Is it possible to be a Sinn Fein member/supoporter and not support IRA actions?

raymon

grainnewhale wrote: »

I imagine the majority of people who vote for Sinn Fein will be republicans, with a few disaffected F.F and lab. supporters thrown. I don't forsee any F.G blueshirts voting for republicans, when they have spent a lifetime supporting unionism. After all F.G's John Brutal said meeting Prince Charles was the best moment of his life. It's hard to know whether F.G created a unionist dominated state because of their love for them or brain washed themselves into loving them, to justify creating the despicable apartheid state of northern Ireland.

Is this a reply to me ???

Your reply makes no sense as a response to my post ?
Prince Charles , FG, Apartheid , Unionism, John bruton , Brainwashing ??

How did you pack so much random nonsense into one paragraph? Well done though!

Can you summarise your point in one line ?

MFdaveIreland

I dnt support ira today or anything they do, does this make me a stereotypical hypocrit that laments over the old ira like a lot of others, I'm nt sure, I do support Sinn fein up north for the sole reason that they are not a unionist party. Which is sad really as it's either one or the other, and neither do piss all

grainnewhale

raymon wrote: »

Is this a reply to me ???

Your reply makes no sense as a response to my post ?
Prince Charles , FG, Apartheid , Unionism, John bruton , Brainwashing ??

How did you pack so much random nonsense into one paragraph? Well done though!

Can you summarise your point in one line ?

If you cant understand a broad statement, then a one liner would surely kill off the last remaining brain cells.

raymon

grainnewhale wrote: »

If you cant understand a broad statement, then a one liner would surely kill off the last remaining brain cells.

Sure no problem . Don't bother. Thanks

alastair

grainnewhale wrote: »

If you cant understand a broad statement, then a one liner would surely kill off the last remaining brain cells.

It's a broad statement of gibberish tbh.

I don't forsee any F.G blueshirts voting for republicans,

Nor do I. Given that the youngest surviving blueshirt would probably be 98 by now.

when they have spent a lifetime supporting unionism.

Eh, no - they (FG or blueshirts) have not.

After all F.G's John Brutal said meeting Prince Charles was the best moment of his life.

No he didn't. I'm sure the kids and missus ranked higher. He said that the visit of Prince Charles (the first by a British head-of-state in waiting to the State) was the "happiest day of his political life". That's his choice, and certainly would have been an important step in normalising relations with the UK. Not a sniff of unionist empathy, let alone support in the comment all the same.

It's hard to know whether F.G created a unionist dominated state

Really - it's not. They didn't. No-one created a unionist dominated state, given that NI isn't and never was a state in the first place. Craig is probably the man to ask about the partition - after all the agreement between the UK government and Collins included NI in the Free State - where it remained for two days. It's been part of the UK ever since.

because of their love for them or brain washed themselves into loving them,

Maybe you should ponder on DeValera's love for unionists too - he rejected a 32 county free state offer in 1940 after all. Or maybe the claim is just empty cant?

to justify creating the despicable apartheid state of northern Ireland.

Apartheid doesn't exist in NI, and again - it's not a state.

raymon

alastair wrote: »

It's a broad statement of gibberish tbh.

Well done for replying to the nonsense. I am unsure what Prince Charles , FG, Apartheid , Unionism, John bruton , Brainwashing has to do with me or my post. I am not associated with any of the above, except for the odd game of backgammon with prince Charles.

Sunnyisland

Don't think it be possible to be a member of SF and not support the IRA,s armed campaign,not yet anyway.

I do think there are many people who support SF who did not support the IRA.


Did I said that right.

grainnewhale

alastair wrote: »

It's a broad statement of gibberish tbh.


Nor do I. Given that the youngest surviving blueshirt would probably be 98 by now.


Eh, no - they (FG or blueshirts) have not.


