Donegal GAA Discussion Thread

Ceist_Beag

Nidge, either someone has hacked into your account or you forgot to take your tablets today, you're in some form!

dog_pig

Boom__Boom wrote: »

fed by a conversation I had yesterday about how Donegal haven't beaten anyone that looks liked any sort of serious contender for Sam

I'm not sure it's possible at this stage of the season for any of the "top 4" to have beaten a serious contender for the All-Ireland.

While I can't deny the existence of a certain degree of media hyperbole in relation to Donegal (similar to what any All-Ireland contender receives at some point during the season - just look at what's being said about Dublin after yesterday's match), I think you have to look at Donegal's journey to the Ulster Final in relation to the routes that counties perceived to be at or around their level have taken to reach the same point.

Dublin, to reach their provincial final, have beaten Longford (19) and Kildare (10).

Mayo have beaten Galway (12).

Kerry and Cork have beaten Tipperary (16) and Clare (21) respectively.

Monaghan have beaten Cavan (17) and Fermanagh (18).

Compare the above draws to Donegal's, which has involved beating Tyrone (8), Armagh (9), and Derry (7).

I think it's pretty tough to argue that Donegal's journey to their final hasn't been significantly tougher than that of any of the other counties this year.

The numbers after each of the counties refer to their positions in the rankings here: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=96054701&postcount=216

(Obviously this is no way a perfect reflection of the ability of each county but I feel it's probably as good a ranking as any to use.)

2moreMinutes

Nidgeweasel wrote: »

I think we are absolutely f*cked.

Both in respect of the final and in the longer term.

Sure we couldn't be ****ed. Don't we have natural footballers from 1-15.......

Assuming no injuries between now and the final, I'm reasonably confident we'll get past Monaghan with relative ease.

K-9

I suppose it comes back to 3 games to get to a final, Tyrone weren't that far away, and on the day neither were Derry. If you compare it to the other provincial finalists it is a tougher path and not unlikely we would trip up somewhere along the way, unlike Dublin, Mayo, Cork or Kerry.

Also Monaghan, a top 6 side, making hard work of an easier run in suggests that really, its Ulster being Ulster! Really barring Antrim and Fermanagh, the others beating each other is very possible. That doesn't mean Cavan or Derry would win the provincial title, it's just the same old dog eat dog Ulster Championship, and I don't think we'd want it any other way!

I can see Ulster getting 3 or 4 teams in the quarter finals which would suggest Ulster does have the best of the rest teams! The exception to the rule being how consistently unconsistent Down are, and Wexford Park is a tough enough place to go. If I was a betting man I'd have been on that on Saturday.

Nidgeweasel

Ceist_Beag wrote: »

Nidge, either someone has hacked into your account or you forgot to take your tablets today, you're in some form!

It's the heat.:D

The dubs are overly sensitive. Just calling a spade a spade, I think we had more natural footballers than them last year and smarter footballers. The result bore that out somewhat. We don't have their strength in other areas, we don't have their ludicrous talent on their bench, nor their athleticism. We also won't be winning the All Ireland again for quite some time, unlike them. I don't see what the big deal is myself.

The thing is, I'm neither an optimist or a pessimist. Just call it straight down the line as I see it. Mayo 2013 on the way up said we'd be doing well to keep it within 10 points, Dublin last year knew we'd win etc.

Looking at the Monaghan game in particular first off. Redsoxfan has touched on this. I've seen all of their games this year and the most obvious thing is their bench. It has been a major factor, if not the major factor in each game. Against Cavan I couldn't understand why people were saying Cavan looked the more likely to win the game at half time. Monaghan are 3 years down the line, with a far superior, experienced bench and iirc would be playing with the wind. Yes they only won by a point in the end up but they never, to my mind, looked like they'd really lose the match.

Against Fermanagh again they didn't play particularly well but there was more than enough there to suggest this is a team that means business. McManus hit some spectacular scores, as is his want, and once again their bench was absolutely critical. Fermanagh went down to 14 and Quigley missed a couple of routine frees but it never looked in issue. I think they scored 1-13 in the second half of that game which is more than a decent score, even against 14.

