Anyone else think this company is a bit optimistic?

DublinWriter

Anyone else think that this company is being a bit over optimistic?

http://www.computerjobs.ie/jobs/1904811/net-developer-with-vb-and-crystal-reporting-skills-westmeath-30-45k.asp

sKeith

The company has been around for 13 years. what about that ad made them sound optimistic?

John_Mc

They'd be doing well to get a good developer with those skills and experience for that money

ChRoMe

John_Mc wrote: »

They'd be doing well to get a good developer with those skills and experience for that money

Not really, 1-5 years.. living in the midlands....

onemorechance

45k would be a good wage in the midlands I think, anywhere outside of Dublin really. 30 - 45k for 1 - 5 years experience seems ok too. Other than Crystal report development, the job spec seems fairly basic / standard for a developer.

I will add that it seems like it would be good experience also; working for "a financial consulting company specialising in Public Sector Accounting since 2000." That provides "tailored financial reporting and budgeting Solutions to Local Authorities across Ireland."

Beano

onemorechance wrote: »

45k would be a good wage in the midlands I think, anywhere outside of Dublin really. 30 - 45k for 1 - 5 years experience seems ok too. Other than Crystal report development, the job spec seems fairly basic / standard for a developer.

I will add that it seems like it would be good experience also; working for "a financial consulting company specialising in Public Sector Accounting since 2000." That provides "tailored financial reporting and budgeting Solutions to Local Authorities across Ireland."

I'm not sure that " MS Access/Asp.Net 2.0" experience is quite the experience to be going for. They seem like the type to stick with the same tech until the death. A couple of other things would worry me. It seems like a very small shop. And the experience and salary ranges are very broad.

AnCatDubh

Beano wrote: »

They seem like the type to stick with the same tech until the death..

Perhaps, they have a client need for such technologies.

onemorechance

Beano wrote: »

I'm not sure that " MS Access/Asp.Net 2.0" experience is quite the experience to be going for. They seem like the type to stick with the same tech until the death. A couple of other things would worry me. It seems like a very small shop. And the experience and salary ranges are very broad.

Good point about MS Access / Asp.Net 2.0. But the title mentions .net / vb. I don't use microsoft dev so I'm not sure where it's at now, but maybe the access / asp experience is needed because it's what lots of local authorities are using, and this company might be updating legacy access / asp systems to .net and mysql.

Small companies can give you a chance to shine and become an important cog.

Beano

AnCatDubh wrote: »

Perhaps, they have a client need for such technologies.

Possibly true but that doesnt make it a good career move.

ChRoMe

Beano wrote: »

Possibly true but that doesnt make it a good career move.

Could be a very good move, if you came in and re factored everything using best practices...

Beano

ChRoMe wrote: »

Could be a very good move, if you came in and re factored everything using best practices...

In my experience that happens a whole lot less than you would wish for. It can be a very hard business case to make to an employer that has always done things a certain way. And there has to be a business case for it. It cant just be a case that you want to use the latest technologies.

ChRoMe

Beano wrote: »

In my experience that happens a whole lot less than you would wish for. It can be a very hard business case to make to an employer that has always done things a certain way. And there has to be a business case for it. It cant just be a case that you want to use the latest technologies.

Start putting monetary values on support time and that is usually enough. These changes are far easier to do in a smaller company, which I get the impression this ad is for.

seamus

John_Mc wrote: »

They'd be doing well to get a good developer with those skills and experience for that money

I can't really detect if this is sarcasm. A developer specialising in VB.NET and MsAccess should be champing at the bit for a €45k salary.

Looks like a good opportunity for an ambitious junior .NET developer tbh. If the company are flexible enough about it, you could go in there and convince them to use better technologies for their new products and develop migration plans to move their existing stuff off Access.

A lot of these kinds of small software companies get stuck in a rut because their software is painfully bespoke. Applications have to be rewritten from scratch when they want to sell it to different clients, even though the requirements aren't that dissimilar, and scope creep causes some applications to become huge unmaintable monstrosities.

Someone with a good head on their shoulders and good experience working for a big software company could go really far improving the quality and re-usability of code in a small company like this. If you can tell the director that the application you wrote for client X three months ago can be resold to client Y with nothing more than 30 minutes of config changes, you come across like a coding genius.

Of course if the company are inflexible and unwilling to try new technologies, this job would be a complete dead end.

John_Mc

seamus wrote: »

I can't really detect if this is sarcasm. A developer specialising in VB.NET and MsAccess should be champing at the bit for a €45k salary.

Looks like a good opportunity for an ambitious junior .NET developer tbh. If the company are flexible enough about it, you could go in there and convince them to use better technologies for their new products and develop migration plans to move their existing stuff off Access.

A lot of these kinds of small software companies get stuck in a rut because their software is painfully bespoke. Applications have to be rewritten from scratch when they want to sell it to different clients, even though the requirements aren't that dissimilar, and scope creep causes some applications to become huge unmaintable monstrosities.

Someone with a good head on their shoulders and good experience working for a big software company could go really far improving the quality and re-usability of code in a small company like this. If you can tell the director that the application you wrote for client X three months ago can be resold to client Y with nothing more than 30 minutes of config changes, you come across like a coding genius.

Of course if the company are inflexible and unwilling to try new technologies, this job would be a complete dead end.

Not sarcasm at all. 45K is a very low salary for a set of skills where there is a shortage and high demand. Midlands or not. The average industrial wage is 36k for the country.

onemorechance

Technology|1-2yrs Low End|1-2yrs High End|3-5yrs Low End|3-5yrs High End|5+yrs
C# / VB.NET / ASP.NET|25|35|38|55|75


Source: Morgan McKinley Ireland (pdf file, page 36)

I would have thought that 45k was good, and this survey seems to indicate that it's the market rate. I'd expect that they would go up to 50 or 55 if a candidate merited it.

I would guess that Crystal report development experience would be harder to find than .Net, but of course there seems to be an overall tech skill shortage in Ireland.

John_Mc

Well I did say a good developer with the skills and experience. 50-55 would be more like what I was thinking.

onemorechance

John_Mc wrote: »

Well I did say a good developer with the skills and experience. 50-55 would be more like what I was thinking.

You did say 45 was very low! I was thinking that you meant it should have been more like 60-65! Most places I think will advertise a lower price, and have room for manoeuvre, just like candidates will ask for more than they are willing to take! :pac:

John_Mc

Yep, that cat and mouse game