A Slow Journey to Faster Times

yaboya1

ThebitterLemon wrote: »

P,

We started around the same time training for Seville, I was hoping to break 3.10 you started hoping to break 3.30. You've come on in absolute leaps and bounds and are in terrific form. Keep it up, I reckon a young lad like you could have some terrific times over the next few years, if you stay focused and injury free. Be interested to see what you thought of the Portumna course, I don't think its a fast HM course with the twists and turns, it's more suited to the ultra stuff. Great run, on a tough course (especially if congested) and it was very warm.

Take a few days to recover and well done.

TbL

Thanks for the kind words.
Although there was nothing wrong with the race, I would not be a fan and am unlikely to run there again. This is not any fault of the organisers, marshals etc. who were all brilliant, helpful and did a great job in general.
However, I'm not a fan of running laps. 4 x 5k loops was hard enough, but there was a soul destroying 1km run out and back where you do a complete U-turn and head straight back where you came from. Add that to the people slowing down/stopping at the water station there and it cost me at least 10-15 seconds a lap, if not more. It's also very narrow on that section because you only have half the path to overtake. I'll go into more detail in my report but I was also alone at my pace for much of the race. From start to finish I was overtaking and never really had a rival to race/bounce off.

yaboya1

Ferris B wrote: »

Well done. I'd love a half mar time like that. I presume it was quite warm and humid down there which wouldn't have helped.

Enjoy the celebrations. Presume you've got your now customary, post drinks Hadd session planned for tomorrow.;)

Thanks. Maybe it was warmer and more humid than I realised at the time?
I really felt it when I finished, but never noticed it during the race. No HADD session today. I've learned my lesson. Feet up watching the football for the evening

FBOT01 wrote: »

Great running P. Another decent chuck off another PB....run hard, celebrate hard!! Enjoy!

Cheers. I think I celebrate a bit harder than I run at the moment. Maybe that's the problem :pac:

Beef wrote: »

Great running again. A step back to reflect how far you've come will put some extra gloss on it maybe. Enjoy the pints.

I think you could be right. I feel a bit better about the race now than I did immediately afterwards. Thanks for the support.

SamforMayo wrote: »

Well done, great time, enjoy those beers!

I did. Thanks a lot

skeleton_boy wrote: »

Well done on the PB. Each one is getting tougher and tougher isn't it! Makes those beers all the sweeter though

Never a truer word spoken. I didn't think I was going to PB yesterday until the very last mile. The beers were very sweet

jebuz wrote: »

Great running yaboya, you're running some great times this year which is just reward for sensible and dedicated training, enjoy the PB beers!

Thanks. Appreciate the kind words. Last night's beers in front of the football were very enjoyable. I've a fair way to go before I get anywhere near you though. Your progress is very impressive.

Murph_D

Nice going, yaboya - sounds like the kind of course that would drive me nuts too, but great time and I look forward to the report!

carsfan

would agree with you with regard to the course for this race.
I know that it is a social race but too many times I came upon runners chatting to each other not aware of faster participants trying to get past and some sections were narrow enough too.that section out and back to the castle was the worst bit with the tight 180 degree turn around.
Don't get me started on the headphone wearers either, they should have been picked up at the start/finish point by marshals and told to bin them or stop running. They are a danger to others especially on a course like this where space is at a premium.
Overall I think the 5k loop concept is great for the longer distances where your pace is slower and you are never far from water/toilet/first aid etc.
I would return to do a longer run as felt the overall vibe was really good there.

yaboya1

carsfan wrote: »

would agree with you with regard to the course for this race.
I know that it is a social race but too many times I came upon runners chatting to each other not aware of faster participants trying to get past and some sections were narrow enough too. that section out and back to the castle was the worst bit with the tight 180 degree turn around.
Don't get me started on the headphone wearers either, they should have been picked up at the start/finish point by marshals and told to bin them or stop running. They are a danger to others especially on a course like this where space is at a premium.
Overall I think the 5k loop concept is great for the longer distances where your pace is slower and you are never far from water/toilet/first aid etc.
I would return to do a longer run as felt the overall vibe was really good there.

I did spend a lot of time weaving in and out, but most of the time was able to plot a path by the slower runners well in advance. On one or two occasions though, there were groups of three or four runners spread right across the path at practically walking pace having a chat. I had to basically step into the bushes/ditch that were alongside to get by. When I did go by, they jumped a little seeming shocked/surprised that there was anyone coming up behind them as if they were out for an afternoon stroll in the isolated countryside.

menoscemo

yaboya1 wrote: »

I did spend a lot of time weaving in and out, but most of the time was able to plot a path by the slower runners well in advance. On one or two occasions though, there were groups of three or four runners spread right across the path at practically walking pace having a chat. I had to basically step into the bushes/ditch that were alongside to get by. When I did go by, they jumped a little seeming shocked/surprised that there was anyone coming up behind them as if they were out for an afternoon stroll in the isolated countryside.

