Rugby World Cup bid - Castlebar/Westport involvement?

Cosmo Kramer

As has been widely reported this week, a joint cross border bid is likely to be submitted with a view to the island of Ireland hosting the Rugby World Cup in either 2023 or 2027. With much of the infrastructure in place, the potential worldwide appeal of an island-wide bid and the presence of the IRB headquarters in Dublin there is a genuine chance that such a bid could be successful.

A number of the venues are obvious, Belfast, Dublin, Cork and Limerick in particular as the country's rugby strongholds - but other cities and towns would also be needed as host venues. Galway and Killarney have been regularly mentioned in reports about the bid but McHale Park has generally been omitted from the list of proposed venues. There are a number of reasons why a joint Castlebar/Westport effort would be a realistic contender to be a host venue:

- Castlebar has the stadium (at 30,000+ all seater McHale Park is the largest all seater stadium on the island outside of Dublin) but does not have the accommodation to cope with hosting the games. The ground would need some upgrading but nothing unrealistic would need to be done here

- Westport, on the other hand, offers the accommodation options and atmosphere that would be ideal as a host venue

- By the time the tournament comes around it is likely that the two towns will be connected by a dual carriageway, reducing the travelling time between the two places to about 10 minutes (see link below)

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057033353

- Knock Airport continues to grow in terms of its importance over time and is well connected by road to Castlebar in less than 30 minutes (and by 2023 to Westport). The current route network includes flights to both main Scottish cities, a number of English airports and the main airport for the rugby strongholds of south Wales and the English West Country (Bristol) as well as to the north of Italy

- Both Castlebar and Westport are, of course, connected to the national rail network and are adjacent stations on the same line. Westport Station is 10 minutes walk from the town centre, Castlebar station is 10 minutes walk from the stadium

- Without a Mayo venue it is likely that the entire north-west of the country - everywhere north of Galway and west of Belfast would have no involvement in the bid, raising questions about its proposed status as an All Ireland event

Overall it would seem that, in terms of the three main criteria for hosting this kind of event - stadium capacity, accommodation availability and transport links - the two towns between them meet all three and would match a number of Irish cities (such as Galway) in this respect. That's even before you throw in other advantages like the sports hotel at Breaffy and the upcoming sports centre development in Castlebar.

It surprises me that more has not been said locally about the potential use of the area as a venue for the RWC - as the potential economic and promotional benefits to the county would be huge. With the Taoiseach and Minister for Sport hailing from the two towns that would be involved, the potential bid submission could not have come around at a better time. I hope that local representatives strongly promote the potential of the area as it would be a huge missed opportunity if Mayo failed to get involved in the tournament bid given the advantages the county holds as a result of the existing infrastructure in the area.

Is there any reason why this could not be a genuine possibility?

Dudda

Great post and can't see any major barriers that can't be overcome either. Would be brilliant for Mayo if this were to happen.

yop

Minute I heard of the bid it entered my head as to why not, the ONLY thing might be the non motorway route to Mayo, but outside of that we have everything else to be considered.
And at that stage Mayo will be going for the 9 in a row in Croker

finisklin

I can't see the accomodation part being an issue given the organisaton and detail that went into the special olympics where several towns in Mayo hosted athletes. Indeed such a project could rejuvenate the B&B industry in the county.

Disappointing to see that Ballina or the north of the county didn't feature in your reasoning as the quality of accomodation providers is on a par with Westport. Certainly from a heritage and cultural perspective it can only add to the rugby fans experience of Ireland! Plus its not that far from Castlebar.

If MM can deliver the upgraded N26, it potentially can make the journey 20 minutes or so to C'bar. Perhaps that is a debate though for another thread!

Great idea and there are plenty of rugby fans/clubs in the county to boot.

yop

finisklin wrote: »

I can't see the accomodation part being an issue given the organisaton and detail that went into the special olympics where several towns in Mayo hosted athletes. Indeed such a project could rejuvenate the B&B industry in the county.

Disappointing to see that Ballina or the north of the county didn't feature in your reasoning as the quality of accomodation providers is on a par with Westport. Certainly from a heritage and cultural perspective it can only add to the rugby fans experience of Ireland! Plus its not that far from Castlebar.

If MM can deliver the upgraded N26, it potentially can make the journey 20 minutes or so to C'bar. Perhaps that is a debate though for another thread!

Great idea and there are plenty of rugby fans/clubs in the county to boot.

Ah now come on, I agree with the rest of the post, but outside of Mount Falcon I can't see any other hotel in Ballina on the same par as Westport

Le Fornicator was all over the Mayo News this week I see, loving the black framed glasses on her!

finisklin

yop wrote: »

Ah now come on, I agree with the rest of the post, but outside of Mount Falcon I can't see any other hotel in Ballina on the same par as Westport

Le Fornicator was all over the Mayo News this week I see, loving the black framed glasses on her!

I'm getting all hot and bothered by with the thoughts of the black framed glasses. Not!

Ice House is up there....when it is good it is good.

The other hotels (Hotel Ballina, Downhill Hotel & Inn, Manor) are adequate and will comfortably accommodate any rugby fan!

yop

finisklin wrote: »

I'm getting all hot and bothered by with the thoughts of the black framed glasses. Not!

Ice House is up there....when it is good it is good.

The other hotels (Hotel Ballina, Downhill Hotel & Inn, Manor) are adequate and will comfortably accommodate any rugby fan!

We'll give you the ice house

Steamy glasses

Cosmo Kramer

Finisklin, I left out Ballina as it is not as near or as well connected to the other two towns as they are to each other. Having said that though, you could expect the benefit to be county wide and not just limited to Castlebar and Westport. Maybe something like this could help convince people in the north of the county of the argument to join the N26 and N5 at Turlough rather than Swinford!!

Good to see the positive responses and that I hadn't missed something obvious when thinking about this, it really could be a runner and hopefully Mayo is included in the bid process when the time comes. It would be great for the county to be involved in something like this.

Castlebar12

Cosmo Kramer wrote: »

As has been widely reported this week, a joint cross border bid is likely to be submitted with a view to the island of Ireland hosting the Rugby World Cup in either 2023 or 2027. With much of the infrastructure in place, the potential worldwide appeal of an island-wide bid and the presence of the IRB headquarters in Dublin there is a genuine chance that such a bid could be successful.

A number of the venues are obvious, Belfast, Dublin, Cork and Limerick in particular as the country's rugby strongholds - but other cities and towns would also be needed as host venues. Galway and Killarney have been regularly mentioned in reports about the bid but McHale Park has generally been omitted from the list of proposed venues. There are a number of reasons why a joint Castlebar/Westport effort would be a realistic contender to be a host venue:

- Castlebar has the stadium (at 30,000+ all seater McHale Park is the largest all seater stadium on the island outside of Dublin) but does not have the accommodation to cope with hosting the games. The ground would need some upgrading but nothing unrealistic would need to be done here

- Westport, on the other hand, offers the accommodation options and atmosphere that would be ideal as a host venue

- By the time the tournament comes around it is likely that the two towns will be connected by a dual carriageway, reducing the travelling time between the two places to about 10 minutes (see link below)

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057033353

- Knock Airport continues to grow in terms of its importance over time and is well connected by road to Castlebar in less than 30 minutes (and by 2023 to Westport). The current route network includes flights to both main Scottish cities, a number of English airports and the main airport for the rugby strongholds of south Wales and the English West Country (Bristol) as well as to the north of Italy

- Both Castlebar and Westport are, of course, connected to the national rail network and are adjacent stations on the same line. Westport Station is 10 minutes walk from the town centre, Castlebar station is 10 minutes walk from the stadium

- Without a Mayo venue it is likely that the entire north-west of the country - everywhere north of Galway and west of Belfast would have no involvement in the bid, raising questions about its proposed status as an All Ireland event

Overall it would seem that, in terms of the three main criteria for hosting this kind of event - stadium capacity, accommodation availability and transport links - the two towns between them meet all three and would match a number of Irish cities (such as Galway) in this respect. That's even before you throw in other advantages like the sports hotel at Breaffy and the upcoming sports centre development in Castlebar.

It surprises me that more has not been said locally about the potential use of the area as a venue for the RWC - as the potential economic and promotional benefits to the county would be huge. With the Taoiseach and Minister for Sport hailing from the two towns that would be involved, the potential bid submission could not have come around at a better time. I hope that local representatives strongly promote the potential of the area as it would be a huge missed opportunity if Mayo failed to get involved in the tournament bid given the advantages the county holds as a result of the existing infrastructure in the area.

Is there any reason why this could not be a genuine possibility?

Would be amazing. Every hotel in the county would be full! would be great for Castlebar. Leo Varadkar actually mentioned Castlebar when he announced it so it is looking good. McHale Park is more than big enough anyways. We have enough accomodation between Castlebar, Westport, Ballina even Galway. Can't wait to be out that night in Castlebar 2023! Will be amazing! Also what your saying about Ballina adding atmosphere to it is not really true. The streets in Castlebar and Westport will be so wedged that their will be loads of atmosphere their. Don't really see Ballina playing much of a part in it. Just Castlebar because its holding the match obviously and Westport because of Accommodation and somewhere else for people to go out.

Castlebar12

Also I don't really see how this got turned into a Castlebar/Westport involvement. Obviously Westport will play an important role in hosting fans in hotels and their will no doubt be some people who will go out there, but at the end of the day Castlebar is hosting this event. Don't see anything about Killarney/Kenmare or Dublin/Bray or Limerick/Shannon involvement. Just saying. It's like saying Ireland are hosting the Rugby World Cup but some will be staying in England so its an Ireland/England event. But yes the hotels in Westport will be needed to host the fans.

irishgeo

there is one problem, the gaa rules still forbid the playing of foreign sports on their grounds. the only exemption is croke park.

Castlebar12

irishgeo wrote: »

there is one problem, the gaa rules still forbid the playing of foreign sports on their grounds. the only exemption is croke park.

The GAA have already approved the use of their grounds. http://www.thescore.ie/gaa-2023-rugby-world-cup-1184789-Nov2013/

Cosmo Kramer

Westport would be very much needed for this. If Westport, with its award winning, tourist friendly setup wasn't nearby it would be impossible for McHale Park to host games as the hotel infrastructure wouldn't be there. It's the same reason why somewhere like Killarney would be considered for this rather than Clones.

The collective merits of the two towns working together are much greater than the sum of their individual parts - and not just in relation to this issue. They are two very different towns but they complement each other well. Tourism, scenery, restaurant and hotel infrastructure in Westport alongside retail, employment and event venues in Castlebar. I hope that when the upgrade to the N5 is built we will see more benefits of having the two towns in close proximity to each other.

Irishgeo - no issue with McHale Park, the GAA have already cleared their way for it to be used. Changed times.

finisklin

Depending on who is playing....i.e. pool games, quarters etc. will determine the size of the travelling support. If it is one of the bigger teams (Australia, New Zealand, South Africa) then it will depend on whether Westport has the beds to accomodate the support. Probably prudent to take a balanced, county wide approach on this as it may place significant pressures on resources in one place (Westport/Castlebar) e.g. policing, emergency services etc.

This may bring other accomodation centre's into play i.e. Ballina & Galway.

The other point is that due to the improved infrastructure supporters can also make they're way out of the county fairly handy. Dublin, Limerick and Cork is 2-3 hours away which is not a long journey by any means.

yop

Cosmo Kramer wrote: »

Westport would be very much needed for this. If Westport, with its award winning, tourist friendly setup wasn't nearby it would be impossible for McHale Park to host games as the hotel infrastructure wouldn't be there. It's the same reason why somewhere like Killarney would be considered for this rather than Clones.

The collective merits of the two towns working together are much greater than the sum of their individual parts - and not just in relation to this issue. They are two very different towns but they complement each other well. Tourism, scenery, restaurant and hotel infrastructure in Westport alongside retail, employment and event venues in Castlebar. I hope that when the upgrade to the N5 is built we will see more benefits of having the two towns in close proximity to each other.

Irishgeo - no issue with McHale Park, the GAA have already cleared their way for it to be used. Changed times.

Thats v true re Killarney and Westport. It will them tourist towns which will be able to provide the main attraction and accommodation.
I'm sure that they will still fk up the bid somehow.

whitey1

while I think it would be a great idea, my gut feeling is that it would be a non starter. A few years ago a similar idea was floated about Connaught playing their Heineken Cup games in MacHale Park and nothing came of it

I was chatting with a well connected rugby person at the time and he commented that it would never fly in Galway. The Galway business community have been long time benefactors of rugby in the province and they would be the ones calling the shots.

In fairness, while it would be brilliant if they came to Castlebar, I just dont it happening

Coillte_Bhoy

whitey1 wrote: »

while I think it would be a great idea, my gut feeling is that it would be a non starter. A few years ago a similar idea was floated about Connaught playing their Heineken Cup games in MacHale Park and nothing came of it

I was chatting with a well connected rugby person at the time and he commented that it would never fly in Galway. The Galway business community have been long time benefactors of rugby in the province and they would be the ones calling the shots.

In fairness, while it would be brilliant if they came to Castlebar, I just dont it happening

Agreed, there is no way Castlebar would get it ahead of Galway and rightly so

Castlebar12

Then why did Varakar mention McHale Park in his announcement to make a bid? McHale Park is way bigger, all seats and in better condition than Pearse stadium

nuac

Good idea - hope it happens.

While there is friendly rivalry between the two towns, they did cooperate at Urban Council level over forty years ago.

The late Seán Smyth ( Conor and Garry's father ) was Mayo's first County Development Officer.

A textile firm Corah were considering a location for a factory employing about 500. At Seán's suggestion the two Urban Councils employed consultants to research and produce a study showing the strengths of each town as regards industrial tradition, labour supply, schools, amenitiesect etc.

The project did not go ahead for reasons related to Corah.

Perhaps the two Town Councils should get together on this

Castlebar12

nuac wrote: »

Good idea - hope it happens.

While there is friendly rivalry between the two towns, they did cooperate at Urban Council level over forty years ago.

The late Seán Smyth ( Conor and Garry's father ) was Mayo's first County Development Officer.

A textile firm Corah were considering a location for a factory employing about 500. At Seán's suggestion the two Urban Councils employed consultants to research and produce a study showing the strengths of each town as regards industrial tradition, labour supply, schools, amenitiesect etc.

The project did not go ahead for reasons related to Corah.

Perhaps the two Town Councils should get together on this

Very good point, co-operation is needed, but at the end of the day Castlebar is hosting the event

Coillte_Bhoy

Don't ge me wrong, it would be great if it happened but realistically if it came to a choice of Galway or Castlebar/Westport Galway will get it. Though hopefully interested parties in the region (rugby, commercial and obviously public bodies) will get together and see what kind of proposal they could put forward,

witnessrenegade

Coillte_Bhoy wrote: »

Don't ge me wrong, it would be great if it happened but realistically if it came to a choice of Galway or Castlebar/Westport Galway will get it. Though hopefully interested parties in the region (rugby, commercial and obviously public bodies) will get together and see what kind of proposal they could put forward,

If it's a Rugby World Cup, I can safely assume they would need a stadium in both Galway and Mayo to use due to the amount of matches that would need to be played, Would love something like this to go ahead though. Castlebar is dying a slow death, things like this can get it back on its feet

yop

witnessrenegade wrote: »

If it's a Rugby World Cup, I can safely assume they would need a stadium in both Galway and Mayo to use due to the amount of matches that would need to be played, Would love something like this to go ahead though. Castlebar is dying a slow death, things like this can get it back on its feet

It seems the official line is that its Galway. Due to it been the base for Connacht rugby and it would have a stronger rugby support. Also been larger than Castlebar and direct motorway then it probably makes sense.
It ticks all the boxes so I would think it will get the nod going by what is been said on various forums.

signostic

witnessrenegade wrote: »

If it's a Rugby World Cup, I can safely assume they would need a stadium in both Galway and Mayo to use due to the amount of matches that would need to be played, Would love something like this to go ahead though. Castlebar is dying a slow death, things like this can get it back on its feet

I doubt very much if Castlebar would get any matches. McHale Park is no way up to the standard that the IRB would wish for. I would think that the IRB would want to present their matches to a world audience in the most modern of stadiums similar to the Aviva and Croke Park (Even the playing area in Croke Park is too big for a rugby match). Think of the European Soccer Championships last year and the stadia that were used in Gdansk, Poznan, Warsaw etc. Rugby`s major competitor in Europe is soccer.
The bid by Ireland in my opinion will be approved only if stadia in Wales and Scotland are used.
And I doubt if the IRFU would want to to upgrade the facilities of a major competitor especially in a non rugby area such as Mayo.

Castlebar12

Why does it have to be Castlebar or Galway?

Coillte_Bhoy

Castlebar12 wrote: »

Then why did Varakar mention McHale Park in his announcement to make a bid? McHale Park is way bigger, all seats and in better condition than Pearse stadium

I's not all seated as the term is understood by major professional sports. It has approx 10,000 seas and the rest is concrete benching

yop

Coillte_Bhoy wrote: »

I's not all seated as the term is understood by major professional sports. It has approx 10,000 seas and the rest is concrete benching

Yip, 10m in debt from the building of it, a PA system like a tin can and still only 10k seats. I'm sure the builder was delighted.

finisklin

signostic wrote: »

I doubt very much if Castlebar would get any matches. McHale Park is no way up to the standard that the IRB would wish for. I would think that the IRB would want to present their matches to a world audience in the most modern of stadiums similar to the Aviva and Croke Park (Even the playing area in Croke Park is too big for a rugby match). Think of the European Soccer Championships last year and the stadia that were used in Gdansk, Poznan, Warsaw etc. Rugby`s major competitor in Europe is soccer.
The bid by Ireland in my opinion will be approved only if stadia in Wales and Scotland are used.
And I doubt if the IRFU would want to to upgrade the facilities of a major competitor especially in a non rugby area such as Mayo.

Casement park and Parc Ui Caoimh is being redeveloped. These would have to feature and certainly the former as the potential venues in the North is limited to Ravenhill and Windsor Park. My understanding is that there is a substantial investment going into both of these venues that will bring the capacity to 40k.

The proposal is a win win for both the IRFU and the GAA. The revenues generated by this are too good to turn down and for the GAA it brings they're facilities and association to a bigger global audience. This can only benefit them. Any rivalry between the two bodies would be put to one side for this project. It is estimated that a successful bid would generate revenue of 100m of which the GAA would get a good chunk.

Given that the IRFU have stated that the semi finals and finals will be held in Croke park it seems reasonable that the GAA could negotiate a fee of 10% for the use of their stadiums etc. This excludes merchandise, food and beverage sales.

Any development of GAA stadiums for this tournament will be funded primarily by the association with perhaps a small contribution from the government.

The sports grounds in Galway is a fine provincial venue and I don't think it is up to scratch for a full international game as part of the world cup. Though Galway has a powerful rugby body that would be well capable of lobbying for Galway ahead of Castlebar.

Perhaps some of the Mayo players (Duffy, Heffernan) for Connaught could become Mayo ambassadors to secure something for the county from this?:rolleyes:

Castlebar12

Coillte_Bhoy wrote: »

I's not all seated as the term is understood by major professional sports. It has approx 10,000 seas and the rest is concrete benching

Yes and Pearse only holds 26,197 with 8,000 seats?
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_stadiums_in_Ireland_by_capacity:cool:

signostic

The Fanzone in Castlebar would be reminiscent of this

Cosmo Kramer

Cosmo Kramer wrote: »

- Without a Mayo venue it is likely that the entire north-west of the country - everywhere north of Galway and west of Belfast would have no involvement in the bid, raising questions about its proposed status as an All Ireland event

The North West region has been treated like a far out colony for a long long time, don't see why it would be any different for this.

We have a minister and a Taoiseach from the two towns mentioned who are afraid to appear impartial. Cork, Kerry and Limerick have all been chosen as locations, Killarney could easily be swapped for Castlebar but our local excuse for politicians (all parties) are too gutless to attempt this.

Can you imagine if the Taoiseach was from Killarney, they would be building a new stadium and arena no questions asked. We have Mayo people in power that think Mayo should be bottom of the pile. Prime example been Noonans 300m bailout of Shannon, Enda Kenny and co done zero for Knock...or jobs there.