Cost of funerals

cerastes

spank_inferno wrote: »

We need private sector grave-yards.

Where I am they are all council owned.. Costing 2.5k to dig a hole.

2.5k to dig a hole? is that for the plot too or something, Id rather dig it myself, I was told of that happening once, but outside Dublin, I have only known of it happening once that I could confirm, not sure if its common?

RainyDay wrote: »

I'm not sure at all the the private graveyards around Dublin have managed to bring down prices. The private funeral directors around Dublin haven't managed to bring down prices.

I guess people just aren't in the mood for haggling or shopping round.

The only solution seems to be to avoid the traditional funeral. Get cremated, avoid the church, have a get together in the local GAA club.

Indeed, that is what they are playing on, people wont be in the mood to shop around, whats wrong with having people to the house too?

shar01 wrote: »

Yep, we need something similar to Co-op here. My gran in England organised and paid for her funeral in 2010. She died earlier this year and everything was sorted as she wanted it.
Maybe as cremation becomes more popular, prices will come down.

I was at a cremation in the UK, wasnt aware it was even carried out here, but seems popular there, nice ceremony.


I have heard that Undertakers overcharge (no suprise there) to account for/cover the costs of unpaid or incompletely paid for funerals, so you could be paying for someone elses funeral when if you pay in full. Thats probably why they offer the upfront discount, what are they going to do if an outstanding balance isn't paid, dig you up?

Victor

cerastes wrote: »

Id rather dig it myself

This may be problematic if you are in the box.

I have heard that Undertakers overcharge (no suprise there) to account for/cover the costs of unpaid or incompletely paid for funerals, so you could be paying for someone elses funeral when if you pay in full.

All businesses have to make up for bad debts somehow.

cerastes

Victor wrote: »

This may be problematic if you are in the box.
Al businesses have to make up for bad debts somehow.

i meant for a relative, I assume if I was in the box I wouldn't care or be able to care who paid

Agent_99

cerastes wrote: »

i meant for a relative, I assume if I was in the box I wouldn't care or be able to care who paid

I know a group of lads that went down to the graveyard on the evening their father died with a few cans and dug that grave between them. They said that it was the best bereavement therapy ever as they felt useful instead of hanging round the house drinking tea

Howard Juneau

Agent_99 wrote: »

I know a group of lads that went down to the graveyard on the evening their father died with a few cans and dug that grave between them. They said that it was the best bereavement therapy ever as they felt useful instead of hanging round the house drinking tea

When my cousin passed recently, her sons & nephews dug her grave & then after the burial, filled in her grave
It's still a tradition to do this in some rural areas. Not done as a money saver, but as a show of respect to the person who passed

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

I think some people here at assuming that the Dublin way is the country's way. The council owns graveyards in many towns but the parishes own more - hence private sector. Not all graves cost 2500 - some are much more but others are as low as €50. You can of course dig a family grave. The charge is for the grave. Funerals can cost a lot of money but don't have to.
What exactly is the consumer issue here?
College fees are expensive, medical fees are expensive, fuel costs are expensive, razor blades are expensive, funerals are expensive.........

dudara

I'm willing to leave this open in the Consumer Issues forum, as it's a big of an unusual topic. But please, no smart comments, stick the topic and discuss it seriously.

dudara

ABajaninCork

Howard Juneau wrote: »

When my cousin passed recently, her sons & nephews dug her grave & then after the burial, filled in her grave
It's still a tradition to do this in some rural areas. Not done as a money saver, but as a show of respect to the person who passed

At home, the gravediggers LOVE black funerals! They get a huge tip for no work. We have a tradition of the men filling the grave, whilst hymns are sung. The hat is passed round for a tip for the gravediggers. Nothing but paper money goes in! My husband calls it a 'silent' collection as there's no coins put in.

Guy:Incognito

ABajaninCork wrote: »

I've not seen or heard of any in Cork! Anyway - why should the choice be restricted? Why not take out a funeral plan with which ANY undertaker can be paid from the proceeds? That's what I was asking...

Any undertaker can be paid from it, your just making the choice before you pay.

amdublin

ABajaninCork wrote: »

At home, the gravediggers LOVE black funerals! They get a huge tip for no work. We have a tradition of the men filling the grave, whilst hymns are sung. The hat is passed round for a tip for the gravediggers. Nothing but paper money goes in! My husband calls it a 'silent' collection as there's no coins put in.

