Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - 2013/14 Mod warning post #718

Mitch Connor

Morzadec wrote: »

Which parts are particularly wrong in your opinion? (Don't want to give you a headache, but I'm curious, beacuse imo it's a fairly accurate and balanced appraisal of the situation at the moment!)

So you set up the 'par League' on RAWK then....

Morzadec

Mitch Connor wrote: »

So you set up the 'par League' on RAWK then....

Never been on RAWK...

If you don't find it interesting fair enough, leave it, I'm not on a windup or anything, just wanted to give my point of view from a United perspective (i.e. even accounting for fixture difficulty they're still under-achieving to what would be considered their minimum expectations, but on the other hand are still very well-placed for top 4 despite their bad run).

If I've caused offence or headaches I apologise and I'll leave you lot to it and head back to the safety of the Liverpool thread to discuss Moses' brilliant scoop yesterday

Mitch Connor

Morzadec wrote: »

Never been on RAWK...

If you don't find it interesting fair enough, leave it, I'm not on a windup or anything, just wanted to give my point of view from a United perspective (i.e. even accounting for fixture difficulty they're still under-achieving to what would be considered their minimum expectations, but on the other hand are still very well-placed for top 4 despite their bad run).

If I've caused offence or headaches I apologise and I'll leave you lot to it and head back to the safety of the Liverpool thread to discuss Moses' brilliant scoop yesterday

Really? Have seen this posted from RAWK, and I was led to believe they claim ownership/creation of this par league thing. Fair enough.

I have no issue with what you have posted.

In reality it makes United's season look better than it has been so far, and on course for a top 4 finish if we can start playing well. Which I would be happy with.

Timmyctc

IvySlayer wrote: »

Hey Mr Loner did they do a webcam chat with Giggsy?

I was 25 mins into a 30 min walk home when I stopped dead and realised I didn't wait around after the credits :pac:

Morzadec wrote: »

Which parts are particularly wrong in your opinion? (Don't want to give you a headache, but I'm curious, beacuse imo it's a fairly accurate and balanced appraisal of the situation at the moment!)

I just re-read the post and surely enough you do say they are Your targets, Your figures, what You imagine they would need and how You think they will do/have done etc etc so Im assuming it was an opinionated post you were putting rather than trying to paint it as quasi-fact with any sort of scientific basis. Apologies

homerjay2005

Morzadec wrote: »

even accounting for fixture difficulty they're still under-achieving to what would be considered their minimum expectations,

i dont think there is any doubt that United are under achieving so far this season and im sick of seeing people blame the fixture list - we are 10 points down from the same fixtures last year, so that in itself is enough proof the the fixture list excuse is just bulls*it.

its about time people stopped using this excuse and moved on - we dropped points that we shouldnt have dropped against teams we should be routinely beating like West Brom, Southampton and Cardiff and we should have not lost to Liverpool. the next 7 games allows us a chance to to get back into the title rate but we need 19 points there.

Morzadec

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Really? Have seen this posted from RAWK, and I was led to believe they claim ownership/creation of this par league thing. Fair enough.

I have no issue with what you have posted.

In reality it makes United's season look better than it has been so far, and on course for a top 4 finish if we can start playing well. Which I would be happy with.

I remember someone starting a similar one a few years back, perhaps it originally came from RAWK (though I remember it being posted here as a link to a blog).

I thought it was a nice idea but pretty flawed/simplistic. Got to thinking earlier in the season what Liverpool needed to do to get in the top 4, and came up with a different system, although I suppose it was partly inspired by that other one.

Yeah United have had slightly more difficult fixture than the rest.

For example, in my table you are 7 points off the top rather than 9.

Timmyctc wrote: »

I just re-read the post and surely enough you do say they are Your targets, Your figures, what You imagine they would need and how You think they will do/have done etc etc so Im assuming it was an opinionated post you were putting rather than trying to paint it as quasi-fact with any sort of scientific basis. Apologies

Fair enough so!

Yes, it is an opinion-based model, though one which I think makes sense (but is not without its flaws.)