No he didn't. I'm sure the kids and missus ranked higher. He said that the visit of Prince Charles (the first by a British head-of-state in waiting to the State) was the "happiest day of his political life". That's his choice, and certainly would have been an important step in normalising relations with the UK. Not a sniff of unionist empathy, let alone support in the comment all the same.


Really - it's not. They didn't. No-one created a unionist dominated state, given that NI isn't and never was a state in the first place. Craig is probably the man to ask about the partition - after all the agreement between the UK government and Collins included NI in the Free State - where it remained for two days. It's been part of the UK ever since.


Maybe you should ponder on DeValera's love for unionists too - he rejected a 32 county free state offer in 1940 after all. Or maybe the claim is just empty cant?


Apartheid doesn't exist in NI, and again - it's not a state.

If you say its gibberish I will have to agree, you are the expert. After all.

Sorry my reference to blueshirts was about their political beliefs, not a facist army.

I think you know that when john brutal was wetting himself about prince Charles . He certainly didn't mention political life. Although his spin doctors did afterwards.

Even you cant be stupid enough to believe that Dev was genuinely offered a 32 county Ireland

So it wasn't apartheid. It was sectarian bigoted discrimination. Aided or at best ignored by the irish goverement

alastair

grainnewhale wrote: »

If you say its gibberish I will have to agree

Glad to help - excess additional gibberish redacted.

Savage93

CueCard7 wrote: »

Yes you can. The IRA doesn't exist anymore.

How can you support something that doesn't exist.

It's like saying that all Fine Gael supporters support the actions of the Free State army during the civil war.

I.e the executions/ court Marshalls ect.


A stupid hypothesis.

I think most of the hate for Sinn Fein stems from the fact they are a northern party with left wing/confused policies.

But to say every Sinn Fein supporter is an IRA supporter is stupid.


How can I support something that does not exist?

spoken like a true shinner, even with spelling errors:D:D:D:D:D

rockatansky

NIMAN wrote: »

Is it possible to be a Sinn Fein member/supoporter and not support IRA actions?

As time progresses and SF strive to be accepted by the voting public, North and South, as a 'normal' political party, I got to wondering if its possible that we will ever hear any of their members/TDs etc actually condemn the actions of the IRA?

Surely a time will come when someone who may want to get into politics will agree with their policies and beliefs, but find the military actions of the past abhorrent? Will that someone ever be able to speak about IRA actions without adding in the usual "... yes, but there was murder on all sides and by State forces etc etc".

Short Answer No. As someone has said already you would probably asked to politely to hand in your membership card for condemning IRA actions.

Absolutely it is possible to vote for Sinn Fein and not be a supporter of the IRA, there are many Local Sinn Fein activists who do excellent work at community level.

You will never ever hear Sinn Fein condemn any actions carried out by the IRA, and rightly so. By doing so would be a grave dishonor to all those who have died for their cause and they would lose a massive amount of their core vote in the Republican Community.

Tramps Like Us

rockatansky wrote: »

Short Answer No. As someone has said already you would probably asked to politely to hand in your membership card for condemning IRA actions.

Absolutely it is possible to vote for Sinn Fein and not be a supporter of the IRA, there are many Local Sinn Fein activists who do excellent work at community level.

You will never ever hear Sinn Fein condemn any actions carried out by the IRA, and rightly so. By doing so would be a grave dishonor to all those who have died for their cause and they would lose a massive amount of their core vote in the Republican Community.

Thats an absolute lie. I was a member and I knew people who condemned the IRA outright nevermind certain IRA actions (pretty much every member would be critical of certain things that happened, the other claim I highlighted is also untrue) one of whom even works for the party.

rockatansky

Tramps Like Us wrote: »

Thats an absolute lie. I was a member and I knew people who condemned the IRA outright nevermind certain IRA actions (pretty much every member would be critical of certain things that happened, the other claim I highlighted is also untrue) one of whom even works for the party.

Sorry, would this have been within party circles that they would have condemned them or would they have stood up in public and condemned them? What about at an Ard Fheis? Has there ever been a motion tabled by a Cumman condemning the actions of the IRA?

