Manchester United Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread - 2013/14 Mod warning post #718

CSF

RayCon wrote: »

Oh FFS ... "for your sins" - - - - you've enjoyed the majority of league wins in the past 20yrs ... and now you're having a rough 15 game period ... boo bleedin hoo. :rolleyes:

Yeah I agree. That is a very cringey statement.

Idbatterim

If you think that any board that has Sir Bobby Charlton and Sir Alex Ferguson sitting on it, is going to sack a manager after 15 games, then you couldn't possibly be more wrong.

I didnt say sack him now... Also Ferguson isnt calling the shots or paying the wages, I wouldnt be paying too much heed to his opinion to be honest, unless he wanted to step back in... Was it Fergies influence that got Moyes the job? also would he have been pushing for moyes, if here werent a fellow scotsman?

Its like O'Leary recently with Ryanair, where he was forced to totally backtrack and actually focus on customer service, the shareholders in that case, have the ultimate power...

Pro. F

sea_monkey wrote: »

Can we get a separate thread for Pro.F and Your_Airbag please?

Vic Vinegar

Just skip posts if you don't wanna read them. It's not hard....

Kylo Ren

Bombleswizzum wrote: »

Just skip posts if you don't wanna read them. It's not hard....

If only I had some sort of diagram illustrating how to accomplish this...

sea_monkey

Pro. F wrote: »

cant find this on my laptop.

Haven't posted in a while but had some thoughts. While I'm bitterly disappointed with results in the league so far I have felt that at times we have lacked some luck; Especially against Everton. Rooney and Welbeck spurned great chances to put us ahead, not really Moyes fault.

That being said, Carrick being injured is a huge huge loss, we simply don't have the depth in midfield to compensate for such a loss and it's showing as our defence lacks coverage from midfield and quality of passing and decision making is suffering with lack of keys passes and service to the strikers being pretty awful.

One thing Moyes did when he came in was publicly state that midfield was an area that need strengthening, something Ferguson didn't really do. I think this has drained whatever confidence our average midfielders had and contributed further to our poor league form. In addition to this, he didn't actually get his preferred players. While some might have you believe they know that reasons for why he didn't sign Fabregas, Thiago or Strootman etc.. the truth is they have absolutely no idea, just guesswork. So to summarise we've been left with the same lack of creativity in midfield with the added problem of low confidence.

The next problem is who do we sign now? The world isn't exactly spilling over with available established world class midfield playmakers. It wasn't in the summer, never mind in the upcoming January window. So for those calling for Moyes head already, getting in a different manager will not change the available midfield playmakers. I fully expect the people that are calling for Moyes head to come out and lambast him from not sorting out the midfield situation after January when if we don't sign someone that can walk straight into the first 11 and be our playmaker; they will be wrong to do it.

Unless we suffer an absolutely shocking league finish, I would expect Moyes to get two years at the helm before the board consider looking for another manager. Chopping and changing a manager after 6 months is not something I want to see us ever do, it's just not long enough to judge a manager. What I like about Moyes is he is actively trying to fix our midfield, something Ferguson wasn't doing and looked like he had no interest in doing. Give Moyes time to find the right players for his team I say. Quit calling for his head too, it's been six months, it's embarrassing.

zarquon

sea_monkey wrote: »

Can we get a separate thread for Pro.F and Your_Airbag please?

Just add both of them to your ignore list

Backstreet Moyes

Their may be no world class midfielders around in January but their is dozens who will massively improve our midfield.

KH25

Nuts102 wrote: »

Their may be no world class midfielders around in January but their is dozens who will massively improve our midfield.

W need somebody who would immediately improve the first 11. Gundogan, for me, would be that type of player. After him, players like Draxler and Koke etc (though I admit I haven't seen much of them) would be good additions.

titan18

United U-19s about to kickoff against Shaktar in the UEFA Youth League. Can't be as bad as watching the first team play at least.

