puppy price

Mandzhalas

hi
i am in market for new puppy.and maybe this is not right forum,but here is my question:
if puppy cost 800,how much is price negiotable?can i get it for 600?
if i am buying a car,i would negiotate like mad and normally get it 15-25% less than asking price
Is it same story with puppies?I dont want insult owner

andreac

Mandzhalas wrote: »

hi
i am in market for new puppy.and maybe this is not right forum,but here is my question:
if puppy cost 800,how much is price negiotable?can i get it for 600?
if i am buying a car,i would negiotate like mad and normally get it 15-25% less than asking price
Is it same story with puppies?I dont want insult owner

No you don't negotiate with live animals.
If someone came to buy a pup off me and tried to negotiate I prob wouldn't sell them a pup.

Knine

Mandzhalas wrote: »

hi
i am in market for new puppy.and maybe this is not right forum,but here is my question:
if puppy cost 800,how much is price negiotable?can i get it for 600?
if i am buying a car,i would negiotate like mad and normally get it 15-25% less than asking price
Is it same story with puppies?I dont want insult owner

A dog is not like buying a car. I don't actually care about a car after it is sold.

When buying a pup from a reputable breeder, you are paying for their expertise in rearing a quality dog, paying towards the stud fee, registration, microchipping, feeding, health testing, vaccinations etc but most of all you will be getting after sales care for the duration of the dogs life.

If someone tried to negotiate the price of a puppy by €200 I would be taking them off my puppy waiting list. I would also be worried that they might want to negotiate on other aspects of the dogs care or treat the dog as expendable.

Hooked

Hmmm... I'm always one to bargain or haggle. And haggle hard. But when we bought our first dog, I paid what was asked.

I'm not sure if you've seen a pup advertised or been in touch with a breeder, but for 800 euro I'd be expecting:

1. A VERY Reputable breeder.
2. IKC Papers (perhaps with lineage and any show champions noted on both sides).
3. Hip scores, tests, etc...
4. Vaccination / worming record.
5. To be dealing with a breeder who will take the pup back in certain eventualities.
6. Some food, a diet outline and info on the pups first few months.

If this is a 'buy and sell' or 'done deal' backyard breeder.... Run! And keep running.

An ounce of breeding is worth a tonne of feeding.

We're waiting almost a year for puppy number 2, and may have to keep waiting - and are firm believers in that you get what you pay for!

ZiabR

andreac wrote: »

No you don't negotiate with live animals.
If someone came to buy a pup off me and tried to negotiate I prob wouldn't sell them a pup.

Would agree here, you can't negotiate with a living animal.

mud_guard

Mandzhalas wrote: »

hi
i am in market for new puppy.and maybe this is not right forum,but here is my question:
if puppy cost 800,how much is price negiotable?can i get it for 600?
if i am buying a car,i would negiotate like mad and normally get it 15-25% less than asking price
Is it same story with puppies?I dont want insult owner

depends on the breed mostly

some breeds are not only very expensive , their relative rarity in this country drives up the price

hence a Labrador for example should not be particulary expensive

expensive breeds include

pug
bulldog
st Bernard


champion dogs of any breed will be expensive of course

Mandzhalas

mud_guard wrote: »

depends on the breed mostly

some breeds are not only very expensive , their relative rarity in this country drives up the price

hence a Labrador for example should not be particulary expensive

expensive breeds include

pug
bulldog
st Bernard


champion dogs of any breed will be expensive of course

i am looking for french bulldog.so 800 is cheap.champions sells for 1500

what would be the best way to find breeder?

andreac

Contact the ikc for breeders or contacts for the breed club. You won't get a good frenchie for less than 1200-1500 euros.

BalingMad

Just bought a pup last week. Course i bartered. You cant go around throwing money at people. They call is an asking price for a reason, anything they get close to it, they will be delighted

andreac

BalingMad wrote: »

Just bought a pup last week. Course i bartered. You cant go around throwing money at people. They call is an asking price for a reason, anything they get close to it, they will be delighted

Em not true at all. My pups were the price they were not what someone wanted to haggle for.
No one even tried to barter with my pups.
I wasn't glad to get whatever. My pups were a price end of. If you didn't like it then I had plenty more willing to pay that price so don't know why you are saying that.
Reputable breeders have a list and don't haggle or barter with their puppies.

mud_guard

Mandzhalas wrote: »

i am looking for french bulldog.so 800 is cheap.champions sells for 1500

what would be the best way to find breeder?

its unlikely anyone bar a breeder will be selling a French bulldog , their not that common in this country relatively speaking

check out donedeal and select bulldog , scroll down through the English bulldogs until you spot a frenchie

Rips

Mandzhalas wrote: »

i am looking for french bulldog.so 800 is cheap.champions sells for 1500

what would be the best way to find breeder?