I do realise that some people have time for this type of thinking, but I personally like it as it helps me keep track of the bigger picture to some extent.

bullvine

homerjay2005 wrote: »

i dont think there is any doubt that United are under achieving so far this season and im sick of seeing people blame the fixture list - we are 10 points down from the same fixtures last year, so that in itself is enough proof the the fixture list excuse is just bulls*it.

its about time people stopped using this excuse and moved on - we dropped points that we shouldnt have dropped against teams we should be routinely beating like West Brom, Southampton and Cardiff and we should have not lost to Liverpool. the next 7 games allows us a chance to to get back into the title rate but we need 19 points there.

In fairness though, we beat City/Liverpool away last season, most seasons previously we'd lose or draw them.

With the upcoming fixtures, games we'd normally win under Fergie, if wins are not achieved, then there can be no more excuses about fixture lists.

Mitch Connor

I have no real issues with Moyes' results vs Chelsea, Liverpool, City or Arsenal.

Sure I'd have liked more points from them, but the season (and squad) thats in it, they are not the games I'm annoyed over.

Losing to West Brom at home, dropping points in the last minutes vs Southapton and Cardiff - THEY are the games that have pissed me off. Those are the performances that have worried me the most.

Not really bothered about the Spurs result either.

Lord TSC

homerjay2005 wrote: »

which is what? i dont see many weak points in the Chelsea team that stand out like ours. they are well stocked in all areas but the big mistake he made was sending out Lukaku on loan - they could do with him, but they still have 3 strikers two of which who have signed in the past 11 months.

They need a world class striker. There's a reason they were sniffing round Rooney. I'm surprised more people don't make comparisons between their attempts to get Rooney and ours to get Fabregas, since it strikes me to be very, very similiar in nature.

again not relevent, Fergie went normally for players from lesser clubs. right now, we have too many of them and it was about time we signed world class players. all this team needed was two players that would go straight into the first 11 and we would have been ok.

But how do we know Fergie wasn't trying for WC players as well and couldn't get them? Is the idea that Fergie was completely oblivious to our midfield? Don't get me wrong, I agree Moyes should have done better in the window in terms of midfield prospects, but to give Fergie a letoff by saying "it wasn't his style" and then criticize Moyes for it not being his either seems hypocritical.

i know you dont and several others wont either - its called denial. and remember i said it was only a part of the reason, there are several others such as an inept CE, poor planning/scouting and lack of ambition to pay big money, for the correct players as well as other factors such as we may have went after players who just were not willing to play for us or went for them too late.

Denial over what? I'm quite happy to slate Moyes. I've said countless times now if he went tomorrow, I wouldn't be upset at all. I just think that since there's a long list of reasons to criticize him, resorting to judgement on what might or might not have happened behind closed doors isn't necessary.

Giggsy11

Btw did anyone watch Morrison's performance against Fulham? Played only 15 mins I think, made a brilliant pass to Downing who squared the ball to Cole, good dribbling which ended up in a penalty shout and a shot on goal and his brilliant run from half way line to set up Cole. It was a brilliant assist.

Mitch Connor

Gutted over Morrison - should have been doing that for United for the last season and a bit. Gutted.

MANUTD99

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I have no real issues with Moyes' results vs Chelsea, Liverpool, City or Arsenal.

Sure I'd have liked more points from them, but the season (and squad) thats in it, they are not the games I'm annoyed over.

Losing to West Brom at home, dropping points in the last minutes vs Southapton and Cardiff - THEY are the games that have pissed me off. Those are the performances that have worried me the most.

Not really bothered about the Spurs result either.

Agree with most part although Chelsea were so bad that night, didn't play with a striker. We really should of pilled pressure and won that game. We sat back and settled for a draw.

The Cardiff game was so worrying. If Cardiff had of scored a winner they would of deserved it as we showed no desire to pick the game up by the scruff of the neck.

In fairness to Moyes on the Spurs game. He made attacking changes to try win the game. Probably would have liked to see Nani play instead of Welbeck but Moyes was obviously worried about Lennon on that side against Evra and I thought Evra played less than average.

bullvine

Morrison will end up at Chelsea wait till you see, sickening!

MANUTD99

Giggsy11 wrote: »

Btw did anyone watch Morrison's performance against Fulham? Played only 15 mins I think, made a brilliant pass to Downing who squared the ball to Cole, good dribbling which ended up in a penalty shout and a shot on goal and his brilliant run from half way line to set up Cole. It was a brilliant assist.