Were they wearing red singlets?

yaboya1

Pre- Race

I never felt 100% in the whole week building up to this. Seems like I've been playing catch up ever since my drinking session last weekend. I was sweating profusely in my last two recovery runs and although I hit the required paces in my Tuesday session, I was never as fresh as I'd liked to have been. I was hoping a rest day on Friday would leave me raring to go. I got a decent sleep on Thursday night, which was just as well with a 5am wake up call on Saturday. I probably could have got up and left a little later than I did, but I wasn't sure exactly how long it would take me to get there, how easy the forest park would be to find and the amount of time I needed to allow for registration. In the end after a bowl of porridge, a bagel, a banana and a mug of coffee, I hit the road at 5.30am which saw me arrive in Portumna at 7:30. I saw the leaders of the 100k & 50k races completing their first lap while I hung around waiting for registration to open up. I got a few stretches in and made sure I got a visit to the portaloo in before making my way down to the start. After a quick briefing outside the main gate we were under way,


The Race

Miles 1-4

I started pretty close to the front hoping to hold a steady 6:20min/mile pace for the whole race. In the first 200m I picked out two guys in Eagle AC singlets who looked much fitter than me and appeared to be moving at my goal pace. I decided to use them as my pacers, although I would check the watch regularly to ensure I wasn't going too fast/slow. We joined the 5k loop just before the finish line and passed under the arch for our first of four laps. 0.7 miles on the Garmin seemed to be bang on with 20k to go. Finished out the mile comfortably sitting behind my Eagle AC pacers in 6:19. From this point on I found it a real struggle. I don't know why. Was it the heat/humidity? I don't know, but I never felt that was a factor at the time. Was I just not right on the day? I really, really don't know. What I do know is that I shouldn't have been struggling at such an early stage going this pace, considering my recent 5k & 5 mile times. Anyway I decided that although it was already hard work, I was going to keep pushing until I was unable to do so anymore. If I finished a race comfortably running a slower time than I thought I was capable of, I'm not sure I could forgive myself. Second mile in 6:23. All still good. Early in the third mile the Eagle AC guys slowed a bit and we were moving at 6:35 pace. I wasn't happy with this and moved past both of them. One of them didn't seem happy about this and responded immediately by overtaking me again. I was glad to see him do that as I now saw we were now back on 6:22 pace. I thought he must have just got a little complacent and was unlikely to let the pace drop again. It was during this mile we did the first of four soul destroying out & back runs with a 180 degree turn. You seem to be running forever in one direction before doing a complete U-turn and running back along the same track. I found this part of the course the most difficult just because it was so mentally draining. Anyway, through Mile 3 in 6:23. Pace starts to drop a bit here. I notice from the Garmin profile that there's a little climb between here and the finish line. It didn't feel like a hill and looks flat when you're out there, but maybe that's why we slowed a touch? Back out under the finishing arch with three laps to go. We're not going as quickly as I'd like but I'm not feeling strong enough to go any faster. Mile 4 in 6:33. This is where the race got very difficult.


Miles 5-7

Although I wasn't feeling very good up to now I had company. Silent company but it kind of felt like a team/club up to that point even though we never spoke, as we seemed to all have a similar goal. But I noticed that the pace had dropped into the 6:40's now. I thought my Eagle AC friends had got a little complacent and as soon as I injected a little bit of acceleration, one of them would take over again. So I did, but they didn't. They couldn't. And I knew I couldn't afford miles in the 6:40's to have any chance of hitting my pre-race targets. So I left them there and then and for the rest of the race I was alone . I was quite happy to see I managed to drag the pace back to 6:25 in Mile 5, as I was already starting to worry that I was gradually slowing as each mile passed. Miles 6 & 7 were down to the U-turn and back up the little rise to the finish. 6:30 & 6:35 here. I knew it was too slow, but I couldn't go any faster. The U-turn was really annoying me. I was coming down to it each time at sub 6:20 pace and by the time I'd slowed, turned and headed back in the same direction it was showing 6:30-6:40 pace. I never seemed to be able to make that time back up.


