Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - 2013/14 Mod warning post #718

homerjay2005

how good is Gundagon lads and would he rate him higher than somebody like Vidal for example?

i think theres a great chance we will sign him sooner or later, but this injury of course is a roadblock in January. Kagawa going the other way, holds the trump card for us along with the fact that Gundagon is actually a united fan.

Mitch Connor

homerjay2005 wrote: »

how good is Gundagon lads and would he rate him higher than somebody like Vidal for example?

i think theres a great chance we will sign him sooner or later, but this injury of course is a roadblock in January. Kagawa going the other way, holds the trump card for us along with the fact that Gundagon is actually a united fan.

Nailed on for Real Madrid if he does leave, IMO.

Your Airbag

Nothing too report worthy going on transfer wise today but here are a few bits

Chico to the Gunners

http://www.theguardian.com/football/2014/jan/02/football-transfer-rumours-manchester-united-javier-hernandez-arsenal

Robert Lewandowski will reveal which club he will be joining next on January 2nd

Not that he has or its any doubt where he is going but here is the link

http://www.football.co.uk/manchester_united/lewandowski_to_reveal_transfer_destination_on_jan_2nd_-_man_united__bayern__co_wait_in_anticipation_rss4548541.shtml

I think it was mentioned earlier but Dinamo Zagreb’s Robert Muric who was a Croatia Under 17 World Cup star is on Moyes radar apparently. One for the future

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/football/article-2532380/Moyes-closing-securing-6m-rated-striker-Muric-bargain-300-000.html

Next up

Sevilla midfielder Ivan Rakitic says he is undecided on his future, with Manchester United, Chelsea, Liverpool and PSG reported to be interested in him.

http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11834/9098302/transfer-news-sevilla-midfielder-ivan-rakitic-undecided-on-future

German article linking us with Resu, we can expect a lot of this in the coming weeks

http://www.sueddeutsche.de/sport/bvb-stuermer-marco-reus-verzweifeltes-manchester-denkt-an-rekordsumme-1.1854468

bucketybuck

spiralism wrote: »

http://www1.skysports.com/football/news/11096/9098542/style-issues

Good read on what's wrong with us actually

Ouch

As a result, perhaps the biggest fear for Manchester United fans is that they are chasing a solution on the pitch to a problem that is standing on their touchline.

Its a damning article in fairness, some of the stats relating to United this season really are pathetic.

The_Kew_Tour

homerjay2005 wrote: »

how good is Gundagon lads and would he rate him higher than somebody like Vidal for example?

i think theres a great chance we will sign him sooner or later, but this injury of course is a roadblock in January. Kagawa going the other way, holds the trump card for us along with the fact that Gundagon is actually a united fan.

Think he is still out injured. Be a super buy.

Is he really realistic target though?(United fan or not)

Cantona's Collars

Liverpool tore that Spurs team apart & would have probably scored 3 or 4 against them yesterday,Rogers has got them back to basics of passing & movement whereas we've gone the other way.It shows how so many were nervous of playing them at OT where in the past it was taken as a given we'd get a handy 3 points.
For all the criticism of Moyes,he actually had Everton playing some decent stuff,is it just down to him or do some of our players just not give a toss anymore?
Man for man we have a better first XI than Liverpool (Suarez is obviously an exception) but where they play as a team is better than us at the moment.I find it galling watching us playing as if the basics of football are an alien concept to some of our players.

IamtheWalrus

I think a January signing to improve the first 11 is most unlikely.

spiralism

homerjay2005 wrote: »

how good is Gundagon lads and would he rate him higher than somebody like Vidal for example?

i think theres a great chance we will sign him sooner or later, but this injury of course is a roadblock in January. Kagawa going the other way, holds the trump card for us along with the fact that Gundagon is actually a united fan.

He's an absolutely excellent midfielder in fairness and could complement Carrick quite well but there's that one key problem - he's not played a minute since mid august and has a niggling back issue that wont go away. Also, Dortmund generally go with 5 in the middle, with Bender/Gundogan(Kehl or Sahin if out) as double pivots and the three attacking midfielders in front of them. Not as sure how he'd be used in a 4 man midfield (wasted like Kagawa i would imagine)

spiralism

zerks wrote: »

Liverpool tore that Spurs team apart & would have probably scored 3 or 4 against them yesterday,Rogers has got them back to basics of passing & movement whereas we've gone the other way.It shows how so many were nervous of playing them at OT where in the past it was taken as a given we'd get a handy 3 points.
For all the criticism of Moyes,he actually had Everton playing some decent stuff,is it just down to him or do some of our players just not give a toss anymore?
Man for man we have a better first XI than Liverpool (Suarez is obviously an exception) but where they play as a team is better than us at the moment.I find it galling watching us playing as if the basics of football are an alien concept to some of our players.