Please consider what you are paying for.

I'm sure for example, you can go out and buy a pug for 200, a fraction of what one from a reputable breeder costs - but you are buying a puppy that will struggle to breathe for its entire life, and have constant torment from other inherent issues. Not to mention supporting a breeder who is doing nothing to avoid producing these animals.

If buying a puppy is the right choice for you - after ensuring that everything on the checklists mentioned above is taken care of; the health and background of the dog should be paramount - there can be no exceptions to this.

This is what has been suggested already on this thread, and why there really is not a lot of room for haggling - you get what you pay for... and if you are not prepared to pay, then you are buying a very unfortunate creature. If you want to compare it to a car, a very bad investment.

A cheap, but illbred pedigree will cost you so much more in the life of the dog.

meoklmrk91

Rips wrote: »

Please consider what you are paying for.

I'm sure for example, you can go out and buy a pug for 200, a fraction of what one from a reputable breeder costs - but you are buying a puppy that will struggle to breathe for its entire life, and have constant torment from other inherent issues. Not to mention supporting a breeder who is doing nothing to avoid producing these animals.

If buying a puppy is the right choice for you - after ensuring that everything on the checklists mentioned above is taken care of; the health and background of the dog should be paramount - there can be no exceptions to this.

This is what has been suggested already on this thread, and why there really is not a lot of room for haggling - you get what you pay for... and if you are not prepared to pay, then you are buying a very unfortunate creature. If you want to compare it to a car, a very bad investment.

A cheap, but illbred pedigree will cost you so much more in the life of the dog.

I completely agree with you on most points but one, if I was buying a pug I would be very careful about where I got it, serious health problems, but to say that you are going to get a healthy one from a championship breeder, pugs have gone largely the way of the GSD and their frogs legs, champion pugs who have won best of breed at crufts have had to have operations because their faces are so flat they cannot breath properly so this is not just a backyard breeder/puppy farm issue, something seriously needs to be done. If I was getting a GSD I would most likely be going for a working line breeder, the reason, many show breeders are now breeding for the "sloping back", many of these dogs have severe hip dysplasia due to this.

For the most part dealing with club breeders who seriously take the time to health test their dog is the way to go. But in some cases, with certain breeds, it may not be for the best.

wolfpawnat

I always researched the Asking Price for other dogs of similar standard and breed when I was selling mine. The cheapest part of puppy breeding is.....well none of it really, health checks on the bitch and dog before and throughout pregnancy in the case of the bítch. Vaccines, worming, feeding, registering, microchipping, vet checks before selling, hip scores for larger dogs. Contrary to popular belief, it is not a profitable industry for most.

If you want a good dog with a good healthy background, you are going to have to pay out. My partner and I are looking into getting an Irish Wolfhound in 2-3 years, and we are already talking to breeders.

Rips

meoklmrk91 wrote: »

I completely agree with you on most points but one, if I was buying a pug I would be very careful about where I got it, serious health problems, but to say that you are going to get a healthy one from a championship breeder, pugs have gone largely the way of the GSD and their frogs legs, champion pugs who have won best of breed at crufts have had to have operations because their faces are so flat they cannot breath properly so this is not just a backyard breeder/puppy farm issue, something seriously needs to be done. If I was getting a GSD I would most likely be going for a working line breeder, the reason, many show breeders are now breeding for the "sloping back", many of these dogs have severe hip dysplasia due to this.

For the most part dealing with club breeders who seriously take the time to health test their dog is the way to go. But in some cases, with certain breeds, it may not be for the best.

Yes, absolutely. Some breeds suffer this worse then others, the toys mostly.

I have seen two robust little pugs that were sourced from a responsible breeder that seem to avoided the severe manifestations of inherent traits. A breeder in the south somewhere. Probably one in a million!

Likewise, a know someone who went very far out of her way (like, out of the country!) to source a cavalier without any inherent problems, and my god, you wouldn't recognise it as being the same breed if you put it next to your average cavalier. The difference is astonishing. No boggle eyes, no huffing, beautiful flat coat with curls in just the right places, proportionate body.