What's a black funeral

ABajaninCork

amdublin wrote: »

What's a black funeral

A funeral held for a black person. A person of Afro-Caribbean origin if you like. I thought it might've been obvious from my post...

amdublin

ABajaninCork wrote: »

A funeral held for a black person. A person of Afro-Caribbean origin if you like. I thought it might've been obvious from my post...

Well it confused the heck out of me. No idea where it came from or why it was mentioned.

Where is "at home" Cork or the Carribean? And black people there dig their own graves?

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

ABajaninCork wrote: »

A funeral held for a black person. A person of Afro-Caribbean origin if you like. I thought it might've been obvious from my post...

The tradition of local men digging and filling in the grave is very common here too. As is a silent collection. It's also traditional for a family member to take the grave diggers for a drink once the grave is dug.
So the reference to a black funeral was lost on some of us.

Back to the cost and choice. All that can be sorted well in advance if you wish. You can shop around and do a prepaid deal with the undertaker or simply save towards it. If only that could be done for all goods and services.

cerastes

Agent_99 wrote: »

I know a group of lads that went down to the graveyard on the evening their father died with a few cans and dug that grave between them. They said that it was the best bereavement therapy ever as they felt useful instead of hanging round the house drinking tea

This is what I heard being done, few drinks and dug the grave.

ABajaninCork wrote: »

At home, the gravediggers LOVE black funerals! They get a huge tip for no work. We have a tradition of the men filling the grave, whilst hymns are sung. The hat is passed round for a tip for the gravediggers. Nothing but paper money goes in! My husband calls it a 'silent' collection as there's no coins put in.

I consider that quite despicable! people that expect a tip at a funeral, that really reduces the funeral where people are expecting a tip off people when they will be at their lowest, its practically blackmail.
Are they not getting paid already for the job in the first place? perhaps by the council if its a council graveyard?

ABajaninCork

cerastes wrote: »

I consider that quite despicable! people that expect a tip at a funeral, that really reduces the funeral where people are expecting a tip off people when they will be at their lowest, its practically blackmail.
Are they not getting paid already for the job in the first place? perhaps by the council if its a council graveyard?

I do agree. But it's the custom with Caribbean people that the grave is filled in by the men and the diggers get a large tip! I've seen it both in the West Indies as well as at home in the UK. I don't know what the general custom is, but my husband's family did give the gravediggers a drink at a recent bereavement. It might've been because it was a Saturday afternoon and they stayed behind especially.

cerastes

ABajaninCork wrote: »

I do agree. But it's the custom with Caribbean people that the grave is filled in by the men and the diggers get a large tip! I've seen it both in the West Indies as well as at home in the UK. I don't know what the general custom is, but my husband's family did give the gravediggers a drink at a recent bereavement. It might've been because it was a Saturday afternoon and they stayed behind especially.

Ok, I assumed this meant at funerals normally, that tips were expected.
I didnt realise this related specifically to West Indian custom, if thats what they want to do, fine.
edit, someone else has suggested the silent tipping is prevalent here too though?? I dont get it,
Id consider it demeaning for someone to hang around and expect a tip at a loved ones funeral.

ytpe2r5bxkn0c1

cerastes wrote: »

Ok, I assumed this meant at funerals normally, that tips were expected.
I didnt realise this related specifically to West Indian custom, if thats what they want to do, fine.
edit, someone else has suggested the silent tipping is prevalent here too though?? I dont get it,
Id consider it demeaning for someone to hang around and expect a tip at a loved ones funeral.

Maybe read the posts again. She said it was black funerals in the UK. It was then commented that the expression "a silent collection" was used here too. We have silent collections biut not at funerals.

Where are we going with this???

cerastes

Halle Enough Spike wrote: »

Maybe read the posts again. She said it was black funerals in the UK. It was then commented that the expression "a silent collection" was used here too. We have silent collections biut not at funerals.

Where are we going with this???

