Keano Vieira documentary: mod warning post in OP and post #331

LiamoSail

"Bergkamp, he doesn't fly. What does that say to you about him??"

Good aul Roy

theteal

Ha ha, I just let out a proper laugh there. . ."he doesn't even fly". . .

cournioni

Love him or hate him, the world would be a duller place without Roy Keane.

Tinie

Great scene at the end there with the two of them chatting away about the best 11, possibly oblivious that they were being filmed.

Alfred Borden

Absolutely brilliant show, lived up to the hype. Now off to youtube to revisit the glory days :pac:

adox

Pity it was edited to within an inch of its life, really interrupted the flow of it.

DeanAustin

grenache wrote: »

I agree, he was turning to the bottle big time at that stage, but he still had a profound impact in how Keane approached the game.

True, I'm sure Keane rates him highly given Clough discovered him, had a wonderful philosophy on football and an incredible history and record.

But it's preposterous to place him ahead of Fergie. I get the sense that Keane is a bit like Mourinho. Some of his public utterances are purely to wind people up. He can pull it off too with that icy glare but I suspect he's roaring laughing inside.

He's great tv whatever you think of him.

monkey9

Coleman Slawski wrote: »

Why do you say that?

And don't say it's because Keano ended Hallands career, he didn't.

The knee that Keano made contact with isn't the one that caused his (Hallands) retirement.

Ouch, touchy. Picking up on something that hasn't been said there!!

UnitedIrishman

Brilliant bit of viewing and an interesting insight into Keane's mind.

Know it was more geared towards Keane and his opinions than Vieira but he's that much of a more complex character that it was much more interesting. Of course there's a sense of bitterness there towards Fergie, but he must've felt absolutely destroyed after being shown the door and then have Fergie almost trample over what he has achieved by saying it was all Roy's doing. I think the dislike of Neville has been there for quite some time and I remember vividly from games in the 90's and 00's Keane having a go at Neville on the pitch over mistakes more than anyone - and he did do some dumb stuff at RB at times, but became a lot more consistent more post Euro 00. The more time goes on, the more Keane looks correct in what he says. Maybe not how he says it.

He still remains one of the only players that knew exactly what tempo a game should be played at in order to reap maximum reward from a game and could drag a team with him, even when 5-6 players were struggling.

monkey9

Lucky for Ireland that Keane is very bitter towards Man Utd because if Keane seriously thought that that was the best Utd team he played with managed by his best manager ever, Ireland are f*cked! Thankfully, he's only the assistant.

Liam McPoyle

monkey9 wrote: »

Ouch, touchy. Picking up on something that hasn't been said there!!

Awww, you still have access here, how nice for mods and posters alike.

LiamoSail

DeanAustin wrote: »

True, I'm sure Keane rates him highly given Clough discovered him, had a wonderful philosophy on football and an incredible history and record.

But it's preposterous to place him ahead of Fergie. I get the sense that Keane is a bit like Mourinho. Some of his public utterances are purely to wind people up. He can pull it off too with that icy glare but I suspect he's roaring laughing inside.

He's great tv whatever you think of him.

IMO Brian clough represents an attitude and an environment Keane thrives in. Clough flooring Keane after being knocked out the cup being the epitomey of this. Ferguson mellowed as time passed, he said so himself, which again according to ferguson, didn't sit well with Keane

From being a young player in the old school, he them saw younger players coming through, "big time Charlie's before they'd ever achieved anything", the sort of thing that ten years previous the likes of ferguson and clough would have come down hard on. Ferguson didn't though, as times changed, he changed with them and realised you couldn't treat younger players like that anymore. For Keane, this is obviously something that outraged him, hence I think it stands to reason that he'd rate Clough higher, particularly when that decision is considered with the personality of the players he choose in his XI, players who would have been able for that sort of treatment

DeanAustin

LiamoSail wrote: »

IMO Brian clough represents an attitude and an environment Keane thrives in. Clough flooring Keane after being knocked out the cup being the epitomey of this. Ferguson mellowed as time passed, he said so himself, which again according to ferguson, didn't sit well with Keane

From being a young player in the old school, he them saw younger players coming through, "big time Charlie's before they'd ever achieved anything", the sort of thing that ten years previous the likes of ferguson and clough would have come down hard on. Ferguson didn't though, as times changed, he changed with them and realised you couldn't treat younger players like that anymore. For Keane, this is obviously something that outraged him, hence I think it stands to reason that he'd rate Clough higher, particularly when that decision is considered with the personality of the players he choose in his XI, players who would have been able for that sort of treatment

I honestly cannot believe Keane rated Clough higher than Fergie. Under Clough he got to a Cup final and got relegated. Under Fergie he won multiple leagues and cups.

