Will you wear a poppy 2013?

old hippy

Zebra3 wrote: »

You've got a crush on heavily armed humans in an evil organisation that go out to slaughter innocent, unarmed humans.

Your comments on here prove that.

No, I don't support any military organisation. Any. That said, I have nothing against individuals who join up. As I've said, I've enough love for everyone. Even you.

bumper234

Zebra3 wrote: »

Failed attempt to sidetrack the top of the thread which is about supporting the murderers and torturers of the British Army.

Feel free to try again.

Erm the topic is about the remembrance poppy not about whatever atrocities the BA committed. If you feel the need to bring that up every post then he has the right to bring up the tortures and murders that the IRA committed over the years.

Zebra3

bumper234 wrote: »

Erm the topic is about the remembrance poppy not about whatever atrocities the BA committed. If you feel the need to bring that up every post then he has the right to bring up the tortures and murders that the IRA committed over the years.

The thread is about the remembrance poppy which fundraises for the killers and torturers of the British forces and those who support them. You can always check the title which you may need to do as half the time you seem to be lost about what you're on about.

I don't see what the IRA, US army or KGB or whatever else have to do with the thread.

moxin

Captain Farrell wrote: »

here's an idea of what we are taught in English schools about irish history.

You forgot to mention the ethnic cleansing against the Irish. To Hell or to Connaught.

In recent modern history which is 100% truth, the BA have murdered about 150 Irish unarmed civilians and at least another 120 unarmed civilians through their proxies like the Glenane gang. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-24645945

bumper234

Zebra3 wrote: »

The thread is about the remembrance poppy which fundraises for the killers and torturers of the British forces and those who support them. You can always check the title which you may need to do as half the time you seem to be lost about what you're on about.

I don't see what the IRA, US army or KGB or whatever else have to do with the thread.

Can you name a few of these for me please? Can you name lets say.....5 "killers and torturers" who receive money from the poppy appeal. I assume you know the names of these people and have proof that they receive money from the poppy appeal?

I bring up the US army because they are doing (right now) the same things that you say the BA did but it doesn't seem to bother you.

I bring up the IRA because they did the same things as the BA but that doesn't seem to bother you.

I don't recall ever mentioning the KGB

bumper234

moxin wrote: »

You forgot to mention the ethnic cleansing against the Irish. To Hell or to Connaught.

In recent modern history which is 100% truth, the BA have murdered about 150 Irish unarmed civilians and at least another 120 unarmed civilians through their proxies like the Glenane gang. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-24645945

And the IRA killed about 650 but hey who's counting right

moxin

bumper234 wrote: »

And the IRA killed about 650 but hey who's counting right

Aren't the IRA suppose to have been terrorists? As you seem to respect them as equals to the BA, then the BA are terrorists too.

The topic is the BA and their red poppy which the British people are choosing to fund the welfare of their soldiers who murdered hundreds of unarmed civilains in NI.

Captain Farrell

moxin wrote: »

Aren't the IRA suppose to have been terrorists? As you seem to respect them as equals to the BA, then the BA are terrorists too.

The topic is the BA and their red poppy which the British people are choosing to fund the welfare of their soldiers who murdered hundreds of unarmed civilains in NI.

guess you never read my posts about the propganda you are taught in irish schools. IRA killed 4x the amount of irish civilians, but hey, they're the good guys, right?

According to Malcolm Sutton's Index of Deaths from the Conflict in Ireland:[146]
Of those killed by British security forces:
187 (~51.5%) were civilians
145 (~39.9%) were members of republican paramilitaries
18 (~4.9%) were members of loyalist paramilitaries
13 (~3.5%) were fellow members of the British security forces
Of those killed by republican paramilitaries:
1080 (~52%) were members of the British security forces
728 (~35%) were civilians
187 (~9%) were members of republican paramilitaries
56 (~2.7%) were members of loyalist paramilitaries
10 (~0.4%) were members of the Irish security forces
Of those killed by loyalist paramilitaries:
868 (~85.4%) were civilians
93 (~9%) were members of loyalist paramilitaries
41 (~4%) were members of republican paramilitaries
14 (~1.3%) were members of the British security forces

bumper234

moxin wrote: »

Aren't the IRA suppose to have been terrorists? As you seem to respect them as equals to the BA, then the BA are terrorists too.

The topic is the BA and their red poppy which the British people are choosing to fund the welfare of their soldiers who murdered hundreds of unarmed civilains in NI.

Yet thousands of Irish men and women voluntarily go to work in the UK and pay tax that helps fund the same thing

Many Irish also buy the Easter lily that raises money to commemorate the IRA who murdered hundreds of unarmed civilians.

Captain Farrell

moxin wrote: »

You forgot to mention the ethnic cleansing against the Irish. To Hell or to Connaught.

In recent modern history which is 100% truth, the BA have murdered about 150 Irish unarmed civilians and at least another 120 unarmed civilians through their proxies like the Glenane gang. http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-northern-ireland-24645945

and you missed this..

