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West Ham (Home) - 06-10-2013

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    #92
    bishopmuzorewa
    Closed Accounts Posts: 200 ✭✭bishopmuzorewa


    We miss Lennon unbelievably...Townsend is a Birmingham City player..fcuk me the bloke doesnt pass the fcuking ball.


    Oh and yeah dawson won't do. Bad day at the office.


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    #93
    SuprSi
    Registered Users Posts: 6,946 ✭✭✭SuprSi


    It's funny - I mentioned last night that as long as Liverpool knocked the stupid home results on the head, they'd be in with a great chance of the top 4. Now look what's happened! This is one of those stupid results. What's worse is that it's right before an international break so AVB doesn't have time to get them sorted. Not good to leave things like that.


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    #94
    mickman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,661 ✭✭✭mickman


    bishopmuzorewa wrote: »
    We miss Lennon unbelievably...Townsend is a Birmingham City player..fcuk me the bloke doesnt pass the fcuking ball.


    Oh and yeah dawson won't do. Bad day at the office.

    Wouldn't agree at all. Townsend was our only half decent player today, also he made an excellent sliding tackle to stop a west ham goal

    Townsend is one of the first names on the team sheet at the moment


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    #95
    jobeenfitz
    Registered Users Posts: 2,443 ✭✭✭jobeenfitz


    Our big problem for years has been our strikers. Its a shock result. Give AVB something to mull over for the next two weeks. Soldado could yet prove to be the solution. We are only three points off the top with loads of new players getting used to the premier league. We were disappointing today but its early days. Ther'l be days like this. Wont bother with MOTD tonite, I'l read a book instead. No point in annoying myself.


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    #96
    bishopmuzorewa
    Closed Accounts Posts: 200 ✭✭bishopmuzorewa


    mickman wrote: »
    Wouldn't agree at all. Townsend was our only half decent player today, also he made an excellent sliding tackle to stop a west ham goal

    Townsend is one of the first names on the team sheet at the moment

    we must be watching different games. When Lennon is fit, Townsend will be back on the bench.


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    #97
    mushykeogh
    Registered Users Posts: 1,467 ✭✭✭mushykeogh


    bishopmuzorewa wrote: »
    Oh and yeah dawson won't do. Bad day at the office.

    He looked like a right clown falling on his hoop for that third goal. He is not a pretty sight when moving backwards.


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    #98
    mickman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,661 ✭✭✭mickman


    bishopmuzorewa wrote: »
    we must be watching different games. When Lennon is fit, Townsend will be back on the bench.

    Want to bet? That won't happen

    Townsend put in a cross in the first half that any good striker would have scored from it

    Avb himself has said that Townsend has kept lamela out if the team and he will likely start for England on next international

    Sound like a player about to be dropped ?


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    #99
    KingdomYid
    Registered Users Posts: 2,994 ✭✭✭KingdomYid


    bishopmuzorewa wrote: »
    we must be watching different games. When Lennon is fit, Townsend will be back on the bench.

    There is even an argument to play both of them when fit.


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    #100
    bishopmuzorewa
    Closed Accounts Posts: 200 ✭✭bishopmuzorewa


    KingdomYid wrote: »
    There is even an argument to play both of them when fit.

    No point spending 30m to keep Lamela on the bench. In saying that did Lamela even touch the ball when he came on today.

    Lamela and Lennon for me with Townsend the odd man out.


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    #101
    2nd Row Donkey
    Registered Users Posts: 9,713 ✭✭✭2nd Row Donkey


    AVB took a gamble playing Defoe and it back fired. I don't blame AVB for picking him, JD has been on fire and has a great record against WestHam but I hope thats the last time he starts ahead of Soldado in an EPL game.

    Concerned that AVB was outsmarted by Big Sam tactics-wise. A lot of ppl commenting that the players were feeling the effects of the mid week trip to Moscow but perhaps the manager was too. Then again, big Sam doesn't get the credit he deserves when his teams pull of big results.

    That's two loses now and both where during high intensity derbies that we came up short in. Hopefully that's down the the new players gelling and the midweek EL game, expect a different performance in these kind of games in the 2nd half of the season hopefully.

    Soldado's confidence has to have been dipping as he went without goals in the last few weeks, hopefully it hasn't been damaged too much after been dropped. Last thing we need now is another confidence crisis £25m striker.


