The difficult second album

rodneyr1981

Well done Joey. Nice booster heading into Dublin

joey100

Cheers folks, did I see you had a good result yourself at the weekend too Rodney???

Neady83

Great racing Joey, you have to be proud for digging in and keeping the momentum going on a tough run. Hopefully that's the confidence booster you need going into the half.

p.s. this is a stupid question but I don't know much about swimming. I notice that everyone in the tri forum talks about drafting during swimming. When you draft in a swim, is there a gentle mans agreement that you take it in turns to draft or let the stronger swimmer lead the way? Obviously you don't have a chat about it but is there ever a case where ye silently agree to take it in turns?

joey100

Cheers Neady. I've never really had an agreement with someone to draft off them, generally I just try and go toes to toes up the swim. When I'm on the toes I'll try and move up alongside them and if I feel I'm faster than them I'll push on. I wouldn't be waiting to let them on my toes but if they hang on it's no problem either. It's not really like biking where you might agree to take a certain amount of time each on the front, not in my experience anyway!

rodneyr1981

Ya cheers Joey. Improvements being made so can't complain

Neady83

joey100 wrote: »

Cheers Neady. I've never really had an agreement with someone to draft off them, generally I just try and go toes to toes up the swim. When I'm on the toes I'll try and move up alongside them and if I feel I'm faster than them I'll push on. I wouldn't be waiting to let them on my toes but if they hang on it's no problem either. It's not really like biking where you might agree to take a certain amount of time each on the front, not in my experience anyway!

Thanks for the detailed answer Joey, I just wondered if there was etiquette around it. It's interesting:)

joey100

There could well be Neady but I've never heard of it, never even thought of it until you mentioned it! I've probably been skipping my turn at the front all this time!

pgibbo

rodneyr1981 wrote: »

Well done JoeyRob. Nice booster heading into Dublin CPH

:cool: :pac:

RJM85

rodneyr1981 wrote: »

Ya cheers Joey. Improvements being made so can't complain

Fastest bike and run! Nice!

Chartsengrafs

Well done on a super result. Doesn't sound like the easiest week coming up to it so great job.

Dory Dory

Very well done you!!!! Hard work really does payoff!

joey100

Cheers folks. So Monday was taken off, not really tight or sore, more just tired. Was nice to have the day off though and took it very easy. Sometimes I can be tempted to do a bit on a day off, not on Monday.

Tues 12th July

Evening turbo. Bit of a warm up then 10 x 1 min hard, 1 easy. Legs weren't great for this but got it done. Originally aimed for 350w, this didn't last long. Scaled this back and in the end settled for 330 minimum. Most were a fair bit above this but some of the efforts hurt more than others. New 1 min power record set for the first one. Feeling it a bit after them but after around 3/4 mins this cleared and the rest was done easy.

Wed 13th July

Morning swim. Main set being 5 x 300m alt sw/pull. Shoulders a little tight in the water this morning and took a little bit to get going. I haven't been using the pull much recently and it showed on them 300's. Arms tired fairly quickly and even though I find the pull grand on the breathing, the arms were feeling it. Good session.

Afternoon run. I'd normally run twice on a Wednesday but not today, tomorrow's run is the most important of the week so will be one run today to make sure I'm ok tomorrow. Easy run today, 50 mins easy with a few 20 seconds fast included. These were done uphill, uphill fast for 20 and then turn and easy for 30 and then back up. Covered around 11.5km in the time, legs felt good and HR a lot more settled than it has been. All felt easy and was in control the whole way.

joey100

Thurs 14th July

Evening run. A bit of a change to normal and my long run on a Thurs evening. 5easy, then 3x(20steady,10easy). Pleased with how this went, HR nice and settled and pace was decent. Was always in control and even though the steady sections got tougher as it went on I always felt in control of the pace and HR. Legs tired a little towards the end but pace was consistent enough across them. Around 21.5km done in the time.

Fri 15th July

Early morning swim. Bit of pull buoy this morning and another morning I was glad of it. Legs tired after the run last night, not really stiff or sore just a bit heavy and dull. AN ok swim, not fantastic times but ti's more time and distance in the water.

joey100

Fri 15th July

Easy 1hr on the turbo. Legs a little tired but overall not too much bother with this. Again trying to keep the easy easy and seems to be working well. Busy enough weekend so needed to keep this easy really.

Sat 16th July

Long bike. 30 easy then 5x(20@80%,10 easy). Not too bad a session, hit the numbers for each one and was pleased with how it felt. Last one was a little under but that was more to do with the route than effort. Knew this at the second last one so pushed that one and held around 90%. Legs felt decent, tired a little towards the end but overall a good session. Around 100km done.

