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Is this correct?

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  • 19-11-2013 11:23am
    #1
    njs030
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,030 ✭✭✭


    I've had a bit of trouble with the bank transferring money from my account without my consent into a savings account and am working on sorting it out.

    This has caused a situation where I've fallen 2 weeks behind on my rent as well as a few weeks previously from a year or so ago which my landlord said he was happy to have paid gradually after Christmas (I had been paying it off gradually this year already) I've shown him the proof of money being taken from my account and also other things to show I'm attempting to fix it.

    Following the recent problems he is refusing to listen to what happened and sent me a text saying he is sending me a letter of 14 days notice which he says starts the day of the text (last sat). I got the letter today which says I owe three weeks and appox x amount from a previous time and he will only show details of that amount to the prtb.

    Is this fair? I asked him to send it registered delivery so we both know when 14 days are up and he said his text is legal notification!!
    I also asked him to put in full details of what is owed for what date ad how much was paid back and he ignored it but in the letter he has put the full amount and not admitted to paying any back.

    Will the prtb get in contact with me? I'm not sure why they would be involved at this stage?
    And is what he is doing legal- by sending a text saying that's the start date and refusing to give details of what is owed?


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    #2
    djimi
    Registered Users Posts: 13,237 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    The text is legal notification provided it is worded correctly. It cant just be a casual "Im going to send you a letter of warning".

    Also saying that he will only show the amount to the PRTB is not really on. He cant send you a notice of arrears and then refuse to tell you how much you owe. To me, that would be knowingly denying you an opportunity to repay the arrears, which he cannot do. It might be worth contacting Threshold and let them see the letter to see what they think.


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    #3
    D3PO
    Registered Users Posts: 7,879 ✭✭✭D3PO


    Is it fair ? Yes of course its fair your owe rent its not his problem as to why you don't have it that's your problem.

    Do you think he can tell the bank a sob story about why he cant pay the mortgage because his poor tenant has a problem of course not.

    He sent you a letter of arrears you have received it you have 14 days to clear what you owe or quite rightly he is going to give you notice to quit.


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    #4
    njs030
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,030 ✭✭✭njs030


    I didn't ask was it fair to send the letter I clearly asked is it fair to start the time 4 days before the letter arrives.

    I haven't disputed his right to have rent!!


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    #5
    D3PO
    Registered Users Posts: 7,879 ✭✭✭D3PO


    text notification is legal although to be honest I don't think the LL is going to quibble over 4 days if it comes down to it.

    as for what is owed you know what is owed by the sounds of it. If you came to an agreement of paying it back over a period of time (after crimbo)then you clearly know what is owed.


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    #6
    njs030
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,030 ✭✭✭njs030


    Actually I don't 'clearly' know as he was going to show me his records while was in the area over Christmas and I am currently sitting down working out my records so unless the two match 100% there's a problem isn't there?
    I think to state he won't tell me is a bit fishy and my question was is that allowed.

    Thanks for your advice but jumping to conclusions doesn't help at all.

    I appreciate the replies.


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    #7
    D3PO
    Registered Users Posts: 7,879 ✭✭✭D3PO


    well I might be wrong but a notice of arrears to be legal must state the amount of the arrears for it to be valid.

    what exactly does the letter you receive say ?


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    #8
    foggy_lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    notjustsweet wrote: »
    I've had a bit of trouble with the bank transferring money from my account without my consent into a savings account and am working on sorting it out.

    This has caused a situation where I've fallen 2 weeks behind on my rent as well as a few weeks previously from a year or so ago which my landlord said he was happy to have paid gradually after Christmas (I had been paying it off gradually this year already) I've shown him the proof of money being taken from my account and also other things to show I'm attempting to fix it.

    This sounds like a lame excuse, Why couldn't you pay the rent in full when the bank returned the funds back to your current account from the savings account?


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    #9
    djimi
    Registered Users Posts: 13,237 ✭✭✭✭djimi


    D3PO wrote: »
    Is it fair ? Yes of course its fair your owe rent its not his problem as to why you don't have it that's your problem.

    Do you think he can tell the bank a sob story about why he cant pay the mortgage because his poor tenant has a problem of course not.

    He sent you a letter of arrears you have received it you have 14 days to clear what you owe or quite rightly he is going to give you notice to quit.

    What is fair and what is legal are two different things. If neither the text nor the letter are worded correctly then neither are valid and basically can be ignored. The fact that the OP owes the money is not in dispute, however if the landlord wants to pursue the arrears then they must do so the correct way, and if they have not issued a valid notice of arrears then as far as the OP is concerned the process has not begun yet.