Interested to look at the Shaktar LB Sobol, has played a bit for the senior team and meant to be highly rated

Your Airbag

KH25 wrote: »

W need somebody who would immediately improve the first 11. Gundogan, for me, would be that type of player. After him, players like Draxler and Koke etc (though I admit I haven't seen much of them) would be good additions.

Doesn't he operate higher up the field in the Rooney/Kagawa zone? Can't see us going for him if that is the case.

uncleoswald

Rayne Wooney wrote: »

The question isn't whether Fabregas wanted to leave or not, the question is are Barca so cash strapped that they would sell a player who will probably be a sub more often than not in the next season or two to fund a move for the CB they so badly need.

I believe yes they would have, but that 25m offer for him was fcuking embarrassing.

Fabregas has made more League appearances (most of them starts) for Barca over the last two seasons than any other outfield player, he already is integral to their squad. After Thiago Alcantara left Barca were never going to let him go.

Lucas Hood

Gundogan hasnt played a game since August with a back injury. I think it'd be better to leave him till the summer.

Backstreet Moyes

KH25 wrote: »

W need somebody who would immediately improve the first 11. Gundogan, for me, would be that type of player. After him, players like Draxler and Koke etc (though I admit I haven't seen much of them) would be good additions.

Yes and their are dozens of midfielders who would improve our first 11. Cleverley, Jones, Giggs and Anderson are lower league standard midfielders. We could easily spend 30 million in January and get two good midfielders until the summer. I would be happy with something like Dembele and Cabaye in January and a world class midfielder in the summer. While not top signings they would be a massive improvement on the team.

Lawrenson was on The Last Word there again. He fairly rolled back on his comments re Van Persie transfer request. Reckons he got the story from a press guy at utd.

He said he actually rang Moyes to tell him he was responsible for the uproar on Friday.

How the guy has a job as a pundit is beyond me.

Cantona's Collars

Sky Italia reporting that Atletico have contacted Nani through his agent about a move,could be part of a deal to bring Koke to United??

Lithium93_

Never believe anything Man United related that comes from Mark Lawrenson

Lithium93_

Lithium93_ wrote: »

Never believe anything Man United related that comes from Mark Lawrenson

More like it

Pro. F

Nuts102 wrote: »

Yes and their are dozens of midfielders who would improve our first 11. Cleverley, Jones, Giggs and Anderson are lower league standard midfielders. We could easily spend 30 million in January and get two good midfielders until the summer. I would be happy with something like Dembele and Cabaye in January and a world class midfielder in the summer. While not top signings they would be a massive improvement on the team.

Dembele would cost over 30m alone. How do you think he performed in the game against United the other week?

Mitch Connor

Nuts102 wrote: »

Yes and their are dozens of midfielders who would improve our first 11. Cleverley, Jones, Giggs and Anderson are lower league standard midfielders. We could easily spend 30 million in January and get two good midfielders until the summer. I would be happy with something like Dembele and Cabaye in January and a world class midfielder in the summer. While not top signings they would be a massive improvement on the team.

What would your midfield options post summer be then if, for example, we got those two then Fabregas? How many CM options do you think we need?

Cleverley, Anderson, Giggs all moved on/retired?

bmcc10

Players being suggested aren't going to come to united and some simply aren't good enough.

Timmyctc

Nuts102 wrote: »

Yes and their are dozens of midfielders who would improve our first 11. Cleverley, Jones, Giggs and Anderson are lower league standard midfielders. We could easily spend 30 million in January and get two good midfielders until the summer. I would be happy with something like Dembele and Cabaye in January and a world class midfielder in the summer. While not top signings they would be a massive improvement on the team.

Just on this. I know its your opinion. But it is wrong. So So wrong.

The_Kew_Tour

I want Cleverly and Welbeck to stay. But I give them 18 months now. Cant cut the mustard then and its bye bye.

Anderson. I always thought he would pull through and become a very good player but injuries and like have hampered him. His time is up, sadly.

Valencia would want to wake up or bye bye in summer.

Giggs. can go another season just no thanks to seeing him play in 2 man midfield in Europe or big games.

