Things looking good in waterford.

Nypd

7upfree wrote: »

Ergo the problem. Will they never learn? For example, a batch of unsold houses was sold in Waterford recently for €65k. The next batch is now on sale for €70k. Nope. They'll never, ever learn.

Shame on anyone for attempting to make a profit or stem their losses

hardybuck

spankmemunkey wrote: »

Whats your angenda by asking such a question? Are we not allowed view good things happening in and around the city and pass comment on it being a good sign rather than people making accusations and focusing on misery? Are we not allowed focus on good things for a change? Are you not sick to the back teeth with all the misery being spouted about? Its time to start focusing on good things no matter how trivial they are and if you wanna sit at your computer blaming political parties and wallowing then be my guest but i for one dont want that anymore.

It's just that it was a line which Fianna Fail kept trotting out to discredit people who cautioned against their foolhardy policies during the boom. If we're to learn from our mistakes, phrases like that need to be banished forever. I will blame them for chronic mismanagement of the economy. Also, far from wallowing, I've been relatively unscathed by the recession.

Our growth is dependent on Eurozone growth. The good news there is that France and Germany are in growth, and therefore the Eurozone is in growth, at least in the latest quarter. Despite that, the European Central bank are desperate to downplay the short to medium outlook, and are determined not to raise interest rates in the next year at least. Domestically, I would say that things have bottomed out or therabouts, but we're still a long way away from any form of stable growth.

Am I sick to the teeth of the misery - absolutely. I don't bother tuning into the likes of Prime Time any more. I'm all for discussion about the positive efforts being made, Waterford is certainly looking more visually appealing. However, if you make undercooked observations on the economy, there is a strong chance I'll call you out on that.

spankmemunkey

hardybuck wrote: »

It's just that it was a line which Fianna Fail kept trotting out to discredit people who cautioned against their foolhardy policies during the boom. If we're to learn from our mistakes, phrases like that need to be banished forever. I will blame them for chronic mismanagement of the economy. Also, far from wallowing, I've been relatively unscathed by the recession.

Our growth is dependent on Eurozone growth. The good news there is that France and Germany are in growth, and therefore the Eurozone is in growth, at least in the latest quarter. Despite that, the European Central bank are desperate to downplay the short to medium outlook, and are determined not to raise interest rates in the next year at least. Domestically, I would say that things have bottomed out or therabouts, but we're still a long way away from any form of stable growth.

Am I sick to the teeth of the misery - absolutely. I don't bother tuning into the likes of Prime Time any more. I'm all for discussion about the positive efforts being made, Waterford is certainly looking more visually appealing. However, if you make undercooked observations on the economy, there is a strong chance I'll call you out on that.

You don't need to tell me or give me a lecture on economics thanks. I know how it works. Its your sudden judgemental view or political view you suddenly take when i say things look nice and its nice to see activity and you start beating me with a political stick okay boo hoo this place is sh.t doesnt it look terrible and nothings happening.

7upfree

Nypd wrote: »

Shame on anyone for attempting to make a profit or stem their losses

No problem with anyone making a profit. But, given the events of recent years you can see where this is heading. Pure, unadulterated greed caused the collapse.

Someone making a profit to earn a living or providing employment? No problem. But greedy people speculating flushed this country down a toilet.

I, and many others, hope we don't go back there.

hardybuck

spankmemunkey wrote: »

You don't need to tell me or give me a lecture on economics thanks. I know how it works.

Fair enough, but with respect, you wouldn't know it from your posts on this thread.

allthedoyles

spankmemunkey

hardybuck wrote: »

Fair enough, but with respect, you wouldn't know it from your posts on this thread.

What? Saying its nice to see things working in waterford again? Nice to see building picking up again? See people in waterford getting jobs? See people who have to sell houses finally get them sold? Have to laugh at disgruntled people taking a swipe and trying to insult people simply cos they don't agree with what they write, do me a favour just start a doom and gloom thread somewhere else and take the idiot with you who doesnt like to join in he just likes to watch.

