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Landlord responsible for removing furniture?

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  • 16-10-2013 1:24pm
    #1
    sari
    Closed Accounts Posts: 301 ✭✭


    We are living in rented house. It was furnished with a 3 seater couch and 2x armchairs, they are in really bad condition, ripped with stuffing coming out and filthy also huge and take up so much space.
    So we bought a new couch ourselves and moved the old one to the kitchen dinner and covered with throws, it's never sat on.
    Now we have bought a new rocking chair for sitting room which gives us so much more space. I've asked the landlord can they remove the 2 armchairs as we don't have space for them. She had refused to buy new couch and armchairs so we bought our own now she won't take the armchairs away.
    Is she under any obligation to remove them?


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    #2
    djimi
    Registered Users Posts: 13,237 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    The landlord doesnt have a legal obligation to remove unwanted furniture, however if they are in the state that they are in and the landlord wont repair/replace them then I guess you could argue that they are just junk belonging to the landlord that has no business being in the tenancy. How far you would get with this argument however Im not sure.


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    #3
    D3PO
    Registered Users Posts: 7,879 ✭✭✭D3PO


    no shes under no obligation at all. You rented furnished so that's that. If you want them gone you would need to pay for them to be moved and put in storage and returned when vacating the property


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    #4
    sari
    Closed Accounts Posts: 301 ✭✭sari


    Ok thanks everyone, what responsibilities does the landlord have to replace old and damaged furniture?


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    #5
    D3PO
    Registered Users Posts: 7,879 ✭✭✭D3PO


    sari wrote: »
    Ok thanks everyone, what responsibilities does the landlord have to replace old and damaged furniture?

    There is no obligation to replace old furniture at all. As for damaged furniture that's unclear.

    what is the furniture and what is the damage you refer to ? Damage can vary wildly form a scrape on a table to a leg having fallen off said table. The answer would very much depend on what exactly you refer to as damanged.


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    #6
    sari
    Closed Accounts Posts: 301 ✭✭sari


    Couch and 2 armchairs, faux leather, ripped at some of the seams, stuffing coming out, leather peeling off


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    #7
    Ray Palmer
    Registered Users Posts: 8,394 ✭✭✭Ray Palmer


    sari wrote: »
    Couch and 2 armchairs, faux leather, ripped at some of the seams, stuffing coming out, leather peeling off


    What did it look like when you viewed the property? Has this happened while you were living there?

    Did you ask for replacements?


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    #8
    sari
    Closed Accounts Posts: 301 ✭✭sari


    When we viewed the landord was still living here with her family, it was a bit chaotic as they were packing to move to new house. When we moved in we noticed the damage, said it to them and they said they wouldn't be getting new ones. They had tried to stick the rips with what looked like bailing tape.
    So we decided that we would just get a new couch ourselves. I told them we were going to buy new one, she said to sell the old ones and we could have some of the money, 3 days later she called and said don't sell them as they will need them if we move out. Fair enough so I asked could she remove them to make space for ours. She said no, I moved the old sofa to the dining room and it's grand there so I asked could she take just the armchairs, again said no. So we are left with their damaged furniture taking up a lot of space and no space for our own furniture.


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    #9
    elfy4eva
    Registered Users Posts: 1,204 ✭✭✭elfy4eva


    Shame you weren't able to sell them in those 3 days you had permission. She wouldn't have had much to come back on then. :(


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    #10
    Ray Palmer
    Registered Users Posts: 8,394 ✭✭✭Ray Palmer


    sari wrote: »
    When we viewed the landord was still living here with her family, it was a bit chaotic as they were packing to move to new house. When we moved in we noticed the damage, said it to them and they said they wouldn't be getting new ones. They had tried to stick the rips with what looked like bailing tape.
    So we decided that we would just get a new couch ourselves. I told them we were going to buy new one, she said to sell the old ones and we could have some of the money, 3 days later she called and said don't sell them as they will need them if we move out. Fair enough so I asked could she remove them to make space for ours. She said no, I moved the old sofa to the dining room and it's grand there so I asked could she take just the armchairs, again said no. So we are left with their damaged furniture taking up a lot of space and no space for our own furniture.