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    #102
    tippspur
    Registered Users Posts: 4,057 ✭✭✭tippspur


    Townsend was one of our better performers today in fairness.


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    #103
    gar
    Registered Users Posts: 1,099 ✭✭✭gar


    Sorry it was my bad!
    I bet on them in an accumulator and had 3 spurs players in my ff team.
    Like a perfect storm.
    Was bound to happen.

    I'll write out 100 times "I must not bet on or pick spurs players"

    Won't happen again

    Gar

    P.s. I dont get the sun shining out of townsend worship. He's very greedy. We were poor overall and didn't have any rub of the green. siggy was poor. Dont understand why more of the first team were not left behind for the trip to russia. Hope they dont do the same for the next 2 away games


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    #104
    mickman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,661 ✭✭✭mickman


    Hardly remember Townsend making any shot today . He crossed / passed everything


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    #105
    Hatch99
    Registered Users Posts: 5,395 ✭✭✭Hatch99


    OK, I'll be honest, I'm open to criticism, but it's just my opinion.

    Yesterday was tough to take. One of the worst defeats at WHL for a long time. Losing to them the way we did is sickening.
    In fairness, I praised AVB yesterday before the game for giving Defoe a chance seeing as he was scoring goals in the cup competitions, at least we now know where we stand. I'm not saying Soldado was doing anything wrong, he was doing ok, he had scored a couple and had a couple of assists, but maybe the manager thought Defoe would be a better goal threat than him, the chance early in the 2nd half proved otherwise.
    Yesterday we had too many players off form, the likes of Eriksen and Sig offered little, while Dembele once again floated in and out of the game and did very little. Our defending at times was worrying, strange considering we started the season with such a good defensive record.

    In my opinion, the likes of Dawson and Naughton are just not good enough. Yes Dawson will win headers and throw his body down to block balls, but is he of the top standard that we need to get where we want to be, no. He has made too many mistakes for me, and it's now time to either put Kaboul in after the Int break with Jan or else use the Romanian. Don't get me wrong, I wouldn't bomb Dawson completly, but what I'm saying is that he isn't good enough to be a regular in our side in the PL. Naughton is not PL standard, not for us anyway, maybe for a side hoping to finish mid-table or achieve survival. Who ever said we had 2 excellent players in each position:o, if only.

    I have said it before and I'll say it again about Dembele, he isn't doing enough. Doesn't create enough, fcuk all assists, nevers scores, sideways passes... for the money we paid for him, he should be running games, when was the last time he controlled a game for us, I can't remember....played brilliant at Anfield last season for an hour, has he played that well since ??

    Some people saying Townsend is crap and shouldn't be in the side, gimme a break lads. He has been our best player this season. Some saying Lamela should be in the side....I won't have a go at Lamela as he's only in the door, so he needs time to settle which is understandable but to say he should be in the team is a joke. He has come on in games and played against the rubbish sides in Europe, has he impressed enough to warrant a starting place, no chance. He has actually dissapointed me considering the money we paid for him, but like I said too early to judge.

    Very angry and bitter after yesterday, 2 weeks now before we get a chance to make up for it...brings everyone back down to earth a bit.


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    #106
    DubPerryman
    Registered Users Posts: 2,284 ✭✭✭DubPerryman


    Hatch I agree with a lot of what you said.

    A defeat is never easy to take, particularly a 3-0 defeat at home. Though I think the league will be that way this year - who imagined Villa going to Arsenal and destroying them, who imagined United getting hammered by City and then turned over by West Brom at home. The key for us now is to get over yesterday's result and focus on competing for 4th place.

    The break has come at a good time for us, we need to get a few players fit plus a few more training sessions together will do them no harm.

    Villa next - they've beaten Arsenal and City, so we can't be complacent.


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    #107
    mickman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,661 ✭✭✭mickman


    I agree with some of what you write Hatch but not all.

    Demeble for me is a very good player - he wins the ball back and breaks up the play quite well. Having said that, dembele has played way too many games already this season and sandro should have played yesterday .

    Naughton is not first choice and is an ok player - he is versatile and is our cover for both full back positions.

    I agree more or less on Dawson - he makes a lot of errors but we definetely need to keep him in the squad

    The biggest mistake yesterday was starting defoe. When defoe plays , he doesnt care about the team and is only concerned about getting on the score sheet, that is not enough for a top striker. Soldado is very unselfish and links up play much better then defoe. I reckon if soldado played yesterday we would have seen more of eriksen and siggy - its hardly just a co-incidence that the one game soldado doesnt play we see almost nothing of siggy and eriksen

    So i would have played sandro and soldado yesterday - lamela is miles behind the pace and intensity needed for a london derby so bringing him on was a waste of time.