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    #10
    njs030
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,030 ✭✭✭njs030


    foggy_lad wrote: »
    This sounds like a lame excuse, Why couldn't you pay the rent in full when the bank returned the funds back to your current account from the savings account?

    That is my intention but it hasn't been returned yet- it's one of those that needs two weeks notice to allow funds to be removed.


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    #11
    foggy_lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    notjustsweet wrote: »
    That is my intention but it hasn't been returned yet- it's one of those that needs two weeks notice to allow funds to be removed.
    But why was this not done the last time it happened a year ago? you would not have been in arrears when it happened this time and your LL might have handled it very differently.

    At the moment you should check with your bank now today and tell them in front of other customers that their mistake has fooked up your rent payments and insist that they return funds to your account today to cover your rent(which can be taken from your savings account in two weeks) They will be able to do this! they have been doing stuff like this for people for years!


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    #12
    D3PO
    Registered Users Posts: 7,879 ✭✭✭D3PO


    foggy_lad wrote: »
    At the moment you should check with your bank now today and tell them in front of other customers that their mistake has fooked up your rent payments and insist that they return funds to your account today to cover your rent(which can be taken from your savings account in two weeks) They will be able to do this! they have been doing stuff like this for people for years!

    Or just ring them and tell them if the money isn't back in today your going to the financial ombudsman to report financial misconduct by the bank.....

    If its a genuine bank issue then this will be sorted pronto.


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    #13
    njs030
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,030 ✭✭✭njs030


    I will contact the bank ombudsman as I actually have a letter from the bank dated 4 days before the money was debited which states there's is no debit in place!!
    The customer service people are still insisting it's not the banks fault and I will have to wait the full 2 weeks even with this letter!! Unbelievable!!!

    Thanks everyone- great advice.


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    #14
    foggy_lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    notjustsweet wrote: »
    I will contact the bank ombudsman as I actually have a letter from the bank dated 4 days before the money was debited which states there's is no debit in place!!
    The customer service people are still insisting it's not the banks fault and I will have to wait the full 2 weeks even with this letter!! Unbelievable!!!

    Thanks everyone- great advice.
    Why did you go looking for a letter stating that there was no debit in place? Did you set up a debit from one account to the other to boost your savings account then cancel it?

    I get the impression that we are not getting the full story here.


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    #15
    njs030
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,030 ✭✭✭njs030


    Huh? I don't follow that logic at all? Most people have a savings account to boost their savings?

    What happened is this- I set up a savings account to transfer x amount from my current account to the savings account on certain days.
    My income dropped and I cancelled the direct debit to the savings account.
    The bank regularly sends out a confirmation statement (once a month I think) and within that statement it shows the regularity of direct debits. In this most recent statement it states no direct debit in place- this is dated 4 days before the bank debited the money from my account.

    I didn't 'go looking' for a letter stating it was cancelled but I'm glad I have it as proof the bank acted without consent and has put me in this position.


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    #16
    foggy_lad
    Closed Accounts Posts: 20,373 ✭✭✭✭foggy_lad


    Then they must return the disputed debit to your account immediately under the direct debit rules as it was an unauthorised debit although they will argue that it was not a debit but an inter account transfer or some other nonsense. I would also pursue a complaint through the banking ombudsman but you will first have to go through all the banks complaints mechanisms.


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    #17
    njs030
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,030 ✭✭✭njs030


    foggy_lad wrote: »
    Then they must return the disputed debit to your account immediately under the direct debit rules as it was an unauthorised debit although they will argue that it was not a debit but an inter account transfer or some other nonsense. I would also pursue a complaint through the banking ombudsman but you will first have to go through all the banks complaints mechanisms.

    Thanks, they were blinding me with all kinds of confusing statements similar to the above - I'm going to make an immediate complaint.

    Thanks


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    #18
    ScottStorm
    Registered Users Posts: 364 ✭✭ScottStorm


    notjustsweet wrote: »
    My income dropped and I cancelled the direct debit to the savings account.
    The bank regularly sends out a confirmation statement (once a month I think) and within that statement it shows the regularity of direct debits. In this most recent statement it states no direct debit in place- this is dated 4 days before the bank debited the money from my account.

    But do you have a standing order set up?


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    #19
    ScottStorm
    Registered Users Posts: 364 ✭✭ScottStorm


    notjustsweet wrote: »
    My income dropped and I cancelled the direct debit to the savings account.
    The bank regularly sends out a confirmation statement (once a month I think) and within that statement it shows the regularity of direct debits. In this most recent statement it states no direct debit in place- this is dated 4 days before the bank debited the money from my account.

    But do you have a standing order set up?


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