Jesus when was the last time a United player ripped a defence open like that. Not that I'd want Ravel back but just wish we had someone who could take defenders on with pace with an end result

Mitch Connor

MANUTD99 wrote: »

Jesus when was the last time a United player ripped a defence open like that. Not that I'd want Ravel back but just wish we had someone who could take defenders on with pace with an end result

Januzaj can do it, and has.

GavRedKing

bullvine wrote: »

Morrison will end up at Chelsea wait till you see, sickening!

I think we're ok for talented players that can play behind the striker, we nearly have a squad of them at the club at this stage and he wouldnt add anything different really.

MagicMarker

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Gutted over Morrison - should have been doing that for United for the last season and a bit. Gutted.

No he shouldn't.

tallaghtmick

Move over Pogba we got another one to cry over

bucketybuck

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Januzaj can do it, and has.

Nani can do it, and has.

But Valencia gets over double the gametime Nani does, so I dunno.

Mitch Connor

MagicMarker wrote: »

No he shouldn't.

I'm assuming you are missing the point of my annoyance, cause otherwise this makes no sense...

Had he had a good attitude, he'd have been putting on that type of display at 17, and be amongst the very best 19 year olds in football now, imo.

If he had a good attitude, he would be a star for United right now, and it annoys me that he isn't. Looks like he has learnt a few lessons now, eventually, just wish it was Man United benefiting from it.

Mitch Connor

tallaghtmick wrote: »

Move over Pogba we got another one to cry over

Haven't stopped crying over Morrison myself!

He was the one I felt had the most talent, and the one I felt could be an absolute star - and being a local lad the loss of him hurt more than losing Pogba.

Don't have an issue with United over WHY we lost Morrison, but it is gutting none the less that a kid of his talent, who came through our youth system, isn't a star for us now.

greendom

Mitch Connor wrote: »

Haven't stopped crying over Morrison myself!

He was the one I felt had the most talent, and the one I felt could be an absolute star - and being a local lad the loss of him hurt more than losing Pogba.

Don't have an issue with United over WHY we lost Morrison, but it is gutting none the less that a kid of his talent, who came through our youth system, isn't a star for us now.

Personally I think the loss of Pogba is the greater. Looking like he's going to be World Class.

Vic Vinegar

2 Dec 1907 First meeting of what is now the Professional Footballers’ Association @PFA was held in Manchester, opposing a £4 pw wage limit

:eek:

Rayne Wooney

If Moyes gets anything over 4th with the squad we have it'll be one of football's miracles.

Slowly accepting now that we'll probably be in a battle for 4th, the team needs major surgery and I just don't think Moyes can buy the players we need in January.

Your Airbag

From his own half

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CiT-4V3IZFQ

Jimmy Iovine

The husband of one of my work colleagues went to a viewing of the film last night. Apparently there was a live Q and A with people after. I think I heard Beckham being mentioned. Very jealous that I didn't find out this sooner.

statto25

Jimmy Iovine wrote: »

The husband of one of my work colleagues went to a viewing of the film last night. Apparently there was a live Q and A with people after. I think I heard Beckham being mentioned. Very jealous that I didn't find out this sooner.

All six of the lads featured in the film attended the Q&A. I really enjoyed the film but the Q&A was cringeworthy. Some of the questions were very poor like "what film star would play you in a feature film" Phil was asked who would play Gary and he said T-Bag from prison break! When asked why he said "cause he was gay" ! The other five lads went bright red. Scholes was asked a few questions but brushed them off and spent most of his time banging the mic the off his pants. They all looked really uncomfortable.

Paul Tergat

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

If Moyes gets anything over 4th with the squad we have it'll be one of football's miracles.

Maybe im taking you up wrong here but I think if he cant get at least 4th with the squad that cantered to the league last season then thats the miracle.

Jimmy Iovine

statto25 wrote: »

Phil was asked who would play Gary and he said T-Bag from prison break! When asked why he said "cause he was gay" ! The other five lads went bright red.

Haha brilliant.

Fr_Dougal

I wouldn't be too concerned about being 9 points off the top. Traditionally we've always played our best football after Xmas and after a very poor start I'm happy with where we are at the moment, all things considered.

I honestly can't see Arsenal being in top spot come even March, they typically bottle it around the same time we come into form. It's between Chelsea, ourselves and City; we'll be in the top two.

