FAE September 2014

barbie_j

quick question in relation to Internal audit, if it was provided by A consult co. to B company, from A's perspective, is it a agreed upon procedure or assurance service?? a bit confusing.. thanks a mill for any help!

LOccitane

Absolutely losing the will to do anything more at this stage. There are times when you hit an indicator brilliantly and more times you fail hopelessly and any semblance of hope or confidence you've built up is dashed!

Anyway... Less of the narrative that we see in some of the STEPS cases and I'm interested to know if anybody else thought that last year 2013 overall was easier than 2012?

I think the 2013 CORE COMP was more difficult than 2012 (not exceedingly so) but I think the 2012 SIMS were nasty... Especially in terms of one/two of the BL (compound) indicators and were extremely open to interpretation or loosely defined. The SIMS from last year were a lot better structured and defined (in my opinion at least).

FlyingSolo13

just wondering how people are approaching tax for core - I have been adhering to the very '' broad brush strokes'' model, and reading the questions / solutions - Is it necessary to get stuck into close co surcharge or loss relief calculations at this stage>?

laser08

LOccitane wrote: »

Absolutely losing the will to do anything more at this stage. There are times when you hit an indicator brilliantly and more times you fail hopelessly and any semblance of hope or confidence you've built up is dashed!

Anyway... Less of the narrative that we see in some of the STEPS cases and I'm interested to know if anybody else thought that last year 2013 overall was easier than 2012?

I think the 2013 CORE COMP was more difficult than 2012 (not exceedingly so) but I think the 2012 SIMS were nasty... Especially in terms of one/two of the BL (compound) indicators and were extremely open to interpretation or loosely defined. The SIMS from last year were a lot better structured and defined (in my opinion at least).

Yeah I thought 2013 was by far in a way the easiest of all the exam papers. Only 16 indicators across the two days. I'd love to get something similar. If u put that with the easy aafrp that was in 2013 it was a lot easier than any other year.

kenner24

Its at the point where i keep missing indicators now. And when i read the solution and then read the case again i still cant see what they are on about!

womandriver

laser08 wrote: »

Yeah I thought 2013 was by far in a way the easiest of all the exam papers. Only 16 indicators across the two days. I'd love to get something similar. If u put that with the easy aafrp that was in 2013 it was a lot easier than any other year.

A downside of fewer indicators is there are less chances to redeem yourself if you miss an indicator or answer poorly/incorrectly to any of the others.

jaybeeveedub

barbie_j wrote: »

quick question in relation to Internal audit, if it was provided by A consult co. to B company, from A's perspective, is it a agreed upon procedure or assurance service?? a bit confusing.. thanks a mill for any help!

As the Board are seeking assurance over the operation of internal controls (in the main) there will be an Internal Audit Charter and Plan, agreed upon before the commencement of any work. In a regulated environment a number of areas will be a requirement of the regulatory body, but more usually a Board want to make sure management are running the business according to the wishes of the Board, as communicated in their policies and procedures. So mainly the assessment of internal controls part of risk assessment for a statutory audit, adherence to policies and compliance with laws and regs.

Thats why IA regularly detects fraud.....

DaUmpire

womandriver wrote: »

A downside of fewer indicators is there are less chances to redeem yourself if you miss an indicator or answer poorly/incorrectly to any of the others.

In the Delaney's Bakehouse breads question in the the management accounting and finance case book, where does the £417k investment in debtors come from?

At this stage anyone have any suggestions as the best way to study for Management accounting and finance?

autumnbelle

Brain has officially fried remember nothing

Debs23

Does anyone have a checklist for audit matters? Eg. Need communicated to board/need rep letter

What all would i need to put on it?

Dellboy2007

autumnbelle wrote: »

Brain has officially fried remember nothing

I read this and thought, "who is brian?"

Yes my head is firmly rooted up my hole.

littlemiss123

Dellboy2007 wrote: »

I read this and thought, "who is brian?"

Yes my head is firmly rooted up my hole.

Haha, the first time I read it I though Brian had been fired....:D:D

Mark1916

Took the liberty at looking at some tax today and actually looked at stuff going WTF? Hopefully the indicators aren't too detailed at least all ye need is a yellow, if losses come up it's squeaky bum time!

acastudent

autumnbelle wrote: »

Brain has officially fried remember nothing

Nada here too

m1ck007

Spent all day putting a fair bit of effort into primus pet foods. Just read solution and now want to shoot myself.

jaybeeveedub

Looking through Call Management Solutions from the 2012 Sims...