And so the journey began. I became familiar with all of the usual sources and those not so usual. As I read more about Cromwell, it became difficult (although not impossible) to reconcile how a man with such lofty moral ethics could engage in the senseless slaughter of Ireland’s innocents, even amid the frenetic environment of 17th-century warfare. I wiped the slate clean and evaluated the evidence of those people who were actually in Drogheda and Wexford at the time the massacres took place. It was shocking to realise that not one person in either town left written details of the deaths of even one unarmed civilian. Obviously small numbers of male civilians could have died as the result of collateral damage. To argue otherwise is folly. But there was no policy to kill the innocent either before, during or after the sieges of Drogheda and Wexford.

moxin

bumper234 wrote: »

Many Irish also buy the Easter lily that raises money to commemorate the IRA who murdered hundreds of unarmed civilians.

Didn't know you hated dead people whose graves are cared for by the National Graves Association.

moxin

Captain Farrell wrote: »

guess you never read my posts about the propganda you are taught in irish schools. IRA killed 4x the amount of irish civilians, but hey, they're the good guys, right?

You missed the outsourcing of state violence to Loyalists, your good guys right?

Captain Farrell wrote: »

and you missed this..

Nothing missed, tom Reilly has been condemned for half truths in his book. Still Cromwell did murder many Irish people even if what he say about Drogheda is true, that's unrefutable.

bumper234

moxin wrote: »

Didn't know you hated dead people whose graves are cared for by the National Graves Association.

Where have i said i hated anyone?

The money for the Easter lily goes to the National Graves Association to help keep the graves of murderers and torturers. Why not let their family or the government pay for it instead of asking the taxpayer to pay for it?

moxin

bumper234 wrote: »

Where have i said i hated anyone?

The money for the Easter lily goes to the National Graves Association to help keep the graves of murderers and torturers. Why not let their family or the government pay for it instead of asking the taxpayer to pay for it?

You'd have to ask them as I have never purchased an Easter Lilly in my life.

We can't have a government "looking after dead murderers and torturers" can we? But hey we have the poppy to look after living British Army murderers and torturers.

Captain Farrell

moxin wrote: »

You'd have to ask them as I have never purchased an Easter Lilly in my life.

We can't have a government "looking after dead murderers and torturers" can we? But hey we have the poppy to look after living British Army murderers and torturers.

Bought my second one today.

bumper234

moxin wrote: »

You'd have to ask them as I have never purchased an Easter Lilly in my life.

We can't have a government "looking after dead murderers and torturers" can we? But hey we have the poppy to look after living British Army murderers and torturers.

We have a charity donating money to people who need it

http://www.britishlegion.org.uk/about-us/what-we-do/faqs/what-we-do


HOW DO YOU RAISE MONEY?
We raise funds through donations from the public, money left to the Legion in Wills, fundraising events, corporate partnerships, raffles, Poppy Lottery and merchandise.

Our biggest fundraising campaign is the annual Poppy Appeal.

We are completely independent of the Government and MoD and do not receive funding from them.

T runner

bumper234 wrote: »

Can you name a few of these for me please? Can you name lets say.....5 "killers and torturers" who receive money from the poppy appeal. I assume you know the names of these people and have proof that they receive money from the poppy appeal?

I bring up the US army because they are doing (right now) the same things that you say the BA did but it doesn't seem to bother you.

I bring up the IRA because they did the same things as the BA but that doesn't seem to bother you.

I don't recall ever mentioning the KGB

As far as i know there is no rule stopping monies from the poppy appeal going to soldiers who have misbehaved in Ireland or in any other country. Or am i mistaken? Spitting at "Irish" children was fairly commonplace for your average Joe Soldier on patrol in NI.....sighting guns on children to frighten them happenned more often than not. Thats not counting the many cases of brutality, intimidation and muder that people know took place by soldiers but were not acted on or were actually ordered by the BA. Support the ordinary ex-soldier who served in NI: NO thanks.


Soldiers arent generally the patriotic heros they are painted as. Those without education are generally only in the army because they dont have another outlet, to keep them out of trouble....or in the worst case scenario..to provide a legal outlet to feed a violent or psychopathic streak.

In armies of "superior" States like the US, France and Britain...racism is endemic.

The poppy and all associated with it....is an arms dealers and war mongers dream. To counter the obvious evils of war....hey produce the war veteran and say to those against war: are you saying this man who fought/died for his country..this man fought for nothing?

It is perfect for the actual State (the starters of war): they can skimp on supporting vets and the resultant campaigns to raise money actually make it harder for citizens to be against a war thus make a war more acceptable and future wars more likely.

Any public figure who does not wear the poppy bears the full brunt of British nationalism: An Irish presenter on BBC, taken off her show for not wearing one is an obvious example.

Theres no choice in Britian, its not a charity: if you dont wear one youre anti-British and will take the consequences.

The ordinary men who died in the trenches...whether conscripted in Britain, or making the blood sacrifice For/against home rule (both were promised by Britain to Irishmen of whatever hue)....those men, fighting over a dispute among the imperial classes......do you think they would want their memory abused and used by the war mongers who put them in the trenches in the first place?

Say no to war. Dont wear the poppy.