I have a German Sheperd who was a stray, and he has some undesirable aspects from a breeders perspective, shorter nose, straight back, slightly shorter in the body and normal hip stance, but he is a much stronger, healthier dog than my friends pedigree from showing lines. Not as daft either!

sturdyhairy

mud_guard wrote: »

depends on the breed mostly

some breeds are not only very expensive , their relative rarity in this country drives up the price

hence a Labrador for example should not be particulary expensive

expensive breeds include

pug
bulldog
st Bernard


champion dogs of any breed will be expensive of course

I definitely agree with you!

juniord

if you want to see haggling for live animals just go to any horse fair or cattle mart , supply and demand determines the price of everything

Bizzum

andreac wrote: »

Em not true at all. My pups were the price they were not what someone wanted to haggle for.
No one even tried to barter with my pups.
I wasn't glad to get whatever. My pups were a price end of. If you didn't like it then I had plenty more willing to pay that price so don't know why you are saying that.
Reputable breeders have a list and don't haggle or barter with their puppies.

There is always room for negotiation. All pups in a litter may not be worth the same. Payment up front, or cash payment may well effect the price.

In relation to the bolded bit above, if you had plenty of costomers at a given price maybe you undervalued your stock and offered them for sale cheap.

The market dictates the price, be that for a xbred or a high end show dog.

Make sure and ask for a luck penny back too OP!

andreac

Bizzum wrote: »

There is always room for negotiation. All pups in a litter may not be worth the same. Payment up front, or cash payment may well effect the price.

In relation to the bolded bit above, if you had plenty of costomers at a given price maybe you undervalued your stock and offered them for sale cheap.

The market dictates the price, be that for a xbred or a high end show dog.

Make sure and ask for a luck penny back too OP!

Its nothing to do with undervaluing my stock. I had a waiting list for pups as the litter was a good quality litter with the sire being the top winning dog in the country.
So if there had been someone on the list who wasnt willing to pay the price, i had plenty of other people on the list willing to pay it.

I just didnt have enough pups for everyone that enquired, so hence i had a waiting list. Nothing to do with price or undervaluing.

There is no room for negotiation with my pups. Its the same price regardless.

All my pups are good quality and are the same price regardless of sex. I never guarantee a pup show quality. The potential owners who wanted to show came and made their choice on what they felt was good enough to show and if they turn out good enough to show then thats great.

All my pups are paid for in full when they are collected, so saying cash up front etc means nothing really.

Good reputable breeders will never haggle on price. They work very hard to raise a litter and certainly are not going to haggle on a price. If you want to haggle, off you go somewhere else.

wolfpawnat

andreac wrote: »

Its nothing to do with undervaluing my stock. I had a waiting list for pups as the litter was a good quality litter with the sire being the top winning dog in the country.
So if there had been someone on the list who wasnt willing to pay the price, i had plenty of other people on the list willing to pay it.

I just didnt have enough pups for everyone that enquired, so hence i had a waiting list. Nothing to do with price or undervaluing.

There is no room for negotiation with my pups. Its the same price regardless.

All my pups are good quality and are the same price regardless of sex. I never guarantee a pup show quality. The potential owners who wanted to show came and made their choice on what they felt was good enough to show and if they turn out good enough to show then thats great.

All my pups are paid for in full when they are collected, so saying cash up front etc means nothing really.

Good reputable breeders will never haggle on price. They work very hard to raise a litter and certainly are not going to haggle on a price. If you want to haggle, off you go somewhere else.

Totally OT, but do you AI or does he do the job manually?

When you as a breeder spend so much time investing in a good sire and look after your bítch and pups so well, there is toss all profit from breeding.

Knine

Bizzum wrote: »

There is always room for negotiation. All pups in a litter may not be worth the same. Payment up front, or cash payment may well effect the price.

In relation to the bolded bit above, if you had plenty of costomers at a given price maybe you undervalued your stock and offered them for sale cheap.

The market dictates the price, be that for a xbred or a high end show dog.

Make sure and ask for a luck penny back too OP!

I sell all my puppies for the same price. A reputable breeder will never sell a puppy as a high end show dog as sometimes things can go wrong- mouth faults when teeth change, testicles can retract, faults can develop, movement issues can become more noticeable.

My last litter had both parents as Champions, working ability & dogs sports. Any demonstration could be given.

It is actually quite difficult to get quality puppies, I had to disappoint many people & my best puppy never left my home. Anyone wanting to negotiate can go elsewhere! I am also extremely fussy about where my dogs go.

andreac

wolfpawnat wrote: »

Totally OT, but do you AI or does he do the job manually?

When you as a breeder spend so much time investing in a good sire and look after your bítch and pups so well, there is toss all profit from breeding.

I used my own dog who is the sire. I didnt do it to make a profit.