I thought I had it nailed, the MLRO was informed, I had the references from the Money Laundering Guidance, I was really struggling with whether we could, under Section 6.32, Check with client whether he realised what he was doing was illegal and give him opportunity to rectify or not

got to the solution and there wasn't a peep of money laundering, just fraud and fire the FD

arse

acastudent

Just a quick question when we should use uk corporate gov and when Irish annex ????

So tired can't even think straight

myshirt

acastudent wrote: »

Just a quick question when we should use uk corporate gov and when Irish annex ????

So tired can't even think straight

Irish Annex is for companies with a ROI listing.

More onerous than the CG code.

It wouldn't make sense to ask it, as it's ROI only. If it's there, very high level. Don't get bogged down on it.

maninblack

My head is absolutely fried at this stage.

I've been trawling through the Mock cases the past few days and as I've said before in this thread, they're completely ridiculous! If they were to mark everyone based on the marking scheme provided in the solution, I'd honestly be surprised if >25% of people would pass it. Very very tough.

I understand the methodology of getting you used to a tougher paper than you're likely to face... but tbh, that's kind of a false logic because whenever I attempt one of these papers and fail miserably, I'm just left totally disillusioned with the whole bloody exam!! :mad:

Positive Ponts I keep telling myself:
- The exam has gotten easier year by year
- 75% will pass - the odds are in your favour
- Audit, Tax, Finance and IMP are fairly forgiving, we JUST NEED RC!!
- Every single person sitting this exam is terrified, nobody is 'sorted'!

Having said that, I definitely feel that they got away with blue murder last year. As someone said earlier, the AAFRP was considerably easier and I just pray I won't be saying the same thing about the final exam! It'd be hard not to feel royally screwed if they nail us with some tough group structure FR journal adjustments when they got EPS last year :rolleyes:

20 Times 20 Times

maninblack wrote: »

My head is absolutely fried at this stage.

I've been trawling through the Mock cases the past few days and as I've said before in this thread, they're completely ridiculous! If they were to mark everyone based on the marking scheme provided in the solution, I'd honestly be surprised if >25% of people would pass it. Very very tough.

I understand the methodology of getting you used to a tougher paper than you're likely to face... but tbh, that's kind of a false logic because whenever I attempt one of these papers and fail miserably, I'm just left totally disillusioned with the whole bloody exam!! :mad:

Positive Ponts I keep telling myself:
- The exam has gotten easier year by year
- 75% will pass - the odds are in your favour
- Audit, Tax, Finance and IMP are fairly forgiving, we JUST NEED RC!!
- Every single person sitting this exam is terrified, nobody is 'sorted'!

Having said that, I definitely feel that they got away with blue murder last year. As someone said earlier, the AAFRP was considerably easier and I just pray I won't be saying the same thing about the final exam! It'd be hard not to feel royally screwed if they nail us with some tough group structure FR journal adjustments when they got EPS last year :rolleyes:

I thought last year's exam was by far the easiest out if all the papers

maninblack

20 Times 20 Times wrote: »

I thought last year's exam was by far the easiest out if all the papers

I know thats what I said

Compare 2013 to say 2010

No comparison.

Mark1916

20 Times 20 Times wrote: »

I thought last year's exam was by far the easiest out if all the papers

I need at least 3 decent PM indicators after a disasterous AAFRP

Philip1988

Anybody know what cases to look at for consolidation?

Mock 2013 and Mock 2014... Anything else?

LOccitane

Mark1916 wrote: »

I need at least 3 decent PM indicators after a disasterous AAFRP

The average in the AAFRP was RC after what was a rotten paper. Now, if they follow with complex Consolidation or something like Financial Instruments in the Final, they are going to bring down the pass rate below 70%. Either that, or the depth test will have to be adjusted.

Wanting it all to be over now, but really dreading as to what might come up.

In terms of Consolidation practice.. I wouldn't go beyond the DC book. He deals with every scenario including classification issues for JV/Subsid/Associate etc.

That's my port of call the minute I see any Consilidation in the exam...

20 Times 20 Times

I don't see Consol this year - I think there is more scope for it for next year. If it comes up - maybe in a SIM

LOccitane

20 Times 20 Times wrote: »

I don't see Consol this year - I think there is more scope for it for next year. If it comes up - maybe in a SIM

You'd certainly think so with the change to the Comp Statement. Let's hope that if it does appear; it's straightforward.