7upfree

spankmemunkey wrote: »

What? Saying its nice to see things working in waterford again? Nice to see building picking up again? See people in waterford getting jobs? See people who have to sell houses finally get them sold? Have to laugh at disgruntled people taking a swipe and trying to insult people simply cos they don't agree with what they write, do me a favour just start a doom and gloom thread somewhere else and take the idiot with you who doesnt like to join in he just likes to watch.

You've excelled yourself there really.:rolleyes: Reality check: The country is bankrupt. There are some 400,000 people unemployed. We're subservient - effectively - to a foreign power. That subservience has caused a property tax; a "household charge"; water rates to come; a brain drain on the country - and silly people believe the property market "has hit the bottom". And yet idiots try to convince us we're on the up?

Yes, there are some very tiny signs that things may be starting to bottom out. But to dress it up as a "recovery" is incredibly stupid. It's precisely that kind of drivel that is being shoved down our throats weekly by this "socialist" supported Government.

The majority of "disgruntled" people are not gullible enough to believe it. Unlike some.

spankmemunkey

7upfree wrote: »

You've excelled yourself there really.:rolleyes: Reality check: The country is bankrupt. There are some 400,000 people unemployed. We're subservient - effectively - to a foreign power. That subservience has caused a property tax; a "household charge"; water rates to come; a brain drain on the country - and silly people believe the property market "has hit the bottom". And yet idiots try to convince us we're on the up?

Yes, there are some very tiny signs that things may be starting to bottom out. But to dress it up as a "recovery" is incredibly stupid. It's precisely that kind of drivel that is being shoved down our throats weekly by this "socialist" supported Government.

The majority of "disgruntled" people are not gullible enough to believe it. Unlike some.

So as I said is it nice to see some work going on or is it not nice to see some work going on? I think your taking this all far too serious. A lot of jobs announced last week in dublin so I suppose none of that is nice to see,

stefan idiot jones

spankmemunkey wrote: »

So as I said is it nice to see some work going on or is it not nice to see some work going on? I think your taking this all far too serious. A lot of jobs announced last week in dublin so I suppose none of that is nice to see,

Why are you attacking posters who have a different (correct,) opinion on things than yourself ?
Who has mentioned not being happy once concerning any positive news ? No one.
You mentioned about jobs in Dublin, maybe I'm mistaken but I could have sworn that the thread was about Waterford not Dublin ?
The property market has not bottomed out yet in the majority of this country, if you think it has then you are very mistaken.

Please do not take personal swipes at me or other posters. Take it to a mod if you have an issue with a 'debate of difference of opinion'.
Other posters in this forum have the right to take anything as serious as they want to.

nice_very

Is there one of those fancy mis-spelled posters doing the rounds, campaigning for the (soon to be defunct, thanks to fg) CC to reduce their rates to at least try and get business back in the City??? So that there would be more varied local business to support? I cant count the number of vacant units all along the quay and in the centre of the city.


I suppose those bondholders need our money more than anyone else, bless them.

MRnotlob606

some businesses have monopolies in this city, would love to see more competition

7upfree

spankmemunkey wrote: »

I think your taking this all far too serious.

Life, my friend, is a very serious business. Especially for this City, which is under virtual attack and is constantly discriminated against. If certain people like Morgan Kelly had been taken seriously in the past 15 years we wouldn't be where we are now. But I take it you would have dismissed him also?

Have a look at that video of Morgan Kelly at 02:50 in:

OECD: "A soft landing the most likely"

Central Bank: "House Prices are not out of line with market fundamentals:.

Doesn't it say it all really?

spankmemunkey

stefan idiot jones wrote: »

Why are you attacking posters who have a different (correct,) opinion on things than yourself ?
Who has mentioned not being happy once concerning any positive news ? No one.
You mentioned about jobs in Dublin, maybe I'm mistaken but I could have sworn that the thread was about Waterford not Dublin ?
The property market has not bottomed out yet in the majority of this country, if you think it has then you are very mistaken.

