FAE September 2014

cson

Little Pea wrote: »

I thought it was a fair enough paper to be honest - Really kicked me up the backside for FR though !!! very tough and a lot of work needed to get the C in FR....

Anyone spot a finance indicator ? I didnt and would like to hear those that did, your views on it

Bank renegotiating the terms of the loan is what I pulled for it.

2 things stand out to me;

(1) It fully hit home here how wankered you are for time. Like you literally have to be 100% on the ball with your answers and know what you need to get down to get C/RC - no point getting HC in the IMP indicator if you're getting NC in the FR ones. This is about exam management as much as it is knowing you're stuff technically. As a corollary to this; absolutely crucial to have your notes in top order; you simply don't have time to be ****ing around looking at books.

(2) €6 for parking is absolutely ****ing scandalous.

LOccitane

@ TheDoctor - Yes, I said the same re ES5 and in terms of the overall total remuneration from the one client representing a self interest threat given the Group was already the largest client for the audit firm.

However, I went with the assumption that appropriate safeguards could be put in place (probably totally wrong) and therefore went on about implementation points. I said that if the advice would have resulted in a material impact on the Financial statements that would be subsequently audited then the NA engagement should be declined. But that's most likely wrong...!

cson

TheDoctor wrote: »

So there's 2 finance indicators tomorrow, and since there was only 1 audit there's another 2 tomorrow

Jesus I easily pulled 3 Audit Indicators from that;

- Going Concern
- Ethics
- Additional Testing Required

Some of them might blend in alright but they stood out as separate issues to me.

TheDoctor

I through the extra testing in with the ethical issue as one audit indicator.

What was the GC issue?

cson

LOccitane wrote: »

I thought it was an 'alright' paper overall but the volume was very high..

FIN REP was a disaster in terms of the Consolidation.. I thought that was unduly difficult. Definitely did very badly in that.

Found 8 indicators overall if the Deferred Tax issue is counted separate to that of the Consolidation generally. I didn't find any Finance indicators...

LOccitane

If they put something of that level of difficulty as an FR indicator in Sept then imo they're probably going to knock the pass rate down to ~60% considering the AAFRP results. They'll fail a tonne of people on PM if the FR is difficult.

PhilipLuke

How did everyone deal with the consolidation?

cson

TheDoctor wrote: »

I through the extra testing in with the ethical issue as one audit indicator.

What was the GC issue?

Ties into the bank requiring they adhere to the UK Code Corporate Governance - I didn't get to answering that but it looked like they didn't comply. Additionally they'd gone from having no borrowing to a situation where they were @ 50% gearing.

That's what I pulled from it anyway. Could just be a case of reading into it too much. I can see how the various indicators knit together, its just very difficult to do it in an exam situation when you're goosed for time.

m1ck007

Did anyone get ES3 as an audit indicator as they were a client for 20 years??

TheDoctor

cson wrote: »

Ties into the bank requiring they adhere to the UK Code Corporate Governance - I didn't get to answering that but it looked like they didn't comply. Additionally they'd gone from having no borrowing to a situation where they were @ 50% gearing.

That's what I pulled from it anyway. Could just be a case of reading into it too much. I can see how the various indicators knit together, its just very difficult to do it in an exam situation when you're goosed for time.

Everyones going to pull different things from a 15 page case. As long as you can back it up.......

Debs23

Did anyone else take seriously long to read the paper!

I put the ethics as an indicator on its own including the issue of implementing the strategy and also that they had been their auditirs for 20 yrs without it being tendered.

20 Times 20 Times

Auditing
-ES 3 Long term association
-ES 5 Non- Audit work
- Other audit work required to perform for consol.
PM M.A
Divisionalisation – how we should measure it i.e BSC/KPI’S
BL – Strategy
- Implement plan
BL- C.G
- Remuneration committee.
IMP
- Website Features
Tax
- Prompted disclosure about the 80k invoice
- Benefits etc.
PM – FR
- 5 adjustments
- IAS 12 deferred TAX

TheDoctor

m1ck007 wrote: »

Did anyone get ES3 as an audit indicator as they were a client for 20 years??

Yeah I gave it a paragraph, didn't have any more detail bar twenty years.

But with the company becoming listed the conditions would become more stringent

mark_m360

m1ck007 wrote: »

Did anyone get ES3 as an audit indicator as they were a client for 20 years??

