Metal Gear Solid V

lawlolawl

Gamer Bhoy 89 wrote: »

This isn't Ubisoft though :P

Those games started off being that type of game, though. Whereas Metal Gear Solid was never that kind of game. It changed it's genre, essentially, and done it well

My point is that it could be.

From a game play point of view anyway.

As I said already, I'm not saying that the game is bad but it's just all old hat and slightly clunky old hat at that

Gamer Bhoy 89

lawlolawl wrote: »

My point is that it could be.

From a game play point of view anyway.

As I said already, I'm not saying that the game is bad but it's just all old hat and slightly clunky old hat at that

Ah yeah fair enough.

lawlolawl

SouthTippBass wrote: »

Can you give some examples?

Far Cry 2, 3 and 4. All of the AC games. Watch doggys.

All of them have the bullet point of being able to use multiple methods to do the missions

MilesMorales1

Man that list of cut content is crazy. Sounds like Konami rushed it.

SouthTippBass

lawlolawl wrote: »

Far Cry 2, 3 and 4. All of the AC games. Watch doggys.

All of them have the bullet point of being able to use multiple methods to do the missions

I dont agree with AC, its an incredibly linear experience. Far Cry isn't doing anything that this title isn't doing either, in fact they are very similar. Never played Watch Dogs though.

lawlolawl

SouthTippBass wrote: »

Far Cry isn't doing anything that this title isn't doing either, in fact they are very similar.

That's sort of my point.

People are starting to turn on Ubisoft for milking cash out of the same game with a different coat of paint. Then Kojima makes a remarkably similar game to one of theirs (and other devs games) and everyone wets themselves in excitement and acts like they've never experienced being able to do missions more than one way in an open world game before.

Robert ninja

Nobody is saying it's unique by having multiple paths of infiltration. It's just doing it very well and with a metal gear twist. What's so hard to wrap your head around that?

And it's a joke to think that any game with choice in your style = leeching off ubisoft. Ubisoft didn't invent that, christ. You give them too much credit.

lawlolawl

Robert ninja wrote: »

Nobody is saying it's unique by having multiple paths of infiltration. It's just doing it very well and with a metal gear twist. What's so hard to wrap your head around that?

And it's a joke to think that any game with choice in your style = leeching off ubisoft. Ubisoft didn't invent that, christ. You give them too much credit.

Every single review I read had reference to the multiple paths. Nearly every gushing post on any of the forums I'm on has reference to it. It does it about as well as any other game, albeit in a slightly clunky manner.

The only reason I bring up Ubisoft is that I feel they have made very similar games to MGS 5 and catch a lot of grief for it now.

I dunno, maybe I'm just jaded after decades of gaming but I'm just not feeling the MGS magic in this game despite loving previous entries in the series

Zero-Cool

Far Cry 4 was boring AF (imo), only made it half way though, and I loved Far Cry 3. I didn't like MGS 4 but I love MGS 5. Nothing to do with "Open World" or a certain franchise. It just gives you missions contained on a single map and lets you approach how you like, simples. I haven't like a stealth game in years, got sick of looking for guard patterns and sitting still waiting to make my move where I'm finding this much more dynamic. Don't mind waiting when I need it but feel like I'm constantly moving.

Last night, a side op took me a ton of retries, finally decided to take a different approach from another angle and nailed it in one go.

PS. Who cares what reviewers say, either you like the game or you don't.

EazyD

Robert ninja wrote: »

Nobody is saying it's unique by having multiple paths of infiltration. It's just doing it very well and with a metal gear twist. What's so hard to wrap your head around that?

And it's a joke to think that any game with choice in your style = leeching off ubisoft. Ubisoft didn't invent that, christ. You give them too much credit.

Let me give you an example of why it hasn't been done well. One of the first missions after prologue where I have to rescue and extract. I see the small town from a distance and decide that my best point of entry is from higher ground where I won't be seen and will have the best vantage point for taking out enemies.

I proceed in that general direction for a few minutes and then discover I can't go beyond a certain point. Meaning in reality there is only 2 points of entry, one end of the road or the other. And that's the theme throughout, follow these barren empty roads from one base or town to the next, can't cross between them or off the beaten track, that's not open world.

I can ride my horse within 20-30 metres of an enemy compound and no one bats an eyelid. I can snipe away at an enemy base, once I'm caught I hide away a few metres from my original position and within a minute all is calm again. It completely breaks any immersion one can have with the game and shows little to no advancement in the overall mechanics of it.

_CreeD_

This was my first MGS outing and I have to say overall I'm very impressed. Besides anything else, 28 hours in at ~11% completion (doing a lot of wandering) it keeps bringing in new elements at a good pace to keep me interested :

Getting the Russian translator opened up interrogations, more spoils and tactical options to spice up taking bases.

