Donegal GAA Discussion Thread

Fr Tod Umptious

fullstop wrote: »

Yeah they're sh!te Tod, but you knew that. Have you got bored of winding them up in the Roscommon thread?

I'm not suggesting that they are sh!the
Coming into this year they were regarded as a top 4 team, but not unlike Mayo they have had the same core for 4 or 5 years and they may be feeling the effects of 4 good seasons.
Some posters are comparing it to Down 2013, that year people suggested that "they'll be fine in the Ulster final, or in Croke Park,
", but they weren't.

I'm saying that the idea that they are deliberately playing poorly to dampen down hype is ridiculous.

This team and management has too much experience to allow hype to get to them, they're not Roscommon.

And as I said it could be the result of tough training, which is good cos they got the tough work in and still won

overshoot

I'm kinda siding with the priest on this one! I think mxbreartys injury severely dented our attack. He was not going to be making any runs and I'm surprised he wasn't substituted (altho he was better second half).
I had noticed a more patient build up in our play in the last 2 games and thought it may have been aimed at coping with the blanket, it wasn't really evident. Tbh I thought the poor decision making was from frustration if anything.

Also remember o'shea pointing after Armagh that from a kick out is the best time to hit Donegal as the defence wasn't set? I think our goal is exactly the scenario he was alluding to.

Anyway in saying all that, once the goal was in the match was over and never felt Derry would get their noses in front. Especially when Bradley went off. He might not have been scoring but he was causing problems

downthemiddle

A strange game in that while we weren't at our best it was a game I felt we never looked like losing. Derry could never get their noses in front which might have asked different questions and for the most part we contained them without too much trouble.
Derry were well set up defensively and difficult to penetrate. They were disciplined in their approach and we only scored once from placed balls. I felt we were dominant in the first half but poor shot selection and decision making let us down. We dropped two short, the keeper made a good save from Murphy and shot too many poor wides. We were on top around the middle and knew where the Derry kick outs were going, something which eventually led to the goal. The knock Patrick received to his knee also limited out attacking options.
In the second half once we scored the goal the game was effectively over as a contest. We contained the Derry attack relatively easily and their decision making and shot selection was as poor as ours in the first half.
The management team have plenty to work on for the final. I don't know what Monaghan will have learnt from the game but they will surely be better on their own kick out. Durcan's kick outs were excellent btw.
The final two Derry challenges were nasty, dangerous and petulant and could have caused serious injury. The black cards were a cop out from a weak ref.

2moreMinutes

We were well on top for the first 10/15 mins until McBrearty injured his knee. I have absolutely no idea why he was left on as we played the rest of that half with no long ball option as he couldn't jump for a high ball or run for a pass or move to create space for others.
He indicated at least twice that he wanted to come off and while waiting until half time is grand for a lad injured 5 mins before the break, waiting 20-25 mins is just poor decision making. The fact we could overcome that says as much about Derry as it does about ourselves.

It was a great result and hopefully it will dampen the hype a little. I've been listening to people (a lot of whom should have a lot more sense) over the last fortnight talking about how it'll be great that we're meeting Dublin in the final. The Armagh game wasn't us hitting top gear nor was it a sign of how great we are. It was simply a sign of how piss poor Armagh were.

2moreMinutes

Redsoxfan wrote: »

I know of someone who spent an hour trying to get through Enniskillen. Hope too many didn't make that mistake!

Derry Minors arrived on the bus togged out

Good Donegal support here.

Shabby enough treatment for season ticket holders again...

Only one scanner at an Ulster SF was disgraceful enough but it not even working was even worse. We were queued almost to top of the hill waiting to get in. A lot of tickets, including my own, didn't scan at all. One of the Ulster GAA suits had a handful of tickets that wouldn't scan that they were going to notify Croke Park about. I'll wait with interest to see if my attendance was recorded.

Nidgeweasel

2moreMinutes wrote: »

We were well on top for the first 10/15 mins until McBrearty injured his knee. I have absolutely no idea why he was left on as we played the rest of that half with no long ball option as he couldn't jump for a high ball or run for a pass or move to create space for others.
He indicated at least twice that he wanted to come off and while waiting until half time is grand for a lad injured 5 mins before the break, waiting 20-25 mins is just poor decision making. The fact we could overcome that says as much about Derry as it does about ourselves.