Run off the bike. 5 mod,15 steady, 10 easy. Took the HR a little bit to catch up with the effort but was averaging around 3.50 pace for the mod, felt tough but manageable. Steady averaged around 4.18 pace and felt very slow compared to what I was running, very comfortable too though. Slow went right out to around 5 min/km to try and get HR to settle. Legs a little tired towards the end but overall a good run.

Sun 17th July

Easy 2 hr bike. Headed out with Laura for this. Our first hour was pretty much all climbing, looking at garmin connect we were climbing for the first 25k of 55k. Climbed around 500m too so a good amount in that distance. Kept it nice and easy and then bit of downhill and wind behind us on the flat heading home for around 55km done. Legs little tired at the start but woke up as it went on. Lovely day for a spin and just over 2hrs done on the bike.

Mon 18th July

Rest day. Happy to have a day off the saddle at this stage, legs a little tired but nothing major.

mossym

nice training block there joey. i imagine the easy sessions with Laura are good both for keeping it easy and making the training load more amicable at home?

joey100

Def are Mossy, I run with Laura as my recovery run, stops me looking at the watch and getting caught up in numbers and some bike spins with her too. To be fair to her though she doesn't really give out or be put out by my training, at this stage she's well used to it and she see's how grouchy I get when I don't train! She's started using my training time as hers too. Weekday turbos are done together and when I'm out running during the week she would usually head out too, most of my own planned runs are done at lunch time in work and usually if I'm running in the evening it's a recovery run. Nice to have a bit of company when I'm training as well. I'd say 95% of my training is done solo so nice for a change. If I'm out by myself I get caught up in trying to hold an average speed or power, when we go out together I take it easy, she doesn't be flat out either tho.

She's getting better and better, will have to stop running my recovery runs with her soon, shes getting too fast! Sunday bike spin was good, she enjoys getting out on the bike but wouldn't know the area too well, so we went looking for some hills, and there is plenty close to us! This Sunday will be more of the same but probably some steeper stuff. She likes using me as her lead out man for strava segments too, she must have got about 10 top 10's on Sunday's spin.

hf4z6sqo7vjngi

joey100 wrote: »

Def are Mossy, I run with Laura as my recovery run, stops me looking at the watch and getting caught up in numbers and some bike spins with her too. To be fair to her though she doesn't really give out or be put out by my training, at this stage she's well used to it and she see's how grouchy I get when I don't train! She's started using my training time as hers too. Weekday turbos are done together and when I'm out running during the week she would usually head out too, most of my own planned runs are done at lunch time in work and usually if I'm running in the evening it's a recovery run. Nice to have a bit of company when I'm training as well. I'd say 95% of my training is done solo so nice for a change. If I'm out by myself I get caught up in trying to hold an average speed or power, when we go out together I take it easy, she doesn't be flat out either tho.

She's getting better and better, will have to stop running my recovery runs with her soon, shes getting too fast! Sunday bike spin was good, she enjoys getting out on the bike but wouldn't know the area too well, so we went looking for some hills, and there is plenty close to us! This Sunday will be more of the same but probably some steeper stuff. She likes using me as her lead out man for strava segments too, she must have got about 10 top 10's on Sunday's spin.

You old romantic......and domestique.:pac:

joey100

I know my place JB! Sure sometimes we even hold hands cycling on the turbo's....

joey100

Right so back from tales of my romantic nature to training.

Tues 19th July

evening turbo. Plan was 10 x 1.5 min hard,1.5 mins easy. After 2 of these I blew up, power no where near where I had it last week, not so much HR as just legs didn't have it. Altered the session a bit to finish it out, so after the tough first 2 I done 13x1 min hard, 1.5mins easy. This worked a bit better, for the first 2 I really felt it was the last 30 seconds that killed me, these where still tough but could actually get through them. Should have done 15 mins in total hard, in the end I done around 16 mins so hopefully some benefit from the session there. I did find that after around 8 of them my legs opened up a bit and was holding a higher power for the last few than the first few.

Wed 20th July

Morning swim. Main set was 5 x 400m alt sw/pull. Bit like the turbo it took me a good while to get going on these. Was around half way through the middle swim one before I felt my arms were loosened out and starting to work properly. Decent enough session overall though.