Base Building and specialists adding some more management to the relatively simple staff management options.

Staff combat missions add a strategic side.

Just did a mission that looks to add heavy vehicle combat, died for the 2nd time so far with a Tank shell to the noggin'...and was glad the challenge had been upped.

Haven't gotten to the FOB section yet but it also sounds like it will be add some variety

Other than that I think the gameplay is solid if not revolutionary. Graphics are great as is most of the sound design (near field footsteps don't seem to render correctly), the soundtrack is also excellent. And most of the story missions I've done so far have been great

Getting my first 'S' after accidentally walking into the 'Quiet' mission #11 and the following cut-scenes were fantastic

.
I really didn't appreciate the overly long and simple intro though, 25 mins of staring at Ishmael's ass crack, repeating the same actions while occasionally pressing forward nearly put me off the whole thing. But I'm glad I stuck with it, as it has gotten better with each main mission.

Not a 10, but a high 9. For this year just behind The Witcher 3 imho.

SouthTippBass

lawlolawl wrote: »

Every single review I read had reference to the multiple paths. Nearly every gushing post on any of the forums I'm on has reference to it. It does it about as well as any other game, albeit in a slightly clunky manner.

The only reason I bring up Ubisoft is that I feel they have made very similar games to MGS 5 and catch a lot of grief for it now.

I dunno, maybe I'm just jaded after decades of gaming but I'm just not feeling the MGS magic in this game despite loving previous entries in the series

Sounds to me like you're burnt out lad. What was the last game you were truly happy with? You keep using the word clunky, but what is clunky here? Can you expand?

No single element in MGSV is unique or original, it's just the way everything is mixed together to create an almost perfect balance.

For example, Far Cry, which has very similar elements, couldn't hold my attention past a few missions, so I uninstalled it. But I'm really enjoying MGSV, things just work in it. I played my first mission in Africa today and it was just a fantastic experience, everything I wanted from an open world stealth game. Sneak in, **** **** up, sneak out again. Improvising and adapting on the fly.

I didn't feel this until about 8-10% of the way in mind, currently at 18%. So I will reserve final judgement until completion. But at this stage, for me, the game has lived up to expectations.

Robert ninja

lawlolawl wrote: »

Every single review I read had reference to the multiple paths. Nearly every gushing post on any of the forums I'm on has reference to it. It does it about as well as any other game, albeit in a slightly clunky manner.

The only reason I bring up Ubisoft is that I feel they have made very similar games to MGS 5 and catch a lot of grief for it now.

I dunno, maybe I'm just jaded after decades of gaming but I'm just not feeling the MGS magic in this game despite loving previous entries in the series

Well I've not read a single review so I don't know or care about how much multiple paths is mentioned.

EazyD wrote: »

Let me give you an example of why it hasn't been done well. One of the first missions after prologue where I have to rescue and extract. I see the small town from a distance and decide that my best point of entry is from higher ground where I won't be seen and will have the best vantage point for taking out enemies.

I proceed in that general direction for a few minutes and then discover I can't go beyond a certain point. Meaning in reality there is only 2 points of entry, one end of the road or the other. And that's the theme throughout, follow these barren empty roads from one base or town to the next, can't cross between them or off the beaten track, that's not open world.

I can ride my horse within 20-30 metres of an enemy compound and no one bats an eyelid. I can snipe away at an enemy base, once I'm caught I hide away a few metres from my original position and within a minute all is calm again. It completely breaks any immersion one can have with the game and shows little to no advancement in the overall mechanics of it.

I agree that it's not as open as it could be... but you're making a huge mistake in thinking that the initial point of entry is the only aspect of choice in infiltration.

Once you're inside there's quite a many ways to handle yourself. And I've sniped at enemy bases to begin to get bombarded with mortar fire and later on even armoured vehicle, metal gear and chopper fire can be a real deterrent for going in direct. But despite that it still doesn't handle long-ranged A.I as good as it should I mostly agree... but I think it's down to the fact that this is a AAA game so they probably didn't WANT to make it that hard. If this game was everything I wanted it to be I'm sure it would be getting crap 'reviews' that everyone in here seems to give too much attention to anyway. Realistically you should be dead or being extracted after taking even a single bullet. It's not that kind of game.


To talk about the 'hypocrisy' of people complaining about Ubisoft's repeating gamestyle getting criticism and then this game not... well I honestly just don't think they're that similar and last I checked Ubisoft games are overall accepted as great games but the bull**** video game journalism industry. There are guard posts but they are mostly avoidable. Infiltrating one is only rewarding if it had something you wanted. Otherwise you're wasting your damn time. In Far Cry I remembered it being mandatory in order to drive around safely and also the main way to level up.