It was a great result and hopefully it will dampen the hype a little. I've been listening to people (a lot of whom should have a lot more sense) over the last fortnight talking about how it'll be great that we're meeting Dublin in the final. The Armagh game wasn't us hitting top gear nor was it a sign of how great we are. It was simply a sign of how piss poor Armagh were.

who would you have brought in for McBrearty at that stage? McHugh and push Reilly up? Hugh McFadden?

We're really light aren't we. Would be a concern going forward.

Getting ahead of ourselves but the next year or so under Gallagher we have got to start blooding in far more players than we have done. Our core is getting on and will need replacing sooner rather than later.

2moreMinutes

Nidgeweasel wrote: »

who would you have brought in for McBrearty at that stage? McHugh and push Reilly up? Hugh McFadden?

We're really light aren't we. Would be a concern going forward.

Getting ahead of ourselves but the next year or so under Gallagher we have got to start blooding in far more players than we have done. Our core is getting on and will need replacing sooner rather than later.

Isn't this the problem though? We have a starting 15 that most of us are generally happy with but we're far too light once we move even as far as 17/18.

I'd likely have taken McHugh on at that stage and rejigged things to let Murphy/McFadden take turns being the target man up front.
The problem with wanting to persist with Murphy playing deeper is we're short on options up front if anything does go wrong like last night. We got out of jail as we played 20 mins of taking pot shots that we don't usually get involved with simply because we had no target man to hit.

As much as I like Hugh McFadden and want him to succeed at county level, he just doesn't seem ready for a target man role and Rory doesn't seem to see him in that role based on the league.

Redsoxfan

I don't for a second think that Donegal played the way they did to dampen down hype. That's absolute nonsense!

We may (and I stress 'may') be playing within ourselves to a certain extent with the expectation of bigger challenges ahead.

I was shocked to see no Donegal players moving forward to support an attack at one stage in the first half yesterday. I looked at the them and most had their heads down.

It was an odd performance no matter what way you look at it.

Ceist_Beag

downthemiddle wrote: »

A strange game in that while we weren't at our best it was a game I felt we never looked like losing. Derry could never get their noses in front which might have asked different questions and for the most part we contained them without too much trouble.
Derry were well set up defensively and difficult to penetrate. They were disciplined in their approach and we only scored once from placed balls. I felt we were dominant in the first half but poor shot selection and decision making let us down. We dropped two short, the keeper made a good save from Murphy and shot too many poor wides. We were on top around the middle and knew where the Derry kick outs were going, something which eventually led to the goal. The knock Patrick received to his knee also limited out attacking options.
In the second half once we scored the goal the game was effectively over as a contest. We contained the Derry attack relatively easily and their decision making and shot selection was as poor as ours in the first half.
The management team have plenty to work on for the final. I don't know what Monaghan will have learnt from the game but they will surely be better on their own kick out. Durcan's kick outs were excellent btw.
The final two Derry challenges were nasty, dangerous and petulant and could have caused serious injury. The black cards were a cop out from a weak ref.

That's pretty much how I viewed it as well. The second black card especially was a joke - a straight red if ever I saw one.
Agree with others too that any suggestion Donegal played that way to reduce the hype is nonsense bordering on arrogance. We're not so good that we can play at 60% just to keep a lid on the hype! Maybe the shorter turnaround had something to do with the performance, maybe some of the lads are carrying a few niggling injuries, or maybe it was just a bad day at the office. But there is absolutely no way it was intended that way!
Two things really stuck in my head after the match.
1. I absolutely love big Neil, he epitomises everything you want in a footballer. Strength, ability, determination, intelligence, and works his cajones off for the cause every single day. We need him to keep going as long as he can as he's irreplaceable in our team.
2. Michael Murphy must be the dream teammate to have. How many times did he make the run to show for a kickout or free? His willingness to the cause must be infectious and then he has the ability to just whack the ball over from anywhere - there must be times when the other lads just look at him and go Jesus but you're good!

Anyway, 5th Ulster Final on the trot, it's pretty amazing stuff. I remember a few years back speaking to lads about the Armagh team of the 2000s decade and saying it would be a long time before a team dominated Ulster like that again but half way through the decade and we're not far off that. As O'Se said on the SG last night, the result was perfect for Rory as he has plenty to work on over the next few weeks and he will be in no doubt that Monaghan will be by far the toughest challenge yet.

intellectual dosser

Felt like we got out of jail, and that we were there for the taking. If Derry had more luck when shooting then Donegal would be in the qualifiers.