The players have no respect for him is the answer. They've won everything and are now being managed by a man who never won anything. It's pretty clear too, players look disinterested and lethargic, they're not motivated. The most damning indictment in that regard is that despite Moyes being staunchly anti diving, no United team has ever been as bad as this one for it. Januzaj is already the second most booked player in PL history for simulation. Ashley Young is 3rd. Just goes to show the players are not listening to him. Moyes hasnt lost the dressing room though, he never had it in the first place.

homerjay2005

bucketybuck wrote: »

Ouch

Its a damning article in fairness, some of the stats relating to United this season really are pathetic.

it really does sum up where everything is wrong to be honest. wasnt it something like 45 crosses against palace and only 4 or 5 were successful? nice to see that Moyes and the coaching team have learned nothing since then. 47 against Spurs and they just lapped them up.

we are behind Hull, West Ham and Stoke as the worst team in the league for playing ball through the middle. sure, no wonder we are f*cked.

niallo27

zerks wrote: »

Liverpool tore that Spurs team apart & would have probably scored 3 or 4 against them yesterday,Rogers has got them back to basics of passing & movement whereas we've gone the other way.It shows how so many were nervous of playing them at OT where in the past it was taken as a given we'd get a handy 3 points.
For all the criticism of Moyes,he actually had Everton playing some decent stuff,is it just down to him or do some of our players just not give a toss anymore?
Man for man we have a better first XI than Liverpool (Suarez is obviously an exception) but where they play as a team is better than us at the moment.I find it galling watching us playing as if the basics of football are an alien concept to some of our players.

It took him a while to get there though. His first 6 months were on a par with Moyes first 6 months. I wouldn't say man for man utd have better players. There are some very average players in that utd team.

niallo27

spiralism wrote: »

The players have no respect for him is the answer. They've won everything and are now being managed by a man who never won anything. It's pretty clear too, players look disinterested and lethargic, they're not motivated. The most damning indictment in that regard is that despite Moyes being staunchly anti diving, no United team has ever been as bad as this one for it. Januzaj is already the second most booked player in PL history for simulation. Ashley Young is 3rd. Just goes to show the players are not listening to him. Moyes hasnt lost the dressing room though, he never had it in the first place.

I wouldn't read too much about diving. Didn't he have a go at Suarez before the derby last year and his own captain made a fool of him by diving and getting booked.

GSPfan

niallo27 wrote: »

It took him a while to get there though. His first 6 months were on a par with Moyes first 6 months. I wouldn't say man for man utd have better players. There are some very average players in that utd team.

No way. Rodgers improved Liverpool instantly from a mid-table, boring, aimless team in to a mid-table, exciting, progressive team. They drew a lot of matches in his first season which hurt their league position but you could instantly see progress.

Moyes has the league champions in 7th playing worse football than a Ferguson team which played bad football.

Robson99

Very disappointing last night but its really the story of our season.

Evra has had his head up his h**e since the summer and has zero interest in defending. Shaw has to be brought in even if it costs 20m+.

Rafael a big loss when not playing as Smalling just not good enough from an attacking perspective for the role. Excellent CB but not a full back.

I think Val criticism last night is a bit ott. Sure some of his crosses were blocked and didnt get into the box but when the crosses did get in we had 1 player in the box and 3 or 4 defenders. Rooney was playing so deep that it left only Welbeck in there. Hard to be blaming Val when there is no one in the box. Also Smalling rarely overlapped Val which didnt help him. Val plays much better with Rafael.

Midfield was s**te again. And in particular Carrick. He was /is supposed to be the holding player. Well look at how much time and space Adebayor got when he dropped into the hole. Carrick was nowhere near him. Cleverly will be slated on here but Carrick has been piss poor this season. IMO if we manage to get in a creative player for the middle of the park then I would like to see Jones been given the chance in the holding role.

With regards to this transfer window I think he will bring in a LB and a CM. In his defence he identified these two areas in the summer and brought in a CM. Fergie was in the habit of selling / getting rid of CM in the last couple of seasons when we were crying out for them.

Some posters on here claiming Murinho would have been our saviour well he couldnt even bring in a decent CF in the transfer window when the dog on the street knew they needed one and continues to waste Mata. Genius

niallo27

GSPfan wrote: »

No way. Rodgers improved Liverpool instantly from a mid-table, boring, aimless team in to a mid-table, exciting, progressive team. They drew a lot of matches in his first season which hurt their league position but you could instantly see progress.

