New Range

16 bore

Anyone hear anything about a new 300 meter range opening in the Thurles , Templemore area?

badaj0z

They have a facebook page link below:

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Devils-Bit-Shooting-Centre/332492416838806

Cass

Nice one.

Great to see another range up and going in a time when most are finding it hard to keep going. Plus it's another place for comps and to shoot so that always a good thing.

Vest of luck to the lads and ladies responsible. :cool:

16 bore

badaj0z wrote: »

They have a facebook page link below:

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Devils-Bit-Shooting-Centre/332492416838806

Great thanks for that looks interesting i will give them a call tomorrow and post any update i get

bpb101

if yous want a laugh - some counciler on tipp radio about the range @32 minutes
http://tippfm.podomatic.com/entry/2014-01-22T03_37_34-08_00 Dated 22nd of January

and the guy who own the range from 5 minutes to 30 (also featuring a man with racehorses worried about the noise and the local school principle worried about their children getting shot on their way to school, And the presenter worried that criminals with " their glocks " will use the range
http://tippfm.podomatic.com/entry/2014-01-23T03_31_25-08_00 dated 23rd of January

try and not laugh

16 bore

bpb101 wrote: »

if yous want a laugh - some counciler on tipp radio about the range @32 minutes
http://tippfm.podomatic.com/entry/2014-01-22T03_37_34-08_00 Dated 22rd of January

and the guy who own the range from 5 minutes to 30 (also featuring a man with racehorses worried about the noise and the local school principle worried about their children getting shot on their way to school, And the presenter worried that criminals with " their glocks " will use the range

http://tippfm.podomatic.com/entry/2014-01-23T03_31_25-08_00 dated 23th of January

try and not laugh

Thanks for adding the link just finished listing myself. I must say for a local councilor
He should have better informed himself before going on radio.

fish slapped

It seems a bit much for some of these people to inform themselves before scare mongering on the airwaves:

Local school Principal says I don't know anything about it, but we'll be objecting... Teaching children ignorance is bliss...

Local race horse owner says It will scare the horses and someone will be hurt ... does he not know the Curragh race course and areas where some of the top race horses in the country are beside the army barracks and range...

Also everywhere is only 1km from the range ... apparently the school is closer to 3km from the school and the line of fire is 120 degrees in the opposite direction...

FFS, some people should engage their brain before operating their mouth!

Sparks

fish slapped wrote: »

FFS, some people should engage their brain before operating their mouth!

They don't need to. If we'd done more work on building a positive PR image in the last few decades, they would, but we didn't, so say gun and the old list pops into people's heads - Terrorist, Criminal, Army/ERU, The guy who shot Bambi's mom, and Nutter With A Gun Near A School.

When that's what's in Joe Public's mind, Joe Politician doesn't need to factcheck, doesn't need to be reasonable or moderate, doesn't have to make sense, he just needs to say he's going to do something about it and stamp it out or crack down on it or whatever the mob wants to hear, and we're toast.

But hey, I'm sure all that cash we spent in court in the last 20 years couldn't have been spent better on the court of public opinion, which might have been able to protect us from all this nonsense...

rowa

Sparks wrote: »

But hey, I'm sure all that cash we spent in court in the last 20 years couldn't have been spent better on the court of public opinion, which might have been able to protect us from all this nonsense...

I don't understand how going to court would preclude the shooting community from getting positive PR ?

Sparks

rowa wrote: »

I don't understand how going to court would preclude the shooting community from getting positive PR ?

Court costs money, time, manpower and goodwill.
We had a limited amount of that; we didn't spend it on positive PR.

(with the usual disclaimer that this doesn't apply to people who went because they'd tried all the other options, their case had merit and they were forced into that direction)

rowa

Sparks wrote: »

Court costs money, time, manpower and goodwill.
We had a limited amount of that; we didn't spend it on positive PR.

(with the usual disclaimer that this doesn't apply to people who went because they'd tried all the other options, their case had merit and they were forced into that direction)

Nothing stopping an individual club from working towards a positive reputation in the local community. Our club for instance has christmas shoots etc to raise money, this is donated to good causes in the local community. We've never had an issue with the local people.

Sparks

Yup, do have many others (mine included) -- but I was talking about us as a whole, ie. our NGBs.

16 bore

Here's the an update on this and it doesn't look good for devilsbit follow the attached link and you will see letters of correspondence from coilte and DoJ to the local people in opposition to the opening of the range.

https://m.facebook.com/profile.php?id=563708420364919

bpb101

16 bore wrote: »

Here's the an update on this and it doesn't look good for devilsbit follow the attached link and you will see letters of correspondence from coilte and DoJ to the local people in opposition to the opening of the range.

https://m.facebook.com/profile.php?id=563708420364919

Absolute joke. Really hope the lads get the range up.
Thanks for the update.