20 Times 20 Times

LOccitane wrote: »

You'd certainly think so with the change to the Comp Statement. Let's hope that if it does appear; it's straightforward.

every year its a multi division organisation - I see no reason to change from this. it gives great scope across all the indicators. I think Consol question at FAE level WHEN it appears will be a SIM.

myshirt

I'm putting my shirt on it being there.

And I hope not on the first day, that will rattle people.

PM indicator, not a clue. And bang, depth test takes a beating before you even write a word.

But anyway, two possibilities, it either will or will not. And that's it. There's nothing we can do to influence it. We're only scaring each other by trying to guess the paper at this late stage.

20 Times 20 Times

myshirt wrote: »

I'm putting my shirt on it being there.

And I hope not on the first day, that will rattle people.

PM indicator, not a clue. And bang, depth test takes a beating before you even write a word.

But anyway, two possibilities, it either will or will not. And that's it. There's nothing we can do to influence it. We're only scaring each other by trying to guess the paper at this late stage.

Who is scared at this stage ? The work is done - Sitting around waiting for the exam at this stage. Either way if it is or isn't it has to be dealt with.

PhilipLuke

LOccitane wrote: »

Absolutely losing the will to do anything more at this stage. There are times when you hit an indicator brilliantly and more times you fail hopelessly and any semblance of hope or confidence you've built up is dashed!

Anyway... Less of the narrative that we see in some of the STEPS cases and I'm interested to know if anybody else thought that last year 2013 overall was easier than 2012?

I think the 2013 CORE COMP was more difficult than 2012 (not exceedingly so) but I think the 2012 SIMS were nasty... Especially in terms of one/two of the BL (compound) indicators and were extremely open to interpretation or loosely defined. The SIMS from last year were a lot better structured and defined (in my opinion at least).

If the AAFRP is anything to go by they have upped the standard for 2014 and we are in for a gruelling 3 days!!

20 Times 20 Times

PhilipLuke wrote: »

If the AAFRP is anything to go by they have upped the standard for 2014 and we are in for a gruelling 3 days!!

Now this is what I am thinking also !! Too many people slipped through the net !

PhilipLuke

20 Times 20 Times wrote: »

Now this is what I am thinking also !! Too many people slipped through the net !

I still don't think consolidation will come up!! I think the institute know well that our Paul has been promoting the possibility and given that he had it in the mocks a couple of times that may be good enough for them.

Accountant81

I feel like I am done. Just don't know if I can study anymore or if it would even make a difference at this stage. I'm in bed watching tv. No intention of getting up any time soon either.

myshirt

Accountant81 wrote: »

I feel like I am done. Just don't know if I can study anymore or if it would even make a difference at this stage. I'm in bed watching tv. No intention of getting up any time soon either.

Watch this, you might enjoy. This is why I changed profession; plus I'm an idiot.

littlemiss123

Anyone else kind hoping it's gonna rain all weekend at Electric Picnic? Just out of spite....

acastudent

littlemiss123 wrote: »

Anyone else kind hoping it's gonna rain all weekend at Electric Picnic? Just out of spite....

Lol

barbie_j

jaybeeveedub wrote: »

As the Board are seeking assurance over the operation of internal controls (in the main) there will be an Internal Audit Charter and Plan, agreed upon before the commencement of any work. In a regulated environment a number of areas will be a requirement of the regulatory body, but more usually a Board want to make sure management are running the business according to the wishes of the Board, as communicated in their policies and procedures. So mainly the assessment of internal controls part of risk assessment for a statutory audit, adherence to policies and compliance with laws and regs.

Thats why IA regularly detects fraud.....

thanks a mill Jaybeeveedub. agreed. but say, at the end of the IA engagement, an internal audit report would be issued, and provided some assurance, while agreed upon procedure will only provide factual report... if it was agreed upon before the job begun, then why bother expressing an opinion at the end? :eek:

:mad: if engagement letter for internal audit service come up....

acastudent

Can't study at all decided to look at case mapping doc and see what areas has been asked . I know it's only guessing but really don't care at this stage .
marketing only has been asked once in 2012
Change management in 2011 and 2012
HR only in 2013
Ethics, Corp Gov , straregy every year

Dellboy2007

acastudent wrote: »

Can't study at all decided to look at case mapping doc and see what areas has been asked . I know it's only guessing but really don't care at this stage .
marketing only has been asked once in 2012
Change management in 2011 and 2012
HR only in 2013
Ethics, Corp Gov , straregy every year