I wasnt aware of these silent collections, or when they occurred after the proceedings, you mentioned it and it seemed to me that it is ineffect some form of payment?, I dont know who its for as you didnt expand on it, if its for paying someone that helped a family and isnt getting paid, it might be ok, who donates to the silent collection??
I would help dig a grave if asked, but I wouldn't expect to be paid, I'd take the offer of a few sandwhiches and some tea or a drink

If I attended anyones funeral, I've never seen it and Ive attended funerals, in Dublin and down the country and in the UK, I'd find it a bit odd if anyone passed around a hat/bowl to put minimum of a fiver into.
Where this is going?
Well, I think its that funerals are expensive and people expecting to be paid doesnt help the bereaved as far as I can see, it seems like emotional blackmail, the bereaved will feel bad enough and maybe fear as they wont want to appear cheap at a loved ones funeral, but I think it detracts from any dignity at a funeral to have what is effectively tipping brought up.

P_1

One thing that I have noticed with funeral homes in Dublin is that they (for lack of a better word) discourage family members from carrying out tasks that they could charge for themselves.

For example, they charge for dressing the deceased and taking care of their hair and makeup in the case of female deceased prior to the funeral. They charge three figure sums for this and it really is something that the family traditionally take care of

whelzer

At both my recent grandparents funerals, we (the family) filled in the grave afterwards. Every man/boy and some women had a go. It was good craic to be honest! Lots of banter as the folks who moved away from home/office workers (ie me) were "obviously" not able to handle a shovel as well as the more rural types.. It took a surprisingly long time to complete. The priest commented that he had never seen it before but had heard of it done in extremely rural places...

I've no connection with this crowd whatsoever but its where I plan on ending up... even got my coffin type picked! Hopefully they will be still going in 40 odd years when I pop me cloggs......

http://www.greengraveyard.com/

paulbolg

Package wrote: »

was literally just talking about this this morning.. and how much it would cost when, eventually the aul parents pass on, since they have NOTHING, it would be down to us kids to pay , does anyone know how much roughy a funeral costs in dublin? considering they dont even have a plot yet.

To answer your question. Glasnevin Cemetery prices begin at €2030 up to €10,000 for a double grave. The 2030 will accomodate up to 3 burials in some cases. Then an opening fee of 1020 which are 2013 prices. An average funeral home will charge for your coffin which will be from 600 to 2500 then their fees for admin staff use of premises could be from 1300 to 1700. Limousines are between 280 and 300 per car per day. Thats the funeral directors side.

Disbursements are whats paid for on your behalf are the grave opening and or purchase. Church offerings. Papers. Singer and or Organist. Flowers. Average burial with middle of the road coffin and a car for one day funeral 4500 - 5500. Cremation in glasnevin €630 and mount jerome €510.

Im in the business 11 years. Willing to answer any questions you may have.

paulbolg

P_1 wrote: »

One thing that I have noticed with funeral homes in Dublin is that they (for lack of a better word) discourage family members from carrying out tasks that they could charge for themselves.

For example, they charge for dressing the deceased and taking care of their hair and makeup in the case of female deceased prior to the funeral. They charge three figure sums for this and it really is something that the family traditionally take care of

Id love to know where your getting your info from?
The only charge made to families is the embalming fee. Dressing, makeup and hair is done free of charge. Normally wash blow dry. If colour to be done. Family supple colour or even hairdresser. I personally would never discourage a family from doing anything. If a family wanted to assist the funeral director in laying out their loved one i would then at the time see if it was possible to do so. It is vitally important that a family have as much imput into the funeral as its very personal.

VONSHIRACH

We had 2 bereavements during this year in the family in Dublin. The funerals cost €7.5k each. The grave had been purchased a few years ago, so that is not in the cost. I couldn't fault the undertaker in anything and that is why we used the same one. All costs were transparent. We had 2 limos and removal to a Church the evening before each burial. A cheaper coffin and cremation would have brought the cost down but cremation was not a wish of either person. Both deceased had bought the grave several years ago and had left funds with family to pay for burial.

If deceased had not left funds or purchased plot, it would have been very expensive on family Maybe cremation would have been the option then, as €25k for 2 funerals and a grave is a lot.

I think in some cases, cremation is the only option for some people due to the high costs of purchasing a grave plot. It could be argued that some local authorities in Dublin are failing to provide affordable grave spaces.

secretagent

A relative died there last year but about 9 years ago he went to an undertaker and payed for his funeral there and then by cheque.
He didn't tell anyone until he had everything arranged. It took an awful lot of stress off the family.
Intend to do the same myself. Funerals are getting more expensive every year.

RainyDay

paulbolg wrote: »

Cremation in glasnevin €630 and mount jerome €510.

Im in the business 11 years. Willing to answer any questions you may have.