The similarities are there but they're honestly not that excessive. Games will always have overlapping mechanics and similarities especially if they share a same gametype like open world w/ stealth for example.

This is honestly just Peace Walker 2 w/ open world and remarkably refined gameplay. It still looks and feels like a Metal Gear game to me. If it being open world with some enemy checkpoints makes it too ubisoft for you then I think you've related otherwise OK game aspects to ubisoft way too much. I say this as someone who despises modern ubi games and unnecessary open world w/ checkpoints.

And I don't get the whole 'clunky' thing, either. The controls for the most part are fluid and movement isn't restrictive. Just about the only control issues I've had are it detecting when to/not to press against cover and also keybinding options are based on gamepad which is lame as feck because I can't bind NV goggles to 8 for example, I have to hold in 4 to open up another sub-menu to select the damn item with MOUSE movement which the game shows as a little arcade stick followed by L/R... which doesn't exist on KB/M. I can only figure that's to compensate for the lack of buttons on a gamepad. The menus of the game I will also concede are clunky and whole load of smelly feck. No mouse selection, everything has to be done with WASD or arrow keys and it's all click/cancel. It's a complete joke for a game with so many things to do in its menus right down to staff management which looks outright like spreadsheets. Trying to control it with gamepad design is awful, simply awful.

Oh and that weird ass ghosting for WASD. They need to patch that.

lawlolawl

SouthTippBass wrote: »

Sounds to me like you're burnt out lad. What was the last game you were truly happy with? You keep using the word clunky, but what is clunky here?

I really enjoyed Until Dawn and before that I played through all of the currently released episodes of Life is Strange and it is easily my GOTY at the moment (pending the last episode). I've also been playing Zombii U on my Wii U and loving it. I have Trails in the Sky going on PC too. I like plenty of games.

Open world games are just getting to the stage where my eyes glaze over when I hear about them.

It's the reason I didn't bother with Witcher 3. It's probably a good game but I can't be bothered with another 40 hours in Fantasy World #257 doing sidequests for villagers.

I purposefully didn't read much about MGS 5 because, while I knew it was open world, I thought it would surely be different and interesting because of the series pedigree. Turns out I was mistaken and it's just a fairly competent retread game play wise.

The clunkyness is the arbitrary nature of Snake's ability to climb things, the fairly horrendous menus and the fact that the map is quite often just a pain in the hole to get around along with being mostly completely empty

Robert ninja

You play Until Dawn... a game that could legitimately be made into a DVD game, Life is Strange aka tumblr the game, call them 'GOTY'... but not W3 or MGSV.

Yeah I don't think this conversation's going to get anywhere. You're an entirely different demographic that MGSV is not trying for. You can safely ignore it and move on.

lawlolawl

Robert ninja wrote: »

You play Until Dawn... a game that could legitimately be made into a DVD game, Life is Strange aka tumblr the game, call them 'GOTY'... but not W3 or MGSV.

Yeah I don't think this conversation's going to get anywhere. You're an entirely different demographic that MGSV is not trying for. You can safely ignore it and move on.

The demographic it's aiming for is people who have played the former games. It's the most fan servicing series of games in existence I've played all of the other games in the series and loved all of them. I'm in the demographic.

Life is Strange is great and I'm not the only person saying it has GOTY potential. You obviously haven't played it.

Until Dawn is great as well.

Crucifix

Robert ninja wrote: »

You play Until Dawn... a game that could legitimately be made into a DVD game, Life is Strange aka tumblr the game, call them 'GOTY'... but not W3 or MGSV.

Yeah I don't think this conversation's going to get anywhere. You're an entirely different demographic that MGSV is not trying for. You can safely ignore it and move on.

to be fair MGS4 was close to a dvd game, I can see why someone might be disappointed if they hadnt followed the prerelease footage.

Personally, I'm loving it

Robert ninja

I meant in terms of gameplay it could be a DVD game. MGS4 was way too heavy on cutscenes, but you could not play it with only 3 buttons.

I really wish we could add a knight rider addon to vehicles. Not being able to call them to your side is a huge problem :P

EazyD

lawlolawl wrote: »

The demographic it's aiming for is people who have played the former games. It's the most fan servicing series of games in existence I've played all of the other games in the series and loved all of them. I'm in the demographic.

Life is Strange is great and I'm not the only person saying it has GOTY potential. You obviously haven't played it.

Until Dawn is great as well.

I'm not the first person to say it but this "fan servicing" is a major reason as to why games have become dumbed down and more interactive movies than actual games, where the player just gets taken along for a ride and any decisions they do get to make have a marginal if any impact on how the story plays out.

Take the old Star Wars games on PC. The graphics were meh, the audio was meh but the combat was bloody amazing. It was challenging, you had to learn timing and movement and it gave you a reason to sink hours purely into the combat. Contrast this with Witcher 3, great visuals, audio, map etc but the combat is pigs puke. Games across many genres have changed in this way over the last decade, catering for the casuals and with it removing the deep sense of immersion that we used to feel when playing and mastering different games. It's a sad reality.

I don't think I've killed a single enemy I didn't have to so far 20 hours in. I'm still using the starting pistol and rifle, only had to use the rifle once in the heat of the moment after I missed with my last snoozy dart and it was that or get my cover blown.

Robert ninja

^ Yeah don't worry I'm still using the starting weapons. They're actually the best in their respective fields as far as I've found and any alternatives are €80 worth of grind away probably. I've improved them with R&D, though.

SouthTippBass

lawlolawl wrote: »

The clunkyness is the arbitrary nature of Snake's ability to climb things, the fairly horrendous menus and the fact that the map is quite often just a pain in the hole to get around along with being mostly completely empty

I don't agree with any criticism of the games controls, snake does what I want him to do 99% of the time, sometimes he won't stick to cover when I want him too but that's about it. I agree the menus are not exactly fun, and theres a lot of them, and they are a bit confusing, especially some of the mother base stuff.

As for the open world being empty, can you imagine what it you be like with every square metre populated with wild life, locals, enemies and robots? It would be a mess, you wouldn't be able to get anything done. Also, we're in Afghanistan here, not New York City. The sparse population works in context of the location.

Witcher

SouthTippBass wrote: »

I don't agree with any criticism of the games controls, snake does what I want him to do 99% of the time, sometimes he won't stick to cover when I want him too but that's about it. I agree the menus are not exactly fun, and theres a lot of them, and they are a bit confusing, especially some of the mother base stuff.

As for the open world being empty, can you imagine what it you be like with every square metre populated with wild life, locals, enemies and robots? It would be a mess, you wouldn't be able to get anything done. Also, we're in Afghanistan here, not New York City. The sparse population works in context of the location.

The environment in Afghanistan just feels dead though, they could have added in some randomly patrolling troop columns, convoys, helicopters flying overhead etc. Just something to indicate life. Even some events you could stumble across like a Mujahideen attack on a Russian outpost or such would be good. I mean there are all these outposts and soldiers...who are they there to fight? Apart from a single truck driving around the enemies stay in their bases waiting to be picked off.

Don't get me wrong, I love the game, I must be 25/30+ hours into it now but when you spend a lot of time free roaming you notice there is nothing happening.

Xenji

My only gripe with the game so far is with the sniper rifle, there is a glitch with the zoom aim when an alert happens and it goes into slow motion, it takes a good few seconds to be usable again and the L2 button takes on a mind of it own.

tok9

lawlolawl wrote: »

The only reason I bring up Ubisoft is that I feel they have made very similar games to MGS 5 and catch a lot of grief for it now.

What are the similar games that Ubisoft have created to MGS?

If you're talking about Far Cry, then Ubisoft have received critical acclaim for that series so far and it definitely shares some similarities with this MGS.

However if you mean just because MGS is defined as Open World it's similar to Watch Dogs and Assassin's Creed then I think that's a bit of a stretch. MGSV is a far better game than anything in either of those series and they (AC obviously more so) have rightfully received some backlash due to the state they are released in and the stagnation of the series.

weiland79

I feel a bit daft but I'm a bit stuck.

I'm right at the start, only on mission 3 I think and am doing a side op. I have to extract a highly skilled solider and I've been searching the target area for bleedin ages and still cant find the fecker

Zero-Cool

weiland79 wrote: »

I feel a bit daft but I'm a bit stuck.

I'm right at the start, only on mission 3 I think and am doing a side op. I have to extract a highly skilled solider and I've been searching the target area for bleedin ages and still cant find the fecker

Have you interogated anyone in the mission area? They usually give up the goodies. If they do, check the map for a red triangle (enemy with a yellow dot and place a marker on him.

weiland79

Zero-Cool wrote: »

Have you interogated anyone in the mission area? They usually give up the goodies. If they do, check the map for a red triangle (enemy with a yellow dot and place a marker on him.

Theres actually no one here. Not a single enemy and the area is fairly large. Sometimes a truck drives through and there is a base up the hill with enemies but this is outside the target area.

VulcanRaving

Dying to get my hands on this
Preordered it on Amazon but won't get it til the 11th!

Zero-Cool

weiland79 wrote: »

Theres actually no one here. Not a single enemy and the area is fairly large. Sometimes a truck drives through and there is a base up the hill with enemies but this is outside the target area.

Only thing i can think of is a sniper hidden in the hills maybe. Any idea what number side op it is?