Who has been the worst player to start consistantly for a major club?

keane2097

MagicIRL wrote: »

Tom Cleverly. He doesn't just deserve criticism, he deserves a brick to the legs so he can retire for good.

Christ that's horrible.

Lukker-

TheDoc wrote: »

Thread seems to mention "major clubs" and "consistently" played.

Nothing stinks of mediocrity and "what the hell" then Mikel for Chelsea for me, absolutely chuffed they snapped him of our hands

Hasn't been a regular starter in a long time. Also under-rated by most fans, Chelsea generally concede less goals when he plays. IF you asked Chelsea's back four I'd say he'd be the player they'd like most in front of them because he makes their job easier.

Soft Falling Rain

Soft Falling Rain wrote: »

True, but Djimi has a CL medal.

He's has had his fun, and that's all that matters. :cool:

And I will always love him for that clearance off the line

But my god he was ****ing awful. He was the kind of player that you actually shat it watching Liverpool waiting for him to do something stupid

GavRedKing

I'd rather Mikel partner Ramires then Lampard but got to agree, of all the players that started games for us ,hes up there as one of the worst, maybe Kalou and Bosingwa would be up there from recent times too.

I'm not counting People like Shevchenko, Kezman etc as they werent around long enough and didnt play enough games.

The thing with Mikel is he tries to get out of dodgy positions alot but hes been left embarrased a few times, I remember he tried it against Liverpool at the Bridge 2 seasons ago and they took the ball off him at the edge of the box and passed it into the net, it was terrible.

martingriff

GavRedKing wrote: »

I'd rather Mikel partner Ramires then Lampard but got to agree, of all the players that started games for us ,hes up there as one of the worst, maybe Kalou and Bosingwa would be up there from recent times too.

I'm not counting People like Shevchenko, Kezman etc as they werent around long enough and didnt play enough games.

The thing with Mikel is he tries to get out of dodgy positions alot but hes been left embarrased a few times, I remember he tried it against Liverpool at the Bridge 2 seasons ago and they took the ball off him at the edge of the box and passed it into the net, it was terrible.

You could say that more about Luiz also.

GavRedKing

martingriff wrote: »

You could say that more about Luiz also.

I'dd rather Luiz trying it than Mikel, Luiz has the ability to pull it off but he shouldnt be trying it as much when hes lining out at CB, especially considering JT is nowhere near quick enough to cover any mistake ke makes.

Lukker-

GavRedKing wrote: »

I'd rather Mikel partner Ramires then Lampard but got to agree, of all the players that started games for us ,hes up there as one of the worst, maybe Kalou and Bosingwa would be up there from recent times too.

I'm not counting People like Shevchenko, Kezman etc as they werent around long enough and didnt play enough games.

The thing with Mikel is he tries to get out of dodgy positions alot but hes been left embarrased a few times, I remember he tried it against Liverpool at the Bridge 2 seasons ago and they took the ball off him at the edge of the box and passed it into the net, it was terrible.

I'd disagree about Kalou, had a good scoring record considering the majority of appearances he had were as a sub. Great squad player to have. Had a very good season with Lille too last season.

Burt Macklin

Lukker- wrote: »

I'd disagree about Kalou, had a good scoring record considering the majority of appearances he had were as a sub. Great squad player to have. Had a very good season with Lille too last season.

Kalou showed some promise in his first two seasons but he never kicked on from there, one of the most average Chelsea players in the last few years

dobman88

Does every thread in the soccer forum just turn into a "slag the rival" thread. Some ridiculous posts in here.

EuropeanSon

elefant wrote: »

Right. So we're judging how good a player is entirely on 12 league starts then. Not on the players' ability, but on 12 games for a new club in a new league. Where he has 4 goals and 2 assists in those 12 starts.

He had to pick any player, anywhere,7 who starts for a major club and is a poor player, yet he chose Soldado.

And I'm the one who is uncomprehending.

I didn't say I judged anyone other than you on your opinion to read. Which was poor.

I don't have an opinion on Soldado, really. I just dislike people attacking statements that weren't made.

keeponhurling

Maybe not a regular, but Darron Gibson has played 31 times for Man United, and 35 for Everton over the last two years.

Unbelievable

cathalio11

Aaron Ramsey last season, no doubt about it.

It just proves how actually playing these guys can really help.

SureYWouldntYa

cathalio11 wrote: »

Aaron Ramsey last season, no doubt about it.

It just proves how actually playing these guys can really help.

Sure by that logic you could say Rooney was a candidate for this list. He went how many games without scoring a few seasons back ? (No i don't think he is near this list)

Chris Ryan

average_runner wrote: »

Sorry Utd aren't one of the best in the world. Got destroyed in Europe last year.
Premier league last few years has been weak. It is still weak if not weaker this year.