Lunch time run. Another long run tomorrow so only one run today. Around 55 mins easy. Legs felt ok, little tired, HR a little high and kept it nice and easy for the full time. Legs opened up a little as I went on, not my fastest run but it's more miles done.

joey100

Thurs 21st July

Evening run. From looking at the training plan this run looked like the most important session of the week. Had only ran once on Wed to try and get to it in the best shape I could. Legs were pretty tired today though and felt heavy all day. Run was done after work. Plan was 5 easy then 3 x(5mod,10steady,15 easy). First one wasn't too bad, mod was a bit of a push but was averaging around 3.45 pace, steady felt very easy and was running around 4.20 pace and then easy around 4.45 pace. It was the easy ones that felt tougher than the others really, these were the ones I started to tighten up on and feel a few little niggles. Second set was decent, mod around same, steady drifted a little and easy a little too. Legs starting to feel it though. Last one was tough, mod around the same but steady drifted a little again, and by the time I got to the easy my legs were gone. Knees were tightening and stomach wasn't playing ball either. I had purposely ran away from the house because I knew if I passed it earlier I'd probably just go home. Cut it around 5 mins short in the end, had to walk the last little bit home but legs felt better after that and muscles started to loosen out a bit. The changing of pace is what I found tough, mod was tough, steady felt grand but it was the easy were everything caught up on me. By the third easy my legs were really tight, heavy and just felt really uncomfortable. Still though a good run and pleased with the mod sections.

Fri 22nd July

Morning swim. felt alright in the pool this morning, legs tired but not as tired as they felt on Thurs before the run. Fair bit of pull stuff this morning and gave me a chance to work on my catch a little. Lane was busy but if I got caught behind someone I changed my hands to fists and tried swimming like that. It's a drill I find works well for me and rather than get annoyed and trying to slow right down behind someone gave me something else to concentrate on. Pleased with the effort in the pool this morning, no going through the motions, felt I was actually there and working. A good swim.

joey100

Fri 22nd July

Evening turbo. 1hr easy, kept a bit easier than normal, around middle of easy zone and felt ok.

Sat 23rd July

Morning cycle. Same as last week with 30 easy then 5 x(20@200w,10easy). Tired setting out for this and struggled a bit to get out the door. Held the power better than last week for the intervals, AP was above 200 for each and I'd say NP was closer to 210-215. Legs tired a bit as it went on but still no real problems putting out the power. Back and shoulders got a bit sore towards the end but think that was more the road surface, really not great in parts. Can't get the file off the garmin, says it doesn't support the file type (.fit). Bit of a pain because it was a good spin! Around 101km done in just over 3hours.

Straight off the bike into 5 mod,15steady, 10 easy. Didn't push too hard at the start like I did last week and ran knowing the HR would catch up. Watch had first km at 3.19 but think that was wrong. I'd say it was closer to 3.40 pace, this what I was running after the first km. Steady felt easy after the first 3/4 mins of letting the HR settle, first km was around 4.25 but picked up for the next two to just under 4.20 pace. Kept the easy very very easy and didn't even really look at the pace (was around 5min/km) and just ran to HR and time. 7km done off the bike. I don't think I have ever been as tired or have my legs as tired as they were when I finished this session. Think it's more cumulative thing than this session by itself but I spent pretty much the rest of the day lying on the couch. Need to keep an eye on what I drink on the bike too, was better today but probably still a little short. Will just have to remember to keep drinking on the bike.

Sunday 24th July

As tired as the legs were yesterday they weren't too bad at all this morning. Another easy spin with Laura. Went out looking for a few more hills today. Headed to the Naul and then from there to Bellewstown. Plenty of hills found and legs felt good. HR was under control and felt good on the bike. Stopped for coffee in Duleek and then headed back home on a flatter route on the coast. A Little push at times along the coast road but still well within easy. Plan was for 2hrs, ended up doing around 2hr 40 min and just under 65km. All kept very easy though and felt grand getting off the bike.

joey100

Mon 25th July

Day off. Glad off this. Went for a walk in the evening and felt better for it. Legs a lot better today. Seem to have got over Saturday pretty quick.

Tues 26th July

Planned morning swim but have to move it to Friday. Only a Turbo so. Main set being 10x 30 seconds hard, 1.5 min easy. Legs a lot better for this than last weeks turbo. Held the power well, started a little conservatively and built through each one. Held over or around 400w for a good few and was pleased with this. Body a little tired but feeling good.

Wed 27th July

Evening run. Had hoped to do this at lunch time in work but just completely forgot! Done in the evening. 30 mins easy with few fast sections in it. Legs and body felt pretty good. Pace averaged around 4.40 and felt very very easy. Tired a little towards the end but think this was as much mental knowing it was ending soon. In the end around 35 mins done.