Miles 8-11

Hanging on in these miles (6:32, 6:31, 6:33, 6:29). Nothing too memorable except for the constant weaving around the runners I was overtaking. Most of them were very accommodating and actually made a conscious effort to move to one side, so I could pass without any issues. I didn't expect that but did appreciate it. As I mentioned in another post, some weren't as helpful. I remember on two occasions having to step off the path completely while the runners? ahead jogged three/four abreast at walking pace chatting away to each other, completely oblivious that anybody else was taking part in the race. They actually got a fright when I went by them as if I jumped out of nowhere (It's a race ffs!). Anyway, as I was prepared to go off road on those occasions it didn't actually cost me any time. There was a water station on the U-turn (which I'm not sure was a great idea) so apart from the time you lost slowing up and doing the 180 degree turn, you also had people stopping to grab water then walking/jogging while they drank it down. All this on the narrowest part of the course! Without wanting to exaggerate, I think this section probably cost me a minute or more over the course of the race. The only other thing that sticks out for me in this section was a runner in an Offaly singlet shouting some words of support. As I passed him on the long straight lane that led us back towards the finish he said: "You're going for gold". I smiled a little (don't know if he saw), but I hadn't got an ounce of extra energy to do anything else. If I had I wouldn't have had the heart to tell him gold was now out of my reach :pac:. I hope he didn't think I was being ignorant. At the end of Mile 11 I looked at my watch and knew I still needed two 6:3x miles to be sure of a PB.


Miles 12-13

At no stage in the race after the first mile did I think I was going to achieve any of my targets. I was barely hanging on and was working too hard too early for a race of this distance. 1:23 was definitely gone as I had way too many miles in the 6:30's to claw that time back, but I had manged to hold a pretty even pace up to now considering my difficulties and a PB was still on if I could just hang on for two more miles. However, my legs felt as if they were going to fall off. Early on in the race they felt lethargic and heavy but now they felt so weak I thought they were going to give way at any moment and I'd end up with a face full of concrete. I felt awful! I was in the twelfth mile of a thirteen mile race and a DNF didn't seem that unlikely. The fact that I was now running the soul destroying kilometre towards the U-turn didn't help. I got through the mile in 6:38 (baffles me how I did this as I thought at one stage I might have to stop). This was my slowest mile of the race, but in terms of effort it was the most difficult. I was now past the U-turn and it was a great feeling knowing I was heading in the right direction. Having glanced at my watch I knew I would PB once I stayed below 7 minutes in the last mile. This helped me relax for a few hundred metres meaning when the finish started to loom, I had the strength to pick it up a little bit for a final mile of 6:29. I fell over the line and immediately headed for the comfort of the grass to the side of the road. I was so knackered I completely forgot to stop the Garmin until well after the line. When I did hit the button it showed 1:24:16, which is a PB by more than a minute (Official time: 1:24:10), but I think there may be at least ten seconds to come off that and maybe even enough to take me below 1:24 (but I won't get greedy). I'm still waiting on the official result. The Garmin is only showing 12.99 miles. I've no doubt that the course was accurate though and I reckon the tree cover in the forest or the sharp U-turn are probably to blame for the inaccuracy.


Garmin data is here: http://connect.garmin.com/activity/521601454


Post Race

I lay flat on my back on the grass for about five minutes. The little girls handing out the medals had to come over and hand it to me as it was impossible to drape it around my neck. I've never felt as knackered after a race in my whole life. The Eagle AC guys weren't that long in behind me and both of them made it their business to come up to me after the race. They congratulated me on a great race and said they just weren't able to hold the pace. Both were aiming for sub 1:25, but neither managed it. Think they ran 1:26 & 1:27. Up until then I had been unhappy with myself. I didn't know why I found it so difficult, why I felt so bad throughout the race. I thought it was down to not being 100% or a knock on effect from the rough weekend I had last week. But after hearing what they said I started to wonder if everybody had struggled? I really hate making excuses for a below par run, but when I got to the car I noticed how humid and warm it was. It was extremely sticky. The Forest Park is pretty sheltered too. Maybe that had something to do with it. I don't know though. I never once felt like that was an issue while I was running. I just felt awful in myself. Never because of the conditions.