England are not a top 10 side in the world even.

Spain, Brazil, Argentina, Germany, Holland, Italy, Belguim, Portugal, Uruguay, France and more ahead of them.

Destroyed in Europe? Sorry, when did this happen?

extra gravy

blingrhino wrote: »

Giles gramandi

The same Giles Grimandi that made 113 appearances and won the double in 1998 and 2002?

Burt Macklin

SureYWouldntYa wrote: »

Sure by that logic you could say Rooney was a candidate for this list. He went how many games without scoring a few seasons back ? (No i don't think he is near this list)

I think the problem that he's trying to point out is that people are listing good/great players who had bad spells, rather than the worst players to start consistently for a major club.

BNMC

Olivier Giroud.

Sir Gallagher

dobman88 wrote: »

Does every thread in the soccer forum just turn into a "slag the rival" thread. Some ridiculous posts in here.

dobman88 wrote: »

Yeah, but the thread title says "major clubs" so Liverpool doesn't count.

Skylinehead

BNMC wrote: »

Olivier Giroud.

Wrong. Very wrong, in fact. He's integral to how we play, his hold up play is immense and he's been scoring as well.

SM01

Sir Gallagher wrote: »

Excellent .gif choice!

Red Kev

David Ngog, always despaired when he was announced on Liverpool as a starter or when he was put on as a sub.

Hasn't done too much at Bolton either, in the Premiership or in the Championship.

764dak

bucketybuck wrote: »

For the past two years Manchester United fans have had to endure the sight of Antonio Valencia utterly fail to resemble anything like a winger at one of the biggest clubs in the world. Once an effective winger, for years now he has been utterly bereft of anything resembling attacking instinct, and at this point is just a parody, a player seemingly designed to stop dead in his tracks and give the ball to somebody else. Want a stat? Heres one for you, Antonio Valencia has scored only 2 league goals since the start of last season. In fact he has only scored 7 league goals in the past four seasons. Shocking.

But thats not the amazing thing. Instead, the amazing thing is that two seemingly rational and respected managers have continued, game after game, month after month, and now year after year to repeatedly pick him on the right wing for United. He has been shocking this season for Moyes, yet has double the minutes played that Nani or Kagawa have. In fact he has played more minutes than Robin Van Persie :eek:.

I am curious, has there ever been a player be so useless for so long that has continued to be selected for a major club?

Its the so-long part that interests me, there have plenty of useless players for clubs but they tend to just get dropped. Who else was as seemingly immune to getting dropped as Valencia is?

Valencia is not a goal scorer. You forgot to mention that he had the second most assists in the league in 2011/12 so obviously he would still be picked in 2012/13. He didn't play so well last season and he still had more assists than Kagawa but less goals obviously.

Jesus Navas has also scored 2 goals in the same time period as Valencia and had a similar assists/game ratio as to him last season. What do say about that?

DeanAustin

Some of the posts in here are laughable.

Berbatov was absolutely outstanding for Spurs and had a decent spell at United.

Lucas was never as bad as some made him out to be and he isnt as good as some Liverpool fans think he is. Decent player though.

Wellbeck is a decent player too.

Soldado is only in the door.

For me, it's hard to go past Gary Doherty. Horrendous footballer.

rob316

Welbeck can run the channels, hold up the ball all day long if he wants but strikers score goals and doesn't. But in saying that you could make a case that he doesn't start consistently so you cant judge him too harshly. But again tom cleverly a woeful average footballer.

Whoever said dirk kuyt, nice try but just no.

elefant

EuropeanSon wrote: »

I didn't say I judged anyone other than you on your opinion to read. Which was poor.

I don't have an opinion on Soldado, really. I just dislike people attacking statements that weren't made.

Do you understand the function of thread titles and topics?

The thread is about the worst players to start consistently for major clubs.

royster999

David May. I cant believe he was still at United in 2003!

Burt Macklin

royster999 wrote: »

David May. I cant believe he was still at United in 2003!

Ah yes, David May, first name on the team sheet.

Honestly, does anyone read the thread title?
''Who has been the worst player to start consistently for a major club?''

May was never a regular, nor are half of the players listed here.

Quazzie

Johnny Evans

Moneymaker

BNMC wrote: »

Olivier Giroud.

For gods sake.

Bobby Baccala

Roy Carroll

fozz10

GBXI wrote: »

Behind 2 of the best strikers in the world (Rooney and V. Persie) and Hernandez (who he is far more versatile than), at a club that is one of the strongest in the world. Hence, he is better than the vast majority of professional strikers.

just when u think it couldn't get any more delusional!! Hilarious stuff!! you made this thread worth visiting good man!

