Official Conor McGregor Thread (READ MOD WARNING IN OP)

Mellor

DeVore wrote: »

Crazy coincidence... I'm coding a ranking system for a game right now. I literally know Kung Fu about ranking systems as a result

It *is* possible for a 5th place player to rise about a 4th placed player by beating a 10th placed player, but only if the 5th and 4th were already very very close to each other, and it depends on the system you are using of course.

The generally accepted system is the Chess ELO system. This is used far and wide now and in many major sports like basketball and baseball.

A 5th beating a 10th is expected, but not a certainty. The 5th player would get a small amount of points, not much but something. He would also escape an inactivity penalty which the fourth player might get (designed to stop the top players from just never competing again... which is what would happen at the top if they weren't allowed to be leapfrogged).

Think about that for a second... if we never allowed 5th to over take 4th unless he beat a higher ranked player/fighter.... and if 4th 3rd 2nd and 1st just couldn't/refused to play/fight then 5th could never move up!


Sorry, I'm kinda deep into this stuff atm.

Sorry Tom, but none of that applies to the UFC rankings. The UFC doesn't use rankings based on cumulative points, as in chess or other sports. They based the rankings on the selections of multiple people in the MMA media. The official ranking are averaged from this, possibly weighted.
Because of this there's no carry over from one month to the next, other than the fact voters can use the previous list to build their own.
The reason they do this is to make the ranking very dynamic, a few losses drops you rapidly. Allow a new entry at any point.

For example, Melsndez crossed over to the UFC. He entered in the top three, he didnt need to build up points in the background. If due to injury a fighter at number 8, fights for the belt, and wins. He goes to the top of the rankings. As he proved himself to be the best at that time.
Under the chess rankings he wouldn't as its not suitable to do do in chess or other spirts, where as in MMA it is.

Points based rankings are used by systems like Fightmatrix, which has its benefits too.

Mellor

DrPhilG wrote: »

Any thoughts on when Aldo vs McGregor will officially be announced?

I know it's been said a few times that it will be in May in Vegas, which makes UFC 187 all but definite, but I don't want to book flights until it's officially announced.

I thought it would have been confirmed by now, since it was damn near confirmed before he even beat Siver.

Probably just need to get the fight contract signed at this point. agree on stuff like media obligations, PPV money, etc. Base pay is probably included in his main contract, with a title shot bonus.

Can't imagine it would be more than a week away. Possibly as part of next weekends media.

DeVore

Mellor wrote: »

Sorry Tom, but none of that applies to the UFC rankings. The UFC doesn't use rankings based on cumulative points, as in chess or other sports. They based the rankings on the selections of multiple people in the MMA media. The official ranking are averaged from this, possibly weighted.
Because of this there's no carry over from one month to the next, other than the fact voters can use the previous list to build their own.
The reason they do this is to make the ranking very dynamic, a few losses drops you rapidly. Allow a new entry at any point.

For example, Melsndez crossed over to the UFC. He entered in the top three, he didnt need to build up points in the background. If due to injury a fighter at number 8, fights for the belt, and wins. He goes to the top of the rankings. As he proved himself to be the best at that time.
Under the chess rankings he wouldn't as its not suitable to do do in chess or other spirts, where as in MMA it is.

Points based rankings are used by systems like Fightmatrix, which has its benefits too.

Yeah sorry, I didn't mean to imply that the UFC uses an ELO system, I was more commenting in general that real ranking systems absolutely DO allow a lower player to jump above a higher player simply by winning against an even lower player. The amount of dynamism is determined by the R number in ELO's.

As far as I can see fighter rankings are just a great big case of "I think he's number 3"... mushed together and averaged from a bunch of big mouth journalists

There may be maths behind the averaging etc. but there's no science to it in substance afaics.

yipeeeee

Bla bla bla, head melt.

riffmongous

I never actually paid attention to the ufc rankings, the system doesn't seem independent enough what with the ufc being the only real game in town nowadays. I used to always refer to sherdog before, but I never thought of finding out how they worked

xtal191

This would be a tasty co main for Aldo vs McGregor

https://twitter.com/TeamKhabib/status/557509293654945792

johnny_adidas

xtal191 wrote: »

This would be a tasty co main for Aldo vs McGregor

https://twitter.com/TeamKhabib/status/557509293654945792

That would be a very nice co-main. Maybe it was just his reluctance to celebrate beating his mate or tiredness from the two fights (and training for both) but I kinda feared he was injured or just not right afterward. Hopefully his break away isn't for too long

Mellor

DeVore wrote: »

As far as I can see fighter rankings are just a great big case of "I think he's number 3"... mushed together and averaged from a bunch of big mouth journalists

There may be maths behind the averaging etc. but there's no science to it in substance afaics.

That's pretty such it. No science, nothing solid. Just mass opinion polls.
TBF its something like 40-50 guys who submit rankings, so its fairly wide average, and pretty unbiased overall (apart from any bias the media has in general).

riffmongous wrote: »

I never actually paid attention to the ufc rankings, the system doesn't seem independent enough what with the ufc being the only real game in town nowadays. I used to always refer to sherdog before, but I never thought of finding out how they worked

It's in dependent is the sense that the guys submitting each work for MMAWeekly, BloodyElbow, MixedMartialArts.com, etc. But each submission is just one guys/mags opinion, just like Sherdogs rankings I suppose.
The transparency is there too, so can view each individuals list to see where a particular guy put whoever.

They’ve been updated now
McGregor’s moved up to 4th.

Champion : Jose Aldo

1. Chad Mendes
2. Frankie Edgar
3. Ricardo Lamas
4. Conor McGregor
5. Cub Swanson
6. Dennis Bermudez
7. Dustin Poirier
8. Nik Lentz

Photo-Sniper

Rewatched Mendes vs Aldo 2 and wasnt super impressed by Aldo in comparison to what we have seen in McGregor.

My biggest concern for McGregor is can he defend all the leg shots?

Aldo is a beast when it comes to them.

Fromvert

Mellor wrote: »

That's pretty such it. No science, nothing solid. Just mass opinion polls.
TBF its something like 40-50 guys who submit rankings, so its fairly wide average, and pretty unbiased overall (apart from any bias the media has in general).


It's in dependent is the sense that the guys submitting each work for MMAWeekly, BloodyElbow, MixedMartialArts.com, etc. But each submission is just one guys/mags opinion, just like Sherdogs rankings I suppose.
The transparency is there too, so can view each individuals list to see where a particular guy put whoever.

They’ve been updated now
McGregor’s moved up to 4th.

I've heard a few journalists (Luke Thomas, Chuck Mindenhall etc) say they don't take part because some of the journalists given a vote have nothing to do with covering MMA.

Also the rankings are not to be taken seriously, Siver jumped a position or two so he was a top 10 when it was announced he was fighting McGregor.

Mellor

Fromvert wrote: »

I've heard a few journalists (Luke Thomas, Chuck Mindenhall etc) say they don't take part because some of the journalists given a vote have nothing to do with covering MMA.

Nobody from MMAFighting (Ariel, Luke, Chuck, etc) or Sherdog takes part. I'm sure that their negatives comments are accurate, but those websites also have their own rankings - Ones I'd prob take a bit more seriously.

Also the rankings are not to be taken seriously, Siver jumped a position or two so he was a top 10 when it was announced he was fighting McGregor.

Its' not easy to check UFC historical rankings. But I remember that Siver was at 7 or 8 when McGregor entered the Top 10 in July after beating Brandao.


I think the best rankings are done by FightMatrix.

DrPhilG

Anyone else think that McGregor vs Aldo might not be the main event at 187?

It's the memorial day card, traditionally big one. Wouldn't be surprised if they have another title on there too to push the PPV numbers through the roof.

Cain vs Werdum is set for June so the HW title is out.
Jones vs Gus/Johnson could be ready in May.
MW title is unlikely, Weidman vs Belfort is in late February.
Don't think Robbie Lawler is scheduled yet?
Pettis is out, facing Dos Anjos at 185.
Dillashaw vs Barao is at 186 and would be below McGregor vs Aldo anyway.
Not sure what Mighty Mouse is booked for, and again he would be co-main.
Ronda fights at 184 and Carla Esparza at 185.

So LHW or WW belts could in theory still make a main event with McGregor vs Aldo co-main.

TimRiggins

DrPhilG wrote: »

Anyone else think that McGregor vs Aldo might not be the main event at 187?

It's the memorial day card, traditionally big one. Wouldn't be surprised if they have another title on there too to push the PPV numbers through the roof.

Cain vs Werdum is set for June so the HW title is out.
Jones vs Gus/Johnson could be ready in May.
MW title is unlikely, Weidman vs Belfort is in late February.
Don't think Robbie Lawler is scheduled yet?
Pettis is out, facing Dos Anjos at 185.
Dillashaw vs Barao is at 186 and would be below McGregor vs Aldo anyway.
Not sure what Mighty Mouse is booked for, and again he would be co-main.
Ronda fights at 184 and Carla Esparza at 185.

So LHW or WW belts could in theory still make a main event with McGregor vs Aldo co-main.

I'd say the most likely is Mighty Mouse as he won't get PPV numbers.

TimRiggins

TimRiggins wrote: »

I'd say the most likely is Mighty Mouse as he won't get PPV numbers.

apparently it's been announced as the co main event in wrestlemania 3!!

ah c'mon lads, just a jab at the new people who confuse sports!!:D

dave1982

DrPhilG wrote: »

Anyone else think that McGregor vs Aldo might not be the main event at 187?

It's the memorial day card, traditionally big one. Wouldn't be surprised if they have another title on there too to push the PPV numbers through the roof.

Cain vs Werdum is set for June so the HW title is out.
Jones vs Gus/Johnson could be ready in May.
MW title is unlikely, Weidman vs Belfort is in late February.
Don't think Robbie Lawler is scheduled yet?
Pettis is out, facing Dos Anjos at 185.
Dillashaw vs Barao is at 186 and would be below McGregor vs Aldo anyway.
Not sure what Mighty Mouse is booked for, and again he would be co-main.
Ronda fights at 184 and Carla Esparza at 185.

So LHW or WW belts could in theory still make a main event with McGregor vs Aldo co-main.

Way UFC are watering down cards we be very lucky to get two title fights on the same unless it a lower weight 135 down

Can I just say, has anyone considered how hard this lad punches, cut through all the hype and crap and see it for what it is. Can you remember the last time you saw a 145lb'er do that to anothers face within one round? with so few blows?? Im just stating fact, and it gives me pause for thought.

consider the others, including Marcus brimmage just went down. brandao was the same as did Poirier. holloways face was in bits and that may have been worse only for the knee issue on McGregor.

so the latest guy makes it through a round, with a face like mutton and get cracked in half in the 2nd!! IM impartial here, but if he wasn't brash and didn't have the swagger, I think people would consider the facts. These are being clouded by the persona not the fighter.. shame.

Zero-Cool

I was thinking the same Dr Phil. Dana knows Fedderweights won't draw the same PPV as the big boys so I'd say he will stack the card, maybe with some HW/LHW/MW contender fights.

I checked the reebok site as Conor tweeted about his gear there. Well for a start Dethrone had better designs but the big problem is Reebok.com don't ship outside US and the Irish Reebok store doesn't stock McGregor gear. HHHHMMMMMM

MartyMcFly84

Conor has the hardest hands in the division. Possibly in a couple of divisions.

You can see his punching power and technique from his very first fights. I think he has won all of his fights by TKO or KO with the exception of one submission and the Max Holloway decision.

MartyMcFly84

MartyMcFly84 wrote: »

Conor has the hardest hands in the division. Possibly in a couple of divisions.

You can see his punching power and technique from his very first fights. I think he has won all of his fights by TKO or KO with the exception of one submission and the Max Holloway decision.

I assume you mean lighter divisions ha ha ha. but I agree, he must have some power. the record speaks for itself, whos to say punching edgar, mendes etc would not yield the same returns. anyway I say let the fight happen, it will be here before we know it, injury permitting.

maximoose

sheehy83 wrote: »

I checked the reebok site as Conor tweeted about his gear there. Well for a start Dethrone had better designs but the big problem is Reebok.com don't ship outside US and the Irish Reebok store doesn't stock McGregor gear. HHHHMMMMMM

Try shipito.com - Like a US Parcel Motel service, I've used them a few times and pretty reasonable price and really quick turnaround!

yipeeeee

MartyMcFly84 wrote: »

Conor has the hardest hands in the division. Possibly in a couple of divisions.

You can see his punching power and technique from his very first fights. I think he has won all of his fights by TKO or KO with the exception of one submission and the Max Holloway decision.

And the main reason he didnt finish Holloway was he popped his knee in the second round and had to take it to the ground which he managed 3 times.

Pretty impressive.

MartyMcFly84

I assume you mean lighter divisions ha ha ha.

He has knock out wins at 155 also. But yeah would prob call it quits at welterweight

Mike Tobacco

McGregor up to 4 in the rankings ahead of Swanson. Bermudez up one to 6 as well swapping places with Poirier. Siver drops to 12.

Oregano_State

I re-watched Aldo Mendes II last night, brilliant fight. Aldo hits very very hard but does have holes in his game. I would say he hits just as hard if not harder than Conor but isn't as varied in his strike selection or puts out the same output. When Mendez used movement he was able to land numerous shots, and his striking is nowhere near the level of Conor's. Mendez's problem was that he got rocked a fair few times and it took the spring out of his step. If Conor can avoid shipping as many big shots he'll have success against Aldo. Also, Aldo often leaves himself way off balance when he swings and misses so that could be one thing to exploit.

I also think Conor's TD game is underrated. Aldo will probably start throwing loads of kicks, if Conor can anticipate and score a TD early, he'll be less likely to continue that.

As others have said, if the fight stays at distance Conor should win.

CurryFlavoured

I don't think there's a hope in hell of Conor getting a TD, Aldo has the best TD defence I've ever seen. He's stopped takedowns consistently from elite wrestlers like Mendes and Edgar, don't see how Conor gets a TD here.

I think Conor has a chance but the issues for me are:

- Aldo won't have to fear the takedown which could mean he's more varied in his kicks. I can also see him taking Conor down if the standup is competitive.
- Dealing with the leg kicks.
- Going 5 rounds.
- Aldo being a least 2 tiers above anything Conor has fought. The speed difference in particular will be massive.

Oregano_State

I'm sticking with my opinion that Conor offers an underrated TD threat and while I know Aldo is brilliant at defending TDs, he would be wise not to underestimate it just because CMcG isn't a former D1 All-American. I think it's silly to flatly state as a fact that Aldo doesn't have to fear the TD.

DeVore

I dunno about Brimage but hasn't Conor taken down his other UFC opponents (after some good striking, which would seem to be a good way to do it )?

Holloway, Brandao and Siver all were taken down and the later two finished on the ground. Poirer didn't last long enough

Oregano_State

Yeah I was just looking up the stats on Holloway. He's been taken down by a few fighters, but with Bermudez's much-vaunted beastly wrestling, he and Conor scored the same number of TDs against Holloway (4), even though Conor only started trying for the TD half way through round 2.

CurryFlavoured

I'd put my house on Conor not taking down Aldo, just look at how he stopped Mendes and Edgar who are the 2 best wrestlers in the divison. I'd be shocked if Conor even went for a TD. On the flipside I can see Aldo taking Conor down if he needs to.

mdwexford

I agree Aldo can be more aggressive with kicks than he was vs Mendes because he doesn't have near as much worry about being taken down.

I imagine both will be happy to stand and trade but Aldo is the BJJ black belt so you'd imagine he'll have the advantage if it does go to the ground.

Conor's movement and unpredictable angles will hopefully give him advantage in the striking. Sounds silly even saying that when Aldo is such a good striker as well though.