The difficult second album

MojoMaker

Thoughts on this one Joey and well done boysinblack.

mossym

well, how did it go? not seen any results

joey100

Right so a race report, didn't feel like writing this on Sat evening or Sunday so probably an indication of how the race went!

Headed down on the Fri and registered that evening and took it easy for the day. Transition closed at 8.15 on the Saturday morning and my wave wasn't off until 12.15 so a long wait around. loads down from the club in earlier waves so wan't too bad waiting around. Left socks and a long sleeve jersey in transition, was 1 degree when I was racking and wasn't sure how it would be when I was heading out so better to have it and not need it than be looking for it.

Swim 12.45 (includes a long enough run to T1, I had it around 12.10 out of the water).

Lane was organised well and everyone got out pretty much together with no splitting of the group so a good swim. Led out for the first 300/400m then dropped to second for a bit and then back to lead for last 150/200m. Felt decent in the water and was moving ok, died a bit towards the end and was glad of dropping to second to get a bit of a rest. The lane worked well and we got out towards the high end of what we were aiming for. Think I was around 6th out of the water, followed by the rest of my wave.

T1 0.43

Made up a few places here, flew through it. No problems at all. Have a new sworks evade helmet with a magnetic clasp and it worked really well here when others were struggling with the cold and closing their helmet. Decided to go with no jersey and just my tri suit.

Bike 33.49 (Average power 191w, NP 219)

Fair bit slower than what I was hoping for. Got a decent enough start, into the shoes fairly quick and was moving ok. Effort was well up on where it should have been for the watts and was struggling to bring the heart rate down. Passed by 2/3 lads going out the town road only for 2 of them to be knocked down by a car doing a U turn on the worlds smallest roundabout with no indicators. Tried to push on a bit and was passed by another but the distance settled and he never really pulled any further away from me. Struggled to get going for the whole bike so tried to keep it as high as I could. Caught by a few towards the end but pulled away into T2 and through it.

T2 0.59

Struggled to sort on the tongue on one of my new runners but other than that was quick and put a bit of time into a few other lads.

Run 19.04

Tried to ease into the run rather than start off too quick and die. Overtook one straight away and was feeling comfortable-ish. Pushed the pace a bit because I knew there were a few faster runners behind me. Could see the lad who passed me on the bike up the road and used him as my target. Was gaining on him constantly and gradually made up the ground. The 3rd km is always the one I struggle with mentally and on this course it's probably the toughest km too. Picked off one or two back markers here and caught the other lad just after the turnaround. Put in a bit of a surge to get past him and put some distance between us. Back end of the race was decent and with just over 1km to go I pushed on again to try and open up what ever gap I had. Worked well and the gap was never closed from there. Pleased with some parts of the run, was a decent time and not too far off some lads I know who would be low 17 mins 5 km runners (maybe 10 seconds slower than them) but I would have expected to run faster off that bike.

overall 1.07.29 (6th place)

Not too happy with my race at all. Swim was decent, improvement on last year and wasn't too wrecked getting out. Bike I just never got going. Struggled to get the gears moving and couldn't settle and push out bigger power. I know I tried hard on the bike but it just wasn't there. This was were I lost the most time on the leaders and can't even use the excuse of the course didn't suit a smaller person, one of the top bike splits was from someone nearly the exact build of me. Some was down to just not being out on the TT bike at all this year and losing time on the turns. The big difference between NP and average power would also suggest that there were too many spikes in the power. Wasn't kept smooth at all. Run was decent, happy with the time compared to others but again felt like I never really got going. Legs just didn't want to go on the day. Low 19 min is decent on that course, like I said I know the times some much better runners did than me and I was only 10-15 seconds behind them, but then they did a faster bike than me too.

I was pretty down after the race and on Sunday. I've done a lot of training over the last few months and haven't really missed that many sessions. I know it's hard to compare years but to go very similar time to what I done last year after the run in I had last year isn't the most confidence building. Will be having a chat with the coach tonight but not sure where it goes from here. I can keep saying what I think I am able to do (31 min bike, 18.xx run) but until I actually do it all it is is talk. Talking to Laura after and she told me that I'm always the same after a sprint, I always feel the same way. Maybe there is something to that, that I just find it hard to get going in a sprint or maybe I'm looking for an excuse !!

