Tipping

MadsL

Here's what I actually said.

MadsL wrote: »

The discussion was around if you should get in a taxi with only €9 - the fare. A premeditated no tip scenario.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Time we all stopped snapping at the bait here I think.

MadsL

Lewis Savory Clergy wrote: »

I can't resist....

'There is not a strong tipping culture in Ireland but many locals and visitors tend to tip for certain services...'

According to your linked item.

Not a strong tipping culture....

While the same source states it is expected in the United States.

Nothing from you would surprise us at this stage but carry on if it amuses you.

Quote me where it says that there is no tipping culture in Ireland, which is the assertion I have been refuting all along.

People seem to believe that leaving no tip at all in a restaurant of reasonable quality in Ireland when they have received a good level of service is an acceptable thing to do. I fundamentally disagree. Ireland's tipping culture may be not as strong as the US but it clearly exists not just recently but for generations.

MadsL

Lewis Savory Clergy wrote: »

Time we all stopped snapping at the bait here I think.

As I have said before, please report my posts if your feel that they breach the charter, snide digs about my posts are not welcome.

HansHolzel

No, MadsL, keep hopping the ball and they'll keep jumping ...

:-P :-P :-P

MadsL

HansHolzel wrote: »

No, MadsL, keep hopping the ball and they'll keep jumping ...

:-P :-P :-P

I'm just stating my view. There is a lot of denial going on though.

Horrid Henry

MadsL wrote: »

I'm pointing out that all this bull about "I never tip, we don't want this American sh.te here" is completely bunk. Ireland has had a tipping culture in restaurants for generations. Funny how people don't want to admit that.

You're either ignoring the point or else you don't get it.

Quasi mandatory tipping and staff harassing you if you don't tip are US phenomena which have started to take root here.

It has nothing whatsoever to do with origins of tipping itself.

Ace2007

It is acceptable to leave no tip. Put up a poll there and see what the general population of boards think.

Simple question:

Is it acceptable to leave no tip?
Yes
No

Ace2007

MadsL wrote: »

I'm just stating my view. There is a lot of denial going on though.

So you can have a view but no one else?

Got it

MadsL

Ace2007 wrote: »

So you can have a view but no one else?

Got it

They can have a view, but if their assertion is there is no tipping culture in Ireland, well frankly forgive me if I point out that view is (in my view) complete bollox. Will I quote Joyce again?

Next we will have the old chestnut that there are no mosquitos in Ireland.

MadsL

Ace2007 wrote: »

It is acceptable to leave no tip. Put up a poll there and see what the general population of boards think.

Simple question:

Is it acceptable to leave no tip?
Yes
No

*Dodges AH ban for starting yet another tipping thread. *

No thanks, you first....

MadsL

Horrid Henry wrote: »

You're either ignoring the point or else you don't get it.

Quasi mandatory tipping and staff harassing you if you don't tip are US phenomena which have started to take root here.

It has nothing whatsoever to do with origins of tipping itself.

Example?

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

Culex sp. common and widespread in Ireland - unlike tipping.

MadsL

Lewis Savory Clergy wrote: »

Culex sp. common and widespread in Ireland - unlike tipping.

So you are modifying your stance that there is NO tipping culture?

It is now rare and isolated.

Slowly, slowly getting there....

rubadub

MadsL wrote: »

Quote me where it says that there is no tipping culture in Ireland, which is the assertion I have been refuting all along.

Who made this assertion? Did somebody actually say no tipping ever happens in Ireland? must have missed that bizarre post.

If someone said no tipping culture I would presume they meant along the lines of the US, where it is even recognised in the wage laws.

DoozerT6

Edit, sorry tried to post a link but it turned into a wall of text

MadsL

rubadub wrote: »

Who made this assertion? Did somebody actually say no tipping ever happens in Ireland? must have missed that bizarre post.

If someone said no tipping culture I would presume they meant along the lines of the US, where it is even recognised in the wage laws.

Crooked Jack wrote: »

It actually isnt, people have pointed out to you several times that the reasons tipping is practically compulsory in America dont exist here.
Ireland has not had a tipping culture for generations and certainly not on the scale we see in America where every halfwit who does his job functionally feels entitled to a percentage of what you already paid. Perhaps some individual businesses do but it is far, far from the norm.