Thoughts

I definitely feel like my heavy bout of drinking had a knock on effect throughout the whole week. I think in future I need to make sure I get the required sleep/rest after a night out. That would probably do me more good than completing a session on target when I'm not in the right state, as it can end up being detrimental. I think I will also ensure I don't drink for a fortnight in the run up to any future goal race. In saying all that I'm wondering if maybe 1:24 or thereabouts is as good as I am. I like to set aggressive targets and I thought I could definitely improve by more than I did on my Larne time. Maybe that was a better run than I gave myself credit for? For 9/10 miles of yesterday's race, I had a lot more respect for my Larne time than I did before I started. Or maybe I am better than this and the humid/warm conditions were enough to slow me that little bit. The layout of the course also cost me some time. Maybe it was more of a case of me being under the weather than the weather itself? I don't know. So many questions, so many observations. One thing I do now is that my PB's are starting to become really difficult to beat. This race absolutely tore my guts out and I was around 80-90 seconds better than last time. In Larne I was 14 minutes quicker than my previous HM. I doubt I'll be knocking chunks like that off again. Lastly, I'm still not sure whether to be happy or disappointed. A bit of both I suppose. Disappointed as I really believed I could run sub 1:23. I probably didn't prepare perfectly in the preceding seven days and that's something I can definitely learn from. The course, weather etc. may have also been a factor but I'll make sure to be on top of the things that I can control in the future. On the plus side I've got to be happy that I've run a PB. I'm particularly happy with this as I was never comfortable after the first mile. I feel like it took a lot of resolve to see out the race as I did and that can only stand to me. It will serve as a big confidence booster in future races when I hit a bad patch. I know some of you may think I'm being harsh, but if I start getting complacent and patting myself on the back I'll probably stop improving :P.

Roll on Fingal 10k!

Pacing Mule

Super report as always !

Big congrats on the PB. From reading it I think there is a bit of everything mentioned involved in slowing that time slightly. So gold is still within your grasp even if you couldn't have given anymore on the day.

career_move

Super running as usual Congrats. As has been said I'm sure the gold time is there for the taking, just need the right race

RedRunner

Nice report. To be honest I was a bit surprised when I read on your log before about a heavy drinking session a week before a race. For someone who had been taking his training so seriously and seeing great results I just thought this was a bit odd. I know it takes me several days to recover from nights out like that these days. (Getting old!)
I would be fairly certain this had some impact on your performance so with better preparation I'm sure that you can take more off that time.

I'm not Knockin going out for a few drinks either god knows we all need a blow out from time to time but I'd say just be careful on the timing of those. Well done though on a great race. I'd be happy with that pace in a 5k!

SamforMayo

Wow that was some race, fair play to you for not giving up, that pb was well earned, I would say the heat/ humidity was a big factor. That 1.23 is there for you no doubt about it.

yaboya1

RedRunner wrote: »

Nice report. To be honest I was a bit surprised when I read on your log before about a heavy drinking session a week before a race. For someone who had been taking his training so seriously and seeing great results I just thought this was a bit odd. I know it takes me several days to recover from nights out like that these days. (Getting old!)
I would be fairly certain this had some impact on your performance so with better preparation I'm sure that you can take more off that time.

I'm not Knockin going out for a few drinks either god knows we all need a blow out from time to time but I'd say just be careful on the timing of those. Well done though on a great race. I'd be happy with that pace in a 5k!

You're right, but let me explain. A good friend of mine was having a few drinks to celebrate the recent birth of his twins that night. I've always done my best not to let my running get in the way of my life and there was no way I could miss this for the sake of a race in a weeks time. However, I could have been much more disciplined and left at midnight rather than at 3am with a curry for company on the way home! It definitely takes me a few days to shake out the effects of such a night too, which is why I've done nothing yesterday or today. I'll try my best to control my consumption in the future as I already know that I've got two golf functions the weekend before Fingal and a wedding two weeks before Berlin. I can't do anything about the timing of those events, but I can control how much alcohol I consume.

I appreciate the constructive criticism

RedRunner

yaboya1 wrote: »

You're right, but let me explain. A good friend of mine was having a few drinks to celebrate the recent birth of his twins that night. I've always done my best not to let my running get in the way of my life and there was no way I could miss this for the sake of a race in a weeks time. However, I could have been much more disciplined and left at midnight rather than at 3am with a curry for company on the way home! It definitely takes me a few days to shake out the effects of such a night too, which is why I've done nothing yesterday or today. I'll try my best to control my consumption in the future as I already know that I've got two golf functions the weekend before Fingal and a wedding two weeks before Berlin. I can't do anything about the timing of those events, but I can control how much alcohol I consume.

I appreciate the constructive criticism

And so you should I suppose. We'll be a long time dead and all that. Didn't want to come across all wagging the finger like, so apols if it looked like that. You're right to try and balance the two and sometimes we've no control over the timing of events so totally accept what you're saying there.

I wouldn't be the most disciplined myself at the best of times!;)

yaboya1

RedRunner wrote: »

And so you should I suppose. We'll be a long time dead and all that. Didn't want to come across all wagging the finger like, so apols if it looked like that. You're right to try and balance the two and sometimes we've no control over the timing of events so totally accept what you're saying there.

I wouldn't be the most disciplined myself at the best of times!;)

No, I didn't take it that way at all.
I know my preparation in the past week wasn't ideal and I'd prefer to be called on it than people walking on eggshells etc.