They've had a nice run to the final without really having to exert themselves that much.

Armagh were ****e so I'm not going to mention that, we've had two tough games against Tyrone and Derry which will definitely stand to us. It's going to be a fairly rotten spectacle if the game in Letterkenny is anything to go by.

The main issue is, we don't seem to have learnt anything from that as yet. I expected more from us on Saturday in the face of that style of play. Now granted we were noticeably flat maybe this was due to the 13 day turnaround or whatever but it's a major worry.

We've a better 15 than Monaghan and I'd have no concerns about us being there or thereabouts in the game but we have absolutely nothing in reserve. It's frightening. I'm expecting Monaghan to win this by a couple of points with their bench providing the needed push over the line as they have done in every game thus far.

Longer term, my entire concern this year was laid out a few pages back before a ball was even thrown in. We have a tiny panel of players, some of whom have some serious mileage on the clock and were used heavily in the league. Without some fresh blood in there we are going to run out of gas and I expect us to be beaten in round 4/ quarter final against a fresher team with a bit of momentum. The Derry game has reinforced that view.

As always, I will be happier than a pig in muck to be proved wrong.

cj maxx

I ve enjoyed reading the last few posts and i too have been impressed by monaghans bench , which if its close with 20 mins to go could give them an edge . My main fear is it wont be close enough ( 2/3 pts) at that time is use given donegals starts . Unlike some here im expecting a good though not naive game . Both teams have come on in the last few years from the rugby league game they played ( monaghan esp ) so best of luck all round

Nidgeweasel

cjmc wrote: »

I ve enjoyed reading the last few posts and i too have been impressed by monaghans bench , which if its close with 20 mins to go could give them an edge . My main fear is it wont be close enough ( 2/3 pts) at that time is use given donegals starts . Unlike some here im expecting a good though not naive game . Both teams have come on in the last few years from the rugby league game they played ( monaghan esp ) so best of luck all round

Well this is the thing isn't it. And it's what Donegal will have to do if they have any chance of winning the game. Get off to a good start, like the final last year and like Monaghan did in 2013 and then dictate the terms of the game themselves thereafter.

I'm not so sure Donegal will be able to do that or more accurately, I don't think Monaghan will let them. The fact is, this game is probably going to be tit for tat and if it's coming into the final throes where both sides will have unquestionably emptied the tank then it's Monaghan who will be in the driving seat given the boost they can get from their subs.

To be able to call on the likes of Finlay, Clerkin, Gologley, McGuinnes..... It's formidable.

The loss of Wiley is huge and we should be looking to exploit that if McBrearty is fit but Monaghan have more than enough to compensate for that.

At the very least it's going to be a full blooded clash between two incredibly honest and committed groups of players. Again.

charlie14

Nidgeweasel wrote: »

Well this is the thing isn't it. And it's what Donegal will have to do if they have any chance of winning the game. Get off to a good start, like the final last year and like Monaghan did in 2013 and then dictate the terms of the game themselves thereafter.

I'm not so sure Donegal will be able to do that or more accurately, I don't think Monaghan will let them. The fact is, this game is probably going to be tit for tat and if it's coming into the final throes where both sides will have unquestionably emptied the tank then it's Monaghan who will be in the driving seat given the boost they can get from their subs.

To be able to call on the likes of Finlay, Clerkin, Gologley, McGuinnes..... It's formidable.

The loss of Wiley is huge and we should be looking to exploit that if McBrearty is fit but Monaghan have more than enough to compensate for that.

At the very least it's going to be a full blooded clash between two incredibly honest and committed groups of players. Again.

The real question for me is if Monaghan start with the same players they did against Cavan and Fermanagh, will they be anywhere close to catching Donegal by the time they send for the cavalry.
In their two games to date they were pretty poor without Finlay, Clerkin,Gologley etc. and if Wylie is missing, then starting the teams they did in their two previous against Donegal could be suicidal.

