Womens' rugby Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread

awec

@sydthebeat sorry, I had to snip your post as we're not allowed to paste pay-walled material here.

sydthebeat

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120473231#Comment_120473231

apologies !!

Richard Hillman

It is getting absurd from both parties.

The IRFU are just basically playing the media game. When there was that 30 Recommendation thing, the IRFU just flat out said yes to every thing. You'd think there would be some issues, some negotiations on certain things but no. It was a flat out, no thought, yes to everything. Why? Because basically they and the PR department wanted the thing to go away because the media were running with it, on the teams side.

The team have been using the media and playing the game, that a PR/Marketing department would be proud of.

It's basically 2 PR/Marketing departments having a tiff on the behalf of each party. It is pathetic.

minitrue

Where do you think the 30 recommendations came from? It was the IRFU employees. And if you read them what do you think who would have pushed back on? Also highly relevant to note that #29 was to consider the introduction of hybrid or retainer contracts (and #30 was to work with RPI to create a programme of support for players to enable them to balance work, study and rugby commitments) while of course one of the points in today's article was that they dropped that concept in favour of "all or nothing" derisory full time contracts.

And it's not "the team" telling the IRFU their slurry still stinks as they all know they will be the next ones exiled if they do, it's people who have either left the game or at least the IRFU's influence (notice this article isn't from an Irish rugby journalist who would have their access pulled). If you think they are all PR/marketing folk ... hell do you even really think the IRFU are letting their own PR people deal with their responses? You think a PR department told them to tell a journalist they couldn't comment on a question unless they got the name of the player who dared tell a journalist a story?

Some fun questions:

1) How many of the €15k full time employees just see it as serving an apprenticeship in the shop window for a better contract elsewhere?

2) Are the €15k full-time contracts legal in terms of minimum wage legislation?

3) What do the contracts say about expressing any opinions? Could that be why the IRFU were so keen to jump straight to central contracts?

#IGiveAFuck

minitrue

Meanwhile I tried to work out earlier how the WXV 2024 will work and got nowhere, does anyone know? Specifically will our place in the 2024 Six Nations decide our WXV 2024 spot or is that a one off for 2023? If the 2024 6 Nations result has no bearing on WXV we might have a rough time trying to qualify for the 2025 World Cup despite the fact it has expanded to 16 teams! How they split the pools in WXV 3, which I also couldn't find any info on, could mean we have to win all 3 games.

SaoPaulo41

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120472700#Comment_120472700

Isn't it amazing how all these stories always come out after embarrassing defeats. It's time they took responsibility for their abject performances and stopped anonymously blaming others with anecdotes of he said this we were denied that. It should also be ok for the media to critisise them,but they are getting a free ride for some reason.They are becoming a very dislikable team.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120474711#Comment_120474711

The last line sums it up. I back any Irish team or athlete. I've been to plenty of the women's rugby matches but honestly just find the team really hard to support.

I had hoped the new beginnings would help and with a lot of new players maybe it would change. IRFU have made mistakes, there's no denying that, but I do feel like some of the women come across as an extremely entitled bunch who will blame anyone and everyone bar themselves. The media obviously are happy to write about it. The line "Johnny Sexton wouldn't be denied protein" is one of the most cringe worthy things I've read.

Neither side are coming across well, would be nice to be focussing on the rugby and the fact that we've a lot of young players who are going to be learning and improving a lot.

Yes there will be plenty of defeats but that's how you rebuild

CIARAN_BOYLE

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120474383#Comment_120474383

Qualification is a one shot.

Then WXV division one will be ringfenced 2024 but WXV division two and three will have promotion and relegation after 2023.

There are 4 teams qualified, there will be 6 qualified through regions or the pacific fours. These will probably mostly end up in Womens XV 1 and 2.

The top 6 ranked teams that dont qualify through another path will qualify through WXV. That means that a mid table result in WXV3 in 2024 will get us qualification for the women's rugby world cup 2025.

England France Canada and New Zealand will all be in WXV division 1 and are already qualified.

Caranica

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120474711#Comment_120474711

BS. The IRFU is rotten to the core when it comes to the attitudes to and structures around women's rugby. You also call this a team, given the wholesale changes in personnel over past few years, they've had no chance to gel as a unit.

If you don't want to support the players, don't bother. They need support and empathy not negative diatribe like you've posted.

SaoPaulo41

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120474863#Comment_120474863

Sounds like more excuses . Let the results do the talking

Caranica

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120474873#Comment_120474873

We're not going to get results with the current set up. That article is the tip of the iceberg but all of this goes back years. More will come out.

And this article didn't come out after a bad result, it came out on travel day to Italy. It's bad timing for the players but it needs to come out.

They travelled yesterday. Not sure why, but the women seem to do out a day earlier than the other teams

Lost Ormond

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120474354#Comment_120474354

I think many of the contracted players see it as first step towards long term more sustainable and liveable contracts just like with mens game and first pros here were on relatively little.money.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120474383#Comment_120474383

That link shows qualification process.

https://www.world.rugby/news/624265/world-rugby-launches-new-global-competition-and-aligned-calendar-to-supercharge-the-womens-15s-game

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120474711#Comment_120474711

Absolute nonsense. These stories have came out after big wins as well and these stories help show why some of the defeats are as bad as they are as its shows the lack of attention the set up is given by the powers that be.