Seaba

Not played so much this season but Gael Clichy for Man City, last few years. DODGY

GTR63

Seaba wrote: »

Not played so much this season but Gael Clichy for Man City, last few years. DODGY

He is a regular isn't he (I know Kolarov is a back up anyway). Nasri's form has been up and down for them a lot too. Think Arsenal did good business there.

UnitedIrishman

Quazzie wrote: »

Johnny Evans

That'd be United's best center half for the last year, Johnny Evans?

Hard to disagree with Valencia for the last while - has been offering little in the way of creativity from the wing for well over a year now.

Mikael Silvestre wins hands down for me. I despised seeing his big forehead anywhere near the starting lineup. At the first sign of an opposition player coming towards him, he completely cacked himself and either stumbled over the ball or hoofed it back to the opposition. Him playing center back was a complete liability. It's no wonder our downturn in fortunes came with him and Barthez hanging around at the back and we started to come good again when he was turfed out.

Edit - this rant from another board was almost a weekly feature..

I don't know at what point in his life this guy decided to stop playing football and start auditioning for Fossetts Circus, but what I do know is that he is costing Manchester United points every single bloody week, and that he has got to be removed from the team now, for his own good and the good of others.

There will not be a more ludicrous goal scored in the Premiership all season than the one United let in against Bolton a few minutes ago. It was a sculpture of grotesquery. Silvestre just had to hoof the damned thing into the stands to avert the danger. Instead, he sort of half-jumped, half-stumbled over the ball in order to let the grounded Tim Howard get it instead (which Howard had no hope of doing), allowing the 106-year-old Les Ferdinand to gratefully walk the ball into an empty net.

Silvestre used to be good once, you know, in the same sense that REM used to be good once, which was only a little longer ago.

Burt Macklin

UnitedIrishman wrote: »

That'd be United's best center half for the last year, Johnny Evans?

Hard to disagree with Valencia for the last while - has been offering little in the way of creativity from the wing for well over a year now.

Mikael Silvestre wins hands down for me. I despised seeing his big forehead anywhere near the starting lineup. At the first sign of an opposition player coming towards him, he completely cacked himself and either stumbled over the ball or hoofed it back to the opposition. Him playing center back was a complete liability. It's no wonder our downturn in fortunes came with him and Barthez hanging around at the back and we started to come good again when he was turfed out.

Spent two years at Arsenal too didn't he? Don't know what Wenger was thinking, must have lost a bet.

Smithwicks Man

Stewart Downing - 91 appearances for Liverpool between 11-12 and 12-13 and very little to show for it - No wonder they were nowhere near the top 4.

Manuel Almunia - 94 appearances for Arsenal between 2007-2010. Capable of the odd purple patch of form but he was nowhere near 1st choice keeper at the top-tier level, and everybody but Wenger could see it.

Victor Anichebe - Wasn't always a regular in his 9 seasons for Everton but between 2006-2011 he played 90 Premiership games scoring 6 league goals.

Titus Bramble - 11 consecutive years in top flight football, 248 Premier League appearances for Newcastle, Wigan and Sunderland and a whole lot of errors that showed he was constantly a weak link for the opposition to exploit.


There's loads more but I can't think of them. Saw a video on a similar topic to this lately and these came to mind so I checked some stats. I think this is the kind of stuff the OP meant anyway!

Anybody who said Berbatov, Giroud or Soldado - No. Just no.

GTR63

Anybody mention Torres yet, better mention Downing again just to get across how bad he was.
Suprised you didn't mention Zapata, Constant or Muntari smithwicks_man(even if Constant wouldn't start had DeSciglio and Abate ever been both fit much).

kryogen

Valencia is pretty high on the list in fairness, for duration alone

Smithwicks Man

GTR63 wrote: »

Anybody mention Torres yet, better mention Downing again just to get across how bad he was.
Suprised you didn't mention Zapata, Constant or Muntari smithwicks_man(even if Constant wouldn't start had DeSciglio and Abate ever been both fit much).

Was thinking torres but then he had done the business before, was playing poorly for years before pundits finally accepted it though.

I could name half the Milan team tbh! :pac:

Alessandro Matri would have to be one for his Juventus days. He's decent enough (as in he'd be a good player or a weak top division team, wouldn't have him near the Milan squad) but he was playing at a much higher level than he deserved to be and how he managed 68 appearances for Juventus in their 2 recent title-winning years is beyond me.

764dak

Smithwicks Man wrote: »

Was thinking torres but then he had done the business before, was playing poorly for years before pundits finally accepted it though.

