Cat poisoning

DrWu

An evil neighbor has put poison in the estate and our three cats and a neighbors dog were affected. We dont know what it is although she has a bright pink toxin in her birdbath as well. It may be antifreeze. The cats were discharged but have had to go back in to the vets with vomiting, runs and high temperature.

Does anyone have any experience of this and how likely it is that our best little friends will pull through? Cheers.

Capercaille

DrWu wrote: »

An evil neighbor has put poison in the estate and our three cats and a neighbors dog were affected. We dont know what it is although she has a bright pink toxin in her birdbath as well. It may be antifreeze. The cats were discharged but have had to go back in to the vets with vomiting, runs and high temperature.

Does anyone have any experience of this and how likely it is that our best little friends will pull through? Cheers.

If antifreeze it can cause kidney failure. Leaving poison out for any mammal/bird except rats/mice is illegal. Report them to police/ISPCA.

Knine

Capercaille wrote: »

If antifreeze it can cause kidney failure. Leaving poison out for any mammal/bird except rats/mice is illegal. Report them to police/ISPCA.

If the poison is in her back garden you could probably prove it was her legally. I would be presenting her with the vets bill. Definitely involve the Garda & keep your pets well away from her. Do not let them outside without you being there. She sounds like she has a screw loose.

I would also be getting a sample of that bird bath water.

Dermighty

Capercaille wrote: »

If antifreeze it can cause kidney failure. Leaving poison out for any mammal/bird except rats/mice is illegal. Report them to police/ISPCA.

I could put poison out and say it was for mice regardless of its intended use...So saying that it's illegal may technically be true, but it means nothing, as she isn't feeding it to the animals.

Knine

Dermighty wrote: »

I could put poison out and say it was for mice regardless of its intended use...So saying that it's illegal may technically be true, but it means nothing, as she isn't feeding it to the animals.

Normal people don't put antifreeze in bird baths to catch mice. This women needs to be stopped. There is also the small claim courts to recoup vets fees.

DrWu

Thanks for the tips folks. This is a seriously evil human being. She made a big slip up however (cant say here) and will be brought before the courts in time. Fingers crossed for my little friends everyone. Hopefully they'll pull through.

Capercaille

Dermighty wrote: »

I could put poison out and say it was for mice regardless of its intended use...So saying that it's illegal may technically be true, but it means nothing, as she isn't feeding it to the animals.

You can only used authorized rodenticides and the bait must be covered. Antifreeze is never allowed to be used as a poison for rodents. Any bird that uses that birdbath and drinks the water will also be poisoned.

anniehoo

The problem with antifreeze (ethylene glycol) poisoning is trying to prove if it was put out deliberately or has just leaked from a car. It has a sweet taste so dogs can be more susceptible as cats can't taste sweet things, but can ingest it just thinking it's normal water on the ground. It affects the central nervous system first, with kidney failure being the final issue. The symptoms can also be very similar to other conditions e.g pancreatitis, gastroenteritis, CNS trauma etc

Samples can be sent to either the Beaumont toxicology unit or Henry Leach Associates in the UK.

As far as Im aware it can come in different colours, a pinky red being one of them, others a yellow/green where urine can fluoresce under a Woods lamp (same lamp to diagnose ringworm).So, it's more than suspicious that she has pink fluid in her bird bath. The problem here is it's on private property i.e. her house, so you would have to go the legal route to get a sample.

Good luck OP and I really hope your cats pull through.

Knine

I doubt though the antifreeze fell into the bird water bath. Maybe the OP could take photos also of the pink substance in the bath and then take the samples. The more evidence he/she has, the better.

anniehoo

Knine wrote: »

I doubt though the antifreeze fell into the bird water bath. Maybe the OP could take photos also of the pink substance in the bath and then take the samples. The more evidence he/she has, the better.

I agree, but if it's in her back garden they'd be trespassing if they went in to get samples. Legal and toxicology veterinary cases are not always straightforward.

boomerang

Not disputing that your pets were poisoned, but are you sure what you saw in the bird bath wasn't bird feed? It can come in a berry colour.