I did it to keep something for myself to follow on after his Dad. Both my dogs have good pedigrees and the male is top winning dog so i wanted to breed to keep something for myself as Cooper is 7 now and is nearly finished his show career so wanted to breed something to hopefully do as well as his Dad.

Lemlin

wolfpawnat wrote: »

Totally OT, but do you AI or does he do the job manually?

When you as a breeder spend so much time investing in a good sire and look after your bítch and pups so well, there is toss all profit from breeding.

I disagree strongly with this. If there was "toss all profit" from breeding, why would people be doing it regularly and have waiting lists and the like?

I can understand breeders like Andreac above who bred to have a pup herself from her dog but there's obviously money in breeding if people continue to do it regularly.

Yes, you do spend alot of time.money on the pups and looking after the dam, as I know myself, but you are rewarded in monetary terms at the end of it. People wouldn't be doing it otherwise.

westies4ever

Lemlin wrote: »

I disagree strongly with this. If there was "toss all profit" from breeding, why would people be doing it regularly and have waiting lists and the like?

I can understand breeders like Andreac above who bred to have a pup herself from her dog but there's obviously money in breeding if people continue to do it regularly.

Yes, you do spend alot of time.money on the pups and looking after the dam, as I know myself, but you are rewarded in monetary terms at the end of it.

there is NO money in breeding IF done properly.

people who do it properly do it for the love of the breed and to continue a bloodline. they also are careful not to over breed hence prices and waiting lists. generally once vets fees, medicines, food etc are paid for, there will be no profit.

people do make profit but they are over breeding and scrimping on vet costs and care.

what is with this forum lately? so many people who haven't a clue or a care about animals throwing their tuppence in.

Paddy Fields

Hooked wrote: »

Hmmm... I'm always one to bargain or haggle. And haggle hard. But when we bought our first dog, I paid what was asked.

I'm not sure if you've seen a pup advertised or been in touch with a breeder, but for 800 euro I'd be expecting:

1. A VERY Reputable breeder.
2. IKC Papers (perhaps with lineage and any show champions noted on both sides).
3. Hip scores, tests, etc...
4. Vaccination / worming record.
5. To be dealing with a breeder who will take the pup back in certain eventualities.
6. Some food, a diet outline and info on the pups first few months.

If this is a 'buy and sell' or 'done deal' backyard breeder.... Run! And keep running.

An ounce of breeding is worth a tonne of feeding.

We're waiting almost a year for puppy number 2, and may have to keep waiting - and are firm believers in that you get what you pay for!

Thanks, you have answered a question that I would have been asking in a couple of months. I'll be in the same position as the OP looking for a good breeder.

Knine

Some recent costs I would have had just to give people an idea

Emergency C-Section €650
Emergency milk/bottles etc €30
Microchipping & vaccinations €85 × 3
IKC Registrations - €45
Endorsement €15
Looking for Studs -Flights to UK
Stud Fee - Price of pup
Travel to stud €45
Worming - €20
Comprehensive puppy pack which included info sheets, bedding, toys, a book on the breed, 4kg of food easily €30 for each puppy
Show fees - priceless I only breed from dogs who have proved themselves.

I have a prefix which had to be paid for plus membership to the IKC. The above does not included breed specific health testing.

Hellrazer

westies4ever wrote: »

what is with this forum lately? so many people who haven't a clue or a care about animals throwing their tuppence in.

And what's with all the users back Seat modding lately.This isn't the first time you've made a comment like this.If you have a problem with a post report it And stop back seat modding ans slating the forum.

Lemlin

Knine wrote: »

Some recent costs I would have had just to give people an idea

Emergency C-Section €650
Emergency milk/bottles etc €30
Microchipping & vaccinations €85 × 3
IKC Registrations - €45
Endorsement €15
Looking for Studs -Flights to UK
Stud Fee - Price of pup
Travel to stud €45
Worming - €20
Comprehensive puppy pack which included info sheets, bedding, toys, a book on the breed, 4kg of food easily €30 for each puppy
Show fees - priceless I only breed from dogs who have proved themselves.

I have a prefix which had to be paid for plus membership to the IKC. The above does not included breed specific health testing.

How many pups would your breed have and how much would you charge per pup? I'd hazard a guess that the cumulative value is far above the costs given above.

Some of the items above may only be needed on occasion. An emergency c section, for example, often is not. Emergency milk and bottles are also not always needed but I got same for €15.61, not €30, and Royal Canin as recommended by my vet.