Laura's race went well, swim wasn't the best but she has been out of the water for around 4 weeks with an ear infection and wasn't even meant to be swimming the weekend. She had the fastest bike of any of the female club members, not bad for a total of 3/4 outdoor spins since October and the rest on the turbo. She had a decent run and was happy at the end. She's all set now for her next and looking forward to a river rather than a pool swim.

Sunday 10th April

Woke up and knew straight away that I didn't have a tough race. The body was grand, bit tired but no aches or pains or tightness. A sure sign I didn't push that hard at the race. Plan was for a 2 hour easy cycle. Didn't get it in, only managed ot do an hour by the time we got back home. Even for that though I was able to hold a decent power without really feeling it in the legs.

mossym

all read pretty positive until your analysis.
few random thoughts
1) very early in the season
2) power does seem low, i'm sure the coach will have more input on that, but maybe suggests just a bad day, body not right. your regular power numbers would say you should have been higher than that.
3) very different focus this year to last.


i wouldn't go tearing up the winters work over one race. there is a bigger picture around the two halves you are doing, eye on the prize.

joey100

That was my first thought as well mossy, that it's a different focus this year and hopefully that accounts for some of it. Usually struggle at the start of the season when I move out doors on the bike to transfer the power from the turbo to outside so I'll have to make an effort to start using the TT bike outside now over the next few weeks to get that sorted.

peter kern

had seen in results that 215 and 2016 werefairly similar. so had a look here, at least you know what dosnt work and can adjust it.
if it was easy everybody would do it ...
you are about 65.5 kg ?

joey100

Yep, the weather was very similar if not a bit better this year with little if no wind. Bit colder this year but overall very similar.

Bit lighter than that Peter, I'm around 60kg. Usually between 60-61kg.

griffin100

Sorry to have missed you on Saturday Joe. I never even made the start line, a mechanical problem with the bike meant it was taken out of the car and put straight back in again :mad:

MD1983

you had a day where you seem happy with 2 out of the 3 legs and very unhappy with the bike, unfortunately the leg you are unhappy about is also the longest one and the one in which time differences can be big. i wouldnt let that overshadow the race too much, especially when you know what power you did and what you can do, chalk it down to a bad day. IIRC you set some best ever power numbers a few weeks ago so its moving in the right direction, you just havent got a race reward from it!

focus on the positives and move on!

Neady83

How's the body and mind after last weekend Joey?

joey100

Hey Neady, thanks for asking. Not too bad at the moment, been meaning to catch up on this but bit mental in work at the moment so haven't been really able to. Had to get one or two things sorted first too so first chance I'm getting really.

Right so from where I left off,

Sunday 10th April

As soon as I woke up I knew I hadn't pushed that hard in the race. Body was grand, wouldn't have known from it I was even racing the day before. Not a great sign. Plan was for 2 hours easy on the bike, was down in the inlaws for the day so only got 1 hour easy done on the turbo when I got home. Power was towards higher end of easy and felt grand.

Mon 11th April

Morning swim. Main set being 3x400 alt sw/pull. Moving fairly well in the water today, swim was the only thing I was happy enough with at the weekend but was lacking a bit of motivation this week really. Session was done but more got through than participated in!

Weather was awful on the day and plan had for a run. Normally don't mind running in the rain but again with the way the motivation was I just swapped it for Tuesdays easy turbo. Towards the higher end of easy but body still feeling good.

Tues 12th April

Done the planned run from Monday. 40 mins easy during my lunch break in work. Average pace was up on where it has been recently but still not feeling 100%. It was during this that I decided it had been going on too long so once it was over I sorted out a doctor's appointment for Friday to try and find out what was up with me.

Wed 13th April

Missed swim session. Work is mental at the moment, the Guards have completely changed the vetting system and are closing it this week. This was our closing date for accepting returned forms so got into work early and got all that sorted. Wasn't too bothered about the missed swim really either.

Lunch run. 30 mins easy, again the pace was good. Legs felt good and was moving well. Pleased with the improvement in the run pace.