Yeah I threw that in. Threw in general safeguards as I don't think it said how long the AP was on the job etc.

katieanne56

Did anyone think that doing the consolidation journals for the FD was taking on a management role? Or is this grand as long as you state that you can provide the journals but they are subject to management approval and posting? I wasn't sure about that and thought about it in the planning stage - not that I ever got round to 'doing' the consolidation indicator, I left it to second-to-last (last was the additional audit work re Group Audit as well as increased risk due to cash handling in sub, Going concern issue, RPTs and lack of FR skill for group accounting) and when the time was up I had only got to 6 indicators out of the 9 I thought I had to do.

m1ck007, I thought that ES3 Long association was at play too and recommended Partner rotation and EQCR as safeguards - I put it together with Audit fees and lack of competence and skill on the team (ie our role in the paper - newly qualified in a senior audit role for Group Accounts) for accepting the engagement all under one umbrella Ethics indicator. I probably over thought it.

Time is definitely not on our side.

Defo gotta do lots and lots of cases ahead of the real thing to get the speed up!

Nermal

TheDoctor wrote: »

So on that strategy indicator, did anyone go down the line that doing a strategy plan for an audit client would breach ES5 - taking on a management role.

It was just to draft an implementation plan, not actually creating the strategy or even executing the plan, I'd say that's a stretch.

Little Pea wrote: »

Auditing
-ES 3 Long term association
-ES 5 Non- Audit work
- Other audit work required to perform for consol.
PM M.A
Divisionalisation – how we should measure it i.e BSC/KPI’S
BL – Strategy
- Implement plan
BL- C.G
- Remuneration committee.
IMP
- Website Features
Tax
- Prompted disclosure about the 80k invoice
- Benefits etc.
PM – FR
- 5 adjustments
- IAS 12 deferred TAX

Agree with this, but I'm confused about the tax. I wrote about *un*prompted disclosure because I thought there'd be changes to the tax figure from the various consolidation adjustments (not just the 80K invoice). In retrospect though would we actually have paid any CT yet for YE 30/06/2014?

Also don't see going concern being an issue.

katieanne56

I thought GC was an issue because the bank facility was tenuous as they weren't compliant with the bank's terms. Also thought that there might be issues after the consolidation adjustments were made but I didn't get that far...

Debs23

Guys I know this has been asked before but where do I begin to study for audit?

TheDoctor

Debs23 wrote: »

Guys I know this has been asked before but where do I begin to study for audit?

Look at Sean Murrays summary slides on the standards

danko2012

What additional audit tests for the group did people throw down?

katieanne56

danko2012 wrote: »

What additional audit tests for the group did people throw down?

Was gonna start with use of External Parties work - this was one of Sean Murray's revision slides. Again, didn't get that far though!

WhatYaSay

What were they getting at with the Revenue Audit part?

Thought this morning I was wasting my time heading in, but found all the indicators and got round to addressing most of them. Highlighted areas I need to work on so that's as much as I could hope for from it! Snookered now tho!

TheDoctor

Is anyone else mentally shattered after today?

m1ck007

I cant believe how much that mock took out of me today....tired.com

lowenstein

ya im wrecked going try do 2/3hours say 6 to 9 but might be astruggle. find sean murrays lectures online very good for audit but very time consuming

katieanne56

Yep totes tired too and only realising that a lot of stuff I managed to put down, and stuff I planned to put down, was/is wrong and/or irrelevant. Really, really gotta start studying hardcore. But not yet. Too wrecked.

autumnbelle

How did people deal with the deferred tax?

Reddzer2002

This signing the papers out when handing them up is a farce. An extra 15 minutes for them to collect it after a 4.5hour exam is the last thing that is needed!!!

Aidodub87

lowenstein wrote: »

ya im wrecked going try do 2/3hours say 6 to 9 but might be astruggle. find sean murrays lectures online very good for audit but very time consuming

I think he's the most boring person ever

Nermal

autumnbelle wrote: »

How did people deal with the deferred tax?

Got rid of it - he shouldn't be accruing for the bonus at all. They might have a lower bound estimate but there's no legal/constructive obligation - IAS19 paragraph 17.

IR1SH RANG3R

As a lot of people are putting up very different points they got out of the exam today, it might be an idea to put up the comments you get back whenever we get the scripts back ie you're way off the mark there/that wasn't what was looked for but your reasoning is sound/that's correct with good reasoning. Just think it might be helpful to others?