Thanks for your open invite. So if someone goes for cremation, what would be the total overall cost on average? I presume there would generally be some undertaker fees for handling the body etc.

Is it true that it is generally not legal to scatter ashes in public parks or places?

paulbolg

RainyDay wrote: »

Thanks for your open invite. So if someone goes for cremation, what would be the total overall cost on average? I presume there would generally be some undertaker fees for handling the body etc.

Is it true that it is generally not legal to scatter ashes in public parks or places?

On average with a typical one day funeral going to the church or service on the same day as cremation plus funeral directors fee one limousine. Cremation coffin also suitable for burial. Cremation fees and obituary notice all in i would say max would be 4500. You can reduce this my removing limousine. Picking cheaper coffin or having a removal straight from place of death with limited viewing and no embalming to the crematorium. This would normally take place in the afternoon as normally this would be the morning.
As for scattering the ashes im not too sure of the legality issues that could arise when scattering ashes but lets say it has been done privately by the family if suitable. Scattering tubes are also available from most funeral homes but can also be chosen by an irish company called treasured keepsakes. They have a wide range of urns, caskets and jewellery keepsakes to keep portions of ashes.

paulbolg

And also folks the bereavement grant is going to be scrapped dec 31st thanks to the budget last oct. So that would have been €850 towards funeral expenses. People dont know but if the deceased has a credit union account with funds in it. The credit union give grants starting at €1270 and sometimes double the funds in the account. SVP also help out with costs. And visit your local health centre and speak to them with the help of payments.

RainyDay

paulbolg wrote: »

On average with a typical one day funeral going to the church or service on the same day as cremation plus funeral directors fee one limousine. Cremation coffin also suitable for burial. Cremation fees and obituary notice all in i would say max would be 4500. You can reduce this my removing limousine. Picking cheaper coffin or having a removal straight from place of death with limited viewing and no embalming to the crematorium. This would normally take place in the afternoon as normally this would be the morning.

Thanks for the clarification, and for the update on scattering of ashes. €4500 still seems like an absolutely huge amount, when you step back and think about it. I suppose that most people don't have the luxury of stepping back and thinking about it. There does seem to be this bizarre need of many Irish families (particularly less well off families) to spend large amounts of money, and to be seen to be spending large amounts of money, when it comes to funerals.

I guess that there is no real need for embalming if you are going for cremation. In fact, now that I think of it, is there any real need for embalming at all? What is the benefit or rationale?



SO let's say we go for bargain basement prices - no limo, removal straight from place of death with limited viewing, cheapest coffin - what is the lowest price possible?

Is the Newlands Cross crematorium any cheaper? The room for services there is fantastic.

Do you find many people choosing secular, non-religious funerals now, or are they still generally hedging their religious bets?

paulbolg wrote: »

And also folks the bereavement grant is going to be scrapped dec 31st thanks to the budget last oct. So that would have been €850 towards funeral expenses. People dont know but if the deceased has a credit union account with funds in it. The credit union give grants starting at €1270 and sometimes double the funds in the account. SVP also help out with costs. And visit your local health centre and speak to them with the help of payments.

I've no doubt that your comment is well intended, but again, it seems bizarre to see public money (bereavement grant, CWO help) or charity money (SVP) going almost directly to the undertaker, to pay for the fancy coffin or the limos or anything other than the most basic costs. Really, if you can't afford a fancy funeral, you don't get a fancy funeral.

paulbolg

Embalming slows down the decomposition process and it provides a hygienic service to the deceased.
If u wanted the cheapest route with the cheapest coffin ect including crem fees €2000
Newlands cross is run by Glasnevin and is the same price €630 for your 20 minute slot. If u wanted an hour to hold service in crematorium it would be generally after 1pm with an extra fee of 150 i think or near that anyway. And civil funerals are getting more popular with alot of people not having any or little of the religious aspect. Normally you can get a civil celebrant who will lead you in what to do. Poems and songs and stories about the deceased are whats ofter shared.

mikemac1

Usual here in the midlands that local men dig the grave. A family member will buy them a bottle of stout/ale/whatever and soup & sandwiches in the pub. A few others mentioned it on this thread. It's not old fashioned, it's just normal.

Probably different in the cities and I doubt any council has men labouring to open graves anymore. Galway city council have a mechanical digger for the graveyard by Bohermore