Evening run with Laura. Done on the polo grounds in the park and it was a good bit softer than last week. Just done a few easy laps, average pace around 6.05 min/km and body felt good. An enjoyable run and felt better after. Around 9.5km done and around 16km for the day.

Thurs 14th April

Evening turbo. main set being 5x(1@280w,1@230w) 5 recovery and then 5 @ 280w. Held closer to 290 for the 280 bits and around 240 for the 230 bits. Legs felt decent, tried to hit closer to 280 for some of them but the cadence just seemed easier when I was holding 290. Held 290 for the 5 min section too. Good session on the bike, legs felt good and heart rate wasn't off the charts either. The body held up well during this weeks sessions and the pace was good, bit of a sign the race on Sunday didn't go 100%!

Fri 15th April

Morning doctors appointment. Went for a swim anyway, wanted to keep it as normal as possible so I wasn't going in rested and fresh, wanted it to be like a normal week. Swim was the session from Wed that I missed and was 3 x400m sw. Times not great but starting to feel better in the water and more aware of what I'm doing. Normally a good sign.

So I met with the doctor and told them how I've been feeling and what has been going on. Done a few tests, including a peak flow test. I hit around 510 for this, someone my age, height and sex should be hitting at least 640 so a sign that something isn't 100%. Anyway a few more tests done and I'm on some medication now for the next while to try and get it sorted. Doctor said it will be fairly fast acting and shouldn't affect the training, if anything it should help with it.

Fri evening run. Another decent run, pace still good and body felt a lot more comfortable for this. It wasn't that it was much easier, just felt nicer or something. 45 mins easy with a few fast 20 seconds, they weren't that fast but I was running well and covered around 10km in just under 45 mins so a nice improvement on where I had been recently enough.

Sat 16th April

Plan was for a 4hour cycle. Met up with a few lads and headed around north county Dublin, wanted more hills than flat this time so it was around the Naul and Bellewstown. Had to reset my garmin recently and I must have picked the wrong option for time, it said 4hours when we finished but when I uploaded it it was only 3hrs 40 mving time (we had to stop for a puncture twice!). Bit annoyed I didn't get the full 4hrs done but around 92km done with around 1100m of climbing so a good spin all the same. Body felt good and legs were plenty strong.

Sun 17th April

Early morning run. 1hr easy, 20 steady, 10 easy. Bit of a hilly run today but average pace for the easy around 4.45, for the steady around 4.15 so pleased with it. Was pretty comfortable for the whole thing and felt in control. Legs feeling the hilly cycle a bit but were move heavy than sore or tight. Around 19.5km ran.

For a change and to try and get me in the pool a little bit more I got in touch with Portmarnock tri club who run a swim session on Sunday evenings. All my swimming is done by myself and my own club's training times don't suit so I popped along to this. Was nice to be swimming with other people, not too many people there but something about swimming with others just makes you push that little harder. Handy enough session of bit of a warm up, then 9 x 100m as 50 easy, 50 fast with 20 recovery. Then 7 x 50 as 25 fast, 25 easy again with 20. Then 7 x 50 as 25 easy, 25 fast. Finishing with 2 x 25 flat out, around 1 min between and then 50 easy. Decent session and I enjoyed it. Will probably try and keep these going as much as I can, even just for the motivation of swimming with others. Nice change of session for me.

So overall a good week and since I've started on my prescriptions I'm just feeling a lot better overall. Mood is improved and form is better. Body just feels like it's back to normal. I still am a bit disappointed with how Laois went but it's over now and nothing I can do so I've moved on from it. From looking at my times and paces there it looks like I raced it nearly as an Olympic. The run pace and bike pace wouldn't be far out what I would expect to hold for the Olympic distance. But anyway, Outlaw half is 6 weeks yesterday so a recovery week this week before into last 3/4 week block before it.

catweazle

joey100 wrote: »

Doctor said it will be fairly fast acting and shouldn't affect the training, if anything it should help with it.

Will you need a TUE for this - whats this doctors name - I could do with some help myself

joey100

Yep, steroid based so will need the TUE. Not mad on having to take it but if it helps get me back to where I was I'll take what ever I can! e

RJM85

Just catching up on the race report now. 6th place is a decent result regardless of circumstances and its worth reminding yourself that it's a nice position to be in to be able to come 6th after a "bad race".