Please do not take personal swipes at me or other posters. Take it to a mod if you have an issue with a 'debate of difference of opinion'.
Other posters in this forum have the right to take anything as serious as they want to.

As I said its nice to see building work starting again in the city, people in jobs the old crystal site working again and maybe as another poster said call centre jobs going in there,flood defences being improved, oh yeah and empty houses being sold in one go in meadowbank, I think the first ten went in a few hours, I'm not sure how the next lot went, but thats great news for people trying to sell houses that there are fewer houses on the market not to mention the social aspect of those houses now being occupied instead of anti social behaviour going on, its also nice to see tesco fuel isnt destroying cars and recommended by my local vw garage.

Its all nice to see, nobody said the recession was over or the housing market is now sorted, its nice to see and I for one take a positive from it. As regards jobs in dublin, there will always be a ripple effect when theres positive news in dublin and it has to start somewhere. And why are you accusing me of attacking people, you only like joining in threads to try and ridicule since I disagreed with your libelous conspiracy theories about tesco petrol and you have the cheek to say in talking tripe.

spankmemunkey

7upfree wrote: »

Life, my friend, is a very serious business. Especially for this City, which is under virtual attack and is constantly discriminated against. If certain people like Morgan Kelly had been taken seriously in the past 15 years we wouldn't be where we are now. But I take it you would have dismissed him also?

Have a look at that video of Morgan Kelly at 02:50 in:

OECD: "A soft landing the most likely"

Central Bank: "House Prices are not out of line with market fundamentals:.

Doesn't it say it all really?

Nobody said the housing market is fixed nobody said the recession is over, I'm simply trying to highlight some positives going on in the city instead of the usual and the majority of posters agreed with me if you look at the thumbs up from my initial post bar 3 posters or so they agreed with me.

achiman

The weather

wellboytoo

Whatever was or wasn't said in this thread so far, I have noticed a pick up in business in the last two months.Small builders have 4 months work ahead of them for first time in 6 years, there is definitely an increase in volume, not rates but volume, as regards the house sales anything hitting the market priced to sell is selling fast, because the sale price is below cost of building at the moment. This will have to change if we are to have a stable market.
So expect price increases in houses as the market stabilises , it will have to become cheaper to build than buy for a real market to exist!

spankmemunkey

wellboytoo wrote: »

Whatever was or wasn't said in this thread so far, I have noticed a pick up in business in the last two months.Small builders have 4 months work ahead of them for first time in 6 years, there is definitely an increase in volume, not rates but volume, as regards the house sales anything hitting the market priced to sell is selling fast, because the sale price is below cost of building at the moment. This will have to change if we are to have a stable market.
So expect price increases in houses as the market stabilises , it will have to become cheaper to build than buy for a real market to exist!

This is roughly what I was saying I never said the housing market is sorted and I never said that the recession is over I merely pointed out that it was nice to see the amount of building work starting the effort that seems to be made lately in waterford and I have been viewing houses with a friend for awhile and decent houses are moving which is good to see, I also gave examples of meadowbank selling the first bunch in about 3 hours and 2 houses selling in grange manor before we even got there to see them, the estate eagent rang us once when we were on our way to view the house and another time before a viewing they were gone.

Simply put its good to see SOMETHING happening and I see people in jobs and houses even empty houses moving off the market as a good thing, obviously some other posters don't.

7upfree

spankmemunkey wrote: »

This is roughly what I was saying I never said the housing market is sorted and I never said that the recession is over I merely pointed out that it was nice to see the amount of building work starting the effort that seems to be made lately in waterford and I have been viewing houses with a friend for awhile and decent houses are moving which is good to see, I also gave examples of meadowbank selling the first bunch in about 3 hours and 2 houses selling in grange manor before we even got there to see them, the estate eagent rang us once when we were on our way to view the house and another time before a viewing they were gone.

Simply put its good to see SOMETHING happening and I see people in jobs and houses even empty houses moving off the market as a good thing, obviously some other posters don't.

So you equate "something good happening" with the
Prices of the second batch of meadow bank house
being increased by 12%?!