    Thanks for the explanation. Your fault for not checking the place properly and not insisting on replacement furniture for damaged property. Buyer beware and all that.

    The LL doesn't have to do it unless you can get it agreed the furniture is not fit for purpose. The problem is you had an opportunity to inspect the property and accepted what was there. At this point they can claim you caused the damage and even deduct it from the deposit. I'd try to retrospectively get them to agree the condition of all furniture with pictures now.


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    #11
    cormie
    Registered Users Posts: 20,836 ✭✭✭✭cormie


    Why not try give them away on adverts.ie/jumbletown.ie etc, you'll probably get someone to come pick them up handy enough. Then if you're planning to move out, just look for another ****e suite movie on the same websites.


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    #12
    Pawwed Rig
    Moderators, Category Moderators, Home & Garden Moderators, Recreation & Hobbies Moderators Posts: 22,380 CMod ✭✭✭✭Pawwed Rig


    cormie wrote: »
    Why not try give them away on adverts.ie/jumbletown.ie etc, you'll probably get someone to come pick them up handy enough. Then if you're planning to move out, just look for another ****e suite movie on the same websites.

    Because that is theft I guess


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    #13
    sari
    Closed Accounts Posts: 301 ✭✭sari


    Obviously I would never do that to be honest I thought that poater was joking and I took it as a joke :)
    I have pictures, with date stamps, of all of the damage in the house from the day we moved in. I also noted all these bits on the snag list, the landlord has never denied that the damage was there when we moved in


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    #14
    cormie
    Registered Users Posts: 20,836 ✭✭✭✭cormie


    I obviously meant to ok it with the landlord first :confused:

    Tell them you'll give them away and will replace them with another similar suite before you move out. Simple for everyone.


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    #15
    sari
    Closed Accounts Posts: 301 ✭✭sari


    We'll yes except for me who I'll have to advertise, find and organise transport.
    I'm going ask her to call over so we can talk about it


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    #16
    D3PO
    Registered Users Posts: 7,879 ✭✭✭D3PO


    rips / tears on a sofa that could be seen when viewing. Sorry but you have no comeback here. They are clearly still functional just in an awful state. Therefore they are under no obligation to replace them.

    you will have to suck it up OP. If you want rid then you will need to go and store them yourself at your cost.


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    #17
    sari
    Closed Accounts Posts: 301 ✭✭sari


    Wow people on here are harsh, was just looking for a little advice.


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    #18
    athtrasna
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,420 ✭✭✭✭athtrasna


    sari wrote: »
    Wow people on here are harsh, was just looking for a little advice.

    Not at all, just telling you a few home truths. The tenant is responsible for checking the apartment/house before signing a lease and ensuring that any visible issues are dealt with prior to signing that and handing over a deposit & rent. It's akin to buyer beware.

    You accepted the furniture when you moved in and subsequently decided it wasn't good enough for you. That is not the landlord's problem. Cosmetic faults like rips do not mean the furniture isn't fit for purpose even if it is unsightly.

    Sorry but it's the truth.


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    #19
    sari
    Closed Accounts Posts: 301 ✭✭sari


    Ok thanks


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    #20
    Grolschevik
    Registered Users Posts: 3,472 ✭✭✭Grolschevik


    athtrasna wrote: »
    Not at all, just telling you a few home truths. The tenant is responsible for checking the apartment/house before signing a lease and ensuring that any visible issues are dealt with prior to signing that and handing over a deposit & rent. It's akin to buyer beware.
    You accepted the furniture when you moved in and subsequently decided it wasn't good enough for you. That is not the landlord's problem. Cosmetic faults like rips do not mean the furniture isn't fit for purpose even if it is unsightly.

    Sorry but it's the truth.

    In all fairness, I read it as:
    a) On viewing, tenant expresses dissatisfaction with furniture,
    b) Landlord agrees it can be sold and replaced with new furniture bought by tenant,
    c) Tenant moves in and buys new furniture,
    d) Landlord changes mind about selling old furniture,
    e) Tenant now stuck with old furniture taking up space, asks for advice on options.

    The only issue might be the order in which points c and d occur.