Lithium93_

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

I want Cleverly and Welbeck to stay. But I give them 18 months now. Cant cut the mustard then and its bye bye.

Anderson. I always thought he would pull through and become a very good player but injuries and like have hampered him. His time is up, sadly.

Valencia would want to wake up or bye bye in summer.

Giggs. can go another season just no thanks to seeing him play in 2 man midfield in Europe or big games.

You left out Ashley Young, he DEFINITELY has to go

The_Kew_Tour

Lithium93_ wrote: »

You left out Ashley Young, he DEFINITELY has to go

Agree.

Burt Macklin

It's a mystery to me how Anderson has managed to stay at the club as long as he has, how many games has he started in the last three years?
I know he had lots of raw ability, and has struggled with injuries, but he's been given plenty of chances to establish a regular spot in the team.

That four and a half year deal he signed in 2010 doesn't seem wise in hindsight.

Burt Macklin

Lithium93_ wrote: »

You left out Ashley Young, he DEFINITELY has to go

We should never have signed him in the first place. At the time we had Nani and Valencia on form, and were well covered on the wing positions, but were crying out for a central midfielder.

Mitch Connor

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

I want Cleverly and Welbeck to stay. But I give them 18 months now. Cant cut the mustard then and its bye bye.

Anderson. I always thought he would pull through and become a very good player but injuries and like have hampered him. His time is up, sadly.

Valencia would want to wake up or bye bye in summer.

Giggs. can go another season just no thanks to seeing him play in 2 man midfield in Europe or big games.

Would agree with you here.

My opinion on the squad.

De Gea - no brainer to stay.
Rafael - no brainer to stay.
Smalling - no brainer to stay.
Evans - no brainer to stay.
Vidic - - no brainer to stay.
Jones - no brainer to stay.
Carrick - no brainer to stay.
Januzaj - no brainer to stay.
RVP - no brainer to stay.
Rooney - no brainer to stay.
Zaha - possibly out on loan, no sale.
Powell - possibly out on loan, no sale.

Kagawa - Would like to stay.
Hernandez - Would like to stay - can see him leaving.
Cleverley - Would like to stay.
Welbeck - Would like to stay.
Giggs - Can see him staying on.

Ferdinand - I can see him leaving.
Nani - could well be off, not justifying new contract.

Young - should be sold.
Valencia - should be sold.
Anderson - should be sold.

Evra - likely to leave.
Fabio - likely to leave.
Lindegaard - Likely to leave.

Your Airbag

Dembele is not good enough imo.

Gundogan? Madrid bound if reports are to be believed. Vidal has extended his Juve contract until 2017 so both of those are in the very unlikely category.

I can see January being a big let down for people expecting world class singings.

Sneijder has got the skill but age is not on his side, if we could get him for a decent price I would be happy. Then you have Pjanic from Roma, Herrera and Cabaye, they are the most likely. Herrera is a risk, I'd prefer Pjanic and Cabaye would not be too shabby without exactly getting us over excited.

Just above the very unlikely category you would have Modric and Pogba. Modric would be in the world class bracket and I'm not sure Pogba would want to return so both difficult.

Then the signings out of left field would be Everton Ribeiro and Koke, both risks in terms of qaulity.

There are options but they range between no chance and the unproven.

Mitch Connor

Your Airbag wrote: »

Dembele is not good enough imo.

Gundogan? Madrid bound if reports are to be believed. Vidal has extended his Juve contract until 2017 so both of those are in the very unlikely category.

I can see January being a big let down for people expecting world class singings.

Sneijder has got the skill but age is not on his side, if we could get him for a decent price I would be happy. Then you have Pjanic from Roma, Herrera and Cabaye, they are the most likely. Herrera is a risk, I'd prefer Pjanic and Cabaye would not be too shabby without exactly getting us over excited.

Just above the very unlikely category you would have Modric and Pogba. Modric would be in the world class bracket and I'm not sure Pogba would want to return so both difficult.

Then the signings out of left field would be Everton Ribeiro and Koke, both risks in terms of qaulity.