Someone poisoned three semi-feral garden cats that we had neutered. They had threatened to before, despite the fact these cats were healthy, owned, sheltered and fed. The cats showed neurological signs. We sent samples to the UK (must have been Henry Leach, anniehoo.) It cost us about €100 per cat. The lab described crystallisation of tissue in the kidneys, which is an effect of ethylene glycol toxicity, but it couldn't be proven definitively that it was ethylene glycol that was the culprit.

DrWu

A sample was retrieved. Initial results show very high alkaline content compatible with poison.

Knine

anniehoo wrote: »

I agree, but if it's in her back garden they'd be trespassing if they went in to get samples. Legal and toxicology veterinary cases are not always straightforward.

I know :-) I did not want to suggest anything that I might get banned for as if someone harmed my pets I would be seriously unhappy!

Pumpkinseeds

OP I really hope the animals pull through. There seem to be an awful lot of twisted people out there these days. We had some horrendous neighbours for a while and I was always worried that they'd poison our cats. I might be wrong, but I seem to remember reading that there are 2 types of antifreeze, one that isn't toxic to animals? If so it'd be great if there were a law banning the toxic one.

The problem with a deliberate poisoning is that there doesn't seem to be any way of proving it unless you catch someone on camera, in the act. Either way it's a horrible thing for someone to do to an animal, and totally unforgiveable.

anniehoo

DrWu wrote: »

A sample was retrieved. Initial results show very high alkaline content compatible with poison.

A sample of what though? The substance itself? Ethylene glycol can range from 5.5 to 8.0 with alkalinity increased if it's diluted,so it's either side of the pH scale.

Dodd

If you let you cat or dog roam and go on other people's property then you can't know what happens to them.
A few cats have in the past walked in my door and just look at me as if to ask is it ok if I come in.
One has come in for years now and I don't know the owner.
I could understand someone else might not like cats/dogs on their land.
Maybe talk to the person and if they don't want your cats at their home then you deal with it and keep your cats away from other people's property.

Birdnuts

Dermighty wrote: »

I could put poison out and say it was for mice regardless of its intended use...So saying that it's illegal may technically be true, but it means nothing, as she isn't feeding it to the animals.

Rat/mice poison can only legally be used indoors or in special bait boxes that prevents access to other species. All such products are the subject of a licence from the PCS (Pesticide Control Service) - a government body which oversees the use of all potentially toxic substances. Failure to follow the terms of a product licence is an offence. So leaving out such poisons uncovered is indeed an offence.

Birdnuts

Dodd wrote: »

If you let you cat or dog roam and go on other people's property then you can't know what happens to them.
A few cats have in the past walked in my door and just look at me as if to ask is it ok if I come in.
One has come in for years now and I don't know the owner.
I could understand someone else might not like cats/dogs on their land.
Maybe talk to the person and if they don't want your cats at their home then you deal with it and keep your cats away from other people's property.

That's all well and good but the illegal use of poison also kills protected wildlife which is why the misuse of such substances is such a serious matter.

Dodd

Birdnuts wrote: »

That's all well and good but the illegal use of poison also kills protected wildlife which is why the misuse of such substances is such a serious matter.

At this time of year people are changing coolant/antifreeze to be ready for a cold spell.
We have not gone below -0 for some time but people could be changing theirs just to be sure and it is out there.

Birdnuts

Dodd wrote: »

At this time of year people are changing coolant/antifreeze to be ready for a cold spell.
We have not gone below -0 for some time but people could be changing theirs just to be sure and it is out there.

I'm aware of that but I'm talking about the deliberate mis-use of such products as outlined by the OP.

Dodd

Birdnuts wrote: »

I'm aware of that but I'm talking about the deliberate mis-use of such products as outlined by the OP.

But if you have control of you pet then it will never be this problem.
It is when you think your pet can run around where it likes then the problem starts .

anniehoo

Birdnuts wrote: »

I'm aware of that but I'm talking about the deliberate mis-use of such products as outlined by the OP.

The OP has intonated towards the misuse,but there's no definitive proof.There's a massive difference.