Out of all of Sinn Feins elected representatives, both north and south, can you give me a list of the people who 'who condemned the IRA outright'? I wouldn't mind contacting their constituency offices and discussing their condemnation with them.

Tramps Like Us

rockatansky wrote: »

Sorry, would this have been within party circles that they would have condemned them or would they have stood up in public and condemned them? What about at an Ard Fheis?Has there ever been a motion tabled by an Cumman condemning the actions of the IRA?

Ard Fheis are stage managed almost to an extreme, nothing controversial generally gets there - plus cumann wouldn't put motions like that forward, why would they? What use would it serve? Plus motions have to be agreed by cumann, I doubt you'd get a consensus to put forward a motion like that.

Within party circles, on facebook, in debates, they wouldn't be public figures like but besides heated debates nothing happened, no one kicked out or anything

Tramps Like Us

rockatansky wrote: »

Sorry, would this have been within party circles that they would have condemned them or would they have stood up in public and condemned them? What about at an Ard Fheis? Has there ever been a motion tabled by a Cumman condemning the actions of the IRA?

Out of all of Sinn Feins elected representatives, both north and south, can you give me a list of the people who 'who condemned the IRA outright'? I wouldn't mind contacting their constituency offices and discussing their condemnation with them.

You are shifting the goalposts now, I dont know any elected reps who condemned the IRA outright - and I wont be giving you the names of the people I know who do

rockatansky

Tramps Like Us wrote: »

Ard Fheis are stage managed almost to an extreme, nothing controversial generally gets there - plus cumann wouldn't put motions like that forward, why would they? What use would it serve? Plus motions have to be agreed by cumann, I doubt you'd get a consensus to put forward a motion like that.

Within party circles, on facebook, in debates, they wouldn't be public figures like but besides heated debates nothing happened, no one kicked out or anything

Within party circles, amongst members I have no doubt there have been many people for have been critical of the IRA. But its like everything else in life, that's family business and is kept within the family.

Facebook - Ah here.

Debates - Can you supply me with evidence of any public debate where a Sinn Fein representative has come out openly and condemned the IRA, whether it is for action, or outright?? You've have stated what I have said is 'an absolute lie' so by all mean please prove to me that it is.

rockatansky

Tramps Like Us wrote: »

You are shifting the goalposts now, I dont know any elected reps who condemned the IRA outright - and I wont be giving you the names of the people I know who do

I'm sorry but how am I moving the goal posts?? If you read again what I wrote, you will clearly see that I am referring to Sinn Fein as a party.

You will never ever hear Sinn Fein condemn any actions carried out by the IRA

IrishProd

rockatansky wrote: »

I'm sorry but how am I moving the goal posts?? If you read again what I wrote, you will clearly see that I am referring to Sinn Fein as a party.

You will never ever hear Sinn Fein condemn any actions carried out by the IRA

Actually they have, some simple research or googling on your part will prove you wrong, you obviously have a selective memory besides being selective with your false outrage.

Scofflaw

grainnewhale wrote: »

If you say its gibberish I will have to agree, you are the expert. After all.

Sorry my reference to blueshirts was about their political beliefs, not a facist army.

I think you know that when john brutal was wetting himself about prince Charles . He certainly didn't mention political life. Although his spin doctors did afterwards.

Even you cant be stupid enough to believe that Dev was genuinely offered a 32 county Ireland

So it wasn't apartheid. It was sectarian bigoted discrimination. Aided or at best ignored by the irish goverement

grainnewhale, you contribute virtually nothing to the forum but what you apparently think are smart remarks. Clean up your act or face a permaban on return. Week off to think about it.

moderately,
Scofflaw

Scofflaw

And frankly, the rest of this thread is little better. Closing this now because otherwise I can see myself having to come back in 24 hours with the cards and banhammer.

Noise to signal ratio far too high.

moderately,
Scofflaw