Crooked Jack

bumper234 wrote: »

We have a charity donating money to people who need it

http://www.britishlegion.org.uk/about-us/what-we-do/faqs/what-we-do


HOW DO YOU RAISE MONEY?
We raise funds through donations from the public, money left to the Legion in Wills, fundraising events, corporate partnerships, raffles, Poppy Lottery and merchandise.

Our biggest fundraising campaign is the annual Poppy Appeal.

We are completely independent of the Government and MoD and do not receive funding from them.

This does nothing to dispute moxin's point. It has been established in this thread from the first pages that proceeds from the poppy go to past and present British soldiers.

bumper234

Crooked Jack wrote: »

This does nothing to dispute moxin's point. It has been established in this thread from the first pages that proceeds from the poppy go to past and present British soldiers.

*sigh *

A charity collects money and gives it to soldiers (past and present) and people scream about it.

Irish people CHOOSE to go to work in the UK and contribute to the same British soldiers pensions via tax contributions, they contribute to the ongoing wars, they contribute to the military machine but that's ok

Matt_Trakker

bumper234 wrote: »

*sigh *

A charity collects money and gives it to soldiers (past and present) and people scream about it.

Irish people CHOOSE to go to work in the UK and contribute to the same British soldiers pensions via tax contributions, they contribute to the ongoing wars, they contribute to the military machine but that's ok

Best thing to do then would be to allow taxpayers to nominate where they'd like their tax money to go.

Captain Farrell

Matt_Trakker wrote: »

Best thing to do then would be to allow taxpayers to nominate where they'd like their tax money to go.

Or not move to country if they disapprove of where that tax money is spent, or have a problem with the actions of it's armed forces.

Matt_Trakker

Captain Farrell wrote: »

Or not move to country if they disapprove of where that tax money is spent, or have a problem with the actions of it's armed forces.

No, it's clear than my idea is superior.

Karl Stein

Can you imagine this conversation being had on the BBC around this time of year?

T runner

Irish people CHOOSE to go to work in the UK and contribute to the same British soldiers pensions via tax contributions, they contribute to the ongoing wars, they contribute to the military machine but that's ok

Youre clutching at straws. These Irish people also contribute to others' penions, towards health expenditure and towards paying the all British public servants. To imply that these Irish people are endorsing or aiding an aggressive military policy by working in that country is plainly ludicrous. No matter what person occupies that job the tax will be spent where it will be spent. If the person's individual expertese was employed to aid the war cause dirstcly, then that might be an ethical matter for them.

Remember also, these Irish people alo contribute to your Greek style 12 billion pound annual bailout for London to pay for your unsustaineable public service state-let. Be Thankful.

bumper234 wrote: »

*sigh *

A charity collects money and gives it to soldiers (past and present) and people scream about it.

Thats the issue. In Britain they scream about it if you dont wear it. Many of the public people who buy the poppy dont really support it in principle. They are forced to because the consequences could extreme including racial abuse , job loss and death threats. Fighting wars, unfortunately, is still very much a part of the British mind set.

The war mongers and arms dealers dont need to sell war to the people do they? They just need someone to sell the poppy.

IrishProd

Here are some of the reasons why Irish people won't wear the poppy (bar the majority of northern unionists/loyalists who only wear it for political grandstanding and making a political statement). Unionists also wear it to commemorate loyalist paramilitaries, who they held in the same regard as British soldiers, even though they killed more innocent people than anyone else.

Ballymurphy Massacre
Bloody Sunday Massacre
Burning of Cork
Bachelor's Walk Massacre
Croke Park Massacre
Miami Showband Massacre
Arnon Street Massacre
Greysteel Massacre
Loughisland Massacre
Milltown Massacre
Gibbet Rath Massacre
Carnew Massacre
Siege of Drogheda
Massacre of Cashel
Massacre of Dunlavin Green
Execution of the 1916 Rising leaders
Sack of Wexford
Oliver Cromwell's War in Ireland
Fall's Curfew
Internment without Trial
Black & Tans
Loyalist Paramiliaties
B-Specials
Auxillaries

Keyzer

Carlos Roca wrote: »

Can you imagine this conversation being had on the BBC around this time of year?

Its the same bull year after year. As soon as this is over they'll be arguing the merits of the bacon double cheeseburger XL VS the Quarter LB Deluxe...




























mmm.... bacon....

T runner

Carlos Roca wrote: »

Can you imagine this conversation being had on the BBC around this time of year?

I dont even think "have i got news for you" would escape an anti-poppy firing squad!

Edit: a very recent story.... Some of the Lads who will benefit in future years from Poppy sales:

toomevara

I'll be wearing a white poppy, as always.

old hippy

So, to sum up - my murderous little army is better/worse than your murderous little army.

See you next year and the next 800 after :P

Nodin

bumper234 wrote: »

*sigh *

A charity collects money and gives it to soldiers (past and present) and people scream about it.

Irish people CHOOSE to go to work in the UK and contribute to the same British soldiers pensions via tax contributions, they contribute to the ongoing wars, they contribute to the military machine but that's ok

That's been dealt with......
http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=87235103&postcount=1100