I could name half the Milan team tbh! :pac:

Alessandro Matri would have to be one for his Juventus days. He's decent enough (as in he'd be a good player or a weak top division team, wouldn't have him near the Milan squad) but he was playing at a much higher level than he deserved to be and how he managed 68 appearances for Juventus in their 2 recent title-winning years is beyond me.

He was Juventus' top goal scorer in the league in 2011-12 and the 4th top goal scorer in 2012-13 (he had 2nd best goals/games ratio among Juventus players).

CorsendonkX

The problem with these threads is a bit like movie threads, you remember who or what you watched in the last few years with the odd exception.

I would say Dunphy but is Millwall a major club?:pac:

But if you want consistency it has to be Francis Benali, 311 games for Southampton. Even his Wiki entry recognises he wasn't the most talented.

His distribution was somewhat wayward and his crosses when going forward rarely reached their intended target. Nonetheless, he rapidly gained a cult status amongst Saints’ supporters for his whole-hearted commitment to the club and his dedication to the cause.

Benali gained a poor reputation amongst officials, and regularly received yellow cards for challenges which were deemed to be outside the laws. He was sent-off 11 times, including on 7 February 1993 at White Hart Lane in a 2–4 defeat by Tottenham Hotspur for a high challenge on Nick Barmby

Like many defenders, he scored several own-goals, the most spectacular being on 30 March 1994 in a 1–3 defeat at home to Oldham Athletic when he made a diving header at the near post and put the ball past his own goal-keeper Dave Beasant; a goal any forward would have been proud of.

hefferboi

Sir Gallagher wrote: »

Sakho and Cissokho when they were kids.

Kirby

hefferboi wrote: »

Sakho and Cissokho when they were kids.

Smithwicks Man

764dak wrote: »

He was Juventus' top goal scorer in the league in 2011-12 and the 4th top goal scorer in 2012-13 (he had 2nd best goals/games ratio among Juventus players).

Have you ever watched him play? He wasn't near good enough to lead the line for them. Not saying he was a complete failure but he wasn't up to the standard and everyone knew it yet he continually played.

And saying he was "top scorer" doesn't mean much considering he only scored 20 goals in all competitions over the 2 years playing up front for the strongest team in the league. Compare this with the actual league top scorer last year, Cavani, who scored 38 goals in all competitions last season alone.

CSF

This thread has really brought the worst of alot of people and showed up massive biases. No idea why people would go for really successful footballers who've achieved lots at both clubs and international level when there are blatantly much worse, Julian Joachim, Gilles Grimandi (who was a good shout earlier in the thread), Mark Gonzalez, Steve Marlet, Roy Carroll. Ya know like actual **** players who started consistently enough, not the likes of Welbeck, Torres and Kuyt who clearly have bags of ability even if they aren't at the same level as more lauded members of their side.

CSF

Marlon Harewood and Zat Knight also.

Agueroooo

CSF wrote: »

Marlon Harewood and Zat Knight also.

Ohh you reminded me of someone....

Cameron Jerome who averages 5 goals a season in the PL.

cathalio11

CSF wrote: »

This thread has really brought the worst of alot of people and showed up massive biases. No idea why people would go for really successful footballers who've achieved lots at both clubs and international level when there are blatantly much worse, Julian Joachim, Gilles Grimandi (who was a good shout earlier in the thread), Mark Gonzalez, Steve Marlet, Roy Carroll. Ya know like actual **** players who started consistently enough, not the likes of Welbeck, Torres and Kuyt who clearly have bags of ability even if they aren't at the same level as more lauded members of their side.

Grimandi won two doubles with Arsenal so that doesn't really match your complaint.

Here's an interesting article on Grimandi. He was a very useful player, highlighted by the fact Wenger had a lot of trust in him:

http://www.arsenal.com/news/news-archive/rogues-gallery-gilles-grimandi

Dolph Starbeam

Probably didn't play consistently enough to be on this thread but Pascal Cygan played 60 or so games for Arsenal. Even though I seen quite a few of those 60 games I still have no idea what his preferred foot is. Terrible player.

CSF

cathalio11 wrote: »

Grimandi won two doubles with Arsenal so that doesn't really match your complaint.

Here's an interesting article on Grimandi. He was a very useful player, highlighted by the fact Wenger had a lot of trust in him:

http://www.arsenal.com/news/news-archive/rogues-gallery-gilles-grimandi

Duly noted, but still doesn't quite counter my point. Grimandi would be someone I'd consider to have piggybacked on the success of others, I don't think the same could be fairly levelled at the likes of Torres, Welbeck and Kuyt all of whose contributions to their side's success was sufficiently significant.