For what it's worth, I always struggle to hit power numbers during Sprint tri's especially pool sprints. I've put it down to a number of factors in the past, all of which I'd say are relevant here:
- training for longer distances so Sprint hasn't been the focus
- hard short swim will zap the legs more than a longer moderate one
- I tend to kick more in a pool swim than in my wetsuit, further zapping the legs

In and of itself I wouldn't think that a disappointing bike in a C race is anything to be worried about - from my own experience I had a crap bike in a Sprint 3 weeks out from my A race last year and got myself a bit worked up about it. The following week I set a 10mile TT PB and power PB and had the 5th fastest amateur bike at my A race.

joey100

Mon 18th April

Rest day, no training. Even though I was feeling good and wouldn't have minded doing something I took this off.

Tues 19th April

Too nice out to do my easy spin on the turbo so headed out for a bit. Plan was for 45 mins but done the hour, body felt good. Great evening out and nice to clear the head after work.

Wed 20th April

Morning swim. I've started going to the pool a bit later on Wed morning and it's a lot quieter. Simple enough session today with 5 x 200m sw the main set. These were to be steady and was holding around 3.20 for these for what felt like a comfortable effort.

Plan was to run tonight but my ankle has been at me again so I'm going to skip it and it will be 4 days off running so it should be good on Friday to get back into it. Feeling a lot better today so think another 2 days will be really good for it.

mossym

ankle any better today?

joey100

Yep lot better mossy, it's a strange one, it's grand walking around on it and it doesn't hurt to run on it but going up and down stairs and every now and again it lets me know that something is up. Nothing now since Tuesday evening so should be grand to run on it tomorrow evening. Handy that it's a recovery week so have only really missed one 30 minute run. Are we going to see a race report from Joey H for yourself? Hows your own training going?

mossym

wonder are you stretching it going up the stairs, Achilles or something. be careful with it, too early in the season to let a small niggle take hold

there was a race report written alright, but since i let the log go quiet it likely won't make it up here. nothing too interesting in it anyway to be honest. training going well. been a lot better over the last few weeks, got every session done which hadn't happened in a while . can see the difference as well. consistency really is key

joey100

Yep I agree 100%, it's all about hitting the sessions, no point in doing an hour longer on the bike one day and then suffering for it and missing sessions all over the place. Plan done first and then if I'm able I'll add one or two extra. Still a while to go until August now for your Race, hopefully we get a decent summer and it might make it easier to train.

Think your right about the stretching of the ankle, earlier in the week it tended to be sorer in the morning, I usually sleep with my feet pointed straight out. More on the side of the ankle than near the achilles so hoping it's nothing to do with that. I went over it a bit when I was running a week or two ago and it seems to be from then on, hopefully just a bit of a tweak but at least I'm learning something and not going to keep on running on it, just need to give it time to rest.

mossym

i don't believe in the "oh i have a similar pain so you had the same thing i have" cause there is a bunch of muscles/tendons down there, but i had an issue two years ago before and at lost sheep, muscle/tendon down the side of the ankle, between achilles and ankle bone on the inside. has flared up a couple of times since at different times, never enough to stop me but i have to watch it. shoes play a big part in it. didn't you recently change? worth bearing in mind.

Sean (sconhome) pointed out to me that often the site of pain is not the area to be worried about. found that most of my feet issues were actually in the calves. keep the calves loose, no foot pain

joey100

Wed 20th April

Evening cycle with Laura. Plan had been for 30 mins easy running but I skipped it to rest the ankle. Instead headed out for an easy spin to get Ice cream on the bike with Laura. Stopped around 11km in and had a quick Ice cream then around another 11km to home. Nothing too hectic but we did do the climb up to Ardgillan under the rail way bridge (around 1.4km of a steep enough climb) and then managed to have the wind behind us the whole way home to average around 38kmph for the 5km road home. Nice evening for a spin.