Fergie maintained control which is what good managers need to do. Clough lost the plot and control when managing Keane.

I love Brian Clough but the comment was clearly Keane having a pop at Fergie.

LiamoSail

DeanAustin wrote: »

I honestly cannot believe Keane rated Clough higher than Fergie. Under Clough he got to a Cup final and got relegated. Under Fergie he won multiple leagues and cups.

Fergie maintained control which is what good managers need to do. Clough lost the plot and control when managing Keane.

I love Brian Clough but the comment was clearly Keane having a pop at Fergie.

I don't doubt but that that's true, however I do think he's being genuine in his answer. Had Ferguson retired in 2001 however, I think his answer would have been different on the basis that obviously the fall out would have been avoided, but more pertinently, that was prior to Ferguson really mellowing in his treatment of players

Demosthenese

Keane is a typical Corkman, holds a grudge longer than life expectancy. Parker over Neville! (thats how Lauren made Ultimate 11, laughable) and his hatred for Fergie becomes almost too much to keep in. He came off well in that interview though, interesting to listen to.

2 unbelieveable teams though, a great rival.

SantryRed

That documentary has really made me hate what football has become. Are there any proper rivalries any more? I don't think there are. The pure hatred United and Arsenal had for each other in that 6-7 year period was fantastic viewing.

Agricola

LiamoSail wrote: »

IMO Brian clough represents an attitude and an environment Keane thrives in. Clough flooring Keane after being knocked out the cup being the epitomey of this. Ferguson mellowed as time passed, he said so himself, which again according to ferguson, didn't sit well with Keane

From being a young player in the old school, he them saw younger players coming through, "big time Charlie's before they'd ever achieved anything", the sort of thing that ten years previous the likes of ferguson and clough would have come down hard on. Ferguson didn't though, as times changed, he changed with them and realised you couldn't treat younger players like that anymore. For Keane, this is obviously something that outraged him, hence I think it stands to reason that he'd rate Clough higher, particularly when that decision is considered with the personality of the players he choose in his XI, players who would have been able for that sort of treatment

I think you've hit the nail on the head there. Certainly, Fergie's recent book is playing a big factor in Keane's choice, but even from his 2002 autobiography, you get the feeling that Keane has a very large soft spot for Clough and his methods. Even 10 years ago reading that book, I felt he rated Clough more as a manager. But without doubt, Keane felt Ferguson sold out in the later years and began to indulge too many "big time charlies" This really would have rankled with him, and clearly still does. You could never see Clough adapting to this new era, Keane probably respects him for that.

Anyway, a great watch. Both of them touched on something briefly at the end there, that they don't see this sort of vicious rivalry anymore, that teams respect each other too much. My 2 cents is that football has practically been X Factored. Players don't start at the very bottom anymore and scrub out baths. They don't have the hunger because they earn a king's ransom from the time they are 17. Plus they are self entitled, which isnt a phenomenon exclusive to football in this day and age. So how can you expect to produce players like these two in an environment like that.

Oh, I miss the old day of..........10 -15 years ago! Titantic battles.

greendom

Can anyone spell Vieira's name correctly? At least Kaene's is easy to spell

gilmour

When Keane first arrived at the City Ground he was a stick thin right sided midfielder. By the time Cloughie had retired and after that horrendous last season he had turned Keane into a box to box driven machine that could score with both feet and a serious header of the ball. Anyone who thinks Clough was "pissed as a fart by the time Keane played with him" is forgetting just how much of an impact on any player he managed, even to the end.

"Irishman, win the ball off the player not in a red jersey and pass it to another team mate in a red jersey, do that and you'll get paid". Keane made a career out of that advice from Clough.

Mars Bar

Coleman Slawski wrote: »

Awww, you still have access here, how nice for mods and posters alike.

Don't.

Digitalism

I hope this wasn't a once off, and they do these specials every few months.