Moyes has the league champions in 7th playing worse football than a Ferguson team which played bad football.

The first 6 months under Rodgers was pretty tough to watch. Loads of possession but not creating anything. He had a plan though and it's paying off for him. It's great to watch anyway. Moyes has to have a plan doesn't he.

irishfeen

spiralism wrote: »

It seems we even lack a plan A. Our best bet is passing it out to the right wing and hoping for the best, or failing that, kick & chase. We have 423 failed crosses this year and rank last in attempts to play through the middle of the park. That says it all about us imo.

Yeah the lack of a quality attacking midfielder is killing us, we are bypassing the centre of the park completely either by passing it up the wing or lumping it up Welbeck and hoping something comes of it ... we might actually be fine if Valencia could put a better ball in but that's just not happening.

The lack of a midfield is also putting our defenders under unnatural pressure on the counter after Valencia/Cleverly/Welbeck inevitably loose the ball.

bucketybuck

homerjay2005 wrote: »

it really does sum up where everything is wrong to be honest. wasnt it something like 45 crosses against palace and only 4 or 5 were successful? nice to see that Moyes and the coaching team have learned nothing since then. 47 against Spurs and they just lapped them up.

we are behind Hull, West Ham and Stoke as the worst team in the league for playing ball through the middle. sure, no wonder we are f*cked.

The worrying thing is that after 20 games of this ineffective rubbish he stills seems to intend sticking with these tactics. It will still be Valencia on the right and it will still be the same old crap. He has the players there to play a different style, with Januzaj and Kagawa United could easily move to playing through the centre but it doesn't look at all like that is going to happen.

GSPfan

I really hate right footed wingers playing left wing and vice versa but there's a few players who are absolutely brilliant at it. One is Ronaldo, and after last night I'm saying Adnan Januzaj is another.

Most of the time the full back knows exactly whats gonna happen. The right footed player on the left wing will fake to go down the line and turn back and cross with his right foot. (see Ashley Young).
But Adnan was an absolute menace on the right wing. He was going either way and he was fooking brilliant at it. I actually think that will be his best position for now. He looks a bit too hesitant on the left.

GSPfan

niallo27 wrote: »

The first 6 months under Rodgers was pretty tough to watch. Loads of possession but not creating anything. He had a plan though and it's paying off for him. It's great to watch anyway. Moyes has to have a plan doesn't he.

We hope.

homerjay2005

niallo27 wrote: »

. Moyes has to have a plan doesn't he.

sign Baines and let him cross the ball in to Fellaini.

GSPfan

Moyes in charge of United is like watching Lost the first time round.

I believed it didn't matter if the show seemed overly complicated and dis-jointed because I trusted it would all work out in the end because the writers knew what they were doing.

Spoiler Alert

It didn't. The ending was shoite.

LiamoSail

homerjay2005 wrote: »

sign Baines and let him cross the ball in to Fellaini.

I'm not an everton fan, but have been to a fair few of their games. Baines and Fellaini always linked up well, could be seen regularly specifically looking for one another. It wasn't a case though of baines whipping them in towards the big man in the box, more in build up, and playing the ball on the deck, both are technically good footballers

kryogen

GSPfan wrote: »

I really hate right footed wingers playing left wing and vice versa but there's a few players who are absolutely brilliant at it. One is Ronaldo, and after last night I'm saying Adnan Januzaj is another.

Most of the time the full back knows exactly whats gonna happen. The right footed player on the left wing will fake to go down the line and turn back and cross with his right foot. (see Ashley Young).
But Adnan was an absolute menace on the right wing. He was going either way and he was fooking brilliant at it. I actually think that will be his best position for now. He looks a bit too hesitant on the left.

RW has always been his best position, though I think he will mature into a genuine number 10 over time

irishfeen

GSPfan wrote: »

Moyes in charge of United is like watching Lost the first time round.

I believed it didn't matter if the show seemed overly complicated and dis-jointed because I trusted it would all work out in the end because the writers knew what they were doing.

Spoiler Alert

It didn't. The ending was shoite.

Jaysus whats with all the negativity - things will turn around sooner rather then later ... there is problems in a few positions - Ferguson's team that is, just give Moyes a season or two to change things around...