Thurs 21st April

Evening turbo. Wanted to get back onto the TT bike and because I was working a bit later than normal this was done on the turbo. Spent pretty much the whole hour in the aero position with a few surges thrown in. Body felt good and legs were good. Averaged around 192 for the hour, higher end of easy but the surges helped a bit with that.

Fri 22nd April

Early morning swim. Warm up then main set of 12 x 100m sw with 20 sec rec all steady. Averaged around 1.36 for these, one or two faster and one or two slower but averaged out. Pleased that these were done for what felt like a steady effort without ever feeling too pushed. The competitive side of me did come out when I started around 2/3 seconds behind a person leading out in the lane beside me and I made it my business to overtake them in the 100m. It's this extra bit of effort that I miss sometimes swimming by myself a lot so hopefully the swim with portmarnock tri club on Sunday evenings can introduce a bit of this.

Ankle watch: Day 5. Not bother at all with it for the last 2/3 days. No pain or anything at all yesterday and woke up this morning and it felt grand. Run will be done this evening though to give it as much rest as possible but it feels grand and the run should be good.

joey100

Fri 23rd April

First run in week pretty much. Ankle felt fine, was 40 mins easy with 5x30 build,30 easy. Probably didn't get as fast as I would have liked for the builds but legs usually like that after a few days off running. Pace was really good for heart rate today, averaged around 4.30 pace for what felt like easy effort and heart rate matched. Wasn't the smoothest run I've ever had though and felt a bike clunky but overall a good run and the ankle held up well.

Sat 24th April

First outside spin of the year on the TT bike. Took the frst 15/20 mins to get used to it again and was a bit twitchy and tight for this. Once I got moving though I was flying and had no problem holding it around 180w and again felt very easy. Had to go through a few small and bigger towns on the route but average speed was around 32kmph for the spin. Nice spin on the bike, need more time on it though, started to get a bit tight towards the end.

Sun 25th April

Plan was for 1hr easy run but got a call off of a few of my mates who were up from the country for the weekend and wanted to go on an easy cycle. It was their first cycle in a few months so it was all very easy. Average speed around 22kmph and covered around 60km so long enough but easy paced. Legs felt good throughout and even though the run probably would have been better to do at least I still got something done.

Evening swim with Portmarnock tri club again. Bit of a warm up then 8 x 100m with the middle 50 being a bit faster. 20 seconds rec. Pleased with these, was a definite change in pace and was holding low 1.30's for them. Few building 25's then and finished with 4 x 50m (25fast,25easy), 4 X 50m (25easy,25fast). Good session, pool is a bit hot though and took me a while to settle down after it. Sleep wasn't great last night and I'm putting it down to that. Their pool is closing for work in June and with my race in 5 weeks and the bank holiday along with Laura having a race on Sunday in May in reality I only have 1 more session with them for the next while.

Mon 25th April

Morning swim. Back to the 50m pool, main set being 12 x 100m sw. Holding around 1.36 for these so the same as the session I done last week. Could still feel the session from last night in the body and the broken nights sleep didn't help but it's another swim session done.

Big enough training week, 4hr bike with run of it on Saturday and a 1hr 50min run on Sunday. Outlaw half was 5 weeks yesterday so starting to get a bit real now.

joey100

Mon 25th April

Afternoon run. Met a lad from the club very early into this run and we done the majority of our run together. Kept nice and easy and covered around 8.5km in 40 mins. Nice and comfortable the whole way around and nice to have some company.

Tues 26th April

Evening turbo. Main set being 10@210w,10@230w,5@255w,10@230w,10@210w. Held around 5w above each of these and even though the legs felt a little heavy there was no real issues hitting the numbers and was pretty comfortable throughout. A good session and pleasing to be holding the numbers.

Wed 27th April

Morning swim. The plan of getting to the pool a little later on Wed mornings is working well and it's gone from being a struggle to get the session done to nearly having a lane to myself. Tough one today, 5 x 400m sw. Arms were feeling this and was meant to do some fast 50's at the end but swapped them for some easy ones because of some tightness in my left shoulder. Pace was ok, not fast but consistent, all where within 3/4 seconds of each other.