A Lampard vs Gerrard or Ruud vs Henry episode would be great.

moby2101

SantryRed wrote: »

That documentary has really made me hate what football has become. Are there any proper rivalries any more? I don't think there are. The pure hatred United and Arsenal had for each other in that 6-7 year period was fantastic viewing.

Couldn't agree more, the Premiership has become so sanitised.. Those years were EPIC.. you just knew when Man U and Arsenal met it was going to be epic..

Halcyon Days

Rhys Essien

Demosthenese wrote: »

Keane is a typical Corkman, holds a grudge longer than life expectancy. Parker over Neville! (thats how Lauren made Ultimate 11, laughable) and his hatred for Fergie becomes almost too much to keep in. He came off well in that interview though, interesting to listen to.

2 unbelieveable teams though, a great rival.

Yawn.People like you probably have never even been to Cork but like the old lazy generalising crap.

lertsnim

fatherted1969 wrote: »

Ah sorry lads, its the fcuking android app for boards. It keeps repeating my posts

Stop using it. It's not an official app and and it doesn't work properly.

wonderfullife

Digitalism wrote: »

I hope this wasn't a once off, and they do these specials every few months.

A Lampard vs Gerrard or Ruud vs Henry episode would be great.

In fairness this was easier to swing as both are/were employed by ITV for champions league games.

Top class though. Probably helped by Gabriel Clarke keeping the questions short and sweet. Bullet point questioning, bullets for answers at times.

As usual the media have mis-reported Roy for the umpteenth time. All the stuff that came out yesterday about him omitting Scholes, Neville, Giggs.....

In reality:

Neville - Gary is very unlucky to be fair (not to be picked)
Scholes - I'd take myself out and put Scholes in
Giggs - "having a great career doesnt mean you are a great player, NOT that im saying Giggsy isn't" but i can't leave Ronaldo out.

Whereas it was reported as snubs to all 3!! They even quoted him as saying "having a great career doesnt mean you are a great player" and totally omitted the pretty big proviso attached.

Some quality moments though. 2 outstanding footballers. Warriors. Legends.

Bergkamp quote pure gold!! "what about pre-season tours?! Can't go on them!"

Then we get back to the present and it's Tom Cleverley and Felaini ....some of them not fit to lace Keanes boots.

Demosthenese

Rhys Essien wrote: »

Yawn.People like you probably have never even been to Cork but like the old lazy generalising crap.

Old, like how many Corkmen bought a Ford this year? It isn't ment as a bad thing, but proves truthful ... especially in Keanes case. BTW - love Cork and going back for a few nights next month

shamrock55

Digitalism wrote: »

I hope this wasn't a once off, and they do these specials every few months.

A Lampard vs Gerrard or Ruud vs Henry episode would be great.

Not a hope, they were never heated rivals

case885

Great show. You have to respect keane for what he brought to united the shear aggression and drive to win which united badly need at the moment its pity he had to go OTT at times but as he said thats who he is he tells it how he sees it. That great rivalry is badly missed these days, dont think cleverly and arteta will be the next keane and vieira anyway

Demosthenese

shamrock55 wrote: »

Not a hope, they were never heated rivals

Both successful in in their prime, are there even anymore that could be considered!

Mocha Joe

It should be a series but with Roy Keane in each one.

Keane v Neville

Keane V McCarthy

Keane v Fergie

MD1990

a Ronaldo Vs Messi one at the end of there careers would be brillant

Al Capwned

adox wrote: »

What?

Whoooosh!!!!

:pac:


______

BNMC

Mocha Joe wrote: »

It should be a series but with Roy Keane in each one.

Keane v Neville

Keane V McCarthy

Keane v Fergie

Keane v Haaland

Keane v Quinn

Keane v McAteer

Keane v Setters

Keane v Shearer

Keane v Southgate

Keane v Delaney

Keane v Dunphy

Al Capwned

Enjoyed the documentary, too much being made of the selection of the best XI's imo.

Keane is a United legend, he's a stubborn aul sod, but he was some bloody footballer. Glad to hear he regrets not playing in the WC.


It's a shame that intensity of rivalry is gone from the game - I loved them ten years or so that it was ding dong with us and Arsenal.

Big Pussy Bonpensiero

Great documentary, really enjoyed it. Really shows what modern day football has become, or rather what the modern day PL has become.

Spanish Johnny

Very enjoyable show and very different. Keane still has such a gripping edge to him in fairness.