Huge gaps in our defense at times, and similar to the minors there was no real urgency about our play. It's hard to imagine like for like thinking about how we'd handle any of the other teams based on that performance, hopefully they can work on some of the weaknesses and be ready for Monaghan.

Redsoxfan

intellectual dosser wrote: »

Felt like we got out of jail, and that we were there for the taking. If Derry had more luck when shooting then Donegal would be in the qualifiers.

Fair enough, but if we had taken our chances in the first half, the game might have been out of Derry's reach at half time. Paddy's 'injury' had a big impact of on our attacking strategy in the latter half of the first half also.

I think we know we can do better (well, I do anyway) and I think we can expect to see better against Monaghan. Whether or not that will be good enough remains to be seen.

A big concern for me is the form of Eamonn McGee. He hasn't looked up to it all year imho.

Ceist_Beag

Redsoxfan wrote: »

A big concern for me is the form of Eamonn McGee. He hasn't looked up to it all year imho.

+1 RSF, I thought he looked well off the pace at times on Saturday.

harpsman

Another one of those games where we went flat after a promising start and were unable to create space upfront while looking very loose at the back. Once again it was the ability particularly of Murphy and McFadden to kick difficult points that got us out of jail.

Hard to know what to expect as we've usually raised our game for bigger challenges in the past, but not always. Reckon its 50/50 v Monaghan.

Nidgeweasel

Redsoxfan wrote: »

Agreed.

He got a roasting on Saturday.

intellectual dosser

Derry also made it very hard for us to score, and it took some monster points from McFadden and Murphy to carry us along in the second half. There are other days them efforts just wont go over.

I dont mean to sound so glum, obviously still a great team and I dont knock our chances - but plenty to be working on.

Redsoxfan

intellectual dosser wrote: »

Derry also made it very hard for us to score, and it took some monster points from McFadden and Murphy to carry us along in the second half. There are other days them efforts just wont go over.

I dont mean to sound so glum, obviously still a great team and I dont knock our chances - but plenty to be working on.

Fully agree.

cj maxx

intellectual dosser wrote: »

Derry also made it very hard for us to score, and it took some monster points from McFadden and Murphy to carry us along in the second half. There are other days them efforts just wont go over.

I dont mean to sound so glum, obviously still a great team and I dont knock our chances - but plenty to be working on.

So how do you think the ulster final will go . What will monaghan have to do to beat ye ?

2moreMinutes

I don't necessarily agree that McGee has gone backwards this year but rather I think the whole back line has been left more exposed at times this year which is highlighting some poor instances of one-on-one defending.

intellectual dosser

cjmc wrote: »

So how do you think the ulster final will go . What will monaghan have to do to beat ye ?

It will be a fast paced, free flowing game that the purists will drool over for years to come

I confess I havent seen much of Monaghan in this years Championship but I'd expect it to be physical and dogged as usual. Drew Wiley will be a big loss and obviously the form and freedom of Conor McManus is a big factor for them, they should have hunger and confidence following last years Ulster loss and this years solid league performance.

babybuilder

cjmc wrote: »

So how do you think the ulster final will go . What will monaghan have to do to beat ye ?

Monaghan will be relishing our visit to clones. They figure this must be their year. Seeing them playing us in Letterkenny we know that they will adopt the blanket system and try to frustrate us. Last year they left space behind their midfield that Ryan McHugh in particular exploited. It all depends on how quiet we keep Conor McManus. Physically they will be a notch above Derry and will try to hurt Donegal players with every tackle as is customary.

I've noticed gaps in our defensive system of zonal marking with nobody picking up the nearest opponent whereas our attacks have to expend more energy to get through. This may be due to a lack of energy/miles on the clock. I would like to see Donegal putting more pressure higher up the field like Dublin or Kerry will do.

boxer.fan

Clerkin, Finlay & Gallogly are regular subs for monaghan this year, each making significant impact in games to date. Donegal will need to conserve enough energy for a late monaghan surge.

Redsoxfan

boxer.fan wrote: »

Clerkin, Finlay & Gallogly are regular subs for monaghan this year, each making significant impact in games to date. Donegal will need to conserve enough energy for a late monaghan surge.