Cass

Just after realising the page you linked is "No to Devil's bit". I thought for a moment it was their own facebook page and was wondering at the content of some of the comments. Now i realise it's a facebook page AGAINST the range so it makes sense.

Onto other matters. The issue seems done and dusted. I checked the Devil's bit facebook page and there is nothing on it since FEb 5th. It would appear, and that it is not just an opinion, that the range is dead before it begun. That letter says they will be going with the recommendation NOT to allow the range to be re-opened.

16 bore

Yes your right nothing on the page since early February it's a shame really because we could do with range in the Tipperary area. Can only hope they are seeking legal advice and are keeping quite till they know more.

garv123

It looks like they were chancing their arm opening it before they ever had permission got to do so?

Sparks

They didn't seem to have opened it - their last post on Feb 5 says that they were taking names but not money until the DoJ gave the approval, which suggests they wanted to know how much interest there was and that they were doing things the way they should.

The stuff on the other facebook page seems a bit confused - there's reference to a letter from the Department of Defence (not Justice), but that would have said the range wasn't safe for military use without significant work -- and (a) civilian ranges would have to do that work anyway to get their 4A authorisation, and (b) civilian ranges wouldn't be worrying about fully-auto bren fire and grenades and anti-tank stuff.

Hopefully, it's not a complete mess and it can get sorted out, but I wouldn't have thought the courts would be the way to go 16bore...

garv123

Meant to say preparing for opening and not just opening. Seems like they put a lot of work into it going by photos on the page which could turn out to be an awful waste of money.

Sparks

You'd hope not - but you can't get the 4A without the prep, so it's a catch-22

rowa

Cass wrote: »

Onto other matters. The issue seems done and dusted. I checked the Devil's bit facebook page and there is nothing on it since FEb 5th. It would appear, and that it is not just an opinion, that the range is dead before it begun. That letter says they will be going with the recommendation NOT to allow the range to be re-opened.

Dreadful pity.

Cass

It is. Would love to see a new range, especially out beyond 100 yards, being built.

I had another read of the letter. So it seems based on reports from the previous Minister for Defence that Coilte are not going to entertain a request for a lease on the land to open a range. The Dept. of Defence is involved due to it being an old military range, but as Coilte are not caretakers for the land it is their decision that is needed.

The minister at the time said the range needs significant work to bring it up to code, but it seems this Mick Power from Coilte is taking that report as the basis for refusing permission and says as much in the end of the letter where he states he will not be entertaining any submission on the matter.

now the Dept of justice controls ranges, but only from a licensing, building code, etc point of view. The land the range is no is between the prospective range builders and the land owner which in this case is the state via Coilte.


There might still be room for wiggle here. If the lads want to try i suppose they could approach the DoJ, have a meeting with the range inspector, outline the safety measures they intend to implement, the building work they MUST carry out, and then if they can get the "backing" of the DoJ/Range inspector approach Coilte again with a view to a lease on the land.

When i say backing i mean the nod. IOW if they can satisfy the DoJ/Range inspector that their plans are solid and safe then maybe Coilte will re-evaluate the proposal.


I'd really like to see things work out for the lads. Not an easy venture to undertake, even without all this grief.

Sparks

It's the killer with opening a new range - everyone has to agree to it. The Firearms Range Inspector has to give the 4A licence, the local Super has to give the 2(5) authorisation (he usually does so the moment the 4A comes through but it's not mandatory), the local council has to give planning permission, and at any one of those hurdles, it can all come crashing down. And when you have a group of locals - at least one of whom from that facebook page seems to be rather foul-mouthed and closed-minded and not interested in actually talking to anyone - who object to the process, things get delicate in a hurry. And sometimes intractable.

Worst case scenario, you could be out thousands of euro before someone says no because someone put in an objection based on a completely wrong idea of what was coming in.

Sikamick

Sad and sickened by this news, people in the shooting fraternity should make their feelings known in a dignified way on the Anti Range facebook page.

https://m.facebook.com/profile.php?id=563708420364919

If this happened in any other sport here in the ROI there would be a major uproar.

Sikamick

rowa

Sikamick wrote: »

Sad and sickened by this news, people in the shooting fraternity should make their feelings know in a dignified way on the Anti Range facebook page.

https://m.facebook.com/profile.php?id=563708420364919

If this happened in any other sport here in the ROI there would be a major uproar.

Sikamick

There is no point sikamick, this group have made their case through unchallenged half truths and innuendo (the constant mention of schools) , they were not interested in a reasoned debate.