging when that happens.

    What you need to realise is that disincentivizing cycling through taxation would be a huge net negative on society.


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    #1692
    JayRoc
    Registered Users Posts: 1,612 ✭✭✭JayRoc


    Cyrus wrote: »

    And sense of entitlement? Maybe but is it too much to ask that the people who pay the highest property taxes and most likely the most in other taxes as well have a road that isn’t littered with pot holes ? ?

    Ok. Dunno where anyone got a sense of entitlement from


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    #1693
    Cyrus
    Registered Users Posts: 20,059 ✭✭✭✭Cyrus


    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    These people generally got enough incentives. The State subsidised property ownership for years, through mortgage interest tax relief, again at the expense of society at large.

    Do we really have to 'incentivise' the people with the best balance sheets again?

    Incentives for home ownership are at the expense of society at large ? Who exactly is society at large then? You need to be unable to buy a house to be considered? I’d argue there is also plenty of incentives for that cohort too.


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    #1694
    Springy Turf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 173 ✭✭Springy Turf


    Cyrus wrote: »
    Ah you missed my little joke the cycling bros are you and ted like the super Mario bros only pedal powered , not the collective of middle aged men in Lycra who need a reason to avoid their family on a Sunday. And you have mentioned about women being scared to cycle before so its not the first time.

    The first house that shows in your search is a mighty 122 sq/m , great let’s run a B and B from it .

    And sense of entitlement? Maybe but is it too much to ask that the people who pay the highest property taxes and most likely the most in other taxes as well have a road that isn’t littered with pot holes ? It would also be safer for our blessed cyclists too and given the speed they travel down dalkey avenue that can only be a good thing right ?

    I also live in DLR and I have to say in general I am pretty happy with how our public space is maintained.


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    #1695
    ted1
    Registered Users Posts: 23,524 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    Cyrus wrote: »

    And sense of entitlement? Maybe but is it too much to ask that the people who pay the highest property taxes and most likely the most in other taxes as well have a road that isn’t littered with pot holes ? It would also be safer for our blessed cyclists too and given the speed they travel down dalkey avenue that can only be a good thing right ?

    Doesn’t quite work that way. Take a big house in Dalkey. Paying say 2-3k property tax, now knock it down and build 100 apartments all who will pay less than the original house but collectively pay more. So it translates to higher density cheaper house pay more than larger houses.


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    #1696
    Living Off The Splash
    Registered Users Posts: 2,123 ✭✭✭Living Off The Splash


    ted1 wrote: »
    If he had financial issues and was struggling to pay his LPT the sensible thing would be to downsize.

    No. I don't have financial issues. But I don't see why I should have to pay more tax on top of an already high amount just because my local county council demands it.

    Nor am I certain that the sensible thing to do is to downsize. Many older people have lived in their homes for a long time. They like where they live, they like their neighbours. They are familiar with their local shops, transport etc.

    I just do not understand why people think that they should move aside for some one else.

    Many are empty nesters but their houses are often full of grand children at weekends and during holiday time, staying over (as in my case).

    The easy answer is suggest to them to downsize. It is trotted out on a regular basis. I wonder if everyone giving this advice will do the same when it comes to them.

    Dun Laoghaire Rathdown are looking for more property tax. Why?

    What do they need the money for? They probably gather the most Property Tax compared to anywhere else in the country.


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    #1697
    Cyrus
    Registered Users Posts: 20,059 ✭✭✭✭Cyrus


    Springy Turf wrote: »
    I also live in DLR and I have to say in general I am pretty happy with how our public space is maintained.

    Generally I am too

    Specifically with regard to the roads mentioned I am not .


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    #1698
    Cyrus
    Registered Users Posts: 20,059 ✭✭✭✭Cyrus


    ted1 wrote: »
    Doesn’t quite work that way. Take a big house in Dalkey. Paying say 2-3k property tax, now knock it down and build 100 apartments all who will pay less than the original house but collectively pay more. So it translates to higher density cheaper house pay more than larger houses.

    Dlr takes in the highest amount of lpt in the country, the roads should be better.


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    #1699
    Living Off The Splash
    Registered Users Posts: 2,123 ✭✭✭Living Off The Splash


    ted1 wrote: »
    Like a proportional charge.
    Bike+rider =80kg
    Car+driver =1500kg

    Bike takes up about 6 Sq feet
    Car takes up about 90 sq feet

    Braking and torque pressure transfer from wheels to road is vastly difference.

    Road space giving to cyclists = minimal
    Raif space giving to cars in the council area = several thousand

    What about a footpath tax, should we charge pedestrians?

    I could go. Bit other than begrudgary can you tell me why you think there should be one.

    So do you think that cyclists should pay a tax to use the roads?


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    #1700
    Living Off The Splash
    Registered Users Posts: 2,123 ✭✭✭Living Off The Splash


    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    You've paid nothing near the true cost of motoring, which is largely paid by society as a whole, including those who don't drive.

    ...and don't forget poor Ted who has to leave his car in his driveway and cycle to work. I can understand that he has to do this due to the high cost of parking in the city centre areas.....very unfair. I hope his wife at least gets to use it.....