A prefix costs €150 I believe and that could be for a number of litters. Lifetime IKC membership is €100 and that's lifetime as it says on the tin. You would have the IKC membership if you show dogs anyway so it isn't even related to the pups.

My vet microchips and inoculates a pup for €10 per vaccination and €20 per microchip. The consult fee is then €70 for the entire litter. Where is your figure of €85 x 3 coming from?

Info sheets are pretty much free if you print them up yourself. I pulled various useful information and created my own info sheets which I printed. They were better and more comprehensive than anything I found online.

If you are part of a breeder scheme with a pet food manufacturer, they will provide bags for the pups free of charge. Skinners provided me with 2.5kg puppy packs for each puppy.

I don't see any of the above as "scrimping". I'm being realistic about the costs paid.

Lemlin

westies4ever wrote: »

there is NO money in breeding IF done properly.

people who do it properly do it for the love of the breed and to continue a bloodline. they also are careful not to over breed hence prices and waiting lists. generally once vets fees, medicines, food etc are paid for, there will be no profit.

people do make profit but they are over breeding and scrimping on vet costs and care.

what is with this forum lately? so many people who haven't a clue or a care about animals throwing their tuppence in.

A Labrador pup costs €650. A Labrador can have anywhere up to 9 pups on average. Do you mean to tell me that the costs involved in breeding are €6,000 per litter?

This litter must be keeping the vet in full time work, must be a very sickly litter if they need all that medicine and are eating some amount of food!

To continue a bloodline, I'd argue you only need to breed once. Not have waiting lists of people waiting for the next litter. How much continuation of the bloodline do you want?

My own reason for breeding my dog was to have a pup for myself. Whether I will breed her again, I do not know but I certainly wouldn't be keeping waiting lists or the like.

Knine

Lemlin wrote: »

How many pups would your breed have and how much would you charge per pup? I'd hazard a guess that the cumulative value is far above the costs given above.

Some of the items above may only be needed on occasion. An emergency c section, for example, often is not. Emergency milk and bottles are also not always needed but I got same for €15.61, not €30, and Royal Canin as recommended by my vet.

A prefix costs €150 I believe and that could be for a number of litters. Lifetime IKC membership is €100 and that's lifetime as it says on the tin.

My vet microchips and inoculates a pup for €10 per vaccination and €20 per microchip. The consult fee is then €70 for the entire litter. Where is your figure of €85 x 3 coming from?

Info sheets are pretty much free if you print them up yourself. I pulled various useful information and created my own info sheets which I printed. They were better and more comprehensive than anything I found online.

If you are part of a breeder scheme with a pet food manufacturer, they will provide bags for the pups free of charge. Skinners provided me with 2.5kg puppy packs for each puppy.

I don't see any of the above as "scrimping". I'm being realistic about the costs paid.

I'm based in Dublin. That is what my vet charges. I use one vet as I don't shop around with my dogs health. They left for their new homes fully vaccinated & with a Fido Microchipping pack. Those packs I think cost €20 if you wanted to purchase separately.

The emergency items are bought whether I need them or not & in the case above they were needed.

My info sheets are all done & designed by myself, ink & quality paper costs. I also produce my own pedigree sheets. These are not done on standard white paper. I did not include breed club membership fees. I forgot to mention flea preparation which I put on each puppy heading to their new home.

I also provide free grooming to show standard & it can take several hours to complete one dog. I don't think I mentioned feeding costs.

As puppies sell for €500 euro, you can do the maths & work out how much profit I made when there was 3 puppies in the litter.

Edited to add I only sold 2 puppies.

If your €650 Labrador is a top winning champion bitch & likewise the sire, then the costs to gain this title could well exceed the price of the litter. If the parents are just pet quality then yes you can see how they would be making a profit. It costs an awful lot of money & time to Title a dog.

westies4ever

Lemlin wrote: »

A Labrador pup cost €650. A Labrador can have anywhere up to 9 pups on average. Do you mean to tell me that the costs involved in breeding are €6,000 per litter?

This litter must be keeping the vet in full time work, must be a very sickly litter if they need all that medicine and are eating some amount of food!

while i have no experience of the breed, anecdotal evidence suggests that it is extremely difficult infact almost impossible to source a healthy labrador in Ireland anymore so it appears that a lot of breeders may have scrimped and over bred.

my point was that over a lifetime of a dam, give the number of appropriate times to breed her, allowing for issues both with mother or pups etc I fail to see how much profit could be made. Ok, i concede, perhaps a small amount but its hardly enough to support someone as a full time profession?

Anyway, Im out, this place has my blood absolutely boiling lately.