TbL told me he packed in the McMillan coach for the same reason. Being told he was super & doing great when he performed below his own expectations. I'm all for congratulations and praise, but sometimes you also need to be told off when you've done something wrong. Learn from your mistakes and all that .

e.g. I'm pretty sure if I'd had a log here when training for Chicago last year that I wouldn't have got injured. I would have been advised/told not to run on my sore achilles and the need to explain myself/answer here for my own stupidity when I did may have been enough to stop me heading out the door at that time. It's kind of the reason I started a log. Keep the advice/criticism coming. It's probably more important than any praise or congratulations (although I do really appreciate the positive feedback too). Thanks all

SamforMayo

Ye should read my log, I have been fierce disciplined for the last month!!!!!

yaboya1

SamforMayo wrote: »

Ye should read my log, I have been fierce disciplined for the last month!!!!!

I have been reading. GAA dinner dances? They must take more out your legs than the average night on the beer?

SamforMayo

yaboya1 wrote: »

I have been reading. GAA dinner dances? They must take more out your legs than the average night on the beer?

Oh yes you need a lot of stamina for all these social outings I have been having. Next up is a fundraiser for a new school hall on Friday night which of course I will have to go to, follow by a couple of weeks hols in the sun!

yaboya1

Official result finally in from Portumna:

6th place in 1:24:10 (75 second PB)


Splits

1.1km - 3:51
6.1km - 19:58
11.1km - 19:57
16.1km - 20:18
21.1km - 20:05

Pretty even, so can't really complain about my pacing.

Duanington

Well done Yaboya1, great to see the progression continuing here. That's a fantastic time and yet another PB in the bag !

tang1

Excellant result again yaboya1, regarding the alcohol, i'm open to correction on this but i think it was TRR who abstained from the hooch during his training cycle for London and reaped the rewards from doing so.

But everybody is different when it comes to alcohol and running, Gavlor could drink ten pints and run a sub 80 mins half the following day!! I know myself it affects me and is the one thing that causes me to gain weight. If you think it affects your training and performance knock it on the head for a while and see if it helps you.

ger664

Well done on the PB.While the course is flat it can be congested and the turnaround hurts you in the shorter distances. Its a great social race which is why it suits the ultra heads better. Your prep wasn't ideal, I don't think it was totally to blame but it did have an impact. Learn the lesson and move onwards and upwards

AuldManKing

thats super running - very well done. again.

Gavlor

That type of race with laps etc would wreck my bulb. As has already been said you are making huge strides so don't be too disheartened by missing your target, it'll come sooner rather than later.

On a side note, there are WAY too many Alcoholics Anonymous sponsors hanging around these parts over the last couple of days! It's only a race, there'll be many many more. Live first, run second.

Murph_D

Gavlor wrote: »

On a side note, there are WAY too many Alcoholics Anonymous sponsors hanging around these parts over the last couple of days! It's only a race, there'll be many many more. Live first, run second.

Ha ha. It never pays to mention the drink around here!

yaboya1

Monday 16th June - 60 minutes Easy
7m @ 8:39/m average (125bpm avg)

I've taken two full days off since the race on Saturday and didn't really feel like going out for this tonight if I'm honest. I watched the football when I got home from work and decided to fit it in between the final two games assuming I'd feel better when I was done. To summarise, I felt awful beforehand, awful throughout and awful when I finished. Maybe I should have just taken the night off?


Splits:

Mile 1 - 8:36 (122bpm)
Mile 2 - 8:57 (127bpm)
Mile 3 - 8:32 (125bpm)
Mile 4 - 8:57 (127bpm)
Mile 5 - 8:09 (126bpm)
Mile 6 - 8:34 (125bpm)
Mile 7 - 8:44 (125bpm)

RedRunner

yaboya1 wrote: »

Maybe I should have just taken the night off?

Should have had a couple of beers!:pac:;)

yaboya1

Thursday 19th June - 75 minutes Steady (preceded by 10 x 100m Strides)
10m @ 7:37p/m average (145bpm avg)
Strides: (16:88, 18:13, 17:28, 20:24, 17:14, 17:89, 18:62, 19:76, 18:42, 17:65)

I really struggled with this run in the early stages, moving almost a minute per mile slower than last Saturday which suggests I still haven't fully recovered from that race. It really did knock the stuffing out of me! However I felt stronger towards the end which is encouraging. In the current conditions, I'm more worried about a consistent effort than identical splits and seemed to achieve that. It was beginning to get really warm running along the coast but then Ferris B came hurtling towards me in the opposite direction creating a cooling breeze for a few seconds. Thanks Ferris


Splits:

Mile 1 - 7:28 (143bpm)
Mile 2 - 7:16 (146bpm)
Mile 3 - 7:30 (146bpm)
Mile 4 - 7:21 (146bpm)
Mile 5 - 7:36 (146bpm)
Mile 6 - 7:50 (146bpm)
Mile 7 - 7:43 (145bpm)
Mile 8 - 7:42 (146bpm)
Mile 9 - 7:50 (147bpm)
Mile 10 - 7:50 (146bpm)

Hoping to get some easy miles in tomorrow & Saturday before attempting another Steady session on Sunday. If I still don't feel 100% though, I'll just do a long run instead.