This.

Monaghan in both games to date have started relatively slowly, only pulling away late enough in the game.

Donegal have started every game in near whirlwind fashion, but only blew Armagh away. Tyrone and Derry hung tough and were well in contention at half time. In both games it felt like we were hanging on at the end and concession of a goal could have been fatal due to our narrow lead.

In that awful game in Letterkenny earlier this year, Monaghan were content to sit back and hit us on the break. They finished the game much stronger.

There are a lot of worrying signs. It will take a much better and sustained performance for us to win.

The only comfort I would take is that Tyrone and Derry at least are tougher opponents than Cavan and Fermanagh. I have no doubt we would have beaten Monaghan's opponents with relative ease. Still, they came into last year's Ulster Final having beaten Tyrone and Armagh and it didn't do them much good, but there were other factors that influenced their performance last year.

It might not won't be pretty, but it's shaping up to be one hell of a battle.

BonnieSituation

As a neutral (though not really neutral ever in anything).

It's going to shape up as a truly fascinating battle. It's going to be an all-mighty arm wrestle.

Yet again Ulster spoils us with game after game of intensity.

Donegal by 2.

Boom__Boom

boxer.fan wrote: »

Clerkin, Finlay & Gallogly are regular subs for monaghan this year, each making significant impact in games to date. Donegal will need to conserve enough energy for a late monaghan surge.

Saw a stat elesewhere that the Monaghan subs bench have scored 7 points from play in 2 games while no Donegal sub has contributed anything to the scoreboard in 3 games.

The amount of time played by Donegal subs is seriously limited - they've only made 12 subs in 3 games total (out of a possible 18) and 7 of those subs were after the 68th minute. Basically the only point of making subs that late in a game is to take time out of the clock.

It's pretty simplistic stuff but does show the weakness of the Donegal bench. The fact that McBrearty was left on for the full game against Derry despite having a knock really shows how weak the options are in terms of the bench.

It's hard not to see it coming against Donegal at some stage given we're still only inching into the vicinity of the business end of the championship.

Boom__Boom

Redsoxfan wrote: »

In that awful game in Letterkenny earlier this year, Monaghan were content to sit back and hit us on the break. They finished the game much stronger.

There are a lot of worrying signs. It will take a much better and sustained performance for us to win.

The only comfort I would take is that Tyrone and Derry at least are tougher opponents than Cavan and Fermanagh. I have no doubt we would have beaten Monaghan's opponents with relative ease. Still, they came into last year's Ulster Final having beaten Tyrone and Armagh and it didn't do them much good, but there were other factors that influenced their performance last year.

It might not won't be pretty, but it's shaping up to be one hell of a battle.

Just looking at the how the teams Donegal have beaten have gotten on in their other championship games.

Derry only sneaked past Down who were knocked out by Wexford.

Tyrone by all accounts made fairly hard work of getting past Limerick.

Armagh were seriously unimpressive against Wicklow with Wicklow having a nightmare on the free-taking front (apparently missed 8 scorable frees only getting 1 point from deadballs) while the final 10 point winning margin was down to the fact Armagh scored 2-3 in the final 5 minutes with Wicklow getting no score.

Overall none of the three sides Donegal have beaten so far, have turned in any sort of impressive performance in their other championship games.

That's before you consider that both Tyrone and Derry were relegated in the league and Armagh didn't exactly lay a swathe to Division 3 despite getting promoted.

I can't help thinking that folk are looking at the 3 teams Donegal have beaten and thinking of them in terms of their better days as opposed to where they are at this year.

Redsoxfan

Boom__Boom wrote: »

I can't help thinking that folk are looking at the 3 teams Donegal have beaten and thinking of them in terms of their better days as opposed to where they are at this year.

I'm not. I am basing it on what I saw in all three games I attended. I left Armagh out of the comparison because they looked crap. Tyrone and Derry played against Donegal with a serious level of intensity and have more talent than Cavan or Fermanagh.

No argument at all that Derry only sneaked past a poor enough looking Down team. That was their first Ulster Championship win since 2011. And Tyrone are not the team that they were by any strech of the imagination. But they are still one of the better teams outside the top 4.

K-9

Boom__Boom wrote: »

Just looking at the how the teams Donegal have beaten have gotten on in their other championship games.