Two things: why didn't they put Irwin right back instead of Lauren and leave Cole left back (say this as an Arsenal fan). Lauren should not be ahead of either.

Secondly - how anyone could leave Bergkamp out of a combined side of these two teams is just insane. (Saying this as an Arsenal fan but also a football fan). Flying or no flying!!

Neeson

Any link to this? I missed it.

grenache

gilmour wrote: »

When Keane first arrived at the City Ground he was a stick thin right sided midfielder. By the time Cloughie had retired and after that horrendous last season he had turned Keane into a box to box driven machine that could score with both feet and a serious header of the ball. Anyone who thinks Clough was "pissed as a fart by the time Keane played with him" is forgetting just how much of an impact on any player he managed, even to the end.

"Irishman, win the ball off the player not in a red jersey and pass it to another team mate in a red jersey, do that and you'll get paid". Keane made a career out of that advice from Clough.

+1

Keane was a far greater attacking threat at Forest than at United, with a higher goals to games ratio too. Think he became a greater all round player at United though, one who could track back as well as score goals.

BNMC

Neeson wrote: »

Any link to this? I missed it.

RTÉ are showing it next week. 18th Dec, RTE 2, 9:55pm.

Tinie

Demosthenese wrote: »

Both successful in in their prime, are there even anymore that could be considered!

JT vs wayne bridge

Neeson

On YouTube now also.

shamrock55

What happened between viera and ruddock anyway?

GTR63

shamrock55 wrote: »

What happened between viera and ruddock anyway?

I remember Vieira getting in his face after being sent off when Ruddock was at West Ham and he spat at him. Then Neil started telling him his breath stank of garlic. One think Vieira can't deny is that Razor knows his food

cashback

The problem is these days that all the players are too bloody friendly with each other. Can you imagine Keane and Vieira having 'the banter' on Twitter?

wonderboysam

Neeson wrote: »

On YouTube now also.

cant find it, could you link me?

ctrl-alt-delete

Rumours coming out this morning that Roy made a video after that tearing into every one of the ITV staff.

There is a Scottish guy there that everyone raves about but Roy questioned his ability to pass a microphone.

He then launched into a tirade about the cameraman, saying was good at getting into the players faces but he was no good at seeing the bigger picture.

Apparently he was fuming at the location, he wanted the best of the best but a logistical mix up meant the wallpaper and blu tack were delayed and didn't arrive on time.

The managing director at ITV said he felt undermined and they were now looking at a way of shipping him out to STV in the next window.

niallo27

Tinie wrote: »

JT vs wayne bridge

How about a Suarez vs Evra programme. Two of them sit down and have a good chat and a hug.

DeanAustin

gilmour wrote: »

When Keane first arrived at the City Ground he was a stick thin right sided midfielder. By the time Cloughie had retired and after that horrendous last season he had turned Keane into a box to box driven machine that could score with both feet and a serious header of the ball. Anyone who thinks Clough was "pissed as a fart by the time Keane played with him" is forgetting just how much of an impact on any player he managed, even to the end.

"Irishman, win the ball off the player not in a red jersey and pass it to another team mate in a red jersey, do that and you'll get paid". Keane made a career out of that advice from Clough.

It is well documented that Clough was struggling with alcohol abuse towards the end of his reign. Just looking at interviews from that time paint that picture. There is no doubt that Clough was a great man and manager and that he had a positive influence on Roy Keane. It would be stupid to argue otherwise.

However, I cannot believe that someone as driven as Roy Keane would, in the cold light of day, rank a man who managed him to two unsuccessful cup finals and his only relegation above a man who managed him to 7 league titles and 4 FA Cups. It's good that people will make a case for Clough but the argument is not credible in the context of what Keane was asked.

Keane was having a pop at Fergie, playing the game the same way he said Fergie was when he thanked Keane for his 11.5 years at United. The fact that he admitted that he lost his love for United but had it back now that "that man" is gone says everything about the grudge Keane holds against Fergie.

It's incredible that the relationship has soured this much albeit with two personalities like that, I suppose you can see how it would.

Hangballlouie

Keane has said before that he ranks Clough as his best manager. Fair enough that most will disagree with him but it's not a new opinion. Even when him and Fergie got on ok he said this.

IamtheWalrus

Tinie wrote: »

Great scene at the end there with the two of them chatting away about the best 11, possibly oblivious that they were being filmed.

100% staged.