    AVB has slipped up a little this season with decisions - lets hope we put it right against villa


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    #108
    Hatch99
    Registered Users Posts: 5,395 ✭✭✭Hatch99


    DubPerryman wrote: »
    Hatch I agree with a lot of what you said.

    A defeat is never easy to take, particularly a 3-0 defeat at home. Though I think the league will be that way this year - who imagined Villa going to Arsenal and destroying them, who imagined United getting hammered by City and then turned over by West Brom at home. The key for us now is to get over yesterday's result and focus on competing for 4th place.

    The break has come at a good time for us, we need to get a few players fit plus a few more training sessions together will do them no harm.

    Villa next - they've beaten Arsenal and City, so we can't be complacent.

    But I don't think the league will be too different this year.. City, United, Chelsea, Arsenal will all be at the top of the league come Xmas, so yes while teams will take points off each other, the top sides will climb to the top after 15/20 games. Defeats like yesterday are massive. Imagine going in to the International break off the back of another win and being right in the hunt, instead we have just suffered one of our worst defeats in while and all is negative.


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    #109
    Hatch99
    Registered Users Posts: 5,395 ✭✭✭Hatch99


    mickman wrote: »
    I agree with some of what you write Hatch but not all.

    Demeble for me is a very good player - he wins the ball back and breaks up the play quite well. Having said that, dembele has played way too many games already this season and sandro should have played yesterday .

    Naughton is not first choice and is an ok player - he is versatile and is our cover for both full back positions.

    I agree more or less on Dawson - he makes a lot of errors but we definetely need to keep him in the squad

    The biggest mistake yesterday was starting defoe. When defoe plays , he doesnt care about the team and is only concerned about getting on the score sheet, that is not enough for a top striker. Soldado is very unselfish and links up play much better then defoe. I reckon if soldado played yesterday we would have seen more of eriksen and siggy - its hardly just a co-incidence that the one game soldado doesnt play we see almost nothing of siggy and eriksen

    So i would have played sandro and soldado yesterday - lamela is miles behind the pace and intensity needed for a london derby so bringing him on was a waste of time.

    AVB has slipped up a little this season with decisions - lets hope we put it right against villa

    How has he played too many games, we are in October mate, not March. I just don't get this too many games thing. You can use it as an excuse come easter but not in the first week of October.


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    #110
    mickman
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,661 ✭✭✭mickman


    Hatch99 wrote: »
    How has he played too many games, we are in October mate, not March. I just don't get this too many games thing. You can use it as an excuse come easter but not in the first week of October.

    Too many games in a short space of time exhausts a player


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    #111
    Hatch99
    Registered Users Posts: 5,395 ✭✭✭Hatch99


    mickman wrote: »
    Too many games in a short space of time exhausts a player

    I'm not having it Mick, we've played 7 league games and a couple of cup games and we are saying players are tired or exhausted......


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    #112
    Bodie Doyle
    Registered Users Posts: 320 ✭✭Bodie Doyle


    Why did AVB play Dembele & Defoe on Thursday night for 90 minutes and start both of them yesterday? I really despise the Europa league and AVBs thinking towards it. Spurs had to travel over 3000 miles and get a team ready to play in a meaningless tie while big Sam could use the entire week to plan for the derby. Oh yes did AVB forget that the game v West Ham was a derby and way more important to us fans than that god awful Europa group stage tie?
    And the his post match comments made my blood boil. "we had more possession, were in control, they hit us with a set piece" Bull****. West Ham (yes the team that were in the bottom 3 before the game) were by far the better team yesterday. They played without a striker ffs. We had too many players who thought all they had to do was show up to win the game. I thought we got rid of that attitude. Same old Spurs.
    Pissed off here this morning.