Derry only sneaked past Down who were knocked out by Wexford.

Tyrone by all accounts made fairly hard work of getting past Limerick.

Armagh were seriously unimpressive against Wicklow with Wicklow having a nightmare on the free-taking front (apparently missed 8 scorable frees only getting 1 point from deadballs) while the final 10 point winning margin was down to the fact Armagh scored 2-3 in the final 5 minutes with Wicklow getting no score.

Overall none of the three sides Donegal have beaten so far, have turned in any sort of impressive performance in their other championship games.

That's before you consider that both Tyrone and Derry were relegated in the league and Armagh didn't exactly lay a swathe to Division 3 despite getting promoted.

I can't help thinking that folk are looking at the 3 teams Donegal have beaten and thinking of them in terms of their better days as opposed to where they are at this year.

It could be argued that we haven't peaked yet and realistically Tyrone and the Ulster Final were the 2 big targets.

Armagh was over after 15 minutes and we did just about enough against Derry, worrying how we only added on a point after the goal though, we'd normally keep the scoreboard ticking over.

Boom__Boom

Redsoxfan wrote: »

I'm not. I am basing it on what I saw in all three games I attended. I left Armagh out of the comparison because they looked crap. Tyrone and Derry played against Donegal with a serious level of intensity and have more talent than Cavan or Fermanagh.

No argument at all that Derry only sneaked past a poor enough looking Down team. That was their first Ulster Championship win since 2011. And Tyrone are not the team that they were by any strech of the imagination. But they are still one of the better teams outside the top 4.

Wasn't really aimed at you - it was more a sense of an impression that's seems to be around the media if that makes any sense and from taking to the more casual GAA fans - was probably fed by a conversation I had yesterday about how Donegal haven't beaten anyone that looks liked any sort of serious contender for Sam ;

At the moment the odds for the 3 teams Donegal beat to pick up Sam are
Tyrone 40/1
Derry 66/1
Armagh 66/1

For Monaghan the team's they beat are currently
Cavan 125/1
Fermanagh 400/1

Not obviously the fact they are in the last chance saloon of the qualifiers would affect things a fair bit.

The thing is that I think there will be a lot of talk about Donegal's tough path to the final and their record in Ulster, while it was fairly tricky in comparison to some of the other contenders, it wasn't exactly Mission Impossible either.

Tyrone and Derry played 14 games against Division 1 opposition this year and won 2. I know it's "only the league" but Donegal only beat Tyrone by 3 points and Derry by 2. That's less than the kick of a ball margin. The less said about the shambles that was Armagh the better.

The key thing is that the route to the final counts for zero the next day and Monaghan are going to be coming armed for bear.

Boom__Boom

K-9 wrote: »

It could be argued that we haven't peaked yet and realistically Tyrone and the Ulster Final were the 2 big targets.

Armagh was over after 15 minutes and we did just about enough against Derry, worrying how we only added on a point after the goal though, we'd normally keep the scoreboard ticking over.

Yeah but I'm not so sure that it's not all that easy to get a team to peak as some folk in the GAA seem to make out - you're sure that all of the serious contenders aim at "peaking" in August in terms of their conditioning and form but I don't think there's any magic switch there.

To me the Donegal defence look way more brittle than in recent years especially in terms of 1) conceding goal chances 2) marking and free space.

The team is still extremely good at it what they do but I'm not sure they can do it for 70 minutes anymore especially when you look at the options off the subs bench.

I've said it before and I'll say it again the lack of Donegal squad depth - there's no one to touch Dublin's squad depth in terms of options off the bench, I'd have concerns about Kerry depth in the backs especially if there was a day when 1 or 2 lads had knocks/were out of form and Mayo have reasonable cover while in comparison Donegal's looks so wafer-thin it's almost mind-boggling. Dublin had Bastic, O'Gara, Costello and Brennan on the injured list this weekend and still they steamrolled Kildare into the mud. Imagine what sort of state Donegal would be in with similar injuries (and while all those lads are decent serious footballers none of them are close to being "key" players for Dublin) Donegal seem to be walking blind-fold across a tightrope on their route to the Croker, whereas Dublin are strolling across a bridge that almost like O'Connell bridge (as wide as it is long) in terms of their squad depth.

Nidgeweasel

I think we are absolutely f*cked.

Both in respect of the final and in the longer term.