Thurs 28th July

Done the missed swim session from Tuesday today. 20x50m alt fast and easy. Averaged around 42 for the fast with the first one going 39. Again at times it's clicking and feels effortless, others it feels like I'm fighting the water but good signs there. 5 x100m steady to finish. These all came in around 1.35 and was pleased with the consistency. Felt good in the water today.

joey100

Thurs 28th July

Evening run. 30 easy, 15 steady, 5 mod, 5 easy. Pleased with this run, felt in control and pace was good. Legs a little tight and a few little niggles I've never felt before but overall a good comfortable run.

Fri 29th July

Day off.

Sat 30th July

Morning cycle. Done on the turbo, little stuck for time and less faffing about using the turbo. 1hour easy, 20@90%,20@80%,20 easy. Kept the easy easy and then made sure I hit the targets for the efforts. Aimed a little higher, I find power easier to put out on the turbo compared to the road so aimed for 95% and 85%. Held the power well and was comfortable enough. No problem holding the numbers and legs were grand.

Straight off bike onto run. 2 mins mod, 8 easy. Pace for mod was good and each week I run off the bike it's feeling better and better. Around 3.40 pace and was feeling comfortable enough. 2 mins isn't really long enough for HR to fully catch up with effort but pleased with the perceived effort.

Sun 31st July

Easy spin with Laura. Plan was for 45 mins but ended up a fair bit longer. Around 1hr 45 done, but kept very easy for the whole thing. Power just barely into easy above recovery. Legs felt good and strong though.

Mon 1st August

Another easy spin on the bike. Around 52km today and just under 2 hours, headed for a few hills but kept the power well in easy zone. No real fatigue in legs after the last 2 days biking. Legs feeling good.

Club have one of their summer TT's on tonight so going to give it a go. Bike is in the car to head straight after work and have the disc with me so hopefully I get to give it a go. It's around 17km stretch and is a fairly gentle climb for most of it. Think last time I done it I was around 26.30, must look it up and see, so will be hoping for better than that tonight. Looking forward to it.

joey100

Tues 2nd August

Club TT. Around 17km on a lumpy enough course, seemed to have more climbing than downhill and the downhill sections seemed to be worse road surface but I think some of that is down to how I was feeling during the race and probably not a real course guide!

Got there nice and early, had no idea how long it would take me to get there after work so had a bit of time to kill. Got the bike sorted and took it easy. Should have done a decent warm up here but put it off and in the end never really got a proper one done, bit of a chat with another lad from the club while we warmed up but was going off feel rather than by power or HR. Not the best start! This was more a run out to see how the training has been going rather than a race so wasn't too worried about positions or anything like that. Made a silly mistake and never linked the garmin to the PM on the TT bike before the race and only found out when I was 10 seconds into the race, had been using it on the road bike last time so have no power info from the TT which was the main reason I was doing it. Whole race done on feel. No harm in that either.

Started well enough but could feel the lack of a decent warm up in the legs, one or two corners I was a little slow around, wasn't 100% sure how tight they were but kept pushing the majority of the time. No real benefit from the wind tonight, slight crosswind/headwind, . Took around 6/7km for the legs to settle in and start to feel ok. Just concentrated on pushing the speed up and trying to get 'over' the gears on the flat and downhill rather than recovering on these and spinning a bit. Worked well and with around 2.5km to go I caught the lad who started a min in front of me and we had put time into the lads who started in front of him. Finished in 25.49, over a min faster than the last time I done this route in tough enough conditions. Really pleased with this. 1min over 17km is a big enough improvement and I would like to think on a flatter route I would be close to 30 mins for 20km. I haven't had a chance to take the race off the garmin but the lad who finished 2nd and 1 min behind me had an average speed of around 38kmph so I was probably close enough to 39kmph. Not bad on that route and surface. Just a pity I have no power data from it. If I get a chance to do it again I'll probably hide the power on the garmin and just race the same way. I didn't get caught up in the numbers and felt that even from the training with the power meter I had a better idea how to pace, especially on the climbs. This was were I put the biggest time into the lad in front of me.