There are options but they range between no chance and the unproven.

I'm not expecting world class in January but if we don't do SOMETHING we are fooked.

Something like Baines/Shaw, Cabaye, Fernando.

The fact Fernando will be available on a free (so likely cheap in January) makes him a freaking no brainer imo.

Pen.Island

To those saying Moyes didn't deserve the job because he's won nothing, and then saying Martinez should have got it because Everton are much better than they were under Moyes.

1. The majority of people would have chosen Moyes over Martinez, proven to have Everton punching above their weight for years.

2. Moyes didn't win a trophy, but a cup run involves luck. Would anyone like Harry Redknapp or Alex McCleish as manager? Would it be right to give the job to a man that hovered around relegation every season and had his team relegated last season?

3. Everton practically have a new midfield. McCarthy, Barry (who is a fine player) and Barkley who is a year further into his development and looks a star and Lukaku who makes a massive difference. Look at West Brom.

ScummyMan

Looks like a good documentary on ITV4 @ 10 tomorrow night, "The Best of Enemies"..Keane and Viera talking about their rivalry.

I miss those days, there was nothing like the battles United and Arsenal used to have.

Your Airbag

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I'm not expecting world class in January but if we don't do SOMETHING we are fooked.

Something like Baines/Shaw, Cabaye, Fernando.

The fact Fernando will be available on a free (so likely cheap in January) makes him a freaking no brainer imo.

We will surely be in for Baines, I should have had Ross Barkley on that list too, he is possible and a real talent.

Pen.Island wrote: »

3. Everton practically have a new midfield. McCarthy, Barry (who is a fine player) and Barkley who is a year further into his development and looks a star and Lukaku who makes a massive difference. Look at West Brom.

Its a much different and slightly better Everton than Moyes had. Martinez deserves credit for the upgrade on Moyes good work. Agreed on Barkley, he looks like one of the best young players coming through right now.

bucketybuck

Everton practically have a new midfield. McCarthy, Barry (who is a fine player) and Barkley who is a year further into his development

Yep, you have to admire a manager who goes to a new club and immediately makes a few signings to improve an area of the team that needed some work...:pac:

wonderfullife

Man.UnitedLad wrote: »

Looks like a good documentary on ITV4 @ 10 tomorrow night, "The Best of Enemies"..Keane and Viera talking about their rivalry.

I miss those days, there was nothing like the battles United and Arsenal used to have.

Looks quality.

Not sure if it's been posted but both players had to name their Best-Of sides they played with in their era.

Keane named his 11 as:

Schmeichel
Parker
Pallister
Stam
Irwin
Beckham
Ince
Keane
Ronaldo
Cantona
Van Nistleroy


Left out Giggsy, Scholes and Neville.

In the case of Scholes he said it was solely down to the fact the producers said he had to include himself thus no space for Scholes.

Interestingly in the case of Giggs he had a pop saying "having a great career does not make you a great player".

Lots of controversy ahead.

Deise_2012

David Moyes needs time and he is going to get time off the board so the talk about sacking him is just nonsense. What good would it do? Who's there to replace him? Marouane Fellaini I think is struggling at the moment but he's another guy who needs time, I'd like to wait until after he has his operation and rests for a few weeks then throw him back into the side. He's the kind of guy we need when he's on form, we haven't had a tough tackling midfielder since Darren Fletcher.
People have to realise Moyes isn't going to buy top quality replacements in January either, there's no way in the world Everton are going to sell Baines/Barkley. Dortmund would laugh if Utd made a bid for Reus/Gundogen. The only realistic target I could see us signing is Yohan Cabaye. Luke Shaw is another option at left back but Southampton are not going to sell in the middle of the season. I think there's way too many impatient United fans around the place, Ferguson was smart leaving at the end of last season, he knew it would take another 2/3 years to build a top quality side. People have to realise this, this season reminds me of the 2004/2005/2006 seasons, our players just weren't good enough to challenge for the title. We had to wait for Ronaldo/Rooney/Vidic/Carrick to get settled at the club and it paid dividends in the 2006/2007 season.

