NDLS - National Driver Licence Service centres (Qs, waiting times, etc)

bugsntinas · 13-10-2014 11:51pm

I have a 2 part uk license and was told by the dvla that it is valid even though the photo is out by a number of years.

Kotek Besar · 14-10-2014 9:39am

Why on earth would you want to exchange your UK licence for an Irish one OP? Do you like collecting penalty points or something?

14-10-2014 10:27am

Have you no UK address to renew it to? Far better to keep it if you can.

I certainly plan on renewing mine to the UK when the time comes (once its still advantageous to have a UK one of an Irish one of course).

keithclancy · 14-10-2014 11:17am

Victoria Brief Industry wrote: »

Have you no UK address to renew it to? Far better to keep it if you can.

I certainly plan on renewing mine to the UK when the time comes (once its still advantageous to have a UK one of an Irish one of course).

One of the lads here applied to renew his Driving License card in the UK. Had to provide his addresses for the last 3 years and his NI number.

He received a standardised letter with some guff about providing false information based on the information he had submitted against his National Insurance Number. It mentioned fines up up to 1000 pounds or upto 2 Years in Prison or both.

Basically he works in Germany and lives in the UK, so pays into the German system, it threw up a red flag as he hadn't been making NI Contributions or something to that effect.

He provided them with some information proving his situation and it was fine, but I guess you should do this at your own risk if you are making a false declaration.

Mr.David · 14-10-2014 12:35pm

Afaik a foreign licence is only valid in your country of residence until the soonest of the two options below occurs:

a) it expires (MUST then be replaced with an Irish licence)
b) it is held for longer than the max. validity period for a full licence of your resident country (even if it has not expired in its country of origin), so 10 years in Ireland.

Pretty sure this is the case, unless someone knows something I don't? Have a UK licence myself, living in Ireland which I will reluctantly (I believe) have to replace with an Irish one in 7 years time.

Mo60 · 14-10-2014 1:12pm

Any EU licence is valid in Ireland until the date it expires.

14-10-2014 2:29pm

Mr.David wrote: »

Afaik a foreign licence is only valid in your country of residence until the soonest of the two options below occurs:

a) it expires (MUST then be replaced with an Irish licence)

If you have an address to renew it to then nobody is going to be any the wiser, and you can claim that the new one is now valid until it expires also.

keithclancy · 14-10-2014 2:46pm

Victoria Brief Industry wrote: »

If you have an address to renew it to then nobody is going to be any the wiser, and you can claim that the new one is now valid until it expires also.

http://europa.eu/youreurope/citizens/vehicles/driving/validity/index_en.htm

I don't think that is the case.

You can have your licence renewed (or exchanged from a licence issued by another country) only by the authorities of the country where you are resident.

As per my post above you are obtaining a license when renewing it in the UK by making a false declaration.

If you can provide information to the contrary then that would be useful as my Irish License is coming up for expiry and all places I've checked so far (European Helpline, RDW, NDLS) say I must renew it where I am resident (Netherlands)

vibe666 · 14-10-2014 5:49pm

i tried getting my old man to renew it in the UK for me, but they wouldn't do it without getting my picture done there and signing it in front of them in the post office and i didn't want to faff around and have to go over and do it myself. also tried to do it up the north last time i was there, but no luck with that either.

basically, we're going to Oz on thursday and with the photo ID out of date, I wasn't sure if it would still be legal for me to drive there as the last time I was in the UK (for a funeral just for a few hours so no time to get the licence renewed) the hire car people almost wouldn't give me the car with the expired photo ID as apparently its now an offence there to drive if you ID is out of date, even if the licence is still in date. he mentioned a £1000 fine and 2 or 3 points i AFAIR.

doesn't sound like i'd have much luck if i'm not paying national insurance there either.

anyway, it was just a quick way to get a valid licence to use for the few weeks in Oz in case I got stopped, but it might be alright.

EDit · 14-10-2014 6:40pm

Funnily enough I went through the process of getting an Irish license because I was going to the US and needed to hire a car. Anyway, because of the delays mentioned above, I didn't get the new license in time. Way we got around it was to hire the car in my wife's name (so she had to show the car hire company her full license) and have me as a named driver (and car hire company didn't need to see my license). I also checked and it appears that if the US cops had stopped me, the combination of my passport and the valid paper part of the UK license would have been sufficient (no idea if true, as I was never stopped). Possible it's the same in Oz??

vibe666 · 14-10-2014 8:45pm

yep, I'm hoping the same. thankfully it's not a hire car, we're visiting my brother in Perth and he has a dealership, so handy enough to get hold of a car for a few days without having to jump through lots of hoops!

cantdecide · 14-10-2014 9:20pm

@OP, you know that they can't give you a card there and then even if you could have it exchanged? An exchange will take longer but afaik they will take it as long as it has the counterpart (which I think you mean by the paper part). UK licence exchanges are actually trickier than most other EU countries.

vibe666 · 14-10-2014 11:17pm

I was told it could be done on the spot, but that might have been for an irish paper to irish photo licence?

cantdecide · 15-10-2014 1:42am

vibe666 wrote: »

I was told it could be done on the spot, but that might have been for an irish paper to irish photo licence?

That'd be right- you could show up first thing at the new NDLS office but the application would still have to go to the Central Licence Processing Unit and then elsewhere again for the actual licence card. I'd imagine the whole process would still take weeks

the culture of deference · 15-10-2014 11:31am

A uk license is valid until you are 70 years old, it does not matter that the card is out of date.

Having contacted the DVLA, I can confirm that the date at 4b is when only the photo expires. Your licence remains valid until such time as the DVLA revokes it, and that requires written notice.