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120474873#Comment_120474873

Not excuses at all. The players are not getting the support they should which would give them better performances/results.

minitrue

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120474824#Comment_120474824

The "these will most probably end up in WXV 1 or 2" part is a little bit of a stretch as I presume they will qualify for WXV from tournaments this year but then get the world cup spots from tournaments next year. That's 3 regions (Oceania, Asia and Africa) where one team might win this year (WXV 2) but another (WXV 3) wins next year to take a WC spot. Worst case that could leave only one spot for WXV 3. Throw in the confusion from promotion/relegation and the way it's played in pools and even if there are 3 spots available you could only lose 1 game and still not be in the top 3 if the other 2 teams in your pool are the weakest and get whipped by the teams you beat.

Or IOW we really want to either get into WXV 2 and stay there somehow or win WXV 3 this year to get there!

CIARAN_BOYLE

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120475049#Comment_120475049

While South Africa aren't the best womens team (by a long shot) no one in Africa will challenge them and they will sail into the African championship this year and next year.

You are right about the Asian tournament being up in the air. Japan or Hong Kong are realistic competitors. Oceania also could be up in the air with Fiji or Samoa being likely to qualify but if Australia doesn't beat USA in pacific 4s Australia may be trying to qualify through Oceania.

Getting into WXV2 is the easiest route to the world cup. I suspect our team would be stronger than the Oceania or Asian qualifier.

Our easiest route to the womens rugby world cup is probably to beat Scotland to claim 5th in the six nations this year qualifying for womens xv2. Beat either or both of Fiji/Samoa and Japan/Hong Kong to retain our spot in WXV2. That of course assumes that the split into pools allows us to face one of those teams. It may not which could see us screwed (facing the other six nations qualifier, the 4th place team in pacific 4s and South Africa).

naughtyboy

We all know what's going on here with the current and ex players, this is nothing but a money and power grab.

The problem is the ladies are useless and have been for years and so their bargaining chip is not success but instead we are women and so are entitled to equality.

It's embarrassing, they should focus all their energy on getting better and as they do their will be more interest in the women's game and as a result more money , its basic common sense. Someone needs to get through to them that You get paid by your value not your Time.

Mod: Trolling and misogyny will not be tolerated here. Infraction issued.

minitrue

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120475360#Comment_120475360

South Africa seem to be on the up from a low floor with the most distant challenger(s) so I'd agree it would be the biggest shock of the 3 if say Kenya nipped past them but all it takes is one surprise result and between teams close that could be one early red card mistake (or a red and the wrong injuries/other cards). Oceania is a little nuts and I guess we'd want Australia to be 4th in P4N and then take the Oceania WC spot to make sure Fiji/Samoa can't do the flip-flop and both qualify without WXV results.

If we somehow beat Scotland and get 5th then we'd probably have to beat at least one of Australia/USA, South Africa and Japan/Hong Kong to survive in WXV 2 (wikipedia says it's the 2 six nations and Oceania in one side and P4N, Asia and Africa in the other). Given what we saw in Japan and the trajectory South Africa seem to be on I wouldn't be very confident. If we don't beat Scotland you would hope we could win WXV 3 with something like Spain, Hong Kong, Samoa, Kenya and Colombia but I wouldn't be rushing to put money on it!

Larbre34

Ireland improved in some aspects, but were ultimately shown up again by a decent Italian side playing well within themselves.

How you even ask this team to pull on jerseys to play an England team that are at the pinnacle of the women's game, I just don't know. It could very feasibly be a 100 point margin.

Cosmo Kramer

The PR machine will be going into overdrive for the next week now. Who knows what kind of stuff will be leaked out this week.

prawnsambo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120481883#Comment_120481883

They will have the sevens players back by then surely?

Caranica

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120482029#Comment_120482029

🙄 Really, that's the best you can do? There were improvements but going on form we were never going to win this game. And we won't win against England either. That doesn't mean that every girl in green today didn't put their heart and body on the line, they clearly did.

Cosmo Kramer

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120482164#Comment_120482164

I don't doubt for a second that they gave their all on the day.

Furze99

What doesn't really help is that the tournament is being run as a separate entity from the mens. In order to give it greater media exposure etc. So there's nowhere to hide.

Caranica

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120482401#Comment_120482401

Are you serious? Separating it from the men's has boosted coverage and attendance and support for the women's competition. The women's world cup isn't even in the same year as the men's.

Yes it means there's nowhere to hide, nor should there be. We'll build and improve but that will take time. We gave our men time after a bad few seasons, we owe the women the same.

Furze99

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120482424#Comment_120482424

Of course, but in previous years where womens Six Nations was run in parallel with mens, there was a place to hide poor results. What I hear, particularly on RTE is a lot of talking up the womens game but it's not being borne out.

Jack Daw

It was an extremely bad look when all the controversy about the running of the womens team was in the papers over the past couple of years and whenever players were asked for comment almost none of them said we need to play better, we need to work harder , we need to improve our skills it was always someone elses fault.

prawnsambo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120482617#Comment_120482617

Oh! So the fact that the IRFU apologised for their failings and accepted all 30 recommendations of the review into women's rugby had nothing to do with the state of the women's game and they were just being upitty and [checks post] not training hard enough.

Right.

Jack Daw

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120483582#Comment_120483582

Every individual athlete has personal responsibility regardless of the sport.The fact that the players seemed to lay all the blame at the hands of the IRFU and none of it on themselves is not a good look in my opinion irrespective of how poor the structures and management are.

prawnsambo

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120483776#Comment_120483776

You don't seem that convinced of your own argument: "seemed".

Maybe back that statement up and then we both can be convinced.

Jack Daw

https://www.boards.ie/discussion/comment/120483824#Comment_120483824

Every time I read any comment from players in the papers over the last couple of years only a couple of them said we need to get better all the rest laid the blame on the IRFU.

What do you want me to do to back up that statement, go through newspaper archives for the past 2 years and fund all the quotes from players, because I haven't got enough time to do that.