I predict a riot

I predict a riot

Philiminator

Woke up just there and I got man flu. Symptoms are exaggeration & the urge to seek sympathy.

littlemiss123

Philiminator wrote: »

Woke up just there and I got man flu. Symptoms are exaggeration & the urge to seek sympathy.

m1ck007

This time next week the core will be over yeayyyyy.

jaybeeveedub

barbie_j wrote: »

thanks a mill Jaybeeveedub. agreed. but say, at the end of the IA engagement, an internal audit report would be issued, and provided some assurance, while agreed upon procedure will only provide factual report... if it was agreed upon before the job begun, then why bother expressing an opinion at the end? :eek:

:mad: if engagement letter for internal audit service come up....

Statutory Audit requires an element of surprise, if you will, we as Auditors provide an opinion to shareholders on the financial statements, The shareholders use us, partly because they don't know what to look for, partly because its a requirements, so we come up with an audit plan which we think will serve the shareholders. It must be a surprise to the company, or theyll work around it

For internal audit, the Board, should ideally know exactly what it is they want assurance over (in contrast to the shareholders) so we agree the plan with the Board.

Lets say we look at Bank, we're not interested in half of the stuff which an auditor would look at (cutoff etc), the Board want to make sure
-all efts are subject to dual authorisation
-all bank recs are performed
-all adjusting items are valid
- segregation of duties is being adhered to

so our report to the Board (which will most likely be at least quarterly, as IA is an ongoing engagement rather than an annual audit) is confirming to the board that systems are operating as they should, or exceptions have been noted.

That would be the classic model, born out of the huge american corporations with expert boards

Nowadays there are areas where the Internal Audit function will advise on strengthening controls, accounting treatments, compliance etc So more like a regular management letter from the Auditor....

So hopefully to answer your question, the IA function doesn't express any opinion (certainly none on the Financial Statements) save that the Policies and Procedures by which the Board direct management in the day to day running of the business are sufficient and being adhered to....

20 Times 20 Times

jaybeeveedub wrote: »

So hopefully to answer your question, the IA function doesn't express any opinion (certainly none on the Financial Statements) save that the Policies and Procedures by which the Board direct management in the day to day running of the business are sufficient and being adhered to....

I have PM'd you I am looking for some clarification if you can help.

barbie_j

jaybeeveedub wrote: »

Statutory Audit requires an element of surprise, if you will, we as Auditors provide an opinion to shareholders on the financial statements, The shareholders use us, partly because they don't know what to look for, partly because its a requirements, so we come up with an audit plan which we think will serve the shareholders. It must be a surprise to the company, or theyll work around it

For internal audit, the Board, should ideally know exactly what it is they want assurance over (in contrast to the shareholders) so we agree the plan with the Board.

Lets say we look at Bank, we're not interested in half of the stuff which an auditor would look at (cutoff etc), the Board want to make sure
-all efts are subject to dual authorisation
-all bank recs are performed
-all adjusting items are valid
- segregation of duties is being adhered to

so our report to the Board (which will most likely be at least quarterly, as IA is an ongoing engagement rather than an annual audit) is confirming to the board that systems are operating as they should, or exceptions have been noted.

That would be the classic model, born out of the huge american corporations with expert boards

Nowadays there are areas where the Internal Audit function will advise on strengthening controls, accounting treatments, compliance etc So more like a regular management letter from the Auditor....

So hopefully to answer your question, the IA function doesn't express any opinion (certainly none on the Financial Statements) save that the Policies and Procedures by which the Board direct management in the day to day running of the business are sufficient and being adhered to....

Thanks so much Jay!

faedub24

Just did Logic Med - The FR was a nightmare - Are we expected to know that level of detail? If so some job from assessment

Has anyone a map of indicators for the steps Cases?

Any recommendation on cases for last few days?

Someone the other day was looking for Transfer Pricing calculation question - any luck?

Thanks in advance

Debs23

The cases i haven't looked at are:

Mortorvation
New inn
Texron
Lowland bank
Enver plastics
Thorpe clinic

Are there any of these that i must do?

FlyingSolo13

Debs23 wrote: »

The cases i haven't looked at are:

Mortorvation
New inn
Texron
Lowland bank
Enver plastics
Thorpe clinic

Are there any of these that i must do?

enver is good for variances & thorpe very good for tax

m1ck007

I wish i sat the 2013 paper.

Philiminator

I did and I got 3 greens and went down in BL......so yeah. What a waste of greens! Loads of people passed on 6 yellows