Nidgeweasel

charlie14 wrote: »

The real question for me is if Monaghan start with the same players they did against Cavan and Fermanagh, will they be anywhere close to catching Donegal by the time they send for the cavalry.
In their two games to date they were pretty poor without Finlay, Clerkin,Gologley etc. and if Wylie is missing, then starting the teams they did in their two previous against Donegal could be suicidal.

A fair point and that's going to have to be our plan, rattle them hard, as hard as we possibly can in the opening stages. You'd have to imagine that the intensity and divilment will be back in their game for the final though. Hopefully not!

Redsoxfan

Nidgeweasel wrote:

I think we are absolutely f*cked.

Nidgeweasel wrote:

Both in respect of the final and in the longer term.

Go back to trolling the Dubs in the 2015 Championship thread like a good man.
😀

Nidgeweasel

Redsoxfan wrote: »

Go back to trolling the Dubs in the 2015 Championship thread like a good man.
😀

What's the problem?

Ceist_Beag

Nidgeweasel wrote: »

The main issue is, we don't seem to have learnt anything from that as yet.

+1 ... or is This the new +1 ... it's hard to keep up!

Anyway yeah, that for me is the biggest concern this year. Last year we had Ryan, Odhran and Jigger playing first team championship football and this added to our small squad. This year we're down a couple of options from last years panel in Leo and Brick and Jigger hasn't progressed as we might have hoped. The only new face in the first team really this year is O'Reilly (I know he was involved the past few years but was never a serious contender for a start).
The games to date have just highlighted how much we rely on the main men, the likes of Neil McGee, big Neil, Murphy and even McFadden has shown that we still really need him fit.
Paddy McB has certainly improved this year so that is another positive but as you say Nidge, when you look at our bench compared to Monaghan then they just don't compare.
All that said, we have come this far without really been shaken and the belief in the camp I'd say is very strong so I expect the lads to go into the final knowing how to win and I think the pressure is really on Monaghan to win this moreso than Donegal. If we can rattle them early on it will really put it up to Monaghan and that could play into our hands. Once again I think we will be relying on our top men to be the difference.
One thing is for sure, it won't be easy!

doc_17

I'm not too sure on the whole bench argument when it comes to Monaghan. Monaghan played two weak teams and late in the game their bench made an impact against weaker teams with even weaker benches. And if I recall Fermanagh were also a man down. obviously it would be an issue against Dublin/Kerry if you had to make 4/5 subs before the 60th minute.

On another note, the Co Board have called a fixtures meeting for tomorrow even to discuss the Master Fixtures Plan. It was scandalous, no shock there, what happened some teams at the weekend. And apparently the starting 15 have been told that they are not allowed to play for their clubs again this weekend, even though the 13 day rule doesn't apply and all star fixtures have been played. And that's even before you take last weeks matches, where some teams refused to field because of being told their players couldn't play, into account.

doc_17

And just to state that I have no problem with Co players being protected. But there are promotion/relegations issues at stake and it is unfair on clubs.

Nidgeweasel

doc_17 wrote: »

I'm not too sure on the whole bench argument when it comes to Monaghan. Monaghan played two weak teams and late in the game their bench made an impact against weaker teams with even weaker benches. And if I recall Fermanagh were also a man down. obviously it would be an issue against Dublin/Kerry if you had to make 4/5 subs before the 60th minute.

We've no bench sure!

Alvin Holler

doc_17 wrote: »

I'm not too sure on the whole bench argument when it comes to Monaghan. Monaghan played two weak teams and late in the game their bench made an impact against weaker teams with even weaker benches. And if I recall Fermanagh were also a man down. obviously it would be an issue against Dublin/Kerry if you had to make 4/5 subs before the 60th minute.

I'd agree with this, Clerkin is a great impact sub to bring on, Gollogly is a solid player but I'd be surprised if him or any of the rest of them make a big impact in an ulster final.