Afternoon run. Best run in a long time. Great day for running too and just missed a big hail shower. 50 mins easy, uphill pace around 4.40, downhill was 4.10 and on the flat was holding low 4.30's. Legs felt great, heart rate towards the higher end of easy and did creep out a bit but only by 1/2 beats and was very easy to pull back. Best run in a long time. Both the bike and the run seem to have a bit of form building.

Would normally run on a Wed evening too but working late and don't mind too much really, extra run session on Sat and Sundays one is longer than usual. Ankle is grand at the moment and even if I wasn't working I'd probably skip the session anyway to make sure the ankle stayed ok.

joey100

Thurs 28th april

Evening turbo. Repeat of a session I have done the last few weeks. Main set being 5x(1@280w,1@230w) then 5easy with 5 @280w to finish. Legs felt pretty good on the bike today and was holding around 10w above where I needed to for the 1min efforts. Tough but not unbearable either. Held around mid 290's for 3 mins of the 5 and then built to have average power for the 5 mins @ around 301. This last bit was tough but I could have held it at the 290 and kept it a bit easier. Average power was around 8/9 watts higher than the same session last week and that was an improvement on the week before. Good bike session.

joey100

Fri 29th April

Morning swim. Main set being 400sw,4x100pull,300sw,3x100pull,200sw,2x100pull,100sw,100pull. Was feeling this towards the end. Shoulders a little tired but nothing happening in the left shoulder so good sign. Becoming more aware of what I'm doing in the water which is normally a good sign. not especially fast today but was consistent enough.

Evening run. 50 mins easy incl 5 x20fast,40 easy. Easy pace again was good and felt nice and comfortable. Body feeling good and no issues with the ankle at all. Fast not as fast as i have gone previously but were ok, a bit of a struggle to get the legs moving quickly. Over 11km ran in the time so a good distance.

Sat 30th April

Long cycle. Done on the TT bike and was trying out some of the food and gels I'l be using for my race. Have recently started using powerbar stuff and find it easy enough on the stomach, not too bad tasting either. Plan was 1 hr easy then 4 x 20@210w,10 easy and then 30 easy. Done this on a little loop that has a few parts I could add on easily if I was in the middle of a 20 min section and wanted to keep it going. Hit the numbers for 3 of the efforts and the other two coming in just below but the route for them had a lot more downhill so was harder to put out the power. Came back home with the wind so was moving really well towards the end. Covered 135km in just over 4hrs for my longest ever spin. Neck adn shoulders got a bit tight towards the end but legs felt good and overall felt ok.

Brick run as 10 steady, 5 easy. Legs were complete jelly for the first 4 mins of this but the pace was good. Held aroudn 4.05 for the first km and then lowered a bit for the next 6 mins to around 3.55, heart rate one or two beats higher than I was aiming but once I settled it felt very comfortable. Back to around 4.30 pace for the easy and it felt like I was walking. Pleased with how I ran off the bike.

Sunday 1st May

Long run. done a bit later than I would have liked but got it done. 1hr easy, 30 steady, 20 easy. Moving well and surprised with how the legs felt, bit of tightness in the shoulders but overall was ok. Covered just over 13km for the first 1hr, the steady section was done on the toughest part of my route and was averaging around 4.20 pace which isn't great for steady but is good for the route. Legs were feeling strong and felt in control. Took a while for the heart rate to settle back after this and was quick to jump a bit. With about 10 mins left tho the wheels came off a bit, back and shoulders got very tight, and was a bit of pain in my lower back. Had to pull the pace right back but was able to keep going. Not sure if this was because of the uphill/downhill route, the fatigue from the last 2 days catching up or the fact I took nothing on during the run but will have to look at it a bit more. Covered 25km in 1hr 53 mins, garmin has me through the half marathon in around 1.35 but think this is a bit out and was closer to 1.38. Pleased with that though on this route for the majority of easy zone.