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    #113
    Hatch99
    Registered Users Posts: 5,395 ✭✭✭Hatch99


    Bodie Doyle wrote: »
    Why did AVB play Dembele & Defoe on Thursday night for 90 minutes and start both of them yesterday? I really despise the Europa league and AVBs thinking towards it. Spurs had to travel over 3000 miles and get a team ready to play in a meaningless tie while big Sam could use the entire week to plan for the derby. Oh yes did AVB forget that the game v West Ham was a derby and way more important to us fans than that god awful Europa group stage tie?
    And the his post match comments made my blood boil. "we had more possession, were in control, they hit us with a set piece" Bull****. West Ham (yes the team that were in the bottom 3 before the game) were by far the better team yesterday. They played without a striker ffs. We had too many players who thought all they had to do was show up to win the game. I thought we got rid of that attitude. Same old Spurs.
    Pissed off here this morning.

    Hang on, correct me if I'm wrong, but did we not start with 7 different players yesterday compared to the EL game, Lloris Walker Dembele and Defoe started both games, so because 4 of the starting 11 yesterday started on Thursday is the reason we got stuffed.... we need better excuses than that lads..

    We are all annoyed but using last Thursdays game as an excuse is lame.


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    #114
    Bodie Doyle
    Registered Users Posts: 320 ✭✭Bodie Doyle


    Hatch99 wrote: »
    Hang on, correct me if I'm wrong, but did we not start with 7 different players yesterday compared to the EL game, Lloris Walker Dembele and Defoe started both games, so because 4 of the starting 11 yesterday started on Thursday is the reason we got stuffed.... we need better excuses than that lads..

    We are all annoyed but using last Thursdays game as an excuse is lame.

    Supposedly we have 2 players for every position. Why play Defoe again on Sunday after 90 mins and a trip halfway around the world when you have a 30m ( miles better) replacement on the bench. That goes the same for Dembele. Why start him when Sandro or even Holtby could have played.
    I am not using the Europa league as an excuse for yesterday rather i am pointing out how stupid our manager can be sometimes.


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    #115
    Bodie Doyle
    Registered Users Posts: 320 ✭✭Bodie Doyle


    Hatch99 wrote: »
    Hang on, correct me if I'm wrong, but did we not start with 7 different players yesterday compared to the EL game, Lloris Walker Dembele and Defoe started both games, so because 4 of the starting 11 yesterday started on Thursday is the reason we got stuffed.... we need better excuses than that lads..

    We are all annoyed but using last Thursdays game as an excuse is lame.

    Supposedly we have 2 players for every position. Why play Defoe again on Sunday after 90 mins and a trip halfway around the world when you have a 30m ( miles better) replacement on the bench. That goes the same for Dembele. Why start him when Sandro or even Holtby could have played.
    I am not using the Europa league as an excuse for yesterday rather i am pointing out how stupid our manager can be sometimes.


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    #116
    Leinstersqspur
    Registered Users Posts: 2,290 ✭✭✭Leinstersqspur


    Agree about Dawson but not Moussa. Dembele was man of the match v Chelsea last weekend then played 90mins in a carpark in Russia on Thursday night. That was a big mistake by AVB, not Dembele.

    Also, why would you bnch Soldado for Thursday night and then Sunday again? Defoe should not have started both games.

    That said, I won't be getting bent out of shape over this and will chalk it up to an off day at the office following an EL hangover...


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    #117
    Hatch99
    Registered Users Posts: 5,395 ✭✭✭Hatch99


    Bodie Doyle wrote: »
    Supposedly we have 2 players for every position. Why play Defoe again on Sunday after 90 mins and a trip halfway around the world when you have a 30m ( miles better) replacement on the bench. That goes the same for Dembele. Why start him when Sandro or even Holtby could have played.
    I am not using the Europa league as an excuse for yesterday rather i am pointing out how stupid our manager can be sometimes.

    The only way I or the manager no doubt can justify it is by saying that Defoe has been in better form, scored again on Thursday and might be a better goal threat, and listen Defoe couldn't be fcuking tired could he.
    Leinstersqspur wrote: »
    Agree about Dawson but not Moussa. Dembele was man of the match v Chelsea last weekend then played 90mins in a carpark in Russia on Thursday night. That was a big mistake by AVB, not Dembele.

    Also, why would you bnch Soldado for Thursday night and then Sunday again? Defoe should not have started both games.

    That said, I won't be getting bent out of shape over this and will chalk it up to an off day at the office following an EL hangover...
    We must have been watching a different game if Dembele was MOTM against Chelsea.
    I don't get the EL hangover thing at all.


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    #118
    Bodie Doyle
    Registered Users Posts: 320 ✭✭Bodie Doyle


    Hatch99 wrote: »
    The only way I or the manager no doubt can justify it is by saying that Defoe has been in better form, scored again on Thursday and might be a better goal threat, and listen Defoe couldn't be fcuking tired could he.


