Car Clamped outside my House

aonchraic

I arrived home to my apartment block yesterday to find my car had been clamped. My initial belief was that there had been a mistake as my car was on a so called "safe list" which prevented it from being clamped.

However on further enquiries it was brought to my attention that the policy regards parking had changed 2 months ago and that there is now no "safe list" and that every car must have a permit.

I didn't receive any letter or new permits however the management company are telling that it was delivered to my house 2 months ago. They are refusing to pay for the clamp to be removed so now I need to go down an appeals approach.

Has anybody any advice on the issue. I have been a tenant there for 3 years and never had any issue. My landlord didn't inform of the change of policy however I believe it was up to the management agency to make everyone aware of the new system. No new notices were put up in the area to notify people of the new change. Is it enough for the management agency to say they sent me the letter or have I grounds that I wasn't notified in a correct manner???????? Any advice would be greatly appreciated.

Cheers.

No Pants

Are you up to date with your management fees? May be more of a question for your landlord.

As you're a tenant, do the management company normally interact with you directly or do they communicate with the landlord at his address?

aonchraic

The management company normally deal with the landlord. The landlord has always been up to date with payments.

Who do you think is accountable for notifying me? Landlord or management agency? I would think the management agency since they are the one's trying to inforce the clamping??

No Pants

I would say landlord. You have no relationship with the management company.

Paulw

The management company would have written to your landlord and sent parking permits to your landlord. He/She should have forwarded them on to you.

Contact your landlord and get him/her to pay for the clamp to be removed.

Michael D Not Higgins

By "your house", did the management agency mean there was a notice around the block of flats or that they wrote to the owners, i.e. your landlord. I'd be on the phone to the landlord about this.

djimi

This is an issue for the landlord to sort; they are the ones who deal with the management company and they would have been issued with the new permit.

aonchraic

The management agency said they sent the letter to me the tenant and not the landlord.

However I did not receive them.

Landlord said at the A.G.M that they were informed that permits were sent out accompanied by a letter to the tenants outlining the new policy. She felt as if she did not need to notify me because of this.

If I am to appeal is it enough for the agency to say they sent a letter even though I didn't get one. In the eyes of the law would they be in right or the wrong?

Michael D Not Higgins

If the policy changed 2 months ago you would have expected that it has been a two month grace period while they change over to the new system. As such, you'd expect that they could check their records of safe list cars and permit cars and leave a reminder note on the ones not on the permit list. That might have been too much sense though.

No Pants

aonchraic wrote: »

Landlord said at the A.G.M that they were informed that permits were sent out accompanied by a letter to the tenants outlining the new policy. She felt as if she did not need to notify me because of this.

How did the management company know who the tenants were?

Michael D Not Higgins

No Pants wrote: »

How did the management company know who the tenants were?

They wouldn't need to, they could deliver a leaflet to each letterbox in the block. Regardless, this is an issue between the landlord and management agency. The tenant has no contract with the management agency.

No Pants

Michael D Not Higgins wrote: »

They wouldn't need to, they could deliver a leaflet to each letterbox in the block. Regardless, this is an issue between the landlord and management agency. The tenant has no contract with the management agency.

Agreed. This is for the landlord to sort out.

aonchraic

Correct the permits were apparently distributed to the houses by hand by the management agency (according to them under my door!)

Fair enough in saying it's my Landlords problem, but it's not her car that is clamped. My landlord is unwilling to pay for de- clamp and management agency won't budge either so not sure where that leaves me.

I can appeal through the clamping agency but I get the impression the management agency won't change their mind.

So what would my next port of call be? Small claims Court??? If so would I win!??

peteb2

Why woudl there be a "safe list"? Surely it'll come down to whether your landlord had said there was a dedicated parking spot. they may not have purchased one at the time.

No Pants

Your landlord has not provided you with a necessary permit. Ask her (1) when she's going to arrange the release of your car, (2) when your new parking permit is going to be supplied and (3) keep track of any additional expenses you incur (taxis, etc) while your car is immobilised and keep her apprised of the running tally. PRTB would be your next port of call I think, assuming your tenancy comes with a parking space.

Appealing to the clamping agency is a waste of time.

RangeR

Can you ask some other tenants if they received this letter, 2 months ago?

aonchraic

Any body who was up to date with maintenance which my landlord always was, was given the grace of having two cars registered.

They changed this for some reason 2 months ago and the new ruling is that every car must now have a permit.

I got no letter and no permit but even if that had been given to me, would I be correct in saying due to the significant change in policy there should have been a number of ways where people were informed.