OctavarIan

bucketybuck wrote: »

Nani can do it, and has.

But Valencia gets over double the gametime Nani does, so I dunno.

Because Valencia puts in a good defensive shift, for both teams.

RGDATA!

homerjay2005 wrote: »

we need to improve dramatically for that to happen - currently we are on target to hit about 66-68 and that is not good enough.

that projection (of 66-68) is skewed by a sh*t september I'd say (i'm assuming you're taking the total points so far and multiplying by three, as we are now 1/3 way through the season?)

if you project just on current form as opposed to a "dramatic improvement" - you could argue we're on course for a total of mid 70s, which I think will be plenty for CL qualification although probably not enough to win it.

Mr.Crinklewood

Class of '92 talking on BBC Five Live now.

The_Kew_Tour

Little snigger at end. He liked it.

aperture_nuig

I don't get this "projected finish" stuff. Surely if we were on course for a top 4 finish we'd be in the top 4?

Rayne Wooney

aperture_nuig wrote: »

I don't get this "projected finish" stuff. Surely if we were on course for a top 4 finish we'd be in the top 4?

God you'd hate working in finance ha ha

Pro. F

That type of result just is not good enough imo. Spurs are in very poor form, struggling to score and conceding too many. And yet we end up having to settle for a hard fought draw. It's the same crap performances and indifferent results we've been getting all season. We'll be fighting for fourth at best the way this season is going. And this squad is so much better than that, despite what some people are trying to convince themselves just now.

Quick thoughts:

- Rooney is dragging this team along all season.

- I was pleasantly surprised with Jones' comfort on the ball. It wasn't particularly good for a CM, but he's getting better quickly and that surprises me.

- Moyes needs his head examining sticking Kagawa out on the wing for most of the game when RvP was out. There is not one valid reason to stick Kagawa out wide when RvP isn't playing.

- Moyes' whole strategy revolves around getting the ball into good crossing positions yet he picks RW, LW, RB, LB who can't cross. That is idiotic.

I'll give my thoughts on Cleverley in another post, because I want to have this one where I can just vent my feeling on the game.

The_Kew_Tour

Koke this

Koke that.

Anyone here about this chap been possible signing in January.

Cantona's Collars

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

Koke this

Koke that.

Anyone here about this chap been possible signing in January.

He's good at the Hoke Koke I'm reliably informed.

Cantona's Collars

OctavarIan wrote: »

Because Valencia puts in a good defensive shift, for both teams.

Last 2 games: 22 attempted crosses, 1 successful.

Winston Payne

Koke would be a sweet purchase. Add plenty of fizz to the midfield.

Rayne Wooney

He'd be mad to leave Atletico for us ahead of the World Cup, his form is all down to that team and I can't see him risking a move.

And has he even been played in CM? Whenever I've watched him he's been playing in the Rooney/Kagawa role and we definitely don't need another one of them.

He's only 21 though so could be perfect to mould into the attacking CM we need.

yabadabado

zerks wrote: »

Last 2 games: 22 attempted crosses, 1 successful.

**** ,are those stats correct?That is shocking .

Mitch Connor

Winston Payne wrote: »

Koke would be a sweet purchase. Add plenty of fizz to the midfield.

He puts his foot in, out, in, out....

bucketybuck

Heres what I don't get about the whole projection thing.

Some people are assuming that our form will improve and that we will get top four. Excuse me, but on what basis can people assume that our form will improve? We have been dire all season, why exactly is that all about to change?

If it was City we were talking about I could understand it, they have been poor away from home but they can point to thrashing both us and Spurs and rightly say, "We have the potential to go on a run". Chelsea have also been poor, but again they can point to a few performances that suggest that should they click they might be hard to stop.

What can United point to? Our best result was against Arsenal where they were rubbish and we had a mighty 2 shots on goal! Every single league game we have been turgid and bereft of ideas, every one, so whats about to change in that regard?

onemorechance

newballsplease

Does anyone know does a train go from piccadily station to old trafford?

onemorechance

Northern Rail.

Paul Tergat

newballsplease wrote: »

Does anyone know does a train go from piccadily station to old trafford?

yup

Bleating Lamb

Wasn't too impressed to read in Sunday Independent that Utd are going in for Herrera again during Christmas break....did signing one overrated midfielder in the summer not teach them anything