Ferris B

yaboya1 wrote: »

Thursday 19th June - 75 minutes Steady (preceded by 10 x 100m Strides)
10m @ 7:37p/m average (145bpm avg)
Strides: (16:88, 18:13, 17:28, 20:24, 17:14, 17:89, 18:62, 19:76, 18:42, 17:65)

I really struggled with this run in the early stages, moving almost a minute per mile slower than last Saturday which suggests I still haven't fully recovered from that race. It really did knock the stuffing out of me! However I felt stronger towards the end which is encouraging. In the current conditions, I'm more worried about a consistent effort than identical splits and seemed to achieve that. It was beginning to get really warm running along the coast but then Ferris B came hurtling towards me in the opposite direction creating a cooling breeze for a few seconds. Thanks Ferris

The agonised look on my face possibly suggested hurtling....actual pace was a paltry 8:45 . It was a struggle for me at that pace today so savage session by you. Apologies for the delayed hello...aul man eyesight etc.

yaboya1

Friday 20th June - 150 minutes Easy
17.38m @ 8:38/m average (130bpm avg)

As mentioned in my last two posts I felt awful during my recovery run on Tuesday before gradually feeling stronger during my Steady run yesterday, which was a bit odd as you expect the opposite given the conditions. Anyway the gradual improvement in my well being continued and I felt great before going out for my easy run tonight. So much so that I decided to make it my Long Run for this week. The plan was to run at 130bpm or below for two and a half hours. Even though I didn't head out until after 7pm, it was still pretty warm. I didn't bring or take on any hydration throughout and my HR started to rise in the final third of the run. Rather than slowing to stay below 130bpm, I decided to ensure that I kept the remaining miles below nine minutes regardless of the heart rate. Probably not exactly what I was meant to do, but I'm happy with the workout.


Splits:

Mile 1 - 8:17 (124bpm)
Mile 2 - 8:26 (127bpm)
Mile 3 - 8:25 (127bpm)
Mile 4 - 8:27 (127bpm)
Mile 5 - 8:33 (127bpm)
Mile 6 - 8:28 (128bpm)
Mile 7 - 8:29 (128bpm)
Mile 8 - 8:31 (128bpm)
Mile 9 - 8:35 (129bpm)
Mile 10 - 8:39 (128bpm)
Mile 11 - 8:39 (130bpm)
Mile 12 - 8:55 (132bpm)
Mile 13 - 8:58 (131bpm)
Mile 14 - 8:59 (132bpm)
Mile 15 - 8:53 (135bpm)
Mile 16 - 8:48 (137bpm)
Mile 17 - 8:43 (142bpm)
0.38 - 3:19 (144bpm)

Murph_D

That looks like a good long run to be sure. Can I ask why it may be a good thing to not take on water? Apologies if you've discussed this elsewhere.

yaboya1

Murph_D wrote: »

That looks like a good long run to be sure. Can I ask why it may be a good thing to not take on water? Apologies if you've discussed this elsewhere.

It's probably not a good thing. I just hate carrying anything and forgot to bring a couple of euros to nip into the shop.
In saying that I like the idea of letting myself run on empty, as I think it may train my body to be as efficient as possible with carbs/water. Something along the lines of what jebuz was saying in his log about replenishing carbs afterwards. The same probably doesn't apply to water, but it didn't do me any harm :-P.

yaboya1

Saturday 21st June - 60 minutes Easy
7m @ 9:02/m average (123bpm avg)

A glorified recovery run that I extended to an hour because I was feeling so fantastic . I expected some stiffness & soreness after yesterday's late evening long run, but none was evident and I'm pretty sure I'm going to give the Steady state session another go tomorrow night. Was in such a good mood towards the end of the run on this beautiful morning that I threw in a few TRR/Claralara style windmills. I may use this celebration if I break three hours in Berlin .