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    #1701
    MonkstownHoop
    Registered Users Posts: 3,196 ✭✭✭MonkstownHoop


    Think I'll unfollow this thread until this crap is over


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    #1702
    haskellgeek
    Registered Users Posts: 98 ✭✭haskellgeek


    The problem for you is that it's an emissions based system post 2008 vehicles, so all bicyces fall into the 0 emissions category so 120 a year. Average weight of a car is 1.4 tones. Average weight of a bike is circa 10kgs. So who excatly do I pay my 85c to for yearly cycling?


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    #1703
    ted1
    Registered Users Posts: 23,524 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    Living Off The Splash wrote: »
    So do you think that cyclists should pay a tax to use the roads?

    They do, through general taxation. Same way as pedestrians pay. It’s the free loaders on buses that don’t pay anything and get subsidied journeys.

    But propositional i have no problem paying a euro a year.


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    #1704
    ted1
    Registered Users Posts: 23,524 ✭✭✭✭ted1


    Living Off The Splash wrote: »
    ...and don't forget poor Ted who has to leave his car in his driveway and cycle to work. I can understand that he has to do this due to the high cost of parking in the city centre areas.....very unfair. I hope his wife at least gets to use it.....

    My wife had her own car , so I pay the motor tax on two cars. I have a parking space at the office but prefer the 60km Roundtrip to the airport daily as it saves me much more time.
    1hr 5 each way. Faster than Driving most days. And means I don’t have to spend 90 minutes in the gym.


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    #1705
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,995 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Cyrus wrote: »
    Incentives for home ownership are at the expense of society at large ? Who exactly is society at large then? You need to be unable to buy a house to be considered? I’d argue there is also plenty of incentives for that cohort too.


    Society at large is the rest of the folks who don't get to own a home, but for years, subsidised those who did get to enjoy home ownership.

    Living Off The Splash wrote: »
    So do you think that cyclists should pay a tax to use the roads?

    So do you think that pedestrians should pay a tax to use the footpaths?


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    #1706
    AndrewJRenko
    Registered Users Posts: 28,995 ✭✭✭✭AndrewJRenko


    Cyrus wrote: »
    Ah you missed my little joke the cycling bros are you and ted like the super Mario bros only pedal powered , not the collective of middle aged men in Lycra who need a reason to avoid their family on a Sunday. And you have mentioned about women being scared to cycle before so its not the first time.
    I mentioned about women being scared to cycle in response to your 'cycling bros' jibe.

    And right on schedule, there comes the misinformed lycra jibe. Any minute now it will be helmets and hi-vis, right?
    Cyrus wrote: »

    The first house that shows in your search is a mighty 122 sq/m , great let’s run a B and B from it .
    The first house is a sponsored link, and not within the €1m search criteria, though again, you won't find too many hearts bleeding for the owners of 122 sq/m properties.


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    #1707
    Cyrus
    Registered Users Posts: 20,059 ✭✭✭✭Cyrus


    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    I mentioned about women being scared to cycle in response to your 'cycling bros' jibe.

    And right on schedule, there comes the misinformed lycra jibe. Any minute now it will be helmets and hi-vis, right?


    The first house is a sponsored link, and not within the €1m search criteria, though again, you won't find too many hearts bleeding for the owners of 122 sq/m properties.

    No I’m sure society at large thinks people with massive houses that size have staff quarters and the rest ....

    What’s the misinformed Lycra jibe , unfortunately for you within your ranks is that very cohort , I include some of my friends in that, too old to play team sports now, they don’t golf but need a reason to get out of the house on weekends off they go to spend a couple of grand on a bike , some white Lycra and tales of their Strava kom exploits .


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    #1708
    Cyrus
    Registered Users Posts: 20,059 ✭✭✭✭Cyrus


    AndrewJRenko wrote: »
    Society at large is the rest of the folks who don't get to own a home, but for years, subsidised those who did get to enjoy home ownership.

    Don’t get to own a home ? There’s only one cohort that get given them for free or a nominal rent, everyone else has to pay for it .

    Who exactly are you speaking for and what’s your solution to their problem ?


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    #1709
    crushproof
    Registered Users Posts: 2,809 ✭✭✭crushproof


    Where the heck are the moderators? This thread goes to the dogs every month.


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    #1710
    wowy
    Registered Users Posts: 709 ✭✭✭wowy


    Larbre34 wrote: »
    The owners of Dun Laoghaire shopping centre have, with HSE intent, applied to convert Level 3 of the building into a primary care centre.

    The 4,100 sq. m plan involves 1,800 sq.m of consulting and treatment space, an 800 sq.m GP suite and the balance, offices for ancillary and support services.

    The potential for increased footfall from staff and service users is fantastic.

    Lets hope it doesn't turn out to be too dull drab and dreary eh.... ��

    Trying to drag this thread back on topic...

    Permission has been granted by DRLCC for this application.

    https://planning.agileapplications.ie/dunlaoghaire/application-details/86082


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    #1711
    bodgerfederer
    Registered Users Posts: 193 ✭✭bodgerfederer


    i dunno - a lot of people won't be happy that this development comes with 52 'new cycle parking spaces'. imagine if the cyclists don't have to pay for parking while the car owners do!

    it's great that the space will be used though, more footfall etc.

    in fairness, prior to this latest lockdown I got the sense that dun laoghaire was doing well, it seemed busy enough. maybe because people were stuck in their locality and maybe because people didn't fancy the indoor alternative of, say, dundrum ?


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