Pen.Island

Worth noting Everton had their best ever scoring start to a league last season, 15 goals in 8 games. Only had 12 this season at same stage.

titan18

Mitch Connor wrote: »

I'm not expecting world class in January but if we don't do SOMETHING we are fooked.

Something like Baines/Shaw, Cabaye, Fernando.

The fact Fernando will be available on a free (so likely cheap in January) makes him a freaking no brainer imo.

Don't know enough about Fernando, but wouldn't want Baines or Cabaye. Prefer someone like Rabiot from PSG, Coentrao in on a loan deal (can't see Shaw moving in January) and Guarin or Nainggolan.

Iused2likebusts

Your Airbag wrote: »

We will surely be in for Baines, I should have had Ross Barkley on that list too, he is possible and a real talent.




Its a much different and slightly better Everton than Moyes had. Martinez deserves credit for the upgrade on Moyes good work. Agreed on Barkley, he looks like one of the best young players coming through right now.

Cant see utd signing barkley in jan. Fair chance of getting baines as you would be paying over the odds for him. Everton have an outside chance of top 4 and barkleys value is only going to go up, particularly if he does anything for england at the world cup. The move would also make no sense for barkley at this stage in his career its his first 1/2 a season as a regular first team player.

CSF

Sacramento wrote: »

Haven't posted in a while but had some thoughts. While I'm bitterly disappointed with results in the league so far I have felt that at times we have lacked some luck; Especially against Everton. Rooney and Welbeck spurned great chances to put us ahead, not really Moyes fault.

Posts like this I really can't get behind. Moyes is 100% responsible for the performances of the players. That is his responsibility. We'll give him the credit when United's players do good things that win games, and the same has to apply for things that go wrong.

Timmyctc

CSF wrote: »

Posts like this I really can't get behind. Moyes is 100% responsible for the performances of the players. That is his responsibility. We'll give him the credit when United's players do good things that win games, and the same has to apply for things that go wrong.

Posts like this I cant get behind. Whats he meant to do ffs? Go out and actually play the game for them? He can't make a player be good. (That being said I think Moyes has been faarrrrrrr below par so far)

bmcc10

Isn't Moyes brother Barkleys agent or something like that?

The_Kew_Tour

U19s 0-1 down after 77 minutes

Mitch Connor

titan18 wrote: »

Don't know enough about Fernando, but wouldn't want Baines or Cabaye. Prefer someone like Rabiot from PSG, Coentrao in on a loan deal (can't see Shaw moving in January) and Guarin or Nainggolan.

the point, more so, is there are a number of players who are very likely attainable in January - and we need to go get the best ones we can't. Whether it is the fault of the players or Moyes doesn't really matter, it is working for United right now and something has to change. It won't be Moyes, so it needs to be the players.

If we don't sign a few players in January, we won't finish in the top 4.

Timmyctc

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

U19s 0-1 down after 77 minutes

Ugh. Can't we win ANYTHING? :pac:

scudzilla

wonderfullife wrote: »

Looks quality.

Not sure if it's been posted but both players had to name their Best-Of sides they played with in their era.

Keane named his 11 as:

Schmeichel
Parker
Pallister
Stam
Irwin
Beckham
Ince
Keane
Ronaldo
Cantona
Van Nistleroy


Left out Giggsy, Scholes and Neville.

In the case of Scholes he said it was solely down to the fact the producers said he had to include himself thus no space for Scholes.

Interestingly in the case of Giggs he had a pop saying "having a great career does not make you a great player".

Lots of controversy ahead.

And i'd still take Scholes over Ince any day of the week and twice on Sunday

scudzilla

The_Kew_Tour wrote: »

U19s 0-1 down after 77 minutes

errrrrrr....................Moyes out????

Vic Vinegar

Everton Ribeiro has told ESPN Brasil that he would fit into Manchester United's midfield and would welcome the chance to play for the Premier League champions.

Full Story

Headshot

I could fit in to utds midfield