Splits:

Mile 1 - 8:54 (118bpm)
Mile 2 - 8:53 (122bpm)
Mile 3 - 9:02 (123bpm)
Mile 4 - 9:18 (124bpm)
Mile 5 - 9:09 (124bpm)
Mile 6 - 9:02 (127bpm)
Mile 7 - 8:53 (127bpm)

yaboya1

Sunday 22nd June - 75 minutes Steady (preceded by 10 x 100m Strides)
11m @ 7:22p/m average (145bpm avg)
Strides: (18:93, 22:34, 18:40, 19:17, 18:87, 18:57, 17:83, 17:89, 18:03, 17:21)

I'm very happy with this session. The soreness/stiffness I was expecting in the muscles yesterday from Friday's long run was evident today, but I did a bit of stretching before I went out and got on with it. I was very comfortable for the entire run and if I'm honest, felt stronger & stronger as the time (and miles) went by. I added on a few minutes at the end to squeeze in an eleventh mile. The average pace was consistent early on and only began to slow when I hit a headwind/incline. I sped back up when I turned around and had those factors in my favour. Felt like I could have picked up the pace and run all day by the time I finished. Made a fool of myself mid-run frantically waving at some guy who I thought was Murph_D. When I realised it wasn't him, I felt a bit embarrassed but thought the least the guy could do was wave back. Still I'm used to being blanked by now. I reckon my response rate to waves/nods/hello's is about 1/20 :pac:


Splits:

Mile 1 - 7:22 (142bpm)
Mile 2 - 7:15 (146bpm)
Mile 3 - 7:17 (146bpm)
Mile 4 - 7:16 (146bpm)
Mile 5 - 7:26 (145bpm)
Mile 6 - 7:31 (145bpm)
Mile 7 - 7:28 (146bpm)
Mile 8 - 7:35 (146bpm)
Mile 9 - 7:28 (146bpm)
Mile 10 - 7:03 (146bpm)
Mile 11 - 7:19 (146bpm)


Just a few observations/things to note:

- The first mile split is wrong. The exact same thing happened on Thursday in the exact same place when I used a similar route. The Garmin was showing 7:15 lap pace and shot up ten seconds in the space of a few yards. It doesn't really matter as it wouldn't have affected the overall average anyway.

- I don't know what's going on with the second stride. It didn't feel that different to the rest of them and definitely not four seconds slower. I can only assume that's incorrect too.

- Speaking of strides, I'm wondering if I'd be better off leaving these until after the session. I'm sure I read somewhere that they were to be done beforehand, but I don't see the difference and feel it just gets my heart beating quicker before I start the run, meaning I need to allow a few minutes for the HR to come back down before I can get stuck into the Steady pace.

- I've now completed a fair few sessions at this heart rate. Most of them have been at a very consistent pace (although that has varied depending on conditions) and I think it's time to move up to 150bpm. Today I felt like I could have run ten miles further at a quicker pace. My HR wasn't rising towards the end even though the pace was quickening and I'd been running for 80 minutes.

- Since I made a complete hash of my last 2400m test, I think I will give it another go on Tuesday. I won't be drinking before then and should have a couple of decent night's sleep under my belt too. I'll throw in a few recovery miles tomorrow to shake out the legs which should have me as fresh as possible.

I'd be interested to hear any thoughts/observations/opinions/advice that anybody has in relation to any of this stuff.

ThebitterLemon

Can't proffer any advice P, buts that's a tasty looking session

TbL

Duanington

Nice session there Yaboya1 - I believe I am the 1 in 20 that returns nods, waves, grunts :cool:

yaboya1

Duanington wrote: »

Nice session there Yaboya1 - I believe I am the 1 in 20 that returns nods, waves, grunts :cool:

Did you see me out there tonight?
I still don't know what you look like.

Duanington

yaboya1 wrote: »

Did you see me out there tonight?
I still don't know what you look like.

Didn't see you Yaboya1, I was out a little earlier than you I'd say

yaboya1

Monday 23rd June - 60 minutes Easy
7m @ 8:50/m average (121bpm avg)

A carefree run on a beautiful morning. The battery in the Garmin went after 47 minutes, so I've just assumed I would have continued the sixth mile as I started and used the average split/HR for the last one.


Splits:

Mile 1 - 8:50 (117bpm)
Mile 2 - 8:45 (125bpm)
Mile 3 - 8:48 (122bpm)
Mile 4 - 8:54 (121bpm)
Mile 5 - 8:48 (123bpm)
Mile 6 - 8:58 (124bpm)
Mile 7 - 8:50 (121bpm)

Murph_D

yaboya1 wrote: »

Made a fool of myself mid-run frantically waving at some guy who I thought was Murph_D. When I realised it wasn't him, I felt a bit embarrassed but thought the least the guy could do was wave back. Still I'm used to being blanked by now. I reckon my response rate to waves/nods/hello's is about 1/20 :pac:

I ran in the Park yesterday so you're right, it definitely wasn't me - but thanks for the wave anyway. Like Duanington, I would have waved back!

dublin runner

Personally, I wouldn't be overly concerned about recording the distance of strides. For me, strides should all be about effort (5k effrot, 10k effort etc) If I were to do 10 strides I would simply use the stopwatch and run between 20-30 seconds, focusing purely on effort.