Michael D said there should have been 2 months grace.

It wouldn't have mattered how much grace was given because the only way I was ever going to find out was if my car was clamped. Me and my girlfriends car have been parked there for the last 2 months without a permit

Paulw

The simple situation is that you don't have valid permits and your vehicle was clamped.

This is now a matter between your landlord and the management agent. Between them, they must ensure that you get your valid permits, and that your car is unclamped.

Chase your landlord. You never received the permits. Make your landlord chase the management agent over this whole issue.

Muahahaha

Paulw wrote: »

The simple situation is that you don't have valid permits and your vehicle was clamped.

This is now a matter between your landlord and the management agent. Between them, they must ensure that you get your valid permits, and that your car is unclamped.

Chase your landlord. You never received the permits. Make your landlord chase the management agent over this whole issue.

Good advice and correct to say that the issue is not with the clamping co but instead with your landlord who then in turn has an issue with the mgmt co, especially as the permit never showed up in your letterbox.

Whatever you do don't spend any money appealing it to the clampers-the system is called 'independent' but is far from being so- you are highly unlikely to get any success from any appeal.

One other option open to you is the small claims court, you could spend the 25 euro to take a case against the management company for negligence in not sending the permit. Doing this is a speculative punt but it might work because it will cost them somewhere in the region of €150-€200 to send a solicitor down to the court to defend the case whereas just paying you back the €80 you spent on clamp removal is probably the safer and least risky option for them. I did this before with my own mgmt co. when I was in the exact same situation as yourself and the mgmt co decided it wasn't worth their while fighting it in court and instead paid up. Be aware though that you cannot claim your legal costs ie the €25 fee, however you can add an amount for distress caused to you by the clamping. You should put that amount at €50, if the judge allows all of it plus the €80 then you are quids in but even if he allows half of it then at least you've got your initial €25 outlay back. Once you have submitted your claim the defendant has 15 days to respond so it is a pretty quick process and if they don't respond then you have won your case and can then move to enforce the judgement.

djimi

aonchraic wrote: »

Fair enough in saying it's my Landlords problem, but it's not her car that is clamped. My landlord is unwilling to pay for de- clamp and management agency won't budge either so not sure where that leaves me.

Your rent includes the parking space, which you currently do not have access to. Your issue is with your landlord alone. You need to put serious pressure on them to get onto the management company to get this sorted for you.

And if the management company want to persist with this line of "well we delivered the permit so tough" then its up to them to prove that you actually received the letter; its not good enough for them to say that they shoved it under the door and assumed it made it into the hands of the relevant person.

I dont see why this is causing such a big song and dance for the landlord or the management company. Assuming you actually are entitled to use the space (ie the landlord is paid up to date with their management fees and youre paid up to date with your rent) then all it should take is a single phone call from the management company to the clampers to say that the car was clamped in error and to kindly remove it.

djimi

Muahahaha wrote: »

One other option open to you is the small claims court, you could spend the 25 euro to take a case against the management company for negligence in not sending the permit. Doing this is a speculative punt but it might work because it will cost them somewhere in the region of €150-€200 to send a solicitor down to the court to defend the case whereas just paying you back the €80 you spent on clamp removal is probably the safer and least risky option for them. I did this before with my own mgmt co. when I was in the exact same situation as yourself and the mgmt co decided it wasn't worth their while fighting it in court and instead paid up. Be aware though that you cannot claim your legal costs ie the €25 fee, however you can add an amount for distress caused to you by the clamping.

In this case would the OP not need to take a case against the landlord through the PRTB rather than the mananagement company? The management company has no direct responsibility towards the OP; they deal with leaseholders only, and as such their dealings are with the landlord.

Michael D Not Higgins

aonchraic wrote: »

Michael D said there should have been 2 months grace.

It wouldn't have mattered how much grace was given because the only way I was ever going to find out was if my car was clamped. Me and my girlfriends car have been parked there for the last 2 months without a permit

It sounds like there was 2 months grace during the switch as it's only being enforced now. That's not to say there should be 2 months grace.

A fair system as I outlined would remind people during the grace period.

As others have pointed out this can be solved with a couple of phonecalls. You need to put pressure on the landlord to sort it out.

This is assuming the parking space is party of the rental agreement (which could be argued anyway due to your use of the space up to now)

aonchraic

Crisis averted!!

The management agency have been in contact to say the the clamp will be removed as a gesture of goodwill due to the fact my Landlord has always been up to date with her maintenance payments.

Thanks for all the advice, hugely appreciated:D