This is precisely what caused out current difficulties.

It is an economic fact.

BadCharlie

I think things are picking up also. Its very very slow in waterford & other county's such as dublin picking up at a faster rate. Its not going to happen over night like the crash but will take some years yet. Lots of work going on in waterford at the moment, i hope when its all finished we will have a nice City that we can be proud about.

spankmemunkey

:eek:

7upfree wrote: »

So you equate "something good happening" with the
Prices of the second batch of meadow bank house
being increased by 12%?!

This is precisely what caused out current difficulties.

It is an economic fact.

Over 20 houses in meadowbank were left empty with the houses being burnt out, vandalised and the subject to anti social behaviour on a regular basis for the people living there the numbers also adding to the surplus of empty houses in the city= a bad thing

Houses sold renovated with people living in them= a good thing

spankmemunkey

spankmemunkey wrote: »

:eek:

Over 20 houses in meadowbank were left empty with the houses being burnt out, vandalised and the subject to anti social behaviour on a regular basis for the people living there the numbers also adding to the surplus of empty houses in the city= a bad thing

Houses sold renovated with people living in them= a good thing

I never said a price increase was a good thing, how low did the prices drop in the first place and how much are the rebuild costs alone, for inurance purposes its recommended that a 3 bed semi is insured for 150, 000 at least for rebuild costs alone. As I said already I was surprised anyway by the demand for houses in that area after all it is ballybeg, why not buy a house in there for 40, 000

Max Powers

House prices are probably too low at the moment and need to rise. At the moment in a lot of cases, house prices are lower than the actual value of materials gone into constructing them. That cant be a good scenario. House prices going up moderately is a general good indication that things are on the up economy wise so there is positivity there (for Irish economy anyway). People might not like to hear it but its not all bad. Im also sure that those in negative equity and want out would love to hear prices are increasing.anyway, according to survey below, they are not increasing.

from WLR - Monday, 30 September 2013 12:47
A new report shows the average asking price for a three bed semi detached house in Waterford is now 139,500 euros.Waterford performed the worst of the major urban areas, with asking prices dropping by 9 per cent annually, and just under 3 per cent over the last quarter. It's the highest of the counties in the South East with Kilkenny at 130 thousand, Tipperary 124, and Carlow and Wexford the price is 110 thousand.The latest survey by MyHome-dot-ie for the third quarter of 2013, puts the average house price in Dublin at 240 thousand euro's. The report shows asking prices are continuing to decline across Ireland.Author, Caroline Kelleher from DKM Economic Consultants, says the figures show the two tier market which exists between Dublin and the rest of the country is continuing to gather momentum.

spankmemunkey

Max Powers wrote: »

House prices are probably too low at the moment and need to rise. At the moment in a lot of cases, house prices are lower than the actual value of materials gone into constructing them. That cant be a good scenario. House prices going up moderately is a general good indication that things are on the up economy wise so there is positivity there (for Irish economy anyway). People might not like to hear it but its not all bad. Im also sure that those in negative equity and want out would love to hear prices are increasing.anyway, according to survey below, they are not increasing.

from WLR - Monday, 30 September 2013 12:47
A new report shows the average asking price for a three bed semi detached house in Waterford is now 139,500 euros.Waterford performed the worst of the major urban areas, with asking prices dropping by 9 per cent annually, and just under 3 per cent over the last quarter. It's the highest of the counties in the South East with Kilkenny at 130 thousand, Tipperary 124, and Carlow and Wexford the price is 110 thousand.The latest survey by MyHome-dot-ie for the third quarter of 2013, puts the average house price in Dublin at 240 thousand euro's. The report shows asking prices are continuing to decline across Ireland.Author, Caroline Kelleher from DKM Economic Consultants, says the figures show the two tier market which exists between Dublin and the rest of the country is continuing to gather momentum.

The news on today fm this morn mentioned that offaly for some reason are also entering bubble territory in the housing market, thats dublin and offaly in the past week.

MRnotlob606

up the deise

7upfree

spankmemunkey wrote: »

Houses sold (at inflated prices) renovated with people living in them= a good thing

FYP.