RayCun

I remember brianderunner (when he was a runner;)) telling me that strides should be done at the end of the run
and timing/measuring them is just too much hassle

pconn062

Yeah there is not much point timing/measuring strides, strides should be the length between two telephone poles or from here to that tree etc. Effort can vary, but usually you build up speed, when you reach the max speed (whatever it is) you try to hold it for 50 metres or so and then cruise before easing off (that sounds more complicated that it actually is). Also, they should be done at the end of the run to recruit the fibers that were not used during the easy run.

yaboya1

Tuesday 24th June - HADD 2400m Test

I've used the results from the previous test to compare against, rather than the most recent one as I feel those were more reliable. There was a dead, heavy heat out there today despite the lack of sun, but I'm happy enough with the outcome. There is either minute improvement or slight disimprovement at all heart rates. I'm not at all disappointed as this tells me is that it's definitely time to move up a notch in my Steady sessions, which I suspected already.


Results are below:

2400m @ 120 bpm (Actual 121 bpm) - 9:10 min/mile average (previous: 8:57 @120)
2400m @ 130 bpm (Actual 130 bpm) - 8:20 min/mile average (previous: 8:27 @129)
2400m @ 140 bpm (Actual 139 bpm) - 7:47 min/mile average (previous: 7:37 @ 138)
2400m @ 150 bpm (Actual 149 bpm) - 6:50 min/mile average (previous: 6:48 @ 149)
2400m @ 160 bpm (Actual 160 bpm) - 6:16 min/mile average (previous: 6:08 @158)

jebuz

Hey yaboya, I would tend to look at tests like these as more of a rough guide to progress. There are too many factors that can affect your HR on the day of the test and it's almost impossible to recreate the same environment each time. You've got to factor in sleep, diet, weather, recent racing and training efforts, terrain, stress and nights on the booze Just last week one of my easy runs for no reason recorded a HR rate of higher than normal and effort felt hard, no idea why but it was back to normal the day after.

The best indicator of progress for me this year has been the effort I feel on easy runs and how that pace has steadily crept up over the course of the year, of course your race results down on paper are an obvious indicator too but feedback from the body is very important. You just need to look at your training log anyway to see how much you've improved this year, the tests can be useful I'm sure over time but at the same time if you don't see an improvement on the day of the test it can cause doubts to creep into your mind when in reality you've made significant gains. Anyway keep up the excellent training, you've got great things ahead of you if you keep this up.

yaboya1

Wednesday 25th June - 60 minutes Easy
7.07m @ 8:29/m average (124bpm avg)

Dragged myself out of bed to get this in before work. Getting up wasn't easy after a night on the beer watching the football, but once I was out there the run felt pretty effortless.


Splits:

Mile 1 - 9:05 (120bpm)
Mile 2 - 8:20 (122bpm)
Mile 3 - 8:28 (125bpm)
Mile 4 - 8:24 (126bpm)
Mile 5 - 8:27 (125bpm)
Mile 6 - 8:22 (124bpm)
Mile 7 - 8:19 (127bpm)
0.07 - 0:36 (122bpm)

I think Mile 2 perfectly illustrates jebuz's point (above). Yesterday at 121bpm, I was running at 9:10min/mile pace. This morning after a night on the beer, I was hitting 8:20min/mile at 122bpm. It took me 130bpm to hit that pace in the test! It was a bit cooler today but I think the point is still valid.

Ferris B

Are you running the 5m in the park?

yaboya1

Ferris B wrote: »

Are you running the 5m in the park?

No, I'm heading out on Friday night so will either get a few recovery miles in or a long run if I feel ok. Definitely won't be running that race.
Strong possibility I'll do the beer mile though

Ferris B

yaboya1 wrote: »

Strong possibility I'll do the beer mile though

I reckon you could do some damage there with all the beer running sessions you've been doing. You'll certainly be a good bet.

yaboya1

Ferris B wrote: »

I reckon you could do some damage there with all the beer running sessions you've been doing. You'll certainly be a good bet.

I seriously doubt that!!
I can't run/drink anywhere near as fast as the favourites. I'll be happy to get around without incurring a penalty lap on my (beer) mile debut.

statss

what's the story man, will you be sticking to HADD through to your next marathon cycle, are you doing Dublin?