Contrary to some police officers, out-of-date photos do not invalidate licences.

vibe666 · 16-10-2014 12:08am

the culture of deference wrote: »

A uk license is valid until you are 70 years old, it does not matter that the card is out of date.

Having contacted the DVLA, I can confirm that the date at 4b is when only the photo expires. Your licence remains valid until such time as the DVLA revokes it, and that requires written notice.

Contrary to some police officers, out-of-date photos do not invalidate licences.

when were you told that?

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-20968886

Many drivers face a fine of £1,000 if they fail to update their photo-card driving licences, according to the Driver and Vehicle Licensing Agency.

It started issuing photo-card licences 15 years ago and more than 30 million drivers now have one.

These are usually valid for 10 years and there is a legal requirement for drivers to renew the photograph at the same time as they renew their licence.

However, two million drivers have failed to do this.

And this means they could be fined up to £1,000 should they be pulled over by the police, who then discover that the photo and licence is out of date.

Even failing to notify the DVLA that you have changed address could be costly.

was in the daily mail as well, so I guess my car hire guy was right after all and the daily mail was right about one thing at least in the entire history of the newspaper! :pac:

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2257383/2m-drivers-dont-know-licence-invalid-face-fines-1-000.html

delahuntv · 16-10-2014 9:24am

but the older paper licence which is valid until your 70th birthday is still valid, doesn't need renewing (until you are 70) and valid until you are 70 in all eu countries. In 1998 they changed to a 10 year licence which has to be renewed.

As one garda said to me when I said I must switch it to an Irish licence "what would you be doing that for?"

So until Mid 2038 - I will continue with my very shoddy paper licence.

EDit · 16-10-2014 10:21am

I think the difference is between what you can get away with when driving in Ireland and possibly other EU countries, except the UK (ie, the valid paper part, regardless of whether the photo card is in date) and the requirements for most car rental firms (a valid photocard). Tbh, I probably wouldn't have bothered swapping except for the need (in US and Portugal) to hire a car

vibe666 · 16-10-2014 10:33am

long story short, don't plan on hiring any cars in the UK with an expired UK photo ID licence unless you are very lucky like me and that was only because he called the DVLA to query it and the guy on the phone didn't have a clue, so he asked his manager and let me away with a 'stern' warning that if i was caught by the police I'd be in for £1000 fine and points on my licence.

I think I'll be okay in Oz anyway, it's not a hire car I'll be driving anyway.

keithclancy · 16-10-2014 12:41pm

delahuntv wrote: »

but the older paper licence which is valid until your 70th birthday is still valid, doesn't need renewing (until you are 70) and valid until you are 70 in all eu countries. In 1998 they changed to a 10 year licence which has to be renewed.

As one garda said to me when I said I must switch it to an Irish licence "what would you be doing that for?"

So until Mid 2038 - I will continue with my very shoddy paper licence.

That's a whole shady area at the moment, depending on the country you move to.

E.G.
Lifetime French/German/UK licenses, valid until your 70 or whatever are valid in their respective countries until you are 70 unless its lost or stolen.

The tricky part now is that the EU Rules say its only valid as long as a license issued in the country where you are now resident is valid, so for example some Germans moving to Belgium and being told they need to renew it because the license is over 10 years old, whereas in Germany they don't enforce this on French licenses.

Also Ireland doesn't seem to enforce the rule either, but the UK does.

Myself I think i'll just change to a Dutch one, it would be a feckin nightmare if I lost it or it ended up in the washing machine somehow

vibe666 · 16-10-2014 1:21pm

keithclancy wrote: »

Myself I think i'll just change to a Dutch one, it would be a feckin nightmare if I lost it or it ended up in the washing machine somehow

is that the one where your missus pays for half of it? :pac:

Gwynston · 16-10-2014 3:28pm

I'm still using my old paper UK license after living in Ireland for almost 14 years. There's no photo on it, and the UK address is meaningless, but it says it's valid until my 70th birthday.

I have used it to hire cars on holiday before, but not since a few years. Is it likely I wouldn't be able to do that now as there's no photo on it?

keithclancy · 16-10-2014 3:31pm

Gwynston wrote: »

I'm still using my old paper UK license after living in Ireland for almost 14 years. There's no photo on it, and the UK address is meaningless, but it says it's valid until my 70th birthday.

I have used it to hire cars on holiday before, but not since a few years. Is it likely I wouldn't be able to do that now as there's no photo on it?

My address is wrong on my Irish license and I never had a problem.

I guess you'd just need to check with the rental company directly, nobody could really tell you for sure.

16-10-2014 4:52pm

Gwynston wrote: »

I'm still using my old paper UK license after living in Ireland for almost 14 years. There's no photo on it, and the UK address is meaningless, but it says it's valid until my 70th birthday.

I have used it to hire cars on holiday before, but not since a few years. Is it likely I wouldn't be able to do that now as there's no photo on it?

There is a possibility for some confusion here.

If you have an old UK paper licence it never had a photo or photo card and was valid until you were 70 without any form of renewal. They brought in the photocards then at some stage to accompany the paper part of the licence but anyone who had the old licence was not under any obligation to upgrade to a newer paper licence with accompanying photocard.

In simple terms if your licence pre-dates the introduction of the photocard then its valid until you are 70 without any form of renewal.

Gwynston · 16-10-2014 7:15pm

Yeah, I'm clear on that nox.

But someone mentioned in this thread that rental companies in some EU countries might not accept a photoless license as it's not much of a form of ID, and photos are pretty much standard on licenses in most countries now. I guess showing a passport ought to be enough for them though....?