Apologies to Sarumeen I attributed that to him.

Ace2007

MadsL wrote: »

They can have a view, but if their assertion is there is no tipping culture in Ireland, well frankly forgive me if I point out that view is (in my view) complete bollox. Will I quote Joyce again?

Next we will have the old chestnut that there are no mosquitos in Ireland.

See your beginning to come round, it's in your view that you believe things are happening.

It only took you 4 days of the thread for you to come round.

MadsL

DoozerT6 wrote: »

data:image/jpeg;base64,/9j/4AAQSkZJRgABAQAAAQABAAD/2wCEAAkGBg8PDxUQDRA

That you Neo?

Nemeses

DoozerT6 wrote: »

<Insert Jargon>

Whoops... I know a picture is worth a 1000 words but crikey!

MadsL

Ace2007 wrote: »

See your beginning to come round, it's in your view that you believe things are happening.

It only took you 4 days of the thread for you to come round.

That makes no sense.

Tipping exists in Ireland, such denial.

(on that note - off com for a while, talk amongst yourselves)

SV

MadsL wrote: »

That makes no sense.

Tipping exists in Ireland, such denial.

Yes, but not to the extent that you think it does, or should.
Such denial.

AdamD

MadsL wrote: »

Huh?



What I said was that taking a taxi with the premeditated intention of not tipping by literally not having the tip in your pocket was wrong.

Perhaps you shouldn't pick and choose the things I said in your head rather than the things I actually said.

How is that in anyway wrong? Lets say the taxi fare is 10 quid, and I get into the taxi with 10 quid. Where have I gone wrong? Nowhere, that's how business works. Somebody sets a price for their service and I choose whether to avail of that service at that price. The logic of tipping being normal is actually completely flawed; all it suggests is that the original price was completely wrong.

Ace2007

AdamD wrote: »

How is that in anyway wrong? Lets say the taxi fare is 10 quid, and I get into the taxi with 10 quid. Where have I gone wrong? Nowhere, that's how business works. Somebody sets a price for their service and I choose whether to avail of that service at that price. The logic of tipping being normal is actually completely flawed; all it suggests is that the original price was completely wrong.

He reckons you shouldn't get in with just 10, you should have 11 with you and if you don't then you should get the bus - he actually said this.

Artful_Badger

There should be a post limit for posters. 140 posts and hasnt yet made anything in the way of a relevant point let alone a reasonable argument. All the while doing nothing but going in circles just to contradict people.

Currently arguing against an invented point of there being no tipping in Ireland. Because he's ran out of points on the thread to contradict.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

MadsL wrote: »

So you are modifying your stance that there is NO tipping culture?

It is now rare and isolated.

Slowly, slowly getting there....

You probably think obnoxious comments like that are clever but being neither common nor widespread does not by definition imply rare or isolated. It may also suggest non-existance. My post was the typical environmentalist's convention of common and widespread. The opposite of which is not necessarily rare and isolated. This I know. This is my field, so don't play word games on wildlife/nature conventions with me.

Anyway, I have never asserted that there was no tipping whatsoever here. Indeed, I told you I tip and tip well when appropriate. Most others have said similar. However, the American nonsense of quasi-compulsary tipping is not prevalent nor do we wish it to be.

Why oh why did I bother replying? Fool me once...and all that.

rubadub

MadsL wrote: »

Not much point in upselling wine then if the wage stays the same. Then both you and the restaurant lose out if you lose your incentive to upsell or push the special.

There are plenty of jobs where people would push items for sale, its part of their job, they do have an incentive, their weekly wage and appreciating their job and not wanting the business to go bust. You seem to have a really low opinion of people's work ethic.

MadsL wrote: »

This is a private business, they can seat in any order they like. It's not a queue for a fairground ride.

If I were Maitre d' I might seat three couples before a party of six all day, simply by availability. If I got a tip from the party of six, I'd certainly help them out to get seated faster if I could..

I'm sure you could similarly bribe some fairground operators to skip the queue. I have seen fairground operators seating some before others like your example, e.g. they might have a couple in a big wheel chair together, with someone on their own, then have 3 lads wait until a 3 seater comes around. All reasonable and common sense, nothing underhanded or sly going on.