Was talking to a few of the lads in the club on the way back and it turned to the power of your mind over your body. This is something my coach has talked to me about before and even though I have improved it I think it's something I still suffer from a bit. The lads knew a little more about it than me and when I got home I had a quick look into it, this as well as Bryan McCrystal linking on his facebook to a talk from Kent university about it was good timing. Interesting stuff and gave me something to think about, especially in my training and how I race. I get too caught up in my head a lot of the time. Best example is an early season duathlon I done, there's a lad in the club who has always been a better runner than me, and a good bit better. I was close enough to him on the first run, started well, felt good, then when I got close to him I started to think that I was running well to be this close to him, then I thought about it a bit more and was thinking I must be pushing hard to be this close. Ended up backing off a bit, nearly convinced myself I was working too hard. Came into T2 together and I got out quicker, again too much into my head, over thinking it. Thinking I must be running too hard to be ahead of him still. Eventually slowed and he caught me, let him go ahead, thinking he would be a much faster runner than me. In the end he beat me by around 6 seconds. Looking at it now I gave him too much respect, he is a good runner and would usually beat me on a duathlon or run race, but there was no reason on that day I couldn't have won. I over thought it and got caught up in it. I probably do the same on the bike too, I need to learn to switch that off a bit and push myself a little harder. Even writing this sounds like I am over thinking it! But I need to be aware of it to try and sort it out. Zico has said before I probably stick too much to HR and computers. From my last 2 races where I have set pb's (a recent 5km and this TT) I didn't use them at all, in the running race I just ran hard and last night I just pushed. Might be something in it! They have their place alright but I just need to work on how I use them and what I do with the information they give me.


And back out of my mind to my training,

Wed 3rd August

Morning swim. Main set being 12 x 100m steady. A strange morning in the pool, started feeling like I was swimming in custard, got better and then slowed again. Legs feeling the effort from last night a little. A girl in my lane was getting some instruction from her coach, I heard a bit of it when I was stopped between 100's and used some of what he said. Seems to work well, slowing my stroke a little and worrying less about arm turnover and more about getting a good stroke. Seemed to get a good return on effort from this. More thinking! I promise there will be some training on this log and less of my ramblings!

hf4z6sqo7vjngi

Some of my best race performances have been this season, i put some of it down to shutting off my brain when racing and not overthinking (still a WIP).
I don't pay half as much attention as i used to on power, pace and a thousand other metrics. I was ten times as bad as you, Tunney can attest to that when he used to coach me:)
They have their place but in short races like a SPR or a TT its just go as hard as you can and race those around you, the data can be reviewed afterwards.
No reason why you cannot be challenging for wins next season!

MD1983

i sold my power meter and on my garmin now i generally put it on indoors mode when i am out running and use it just for telling me the time! reason was that i used to look at my power and pace/HR and conclude that i was tired and then that just spiralled into abandoned sessions thinking i needed a rest (something i have seen you do based on HR from time to time). if i was still using tech since the baby arrived i would have completed few sessions i imagine on the conclusion that i was tired!

not saying that no tech is the right approach for you but i have wondered before when reading your log would you have completed more of your planned sessions without tech and overall would you be worse or better off (you refer from time to time to your HR being not where you expect it)?

joey100

I'd agree with you MD. I'm pretty new to HR training really and was making the mistake of thinking of HR as a constant, so the only thing that would have an effect on HR was the training that I was doing at that time. I wasn't taking into account the previous day's training, sleep or other factors. My run training also took a bit of a jump this year, on average around an extra 10km a week and I wasn't thinking of the impact this was having on the body. Again I was getting caught up in what pace I should be running at that HR. It's only really now, after nearly 2 years of training with HR, that I'm starting to realise that if the HR is high to just slow down. Some days will be better than others, some days pace will be great for HR and others will be slow days. I'm starting to accept that and starting to go a bit more on how I feel at a particular HR rather than how fast I'm going.

The other thing I do is just think 'what would RJM do', that usually motivates me to keep going and not cut a run short!

RJM85

The answer to that question is almost always have some beer and cake.

joey100

Wed 3rd August

Evening run. 30 mins easy, 20@HIM pace, 10 easy. Windy tonight so found it a little harder to judge the pace. I aimed for around the pace I ran in Nottingham, so was aiming for around 4.10. The splits for each km in the 20 mins were a little faster than this, averaging around 4.05. I wouldn't say it was entirely comfortable but wasn't the worst either. Few drags on the route and blustery wind, hopefully that meant I was working a little harder than I will have to on the day. On a positive note, before outlaw half I struggled to run around 5 mins at this pace so that has to be a plus.

Edit: Finally got my stuff off my garmins, usually it's the 910 but recently both have been acting a bit odd. Average speed from the TT on Tuesday was 39.4kmph, happy with that on that course. Getting closer to the 40kmph.

joey100

Thurs 4th Aug

Evening turbo. Not too long on the turbo tonight, main set of 5x2@110%,3 easy. Aiming for 280 for the 110% and held it well. House pretty warm tonight but other than that no real issues holding the power. Legs still a little heavy from Tuesdays TT though.

Fri 5th Aug

Morning swim. Main set being 19x100m off 1.50. Plan was to swim these as hard as I could. Start ok, coming in around 1.34 for the first few, as it went on these slipped out a bit though and was coming in around 1.39/1.40 for the last few. Tough session, never really felt I got going, sort of stuck in second gear the whole time.