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    #21
    athtrasna
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,420 ✭✭✭✭athtrasna


    sari wrote: »
    When we viewed the landord was still living here with her family, it was a bit chaotic as they were packing to move to new house. When we moved in we noticed the damage, said it to them and they said they wouldn't be getting new ones.
    Grolschevik wrote: »
    In all fairness, I read it as:
    a) On viewing, tenant expresses dissatisfaction with furniture,
    b) Landlord agrees it can be sold and replaced with new furniture bought by tenant,
    c) Tenant moves in and buys new furniture,
    d) Landlord changes mind about selling old furniture,
    e) Tenant now stuck with old furniture taking up space, asks for advice on options.

    The only issue might be the order in which points c and d occur.

    Not what the OP said!


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    #22
    cormie
    Registered Users Posts: 20,836 ✭✭✭✭cormie


    sari wrote: »
    We'll yes except for me who I'll have to advertise, find and organise transport.
    I'm going ask her to call over so we can talk about it

    It's probably your cheapest solution if the landlord isn't willing to help and is ok as long as there's a suite of furniture still there when you're moving out. The faux leather sofas are terrible, nearly every one I've moved has been in bad condition. I did the same thing myself that I'm advising, I didn't like the sofa bed so kept my eye on them sites for a new one, one came up so I got it and got rid of the one I had, before I move out again I'll either keep it and get another similar one to the original or just leave it here. Helps to have a van but I did all this on my own back and didn't expect any help from the landlady.


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    #23
    Grolschevik
    Registered Users Posts: 3,472 ✭✭✭Grolschevik


    athtrasna wrote: »
    Not what the OP said!

    You got me!

    I must have subconsciously assumed that the chaos of the landlord packing and moving precluded a detailed examination of the furniture.

    OP, was the sofa covered in boxes and stuff, or was it a rushed and disjointed viewing?


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    #24
    Sleepy
    Registered Users Posts: 24,247 ✭✭✭✭Sleepy


    Would the armchairs fit in the attic?


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    #25
    sari
    Closed Accounts Posts: 301 ✭✭sari


    No we tried that can't get them up the stairs they are too big!!


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    #26
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,648 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    LL probably doesn't have anywhere to store them.

    Why not give notice. The LL is not abiding by the original arrangement.


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    #27
    Ray Palmer
    Registered Users Posts: 8,394 ✭✭✭Ray Palmer


    beauf wrote: »
    LL probably doesn't have anywhere to store them.

    Why not give notice. The LL is not abiding by the original arrangement.
    How are they not abiding by the original arrangement?


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    #28
    omega666
    Registered Users Posts: 595 ✭✭✭omega666


    Bad form from the Landlady in fairness after knowing the OP was buying new furniture and agreeing to allow the OP to remove the old furniture and then changing her mind.

    If it's in such a state she will prob have to replace it anyway after the OP moves out and she wants new tenants.


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    #29
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,648 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    Ray Palmer wrote: »
    How are they not abiding by the original arrangement?

    The LL agreed to new arrangement then, if you prefer.

    I think there's a difference in changing your mind and finding a problem. I don't see the point in ignoring a problem, simply because the tenant didn't realise it was there. A couch has to be fit for purpose. If the LL isn't willing to change it they should let the tenant move out.

    I don't see the point in being unreasonable about it.


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    #30
    Ray Palmer
    Registered Users Posts: 8,394 ✭✭✭Ray Palmer


    beauf wrote: »
    The LL agreed to new arrangement then, if you prefer.

    I think there's a difference in changing your mind and finding a problem. I don't see the point in ignoring a problem, simply because the tenant didn't realise it was there. A couch has to be fit for purpose. If the LL isn't willing to change it they should let the tenant move out.

    I don't see the point in being unreasonable about it.

    Still don't know what agreement you are referring to. If you are referring to the get rid of the furniture and then changing their mind then you are putting way to much emphasis on that. People can change their minds.


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    #31
    beauf
    Closed Accounts Posts: 22,648 ✭✭✭✭beauf


    I think you are trivialising how important furniture is for people, and tenants have a reasonable expectation that it will be a reasonable standard.


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