It is easier for the matire d to be bribed to skip people ahead since its not blatantly obvious what the situation is, but people certainly notice. I can tell you most people utterly despise queue skippers. If I was a waiter here I would not be too upset over a non tipper, but a queue skipper -utter scum.

MadsL wrote: »

If you can live with yourself for not doing it, and people talking about you when you have gone, off you go.

Oh the sweet irony. When you pay to skip queues you probably have people saying far worse about you, and you have forked out money for it.

DebDynamite

MadsL wrote: »

Describing the dish in detail, including the preparation method, the source of the protein (locally produced Murphy's Farm organic etc) and making an excellent recommendation of a wine to go with it. Making sure the chef can substitute an ingredient to cover an allergy. Making an excellent job of timing the meal, checking if you need a pause before dessert, suggesting a light alternative if you say you are getting full, etc etc.

These are the marks of excellent wait staff, who sadly would do well in the US, but are deemed in Ireland to be doing a job little above the skill level of McDonalds cashiers.

You see MadsL, you might request all these things and quiz servers on their knowledge, but I don't. You seem to make servers work more for their tip than I do. So I don't doubt that you would feel guilty if you didn't leave a tip.

For me, the process of a meal out goes like this:

• Take a seat, get given menu

• Decide what I want from menu. When the waiter comes to take my order, I tell then what I want.

• Starter arrives. I eat it. Waiter comes to take plate and ask if everything was ok. Repeat for main course & dessert. (Oh you'll like this MadsL: sometimes there might even be an amuse bouche, or even a palate cleanser. Fancy! See we don't all only eat in chippers )

• Top up wine glass when running low. Something I would rather do myself btw as one of us might be drinking at a faster rate than the other, so one of use ends up getting less wine.

• Ask for bill. When bill arrives, we settle up.

MadsL wrote: »

Such nonsense, basic duties are hello how are you, here's the menu, what would you like, here it is, did you enjoy it, anything else, here's the bill, thanks for coming, bye.

That's the basic duties. The minimum level you work at without getting fired, and frankly the level that you get in many Irish restaurants.

Perhaps I am being unfair in trying to describe what excellent service is if many posting here simply haven't experienced it.

If you want some tales of outstanding service on the other hand...
http://chowhound.chow.com/topics/582537

Staff going out to clear a path to diners cars in freshly falen snow certainly isn't part of the basic duties.

But that's the standard of service I want! I don't want to be fussed over. I don't even like waiter topping up my wine glass! As long as the server is friendly and efficient, that's all I want.

And yes, you're right, that is the basic lever of service you get in Ireland. Therefore, why should we always be expected to leave a 10% tip?

MadsL

Artful_Badger wrote: »

There should be a post limit for posters. 140 posts and hasnt yet made anything in the way of a relevant point let alone a reasonable argument. All the while doing nothing but going in circles just to contradict people.

Currently arguing against an invented point of there being no tipping in Ireland. Because he's ran out of points on the thread to contradict.

1. I didn't invent the point. I quoted it earlier.
2. My point is very simple. Tipping improves service, I've stated it many times.
3. I thought you flounced out of this thread a few pages back...is it my charm? It is isn't it.
4. Post limits? G'wan outta that. You have an ignore button.

Paddy Cow

MadsL wrote: »

FFS. It's an English custom, and present in Ireland for decades if not centuries.

Tipping might have started as an English custom but it's seen more as an American one as the tipping system is so ingrained in American culture it's accepted that tips make up part of the wages. There is a minimum wage in Ireland and the UK so there isn't the same custom when it comes to tipping.

MadsL wrote: »

What I said was that taking a taxi with the premeditated intention of not tipping by literally not having the tip in your pocket was wrong.

That's absurd. What if someone is on their own late at night and only has the exact fare, should they walk home?

Or what if like me in the summer, someone has to go to a hospital appointment in Dublin, pay for a hotel the night before, the train to Dublin and taxi's from the train to the hotel, to the hospital in the morning and back to the station again? That was a fair ould drain on the wallet. I can tell you now that I wasn't factoring in tips when trying to finance the trip. Didn't tip the hotel staff either. Oh no, I'm a tight arse not made of money :rolleyes: