Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - 2013/14 Mod warning post #718

Liam O

Hopefully Kagawa will be played in a CM role in the FA cup game. He looked good when moved there today, if anyone would ever pass to him...

SlickRic

Headshot wrote: »

I love Mata but how could be transform us? Where will he fit in the starting lineup?

surely he'd play where Rooney does at the moment (pushing Rooney further forward), or he plays on the right with Januzaj as his understudy so to speak.

he's different to Kagawa in that Kag thrives on quick transitions. Mata doesn't necessarily.

ForeverYoung90

I would love to see Juan Mata don the United shirt.He would be guaranteed to be our no.1 midfielder each week which should be a big incentive to him.Would Chelsea let him go to big rivals is the question, regardless how mush we offer them.

Gringo180

beno619 wrote: »

All issues that could have been addressed by the current manager.

Moyes is not getting the best out of the current squad.

We were awful at times last season but still won the league.

Van Persie practically dragged yous single handidly to last seasons title. Unfortunately for Moyes hes been out for half the season with injuries. Look at your team, 2 world class outfield players in your entire squad, yous just arent as good as you think yous are.

bullvine

Majority of players are not gonna jump ship just cause we finish fifth, one bad season. What happens is if the rot is not stopped.

wonderfullife

This might be slightly unfair but is anybody else worried Moyes may view a trophy (winning the Capital One Cup) and a top 6 finish as on ok start to his 1st season?

Given he's never won anything i genuinely wonder how he'll spin a Cup success and top 6 finish.

Looking at these fixtures i'm thinking he's going to put out his strongest available side in both legs of the semi-final. Which is a pretty big problem when the real important fixtures are either side of it against Swansea and Chelsea in the league.

I don't know. Maybe it's being unfair on him. But that's the sort of mentality of a Swansea or Aston Villa not Manchester United.

I really can't ever view that competition as a meaningful trophy, given how the Premier League sides treat it.

ForeverYoung90

nuxxx wrote: »

We won the league last year because of RVP, hes been injured for ages. Vidic and Rio were also much better as was Evra. To say its the same group of players isn't entirely true imo

He's played 11 league games vs Rooney's 16, fair enough but overall this is the same winning squad and this is a huge collapse.I don't understand?

Headshot

Trilla wrote: »

You basing this on the hat full of games he's played in his first season? I'm sure people thought 16m for Carrick was an awful signing and Spurs was his level. Crock Hargreaves, Anderson, Bebe, Veron etc all circumstantial and different situations but cost way more than they should have.

Im basing on watching him for Everton and numerous games he went missing in and when Moyes played him in advance role so he could lob the ball forward to him (like he did against utd)

Veron was one of the best CM's in the world but couldnt adjust to the PL, putting him in that lot is criminal

SlickRic wrote: »

surely he'd play where Rooney does at the moment (pushing Rooney further forward), or he plays on the right with Januzaj as his understudy so to speak.

he's different to Kagawa in that Kag thrives on quick transitions. Mata doesn't necessarily.

What about RVP the?

Mata thrives in the traditional no 10 role tbh

Agueroooo

Just watched Moyes post match interview and he is trying too hard to play it cool.

where is the Moyes that would defend all those nasty things against football like diving, simulation etc that we seen at Everton?

I rated the guy but its getting pathetic and it will be interesting to see if the Glazers back him in Jan as that would be a good indicator of where, and how much he is rated.

mufcboy1999

Let's be honest out recent good run of form still saw us playing terrible football, we are a disaster the last few seasons not just this year. We all know the cm issue that we've ignored for years is the root of the problem but I personally think moyes is way too negative , I mean we have 3 world class strikers and 1 up and coming talent in Welbeck and he still doesn't play 2 up top.

Play to your teams strengths look at spurs now with 2 up top or even the S n S combo at Liverpool. We don't have to have Rooney playing so deep to help pack the cm to make up for how bad it is we should like I said play to our strengths , 2 up top and lots of wing play.

We are scared of every team , always tactically set up to grind out results and cater other sides.

RasTa

To the people calling for Moyes to be sacked today, who would you replace him with for the next games?

RobertKK

Crazy time again, the latest being United are prepared to do a swap with Juventus - RVP for Vidal.

steps_3314

Useless team with a useless manager. Why are people still defending him. Moyes will never be successful at Utd. Just because SAF did back in 86 when things were looking bad doesn't mean that it can happen for Moyes. His tactics are completely WRONG. He reminds me of an Irish politician every time he speaks to the press. He always lies. "We played well" when we were absolutely ****e. At least SAF would admit it when we were poor but this fool just lies. He looks lost. Get out and take Fellaini with you. Rant over.

mufcboy1999

RasTa wrote: »

To the people calling for Moyes to be sacked today, who would you replace him with for the next games?

I'm not against moyes il give him time as long as he gets us a top 4 finish anything below that for a team of champions isn't good enough and would IMO fairly justify the sack.

mufcboy1999

Does anyone think it's strange that moyes was willing to make hierra of Bilbao our record signing in the summer and now seems to be okay with his squad ?

Surely for a player who's not cup tied it would make sense to meet his release Clause and sign him now considering we're crying out for a cm player.

Agueroooo

Wow...

David Moyes has dropped 16 points in 10 league games at home. Ferguson dropped 14 in his last 68.

Nolars

if Chelsea beat us we wont get top 4.

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

I thought taking Carrick off today was a big mistake. I was delighted to see him go off as it pushed Rooney back into midfield where he was largely ineffective. One of the few times Rooney found himself in and around the box in the last 15 mins he almost scored a peach of a shot. Also, Januzaj should have been moved to right midfield much sooner than he was. It was obvious Valencia was having a stinker midway through the first half and our left side was horribly exposed. Could have been a hammering were SAF still at the club.

J. Marston

Nolars wrote: »

if Chelsea beat us we wont get top 4.

We're not getting it anyway.

Headshot

J. Marston wrote: »

We're not getting it anyway.

Going to be hard, very hard infact but we are still have a chance but lets just say im happy I didnt bet on them to get the 4th, eh kry :P

DM_7

Moyes shouldn't be given time for the sake of it, shouldn't be given time because Chelsea or City would knee jerk while United are better than that and he shouldn't be given time just because of who may or may not be available to replace him.

Peraonally I think he should be given time to make real changes, things in spoke about before today but not for any of the reasons above.

Another one goal loss at home is very frustrating (being nice with that description). As the losses were narrow, RVP is missing, Carrick still not fit I don't think it would take a lot to make the improvements necessary. I think two players are needed in January.

A midfield player to free up Rooney is vital now. In these games, where you have ro chase the game, Rooney should be getting pushed up front and supported by likes of Kagawa but the complete lack of midfield players sees them pulled back and Hernandez who really doesn't do enough plod along up front. If Moyes doesn't at least try do something about midfield, even a short term measure I will be very disappointed (a measure that isn't pushing Rooney back).

mufcboy1999 wrote: »

Does anyone think it's strange that moyes was willing to make hierra of Bilbao our record signing in the summer and now seems to be okay with his squad ?

Surely for a player who's not cup tied it would make sense to meet his release Clause and sign him now considering we're crying out for a cm player.

He wasn't willing to do that and never came close to paying a big fee for him by accounts from the club since August.

kryogen

Headshot wrote: »

Going to be hard, very hard infact but we are still have a chance but lets just say im happy I didnt bet on them to get the 4th, eh kry :P

Still happy to have made the bet, what are we? 5 points off 4th? Its not exactly a mountain you know

Regroup, come up with some new ideas as its been 20 games and clearly isn't working, as Fergie himself said, tactics are useful, but its the men on the field that win football games. Men win football games.

The players have been making horrible mistakes all season, and they also have it well within themselves to be more dynamic in attack and don't have to simply keep giving the ball to a winger who cannot cross. They need to take responsibility out there and call an audible now and then.

Moyes will either improve or he will be gone in a couple of years, but for right now he is our manager and he will have my support regardless, its not like he wants to fail, he just needs to remember why he is the Man United manager, he needs to realise this is it, this is his shot. He has to find a way to motivate the players to give that extra 10%

Its not over by a long shot

Technophobe

Another disaster of a day.... Can't see January being much better tbh either in terms of progress on the pitch or signings...

For me, today was a must win match...

beno619

kryogen wrote: »

Still happy to have made the bet, what are we? 5 points off 4th? Its not exactly a mountain you know

Regroup, come up with some new ideas as its been 20 games and clearly isn't working, as Fergie himself said, tactics are useful, but its the men on the field that win football games. Men win football games.

Will he come up with new ideas ? Nothing has changed since the beginning of the season.

The same players and same tactics have been deployed and he seems totally enept at even acknowledging the issues in the side.

As much as we want to back Moyes. Apart from Adnan and Welbz all this optimism is based on hope rather than anything we have seen from the team or manager.

niallo27

There is no reason why utd can't get 4th. Liverpool Everton and spurs are all going drop handy points against nothing teams.

Backstreet Moyes

Evra just has to be replaced this month. He is gifting two to three chances a game by not bothering tracking back.

Valencia just disgusts me. What summed him up was a few mins to go he had the ball and just stood still didn;t know how to bring it forward he only tried to run after the crowd urged him it's pathetic. Also i just will crack up if i hear people talking about his defensive work.

Cleverley is just a passenger i don;t mind him staying but he should not be a regular.

My big problem with Moyes is why he won't drop these players. How Valencia and Evra continue to play is just mind boggling. I hope the two of them are shipped off this month both have got too comfortable and seem to just not give a sh?t anymore.

Hank Scorpio

This sums up Valencia for me

Headshot

kryogen wrote: »

Still happy to have made the bet, what are we? 5 points off 4th? Its not exactly a mountain you know

Regroup, come up with some new ideas as its been 20 games and clearly isn't working, as Fergie himself said, tactics are useful, but its the men on the field that win football games. Men win football games.

The players have been making horrible mistakes all season, and they also have it well within themselves to be more dynamic in attack and don't have to simply keep giving the ball to a winger who cannot cross. They need to take responsibility out there and call an audible now and then.

Moyes will either improve or he will be gone in a couple of years, but for right now he is our manager and he will have my support regardless, its not like he wants to fail, he just needs to remember why he is the Man United manager, he needs to realise this is it, this is his shot. He has to find a way to motivate the players to give that extra 10%

Its not over by a long shot

You just have to look at the other teams around us and how they are playing and see why 4th is alot to ask for. You say regroup, surely after 20 games he would of thought the same and made some changes by now, surely? You could also say his tactics of lobbing the ball in with Val isnt working either.

beno619

nuxxx wrote: »

This sums up Valencia for me.

I think Val has missed Scholes as much as anybody.

His raking diagonals used to take full backs out of the game Valencia very rarely had to actually beat a man.

His lack of gile is really clear to see and he needs an attacking full back with him to be effective in the final third.

xtal191

Top eight mini table, not good enough!

rob316

niallo27 wrote: »

There is no reason why utd can't get 4th. Liverpool Everton and spurs are all going drop handy points against nothing teams.

There is plenty reason. Playing style is muck and some pretty average players. The table doesn't lie united are not better than everton or liverpool right now.

Devil08

Carrick Fellaini

Jan Roo Mata

RVP


doesn't look too bad to me. Thoughts?

Your Airbag

Balls of result. A big set back to our recent run but we never looked convincing on that run.

Its fourth place now for us this season, thats what it will be all about and the cup games. Moyes is the sponge for all the blame and he is responsible for a lot. He seems to use the same tactics and poor players no matter how lucky we got in the last game, ignoring all warning signals.

Saying that a lot of rot has clearly been creeping in for a few seasons. Not replacing our aging great players. The no vaule in the market line. Buying some average players. Average players getting into the starting XI. All of this before Moyes came in.

He had one summer and didn't do enough to remedy this but he also had to evaluate the situation and do a pre-season tour, not enough time imo. Replacing the back room staff is starting to hurt us.

Some of the players need to hang their heads in shame. They have really taken the foot of the pedal since Fergie left. Evra, Clev and Val have been shocking. Carrick, Welbeck, Young, Kagawa are all in unreliable form.

I don't know if its a Moyes tactic to instruct a defender to stay up pitch and let a winger cover for him if an attack breaks down but if thats not a Moyes tactic then Evra's attitude is disgusting. For the first goal he wasn't even visible near the box when Spurs scored. Val was shocking for the second, he is not a defender but Moyes occasionally plays him there.

Spurs were lucky not to concede a second but our players helped with poor finishing and shocking defending.

sawfish

Mocha Joe wrote: »

Only disappointing thing for me about Moyes is that this is exactly how a season would go under Fergie. Exactly.

Are you being serious, lets forget todays game and go back to where it was on the day you posted. After 19 games last season United had 46 points. This season they had 34 points after 19 games (now 20 games).

So tell me how exactly how this is the same as a season would go under Fergie? Exactly.

Winston Payne

Devil08 wrote: »

Carrick Fellaini

Jan Roo Mata

RVP


doesn't look too bad to me. Thoughts?

"It's not going to happen" is my first one.

Devil08

Winston Payne wrote: »

"It's not going to happen" is my first one.

You could equally put kag in place of mata and it would be a much better way of playing than at present with wingers

beno619

All our problems could be solved with a 45 million bid for Fabregas and a loan offer for Coentrao. :P

jamaamaj

beno619 wrote: »

All our problems could be solved with a 45 million bid for Fabregas and a loan offer for Coentrao. :P

And what happens when/if both bids where to fail :P.

beno619

jamaamaj wrote: »

And what happens when/if both bids where to fail :P.

Sign Khedirah for 60 mill, 3 mill more than his release clause.

jamaamaj

beno619 wrote: »

Sign Khedirah for 60 mill, 3 mill more than his release clause.

Who.?

Sami Khedira.?

kryogen

beno619 wrote: »

Will he come up with new ideas ? Nothing has changed since the beginning of the season.

The same players and same tactics have been deployed and he seems totally enept at even acknowledging the issues in the side.

As much as we want to back Moyes. Apart from Adnan and Welbz all this optimism is based on hope rather than anything we have seen from the team or manager.

Well, he introduced Adnan which was a pretty positive move. He is doing very well overall. Welbeck is scoring goals and being played in his correct position, that's good isn't it?

The players deployed has a lot to do with injury in fairness to him, and the tactics, Im not sure, Id rather wait and see how he gets on when he has the full team available and brings in a couple of players. See how he has them playing but your dead on. Generally (the odd time he has got the tactics spot on) the football is pedestrian, it has been for a couple of years now so again, not sure you can land it all at his door.

He needs to make changes, that's clear. Lets see how this window and the season pans out. No point in getting up in a heap at every bad result. He wont be going anywhere until the summer at the very, very earliest. Even at that as long as we get top four I highly doubt they will consider removing him. Im not convinced he will be sacked if we fail to make top four tbh though I wouldn't be against it myself, as long as a good replacement is lined up

He has an impossible job, the next man in will have a much easier one, but I will give him the season before passing judgement on him.

dreamers75

beno619 wrote: »

Sign Khedirah for 60 mill, 3 mill more than his release clause.

Isnt he out for the next 6 months or so?

Devil08

Any decent players with only 6 months left on contract?? Usually a few this time of year. Might get decent player without spending crazy money

bad2dabone

dreamers75 wrote: »

Isnt he out for the next 6 months or so?

yep. and 60m for him is mental talk.

dreamers75

Devil08 wrote: »

Any decent players with only 6 months left on contract?? Usually a few this time of year. Might get decent player without spending crazy money

Imo United need and have needed Ever Banega for 3 years now.

Gifted filthy dirty midfielder, imagine Cabaye but evil.

Backstreet Moyes

Surely Kagawa deserves a game in cm. It's not his ideal position but he would be much better than Cleverley at picking up the ball and being able to bring the ball forward.

Backstreet Moyes

Devil08 wrote: »

Any decent players with only 6 months left on contract?? Usually a few this time of year. Might get decent player without spending crazy money

Mutabadi from PSG.

Lovely Bloke

It's obvious now why Moyes went chasing Baines in the summer, something for which he was derided. Evra is such a busted flush it's not even funny any more. The man is actually sullying his own reputation with his performances, it's ridiculous how bad he's become.

Smalling should never play full back again, and Valencia should never play for United again.

It's probably not totally Moye's fault, but he needs to improve that team by buying smart this winter, and next summer. If not, he should go this time next year.

Either he gets board backing, money and signs players and doesn't do a job. Sacked.

Or else he doesn't get backing, no money is spent again and he has the balls to walk and expose the lies.

Or he gets no backing, the "next Zaha" is signed from some Championship club for 20+m, team fails to perform and he's sacked, only for the next manager to be the same.

I don't believe Moye's was properly backed in the Summer window, and I don't believe he will be properly backed this winter or next Summer either.

kona

Crap Defending cost us today. We really needed to get something from that to keep pace.
The tactics of hitting a ball into the box and hoping for the best was driving me mental, it was insane doing the same thing and expecting a different result.

Need to look to the next game and sharpen up at the back. Even if you cant score, you can still get something by not conceding. We had plenty of chances at the end to win it.

kryogen

bad2dabone wrote: »

yep. and 60m for him is mental talk.

Not really a need for any more water carriers in the team alright

One genuine "**** Me!" signing in midfield would make such a huge difference, it would give the squad a lift and obviously improve the midfield.

We need to get RVP back to full fitness and quick, then stop blasting balls at his head and waist and try to play him into positions to score.

That would be good.