I would be tempted to keep toye in reserve and start mark mchugh to keep an extra eye on mcmanus.

dog_pig

Some seriously sensitive Dubs knocking about this place!

jjdonegal

When tickets on sale? I'm going to try get two for the Hill to keep my options open as to echo what RSF said the season tickets for the Derry game were a disgrace.
No doubt they will be the Pat McGrane for the final but id like then somewhere between the 2 45s; not closer to the goal line than the 45 which was the case

doc_17

jjdonegal wrote: »

When tickets on sale? I'm going to try get two for the Hill to keep my options open as to echo what RSF said the season tickets for the Derry game were a disgrace.
No doubt they will be the Pat McGrane for the final but id like then somewhere between the 2 45s; not closer to the goal line than the 45 which was the case

Last year the season tickets were between the two 65s and it was a pretty good spot. Better than being in the bottom corner of the GA.

jjdonegal

doc_17 wrote: »

Last year the season tickets were between the two 65s and it was a pretty good spot. Better than being in the bottom corner of the GA.

Yeah I was more or less on the 1/2 way line. The Antrim semi I had a great seat on the 65 as I did in Celtic Park for the Derry game.
Tyrone this year was ok; Armagh and Derry were disgraceful. I'm not holding out much hope for the 19th to be honest. Will get a Hill ticket as backup in case I'm stuck in some corner.

2moreMinutes

jjdonegal wrote: »

Yeah I was more or less on the 1/2 way line. The Antrim semi I had a great seat on the 65 as I did in Celtic Park for the Derry game.
Tyrone this year was ok; Armagh and Derry were disgraceful. I'm not holding out much hope for the 19th to be honest. Will get a Hill ticket as backup in case I'm stuck in some corner.

Apart from sitting in front row at Tyrone game, my groups tickets have been fairly good for the last few years. My major complaint from last weekend about the season ticket is the fact that there was only one scanner for the whole of the GA stand and it was only sporadically working leading to huge delays and queues in actually getting into the good seats.

jjdonegal

2moreMinutes wrote: »

Apart from sitting in front row at Tyrone game, my groups tickets have been fairly good for the last few years. My major complaint from last weekend about the season ticket is the fact that there was only one scanner for the whole of the GA stand and it was only sporadically working leading to huge delays and queues in actually getting into the good seats.

So I've heard. Thankfully we were going in about 445 so we were straight through. BIt of a shambles only having one scanner.

Redsoxfan

Group had good seats for the Tyrone game, I swapped for standing in Armagh, ****e seats last weekend (as well as having to queue for scanner in rain well before minor game when there was no-one looking to use other turnstiles). Another group I know had ****e seats for Tyrone, good seats last weekend.

2013 Ulster Final was the worst. More or less below pitch level, with a TV camera blocking view of far goals.

Would gladly swap seating for standing for every game in Ulster but the size of the group makes it too hard to arrange.

jjdonegal

Leo back in the squad for training tonight according to twitter.

henke

Donegal Democrat reporting it also on Facebook. Great news good player to have.

Redsoxfan

Great news. Didn't see it happening myself. It's a pity it took this long but hopefully he will make an impact.

Redsoxfan

jjdonegal wrote:

When tickets on sale? I'm going to try get two for the Hill to keep my options open as to echo what RSF said the season tickets for the Derry game were a disgrace.

Online/Retail sales start on 7 July (Tuesday) at noon according to Ulster GAA

Nidgeweasel

Jesus that is some boost having Leo back. He's been going well for Glenties by all accounts.

Ceist_Beag

Absolutely fantastic news to have Leo back in there.

bob skunkhouse

Nidgeweasel wrote: »

Longer term, my entire concern this year was laid out a few pages back before a ball was even thrown in. We have a tiny panel of players, some of whom have some serious mileage on the clock and were used heavily in the league. Without some fresh blood in there we are going to run out of gas and I expect us to be beaten in round 4/ quarter final against a fresher team with a bit of momentum. The Derry game has reinforced that view.

Just an observation from the Derry game that I find baffling, but lends to the lack of strength in depth of the team. It was pretty obvious Paddy MacB was injured during the game (I think the IT or the Indo reported from the 16th on). He'd minimal impact during the second half. In fact I'd say it was a bit of mind games leaving him on the pitch - lulling Derry into a false sense having one of the best forwards lurking about. Either that, or we'd no reasonable player to bring on (MMcH was already on and McF was brought on towards the end).