I done brutal today but I was prepared for that as I've done no real study yet. Gave a stab at the audit work, the FR and the website indicators but couldn't even think where to start on the others (although I think I identified all or most of the indicators)

TheDoctor

Dont think anyone is pretending to have the answers, we're just bouncing thoughts and opinions off each other

cian twomey

found today very usual and a good learning experience for the main exam, as was mentioned time is and will be a huge issue come the main exam will prob even be worse with the sims days

Torres999

I didn't even understand the first journal in the consol, what was it? The 1.9m, looked at the second adjustment then and decided it wasn't for me, also felt I wrote a serious amount of waffle for the rest of the paper especially strategy

IR1SH RANG3R

TheDoctor wrote: »

Dont think anyone is pretending to have the answers, we're just bouncing thoughts and opinions off each other

That's what I mean, for example I might have had something from today that you didn't and when I say it here today you might think "that's a good point I must remember that" and then if I get my script back and the examiners says what in the f*&k were you thinking I'd say it here so everyone knows not to make that mistake!

Dellboy2007

Really not sure what good all these post-mortems are. I'll be steering well clear of boards in September. No offence loike...

ASOT2012

Nermal wrote: »

Got rid of it - he shouldn't be accruing for the bonus at all. They might have a lower bound estimate but there's no legal/constructive obligation - IAS19 paragraph 17.

My reading of it was this...could be wrong!

My understanding is that bonuses are normally set out in contracts and it states that they are payable up to x%. It said the final bonus payment was unlikely going to be less than 10%. Therefore probable it will be at least 10%.

And the accountant posted a deffered tax liability when it should have been a DTA..anyone else do this?

LuLa0826

ASOT2012 wrote: »

My reading of it was this...could be wrong!

My understanding is that bonuses are normally set out in contracts and it states that they are payable up to x%. It said the final bonus payment was unlikely going to be less than 10%. Therefore probable it will be at least 10%.

And the accountant posted a deffered tax liability when it should have been a DTA..anyone else do this?

Yes i took it as a DTA also.

20 Times 20 Times

SO tomorrow

2 finance
1 IMP
1 Tax
1 PM
2 BL
1 Audit

I reckon there might be 9 tomorrow though , with Paul throwing in another PM one.

autumnbelle

Shattered tired this eve must be drained after the actual exams in september

TheDoctor

Little Pea wrote: »

SO tomorrow

2 finance
1 IMP
1 Tax
1 PM
2 BL
1 Audit

I reckon there might be 9 tomorrow though , with Paul throwing in another PM one.

Yeah, I think there may be two audit tomorrow, considering the special mention it got in the report last year I think Paul may throw it into all the cases

Accountant81

Little Pea wrote: »

Auditing
-ES 3 Long term association
-ES 5 Non- Audit work
- Other audit work required to perform for consol.
PM M.A
Divisionalisation – how we should measure it i.e BSC/KPI’S
BL – Strategy
- Implement plan
BL- C.G
- Remuneration committee.
IMP
- Website Features
Tax
- Prompted disclosure about the 80k invoice
- Benefits etc.
PM – FR
- 5 adjustments
- IAS 12 deferred TAX

I agree with this. Thought it was a fair enough paper and better the consol stuff be seen for the first time in the mocks than in the real thing! Seriously pushed for time tho. Definitely time to knuckle down.

lowenstein

didnt do anything tonight anyway despite my posturing. wrecked just going to havea go at it tomorrow and hopefuuly be able to do some elective wed night/thurs morning

acastudent

Didn't attempt consolidation part at all . Just a quick question what the examiner tried to say whe he made comments like "acquired trade and the assets but not the company " I am sure it might be obvious for some of you but this were I kind of get lost

20 Times 20 Times

acastudent wrote: »

Didn't attempt consolidation part at all . Just a quick question what the examiner tried to say whe he made comments like "acquired trade and the assets but not the company " I am sure it might be obvious for some of you but this were I kind of get lost

Didn't buy the liabilities

autumnbelle

Realised how far behind I am with financial reporting today, I was wondering why no good will in the consol or why we were give the accounts? Felt bad saying the poor fd was bad at consolidation when I hadn't a clue myself!

acastudent

Little Pea wrote: »

Didn't buy the liabilities

Thanks Little Pea , still confused though what it really means ????

m1ck007

Have a lot of auditing revision to do. Also did i see a marketing indicator in sim 2??

TheDoctor

Yes, yes you did

LOccitane

What are the thoughts on today? I thought Sim 1 was very long winded in terms of the transaction flow etc..

Anybody for 9 indicators? I found 4 in Sim 1 and 5 in Sim 2...

The last Auditing indicator seemed somewhat generic as we were given no background on existent controls - not that I had the proper time to answer it anyway..

LOccitane

cson

That audit indicator in Sim 2 was the only indicator out of both Sims that was screaming at you. The rest took a lot of thought imo.

I get where Paul is going with the non directive indicators but what its doing is making you second guess every little detail with the end result that you probably don't give the big ones the attention they require.

Lot of work to do before Sept.

Serious wake up call.