.. We don't have a god given right to win the PL & CL every single year, this year we won't retain it but look we have been spoilt over the last two decades with success. As I said earlier, calm minds and getting behind Moyes/Team is now needed more then ever.

homerjay2005

the more i think about that article, the more angry i am getting (even though being honest its something we have all been saying here for 5 months but when it hits home like this, its just so disappointing). its horrific reading and of course, the "top 8" league table is doing the rounds everywhere now to just add more insult to injury, though again its something we have discussed several times already here over the past month.

no matter what way you look at things, everything just adds up to horrific reading for Moyes.

spiralism

homerjay2005 wrote: »

the more i think about that article, the more angry i am getting (even though being honest its something we have all been saying here for 5 months but when it hits home like this, its just so disappointing). its horrific reading and of course, the "top 8" league table is doing the rounds everywhere now, though its something we have discussed several times already here over the past month.

no matter what way you look at things, everything just adds up to horrific reading for Moyes.

Imo the sooner we're shot of him the better. Hated the appointment and everything bad i said he'd do when we hired him has come to pass....I stood by him like a good little fan which is what we're meant to do but the patience is getting extremely thin now and i've little confidence he can turn around, the flaws are obvious and being ignored, if not getting worse.

People preaching the whole ethos of being patient and giving him a few years need to realise there's a difference between being loyal and stupid and that football is not the game it used to be, those clubs with managerial revolving doors are often actually successful. Look at Liverpool the previous few years for example, they've stood by managers but knew when to draw the line and when it was smart to sit tight. They canned Hodgson rapidly when it became clear he wasnt up to the task like Moyes is now but stayed firm on Rodgers and gave both Dalglish and Benitez ample time, letting them go as the time was right. We need to not be stubborn and admit the mistake before its too late imo.

Mitch Connor

homerjay2005 wrote: »

the more i think about that article, the more angry i am getting (even though being honest its something we have all been saying here for 5 months but when it hits home like this, its just so disappointing). its horrific reading and of course, the "top 8" league table is doing the rounds everywhere now to just add more insult to injury, though again its something we have discussed several times already here over the past month.

no matter what way you look at things, everything just adds up to horrific reading for Moyes.

Moyes was always the wrong choice IMO, just didn't think he'd be as clueless and poor in the job as he has been.

beno619

Robson99 wrote: »

Some posters on here claiming Murinho would have been our saviour well he couldnt even bring in a decent CF in the transfer window when the dog on the street knew they needed one and continues to waste Mata. Genius

Mourinho would defo have us playing better football. His team are also competing for the premier league.

lol, he doesnt have CF because he's making a statement that there is room for a truly world class forward when they become available. Rooney or Falcao failing that Lukaku.

kryogen

I have it open in another tab, but Im beginning to question whether I want to read this article or not, Im kind of in a good mood right now

GSPfan

kryogen wrote: »

RW has always been his best position, though I think he will mature into a genuine number 10 over time

Ah jaysus not another one!

beno619

Crying. :pac:

homerjay2005

spiralism wrote: »

Imo the sooner we're shot of him the better.

we are stuck with him, so we may as well support him. no point asking for him to be sacked as its not going to happen.

he can turn this around, but it could get worse before it gets better.

Robson99

beno619 wrote: »

lol, he doesnt have CF because he's making a statement that there is room for a truly world class forward when they become available. Rooney or Falcao failing that Lukaku.

He doesnt have a CF because hes making a statement. Wat da f**k is dat supposed to mean. You say hes a top manager but he cuts off his nose to spite his face Now thats LOL.

Failing that Lukaku. He sent him to Everton. Top man indeed

GSPfan

irishfeen wrote: »

Jaysus whats with all the negativity - things will turn around sooner rather then later ... there is problems in a few positions - Ferguson's team that is, just give Moyes a season or two to change things around...

.. We don't have a god given right to win the PL & CL every single year, this year we won't retain it but look we have been spoilt over the last two decades with success. As I said earlier, calm minds and getting behind Moyes/Team is now needed more then ever.

I like your style. I wouldn't be Moyes's biggest critic but he has absolutely failed miserably so far by my expectations. And I didn't set the bar that high. I hope you are right. Cause unless we finish in 7th I reckon he will still be in the job next season.

kryogen

GSPfan wrote: »

Ah jaysus not another one!

He doesnt have the pace to be a proper winger and tbh it would be a bit of a waste of his talents to limit him to one side of the field, so a more central role seems to be the one that will suit him best, a free role would be best but may not be possible, he has a quick brain, though he takes too long at the moment a lot of times making decisions, this will get better the more he plays.