7upfree

Max Powers wrote: »

House prices are probably too low at the moment and need to rise. At the moment in a lot of cases, house prices are lower than the actual value of materials gone into constructing them. That cant be a good scenario. House prices going up moderately is a general good indication that things are on the up economy wise so there is positivity there (for Irish economy anyway).

This is what happens when houses are built on speculated, overpriced land. This has little to do with materials really. And is no excuse to recreate the folly that has occurred.

Example:

A semi-detached house in Hillview in 1981 was €23k. By 1987 it was worth €27k. By 1993 it was worth €35k. A rise of around €1k per year from '81 to '93. If that had continued that same house would now be worth around €55k. Even allowing for some other forms of appreciation etc, let's call it €80k at the outside.

Houses in that area, according to Daft, are now asking €90k. So it would appear that prices have fallen into line. Which is a good thing. There are 400,000 unemployed. Bans are not lending.

Do we really want to see a return to the madness of a couple (both working) having to fork out a massive portion of their earnings for a mortgage? Or that purchasing homes be the domain of speculators? I sincerely hope hope not. And that we have learned our lesson. But I doubt it.

Have a look at this gem from RTE from 2007. It really puts things in perspective. Building houses to rent out to the people building them. Utter madness.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZOE43_YnlOQ

wellboytoo

7upfree wrote: »

This is what happens when houses are built on speculated, overpriced land. This has little to do with materials really. And is no excuse to recreate the folly that has occurred.

Example:

A semi-detached house in Hillview in 1981 was €23k. By 1987 it was worth €27k. By 1993 it was worth €35k. A rise of around €1k per year from '81 to '93. If that had continued that same house would now be worth around €55k. Even allowing for some other forms of appreciation etc, let's call it €80k at the outside.

Houses in that area, according to Daft, are now asking €90k. So it would appear that prices have fallen into line. Which is a good thing. There are 400,000 unemployed. Bans are not lending.

Do we really want to see a return to the madness of a couple (both working) having to fork out a massive portion of their earnings for a mortgage? Or that purchasing homes be the domain of speculators? I sincerely hope hope not. And that we have learned our lesson. But I doubt it.

Have a look at this gem from RTE from 2007. It really puts things in perspective. Building houses to rent out to the people building them. Utter madness.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZOE43_YnlOQ

I hear where your coming from with the Hillview analogy but could you buy the site and build a house like that for 80/ 90 k today?

Max Powers

7upfree wrote: »

This is what happens when houses are built on speculated, overpriced land. This has little to do with materials really. And is no excuse to recreate the folly that has occurred.

Example:

A semi-detached house in Hillview in 1981 was €23k. By 1987 it was worth €27k. By 1993 it was worth €35k. A rise of around €1k per year from '81 to '93. If that had continued that same house would now be worth around €55k. Even allowing for some other forms of appreciation etc, let's call it €80k at the outside.

Houses in that area, according to Daft, are now asking €90k. So it would appear that prices have fallen into line. Which is a good thing. There are 400,000 unemployed. Bans are not lending.

Do we really want to see a return to the madness of a couple (both working) having to fork out a massive portion of their earnings for a mortgage? Or that purchasing homes be the domain of speculators? I sincerely hope hope not. And that we have learned our lesson. But I doubt it.

Have a look at this gem from RTE from 2007. It really puts things in perspective. Building houses to rent out to the people building them. Utter madness.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZOE43_YnlOQ

of course we dont, nobody has ever said on here or anywhere else i have seen they want to see return of that madness.

Pattern Welded Blaa

Property can only come down so much before a buyer is found.
Many of the people who built up property portfolios are heading towards bankruptcy and are offloading as many assets as they can before they do so. The banks essentially own these distressed assets will take what they can get.
The banks are also extremely tightfisted when it comes to mortgages after the crunch, making it almost impossible to get one.
Finally, when property is seen to have reached its lowest possible price, wait and see, the people with the cash will come back and the bubble will start inflating again.