DrWu wrote: »

We dont know what it is although she has a bright pink toxin in her birdbath as well. It may be antifreeze.

The OP doesn't know for sure, so either can we.

Pretzill

As I said on another of your posts I do hope your pets health improves. Just a note regarding the pink water in the birdbath could it be from the birds eating hawberries? I'm not disputing the fact that this person poisoned your cats but putting antifreeze in the birdbath seems extreme.

Not that poisoning the neighbours pets isn't, but...well I hope you know what I mean.

DrWu

Dodd wrote: »

But if you have control of you pet then it will never be this problem.
It is when you think your pet can run around where it likes then the problem starts .

And a bird bath full of antifreeze is meant to do what exactly? Secondly, poisoned meat was placed around the estate in amenity areas that children also play in.

DrWu

Pretzill wrote: »

As I said on another of your posts I do hope your pets health improves. Just a note regarding the pink water in the birdbath could it be from the birds eating hawberries? I'm not disputing the fact that this person poisoned your cats but putting antifreeze in the birdbath seems extreme.

Not that poisoning the neighbours pets isn't, but...well I hope you know what I mean.

I got a sample and it is a poison (full lab results havent come back yet).

Dodd

I would get cctv on fast to prove your case.
Maybe people in the area will help pay for you setting up CCTV to sort ot out
The thing is the person is doing this for a reason and that needs to be sorted out.
If they don't want your cat on there property then what are you going to do to stop this happening.

Raminahobbin

Dodd wrote: »

The thing is the person is doing this for a reason and that needs to be sorted out.
If they don't want your cat on there property then what are you going to do to stop this happening.

This is not about the OPs cats on another persons land. Nowhere does it say that is happening. That is an entirely different topic.

This is about someone illegally poisoning wildlife and leaving poisoned meat out in common areas, poisoning indiscriminately. Presumably other people's pets are at risk also.

OP do you live in an estate?

DrWu

Dodd wrote: »

I would get cctv on fast to prove your case.
Maybe people in the area will help pay for you setting up CCTV to sort ot out
The thing is the person is doing this for a reason and that needs to be sorted out.
If they don't want your cat on there property then what are you going to do to stop this happening.

They are doing it maliciously. An anonymous neighbor reported them to the ISPCA for mistreating their dogs and they decided to poison our pets. A neighbors dog was also poisoned. You clearly hate cats yourself. may I suggest you start your own thread on the subject or contribute sensibly to this one.

DrWu

Raminahobbin wrote: »

This is not about the OPs cats on another persons land. Nowhere does it say that is happening. That is an entirely different topic.

This is about someone illegally poisoning wildlife and leaving poisoned meat out in common areas, poisoning indiscriminately. Presumably other people's pets are at risk also.

OP do you live in an estate?

Yes, a small estate of 7 houses.

DBB

DrWu wrote: »

You clearly hate cats yourself. may I suggest you start your own thread on the subject or contribute sensibly to this one.

This is back-seat moderation, I'd suggest you desist from telling people whether and what they can contribute to this thread.
Dodd's enquiries are legitimate. I see nothing to suggest he/she "clearly hates cats". He/she is simply drawing attention to the fact that this is the sort of thing that happens to pets when they're allowed to roam.
That said, going down that line of argument is going to drag this thread off-topic, and probably down the train-wreck route, if history is anything to go by.
In summary, keep this thread on-topic.
Do not attempt to control who posts here, a far more serious breach.
If you have a problem with a post, report it, and if it is a legitimate concern, one of the mods will take appropriate action.
Do not reply to this post on-thread.
Thanks,
DBB

Cuddlesworth

You can't just place CCTV looking onto a public area.

You can take a person to the small claims court. Only a business.

If poison is being left out, its a criminal matter for the guards. Your tests and results will mean next to nothing due to the bias attached to them.

If you want to protect your pets, then stop them leaving your property. There is nothing preventing your neighbour from leaving out some food, picking up your cat, snapping its neck and lobbing the body somewhere. Doesn't sound like they would have a issue with it either.