    We must have been watching a different game if Dembele was MOTM against Chelsea.
    I don't get the EL hangover thing at all.

    YOU must have been watching a different game as Dembele WAS selected as MOTM against Chelsea. He was outstanding in that game.

    I think you are missing the point about Defoe. We have a number of strikers and only 1 of they can play. It makes sense for Defoe to play on Thursday (when he can show the world how he can score v Anzi, Tromso and the other world beaters) and ano on Sunday. Soldado should have played. It was a chance for him to break his duck ( penalties aside) in the league. Everyone could see that. We paid 30m for Soldado. Play him. Defoe showed everyone on Sunday what his limitations are.


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    #119
    Leinstersqspur
    Registered Users Posts: 2,290 ✭✭✭Leinstersqspur


    Hatch99 wrote: »
    We must have been watching a different game if Dembele was MOTM against Chelsea.

    He was voted MOTM by Spurs fans on the back of his 53 Passes, Completed 91%, Tackles 4/4, Take Ons 8/8, Chances Created 1, Interceptions 2
    Hatch99 wrote: »
    I don't get the EL hangover thing at all.

    Why? West Ham played their last game away to Hull the previous Saturday and had all week to recover, train and prepare. Our squad (except for Jan & Paulinho) travelled Moscow on Tuesday night and got back Friday morning. Hardly ideal preparation for a London derby? The EL is a curse!


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    #120
    Hatch99
    Registered Users Posts: 5,395 ✭✭✭Hatch99


    Bodie Doyle wrote: »
    YOU must have been watching a different game as Dembele WAS selected as MOTM against Chelsea. He was outstanding in that game.

    I think you are missing the point about Defoe. We have a number of strikers and only 1 of they can play. It makes sense for Defoe to play on Thursday (when he can show the world how he can score v Anzi, Tromso and the other world beaters) and ano on Sunday. Soldado should have played. It was a chance for him to break his duck ( penalties aside) in the league. Everyone could see that. We paid 30m for Soldado. Play him. Defoe showed everyone on Sunday what his limitations are.

    Oustanding in a game where we were murdered in the 2nd half, if he was that good surely we'd of had more control of the game in the 2nd half no ?

    We have a number of strikers ?? We have 2, don't count the other excuse of a player. I agree, I'd have played Soldado, but I'm trying to justify what the manager could have been thinking, he's the one paid to make the decisions, some he gets right, other wrong. I have gone on record before as saying Defoe needs 4 chances to score, so trust me, I'm not the chairman of his fanclub.
    Leinstersqspur wrote: »
    He was voted MOTM by Spurs fans on the back of his 53 Passes, Completed 91%, Tackles 4/4, Take Ons 8/8, Chances Created 1, Interceptions 2



    Why? West Ham played their last game away to Hull the previous Saturday and had all week to recover, train and prepare. Our squad (except for Jan & Paulinho) travelled Moscow on Tuesday night and got back Friday morning. Hardly ideal preparation for a London derby? The EL is a curse!

    Stats from Sky, please man, Huddlestone would be Beckenbauer if you go by those types of stats. No it's not ideal preperation, but that's football, would you rather have finished 8th last year than 5th ? United played Shakhtar on Wed night, and played after 2 days gap, the same as us, what's the difference ?? They had Thursday Friday, we had Friday Saturday (yes sometimes they play the Tuesday I know).. that's European football, I'd rather be in it than not.


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    #121
    Bodie Doyle
    Registered Users Posts: 320 ✭✭Bodie Doyle


    Hatch99 wrote: »
    Oustanding in a game where we were murdered in the 2nd half, if he was that good surely we'd of had more control of the game in the 2nd half no ?


    OK Hatch we get it, you don't like/rate Dembele. You will not admit to him having a great game even when his own fans vote him MOTM, the commentator on Bt Sports awarded him MOTM and numerous newspaper/websites after the game commended him on his performance.
    We were thoroughly outplayed by Chelsea in the second half i agree but he was still our best player. What does it say about the rest.
    You made a comment earlier on in this thread about how much Dembele cost and how he has not paid us back yet. When are we allowed to bring up the cost of new players who have underperformed? We will of course give them time but after spending 100m this window we fans expected a little bit more from the new lads yesterday.


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