Monday 2nd May

Up early enough to get another long spin done on turbo. Body tired today, no aches or pains but just tired. Headed out on the TT bike but a combination of gusty windy, poor bike handling and a real tightness in my shoulders and neck meant I was not comfortable at al so called it very early and headed home. Around 8km done. Straight onto the turbo though for the planned session. 1hr 40 easy, 1hr@215, 20 easy. Legs a bit dead for this but no real struggles to hold the power, hour effort was tough enough and had to move around a good bit to get comfortable but held 222 so was pleased with this. 3 hours done on the turbo. I know on race day that the conditions could be similar to what they were today but after nearly getting blown under a few passing cars I thought it would be safer to turn for home. Not entirely happy with it but at least I got the session done afterall. Body feeling tired enough now, few easy enough days and than 2/3 more big enough days before the taper begins for my race. Feeling a lot more confident about it after the weekends training.

joey100

Tues 3rd May

Evening turbo. Plan said very easy and I kept it very easy. Legs a little dead but it was more getting comfortable on the saddle that was the issue. Undercarriage is a bit tender, new saddle might be in order. Still can't get fully comfortable on the adamo. Lad in the club is getting a fabric saddle so I'll have a look at that, he is replacing a sitero too so I'll check that out as well. Anyway back to the spin, heavy legs but not too bad. Averaged around 145w and it was very easy.

Wed 4th May

Morning swim. Some fast 50's that weren't fast at all, coming in around 45 seconds, body was tired this morning. Then 5 x 500sw, not too bad and not as much tightening up around the shoulders as there has been. Tried to kick a little less to save the legs a bit. Felt good in the water.

Lunch time run. Bit pressed for time so was glad it was only half an hour. Took about 12 mins to get satellites so no real idea of pace but what I did see it was around low 4.30's for upper end of easy without being at the top.

Evening run. Very very easy. Done in the park and watched some of the duathlon. Around 4.5km ran in 2 sections and never seen below 6min km pace. Legs felt better after than before.

zico10

I saw your question on fueling for long runs on MD's log. Probably more appropriate that I reply here though.

First off, I think long runs take getting used to. The body needs time to adapt and the next time you run for one hour fifty minutes, you'll probably find it will be easier than last Sunday was.

Unless it was preceded by a cycle, I wouldn't take any fuel or water with me, for a 2 hour steady run. I've sometimes done runs of this length, without even having breakfast. I wouldn't think a 'good feed' beforehand, is a good idea. I'd get away with it on the bike, but not so much when I'm running.

If the run is more 90 minutes and includes some speed work, I'll bring a gel with me. Depending on how I'm feeling in advance of the hard work, I may or may not take the gel.

But just keep trying and experimenting and you'll find out what works for you.

While we're talking about nutrition, Barry Murray is giving a talk at the Cycle SuperStore on Saturday. If you can make it, I'd get in touch with them and see if they still have places. Basic message is, you don't need near as much fuel, as you think you do. I've been to a talk he has given before and what he has to say is very interesting.

joey100

Cheers Zico, Yeah the more I think about it I don't think it was a fuel issue, more just not used to the time and distance and then fatigue in the body. My long run would normally be earlier in the day and pretty much done on empty or maybe a slice of toast and I'm usually grand (these have been up to 1hr 30 mins to now). I'll keep an eye on how I get on over the distance next time and see how the body re-acts to it.

Well done last night, you were moving well when I seen you. They need to change that race to draft legal if they are going to stick with that course though. Some serious drafting going on up the stretch where I was standing, I didn't see you drafting , so not saying it was you!

RJM85

I've found recently on long runs that what I had previously attributed to fuelling deficiencies actually seems to be down to dehydration. I've been experimenting with a few different things trying to get my head around what fuelling for the longer races will be like. My big issue seems to be fluids and salts - I've been working off 1 x 600ml bottle water with 2 x electrolyte tabs (non caffeine) per hour for anything over 90 or so minutes and it seems to work.

The other thing I'd consider in relation to fuelling is that while you don't /need/ to fuel half as much as you might think you do, overly depleting your glycogen stores during one session is just giving your body a bigger task to recover in time for your next session. I've found that I don't need gels, but if I do take them, I also seem recover better.

I'd agree with zico on the feed beforehand. Especially immediately beforehand. Likelihood is that your body won't have the time to digest what you've eaten before you actually start running and you're (in my experience at least) just inviting tummy trouble.

hf4z6sqo7vjngi

Pacing on longer runs also comes into it so may not be down to fuel before or during.