Rayne Wooney

I hope Fergie isn't consulting Moyes on tactics I really do

kryogen

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

I hope Fergie isn't consulting Moyes on tactics I really do

Moyes is his own man. That much should be clear to everyone at least.

irishfeen

(I know I shouldn't take any notice :rolleyes: ) but ESPN is reporting "Manchester United are monitoring Juan Mata's uncertain situation at Stamford Bridge with a view to a bid in this transfer window" but are questioning whether Chelsea would sell him to us.

GSPfan

kryogen wrote: »

He doesnt have the pace to be a proper winger and tbh it would be a bit of a waste of his talents to limit him to one side of the field, so a more central role seems to be the one that will suit him best, a free role would be best but may not be possible, he has a quick brain, though he takes too long at the moment a lot of times making decisions, this will get better the more he plays.

I've wondered if he would develope into a Modric type midfielder. Kinda reminds me of him when he is running with the ball. Don't know why. Deceptively fast at times. His pass last night was brilliant too. Haven't really heard much about it because of the diving and the result.

spiralism

homerjay2005 wrote: »

we are stuck with him, so we may as well support him. no point asking for him to be sacked as its not going to happen.

he can turn this around, but it could get worse before it gets better.

Unfortunately this is true, we truly made our bed with this and now have to sleep in it. He could but i do not see it, the problems have got worse and i dont see us being able to count on a manager who's never won anything and who half the team dont even listen to by the looks. Effort and morale at the club is at an all time low in my lifetime.

beno619

Robson99 wrote: »

He doesnt have a CF because hes making a statement. Wat da f**k is dat supposed to mean. You say hes a top manager but he cuts off his nose to spite his face Now thats LOL.

Failing that Lukaku. He sent him to Everton. Top man indeed

He courted Rooney and I still think he wants him, at the end of the day there's room for a world class forward.

At the end of the day his team are in the race for the title where are we ?

GSPfan

Would anyone swap Moyes for Martinez right now?

irishfeen

GSPfan wrote: »

I like your style. I wouldn't be Moyes's biggest critic but he has absolutely failed miserably so far by my expectations. And I didn't set the bar that high. I hope you are right. Cause unless we finish in 7th I reckon he will still be in the job next season.

I think barring relegation he will still be there this time next year - not a chance Ferguson and Charlton would stand for him being forced out.

The_Kew_Tour

GSPfan wrote: »

Would anyone swap Moyes for Martinez right now?

In hindsight yes.

Hate saying that though

NaiveMelodies

irishfeen wrote: »

I think barring relegation he will still be there this time next year - not a chance Ferguson and Charlton would stand for him being forced out.

I really don't think Ferguson should have a say, he can't be objective at all in this situation.

Don't want/think Moyes will be sacked by the way but dangerous territory if SAF gets involved.

irishfeen

GSPfan wrote: »

Would anyone swap Moyes for Martinez right now?

Ha you have to remember that Everton team was for the most hand built by Moyes himself - Don't Everton have like the same points as last year under Moyes?

Mitch Connor

irishfeen wrote: »

(I know I shouldn't take any notice :rolleyes: ) but ESPN is reporting "Manchester United are monitoring Juan Mata's uncertain situation at Stamford Bridge with a view to a bid in this transfer window" but are questioning whether Chelsea would sell him to us.

JUST FOOKING BID AND SEE WHAT HAPPENS.

'Monitoring', Jesus fecking wept.

irishfeen

only1stevo wrote: »

I really don't think Ferguson should have a say, he can't be objective at all in this situation.

Don't want/think Moyes will be sacked by the way but dangerous territory if SAF gets involved.

But of course he and Charlton would be involved in any decision to remove Moyes - they are on the board of directors at Man Utd.

GSPfan

irishfeen wrote: »

Ha you have to remember that Everton team was for the most hand built by Moyes himself - Don't Everton have like the same points as last year under Moyes?

Yeah thats all true but I suppose you would most likely base your decision on which one is a better manager and which one has the best ability to coach Manchester United players.

At this point in time I'd feel better with Martinez as United manager. Hindsight and all. Martinez doesn't get the credit for Swansea's football style either. Everyone thinks of Rodgers but Martinez started that.

irishfeen

GSPfan wrote: »

Yeah thats all true but I suppose you would most likely base your decision on which one is a better manager and which one has the best ability to coach Manchester United players.

At this point in time I'd feel better with Martinez as United manager. Hindsight and all. Martinez doesn't get the credit for Swansea's football style either. Everyone thinks of Rodgers but Martinez started that.

Again you may be completely right but I plead with all sensible United supporters to stick with him and support him and the team until at least the end of next season.